Unventor Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Kuji Rolls said: So... anyways, i feel much better about this firmware update and have regained a fair bit of confidence in the wheel. Time to go ride and do some crazy stuff for the 16X review video coming up. Well I like to thank you for the effort and the risk you have take testing this wheel. And other wheels too of course. Limit tester EUC: @Kuji Rolls Limit tester MC: Guy Martin Yep I think you two are same category, different wheel(s). Looking forward to you review. Both pro and cons. Edited July 30, 2019 by Unventor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) @Mike Paolini how many miles you got Mike? Edited July 30, 2019 by US69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 @Mike Paolini the question is if you allready have done 200km (130miles?) only then you can adjust 31mph-50kmh up to 200km you can only set 40kmh... from 201km on you can set 50kmh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 23 minutes ago, US69 said: Aaah: And the 16X just arrived...and WOW, this really Looks great! So you have your own or just access to one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucasD Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 2 hours ago, chrisjunlee said: Do you even know what the firmware change did? It would’ve involved throttling the power delivery. That was the only way to fix this issue, since before it was overcompensating. Or perhaps there was a phase shift adjustment. Make sense? Not True, classic tuning PID is to put P at value that it makes oscillations (like inn video) and than use that value as basis for P, I, D parameters http://mstarlabs.net/control/znrule.html 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 12 minutes ago, Unventor said: So you have your own or just access to one? Nope, no own ....till now ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Patton250 Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Marty Backe said: I posted the picture to inject humor into the discussion. Nothing more. Really, you're continual espousal of the 16X being the best wheel has a religious fervor to it, considering you've never ridden one. I say the Nikola is the best riding wheel made of all the wheels I've ridden (I've ridden most). I've always stated that I can't compare it to the 16X because I have not ridden a 16X. So indeed, maybe the 16X rides better than the Nikola. Or not. Eventually I'll be able to provide my opinion based on facts. I will never sing the praises of a wheel that I've not extensively ridden. I would say they are both about the same with a little more nimbleness to the 16X. My son has ridden both as well and agrees. That’s just the ride though. Lots of differences in the features. Mikes videos describe the 16X’s features really well. You can use that to compare what you already know about the Nikola. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Important question: how do we apply the new firmware? Is the firmware already ready to roll out and be auto-updated through the Kingsong app? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleepBloopBlop Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) I'm able to monitor battery voltage from the Kingsong app on my android phone. Edited July 30, 2019 by BleepBloopBlop 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Harvey Pooka Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 @Kuji Rolls - thanks for testing out the limits of different wheels on behalf of all of us. I appreciate your risking life and limb on these things as the human crash test dummy. @US69 - thanks for taking on the voluntary role of social media fire putter outer on behalf of Kingsong. Can't be easy. Please also forward my appreciation to them of how quickly they addressed the issue. They probably hear a lot of crap, complaints and hyperbole so I think they should also know not everyone of their potential customers is so reactive. I would also thank Gotway for their relatively quick response to their mosfet/fan problems but I don't know who their media rep is. The way I see it, in 2011 the first solowheel with a range of 12 miles and a speed of 12 mph came out for $1500 USD. A dozen companies jumped on the EUC bandwagon. Only three are left. Within 8 years we have the Nikola and the KS16X with their new kick ass capabilities. That's a hell of a lot of advancement for us - early adopters. We are not a mainstream hobby. The companies servicing us are growing. They are all doing what a growth company should be doing - innovating tech and improving customer service. Watching people here and in facebook debate whether KS or Gotway is better is like watching people debate whether Granny Smith or Spartan apples are better. 8 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 21 hours ago, mrelwood said: That’s not at all what @US69 said or implied. He said that such extreme acceleration is not recommended to be done on any wheel. And he is absolutely correct, I have never seen anyone lean on any EUC like Kuji did to reveal the issue. I also agree that despite that, the issue must be fixed. What is often lost when sharing and discussing issues at a discussion forum, is the actual extent of the issue. While the customers are just starting to get the 16X, so far it seems there is only one person in the world who can reveal the issue as a severe one. Comparing to the Nikola, where the number of confirmed cases on the forum alone got close to ten pretty fast, several of which were already toasted. I suspect we won’t see a widespread issue with the 16X before it’s fixed by a firmware update. That doesn’t mean a good old mass hysteria doesn’t have enough time to spread though. And as I said I agree with those recommendations. However, I don't see any reason for conflating over-leaning in general with this separate issue, which the previous post in my opinion to an extent did. For what it's worth in my opinion this issue doesn't seem like it would affect many, and hopefully it will be fixed quickly, and the KS16X seems like it could be a great wheel. Who's hysteric exactly? I have to say that personally I don't feel hysteric, not more than normally at any rate. This is just another issue in the long line of other issues with our wheels, and in general I encourage everyone to keep it cool and keep to the facts at any given point, which goes in both directions. Before the full extent of an issue is know it doesn't serve anyone to either disparage it or blow it up depending on personal feelings. Compared to the Nikola? That's neither here nor there in my book, as it has no bearing on this KS16X issue. Edited July 30, 2019 by Nils 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Just wanted to say, Fedex is the worst of the worst. I can't believe how backwards and limited they are compared to UPS, and that's a low bar already. Looks like I'm not getting the 16X today. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleepBloopBlop Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 1 hour ago, US69 said: @Mike Paolini the question is if you allready have done 200km (130miles?) only then you can adjust 31mph-50kmh up to 200km you can only set 40kmh... from 201km on you can set 50kmh This is my first wheel and with some fiddling of the speed settings I have it set at 50kph before I stepped on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 2 hours ago, US69 said: Aaah: And the 16X just arrived...and WOW, this really Looks great! Get them pictures up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 8 hours ago, Rehab1 said: What happened that guy? Heard something about a shoulder breaking or something, and all of a sudden it's like no, safety schmatefy, keeping body parts or whatever.. what a wuss.. Am I right or am I right!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 10 minutes ago, stephen said: Get them pictures up If you go way past all the Nikola posts here, someone collected some new pics of KS earlier today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gr8ps Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 23 hours ago, Patton250 said: That’s a little dramatic isn’t it? I'm a little dramatic when a 30+ mph wheel has a bug in it that could throw me into traffic. I don't fanboy over wheel brands. I'm glad to see it has been resolved but the rollout of both the 16X and the Nikola has not been good. I will never, ever, purchase a wheel until it has been out a few months. It has been the proverbial sh!t show with these two wheels. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patton250 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, gr8ps said: I'm a little dramatic when a 30+ mph wheel has a bug in it that could throw me into traffic. I don't fanboy over wheel brands. I'm glad to see it has been resolved but the rollout of both the 16X and the Nikola has not been good. I will never, ever, purchase a wheel until it has been out a few months. It has been the proverbial sh!t show with these two wheels. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post stephen Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Patton250 said: If nobody bought a wheel we wouldn't find the bugs ,, so hats off to everyone for reporting bugs👍👍 and now been solved 👍 quoted wrong one soz Edited July 30, 2019 by stephen 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 13 minutes ago, stephen said: If nobody bought a wheel we wouldn't find the bugs The state of the EUC market summarized in one short statement 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 ffs .... I just bought one Will be here in a couple of days 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eucinsea Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 1 hour ago, ir_fuel said: ffs .... I just bought one Will be here in a couple of days Damn that's quick! I ordered mine two weeks ago and I have to wait until 2nd Batch in September. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean eRide.ie Community Posted July 30, 2019 Author Share Posted July 30, 2019 15 minutes ago, prasket said: Damn that's quick! I ordered mine two weeks ago and I have to wait until 2nd Batch in September. So, 1st batch was in July and 2nd batch is in September? Two months seems quite long of a gap for a 2nd batch of what seems to be a popular model. But of course, the more economies of scale, the cheaper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mrelwood Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 13 hours ago, SamSuffit said: I am not saying I have or I will. But having a dangerous limit close to normal usage is deeply disturbing. If only one rider in the world is able to reproduce a bug, I think it’s fair to say that the bug does not seem to be very close to normal usage. Quote Why are you so fiercely defending Kingsong? As a consumer you dont think it is a dangerous bug which needs to be fixed? Having a reasonable take on how rare an issue is, is not called defending, fierce or regular. And it also does not imply that one thinks the issue (should or) shouldn’t be fixed. An example: I think this was a serious issue and absolutely thought that it must be fixed. At the same time I thought that for example the V8 and Z10 (both current wheels) would likely not have survived either the acceleration or the braking that Kuji did on the video. That’s not defending KS. Reality is that the issue was very hard to reproduce, and therefore was unlikely to be an issue to most riders. Gotway glue gate was shown to be able to toast the mainboard and cause an unexpected crash even under a very mild stress situation. The 16X issue was in no way comparable either in severity or how common it was. 8 hours ago, chrisjunlee said: Do you even know what the firmware change did? It would’ve involved throttling the power delivery. That was the only way to fix this issue, since before it was overcompensating. Or perhaps there was a phase shift adjustment. Make sense? Dude... You don’t have anywhere near the understanding of programming a firmware for a self-balancing vehicle to whip out theories of what the issue was, or how it was fixed. I have done enough coding to be frustratingly familiar with the fact that a bug in code can be a - ny - thing at all, often being completely unrelated to the manifestation of the actual bug. Besides, you are contradicting yourself in first saying what the issue was and what was the only way to fix the issue, then wondering wether the issue was perhaps something else. To answer your question: No, it does not make sense. Quote I will never, ever, purchase a wheel until it has been out a few months. That is absolutely a senseful stance to take. Quote It has been the proverbial sh!t show with these two wheels. I wonder if you’ll remember the situation after a month, or even a week of watching all the happy reviews about a wheel that everyone thinks is free of any (serious) issues. If you then suddenly remember that there was one person that was able to produce a severe bug, will you say to yourself: ”What a $h!t show those two days were!” ? Edited July 30, 2019 by mrelwood 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, mrelwood said: Dude... You don’t have anywhere near the understanding of programming a firmware for a self-balancing vehicle to whip out theories of what the issue was, or how it was fixed. I have done enough coding to be frustratingly familiar with the fact that a bug in code can be a - ny - thing at all, often being completely unrelated to the manifestation of the actual bug. That's exactly my point 31 minutes ago, mrelwood said: wonder if you’ll remember the situation after a month, or even a week of watching all the happy reviews about a wheel that everyone thinks is free of any (serious) issues. If you then suddenly remember that there was one person that was able to produce a severe bug, will you say to yourself: ”What a $h!t show those two days were!” ? The drama is the best part though. Edited July 30, 2019 by chrisjunlee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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