Patton250 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 9 minutes ago, Jia Liu said: Please don't spread this over all Chinese products. Bad products come from anywhere, no one mentioned Boeing 737 MAX yet??? I wonder why no EUC is made from other countries than China, if it was, it might cost twice more and have more issues, who knows. On the other hand, there are many wonderful products from China: my company is running BYD electric buses for all on campus transportations, the little insta360 One X camera many of us using, DJI drones which from amateurs to pros all use, etc, etc, the list can go on and on, they all serve me flawlessly. I believe it's the normal growing pain when new innovation is being adopted, much less to do where it is produced. Happy riding, cheers There’s a reason why the United States and many other countries by 20% of their manufactured goods from China. Cost. There are consequences for that however. I will leave it at that. Boeing makes the best planes in the world and they do it without government subsidies unlike their competitors in Europe. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patton250 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 10 minutes ago, Jon Stern said: Argh! FedEx tried to deliver my 16x a day early (even though an e-mail earlier in the day restated a Tues delivery). No one was home, so they'll try again tomorrow. Weren’t you tracking it? I hate that. Sorry man. Tomorrow is the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jia Liu Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 5 minutes ago, Rywokast said: its because gotway and kingsong are very small companies with basically no financial backing i believe, i think this is more of a seat of their pants type thing a lot of the time, kingsong to a lesser extent of course they dont pump out nearly as many wheels or as quickly as gotway but they are both being assembled mostly by hand and with pretty much no oversight.. its not like theyre multi billion dollar car manufacturers with limitless resources and funding, 100 years of research and testing and extremely strict, government mandated safety protocols, made with exact precision by robots in a billion dollar factory xD Inmotion and ninebot have no reasonable excuse though as they are both backed by huge multi million dollar companies and have infinitely more resources than KS or GW Same applies for Future Motion, Onewheel isn't more reliable than KS or GW wheels as far as I can tell. My point is that it has nothing to do where is produced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patton250 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, Rywokast said: its because gotway and kingsong are very small companies with basically no financial backing i believe, i think this is more of a seat of their pants type thing a lot of the time, kingsong to a lesser extent of course they dont pump out nearly as many wheels or as quickly as gotway but they are both being assembled mostly by hand and with pretty much no oversight.. its not like theyre multi billion dollar car manufacturers with limitless resources and funding, 100 years of research and testing and extremely strict, government mandated safety protocols, made with exact precision by robots in a billion dollar factory xD Inmotion and ninebot have no reasonable excuse though as they are both backed by huge multi million dollar companies and have infinitely more resources than KS or GW And those are key words. Just out of curiosity how many wheels do these companies make a year? Does anyone know? I bet somebody here knows. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Stern Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Patton250 said: Weren’t you tracking it? I hate that. Sorry man. Tomorrow is the day. I wasn't tracking it today, as there was no need! It wasn't coming today (or so I thought). Tomorrow is only the day if my wife hears the doorbell. If she's putting our baby down to sleep when they arrive it's not going to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anagnorisis Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Excuse my ignorance, but will the 16X be firmware flashable, and I am assuming it would be via the App. Alternatively would they replace the board if its not flashable? I guess what I am asking is would Kingsong replace a faulty non flashable board like Gotway. I have no context with Kingsong but I have a single datapoint with Gotway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patton250 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Just now, Jon Stern said: I wasn't tracking it today, as there was no need! It wasn't coming today (or so I thought). Tomorrow is only the day if my wife hears the doorbell. If she's putting our baby down to sleep when they arrive it's not going to happen. Wave signature required if you can. Put a note on the door with the tracking number saying you release them to leave it without signature required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Jia Liu said: Same applies for Future Motion, Onewheel isn't more reliable than KS or GW wheels as far as I can tell. My point is that it has nothing to do where is produced. i agree.. it doesnt.. its how much youre willing to spend (relatively).. not many would be willing to pay 10k for a nikola.. and so inevitably you have some issues lol.. if i were to buy something for ten grand made in the US i would expect it to last basically a lifetime and be able to repair, not just replace components.. and it should be able to easily withstand twice as much as even the most extreme rider could ask of it, and be backed by a ten year warranty.. i prefer it the way it is tbh, though some might disagree Edited July 30, 2019 by Rywokast 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, Anagnorisis said: Excuse my ignorance, but will the 16X be firmware flashable, and I am assuming it would be via the App. Alternatively would they replace the board if its not flashable? I guess what I am asking is would Kingsong replace a faulty non flashable board like Gotway. I have no context with Kingsong but I have a single datapoint with Gotway. yes it is, and yes they would imo... but that would be for a physical defect present on the board such as glue gate, which still blows my mind that GW replaced them free of charge, thats way more than i would have expected from them usually its wait until it blows then complain to your dealer who fronts the cost to get you a new board lol.. in the case of KS i would say im 99% certain everything can be fixed via firmware like has been done on the V10 which had a pretty rocky release, and then with the waterproofing fiasco they paid for people to ship them back their wheels, seal them up, and then ship them back to customers.. i think KS would have a similar approach whereas if it was something widespread that was a safety hazard they would be the ones to front the cost 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 10 minutes ago, Patton250 said: And those are key words. Just out of curiosity how many wheels do these companies make a year? Does anyone know? I bet somebody here knows. :-) i would love to know this too but im not sure anyone knows except for them and i dont think theyre willing to say.. at least, efforts in the past have been fruitless to my knowledge only very rough guesstimates.. would be interesting to know though, i bet its a lot less than you would think 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Marty Backe Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 2 hours ago, ir_fuel said: Or these need to be tested in lab conditions. On a threadmill and with a machine applying weight and lean angle @Rehab1 famously tried this and destroyed his treadmill I miss his science experiments 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EkW Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Patton250 said: Weren’t you tracking it? I hate that. Sorry man. Tomorrow is the day. FedEx seems to have changed the process for signature required for delivery packages. I used to just have them deliver to the nearby Walgreens. Less than two weeks ago I got a Sig. Req'd pkg but could not have it held at any FedEx location. No one could tell me why. Also, just to send any pkg to a FedEx location required signing up for their delivery manager service. One has to waited ntil a code arrives via mail before one can use the delivery manager. I had to stay home from work to await the pkg. The driver barely knocked on the door and by the time I realized that the sound wasn't caused by the cats the driver was gone. Fortunately I didn't have to work the next day. I wasn't very pleased by the whole process. I suggest signing up for FedEx's delivery manager before it is needed, becuase at that point it will be too late. UPS usually allows one to signa release to leave onthe porch or with a neighbor. Hope that things work out well for you. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post petaluma Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 2 hours ago, Jon Stern said: Argh! FedEx tried to deliver my 16x a day early (even though an e-mail earlier in the day restated a Tues delivery). No one was home, so they'll try again tomorrow. Same but called fedex and picked up at the hub tonight. Now I can ride tomorrow instead of sitting on my porch 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleepBloopBlop Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 So is the external led indication the only method for monitoring state of charge for the 16X until they update the firmware? My wheel is slated to be delivered tomorrow afternoon so I'm trying to strategize the best way to actually use it until these bugs get straightened out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, BleepBloopBlop said: So is the external led indication the only method for monitoring state of charge for the 16X until they update the firmware? My wheel is slated to be delivered tomorrow afternoon so I'm trying to strategize the best way to actually use it until these bugs get straightened out. That, plus the charger LED. I actually really like how KingSong shows the status of the charge via the LEDs. You can instantly see the state of the charge without having to connect with an app. Gotway doesn't have this feature. Not sure about Inmotion. The Z10 has a charging indicator too. Edited July 30, 2019 by Marty Backe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 14 minutes ago, BleepBloopBlop said: So is the external led indication the only method for monitoring state of charge for the 16X until they update the firmware? My wheel is slated to be delivered tomorrow afternoon so I'm trying to strategize the best way to actually use it until these bugs get straightened out. i dont see it as an issue i mean i have a cover on my KS wheels that hides the lights that are turned off anyways and i never look at the app besides for calibration and and firmware.. i already know how far i can go on it so theres no need for me to see it.. all you have to do is hold still and look down and you can see the charge level lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Stern Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: That, plus the charger LED. I actually really like how KingSong shows the status of the charge via the LEDs. You can instantly see the state of the charge without having to connect with an app. Gotway doesn't have this feature. Not sure about Inmotion. The Z10 has a charging indicator too. Inmotion has a multi-segment LED battery indicator that shows battery level and animates when charging. Edited July 30, 2019 by Jon Stern 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Just now, Jon Stern said: Inmotion has a multi-segment LED battery indicator the shows battery level and animates when charging. yea but only 4 bars so very inaccurate as its increments of 25% lol.. kingsong has like 15 increments lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Stern Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Just now, Rywokast said: yea but only 4 bars so very inaccurate as its increments of 25% lol.. kingsong has like 15 increments lol Is that much resolution really helpful? Is their gas gauge even accurate enough to justify that resolution? 2 minutes ago, Rywokast said: yea but only 4 bars so very inaccurate as its increments of 25% lol.. kingsong has like 15 increments lol Actually, it's 5 bars! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Just now, Jon Stern said: Is that much resolution really helpful? Is their gas gauge even accurate enough to justify that resolution? couldnt tell you as i dont use it.. surely its as accurate as it gets as its exactly what the app would be telling you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jon Stern Posted July 30, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) There's a difference between accuracy and precision. King Song's indicator may be precise, but is it accurate? Edited July 30, 2019 by Jon Stern 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azze80 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Question, are there good quality pictures of the 16x available? no commercial one from KingSong but from you guys that have preordered them, Thanks🙏🏻 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erk1024 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Jon Stern said: King Song's indicator may be precise, but is it accurate? On the 18XL, it varies wildly depending on whether it's plugged in or not or whether it's under load. It can show eight lights when it's charging and drop to seven or six when you take it off the charger. I think pretty much the same thing happens on the battery percentage readings in the apps (both KS and Gotway). The battery percentage drops under load. But if start a ride with eight green lights on the side, and then you ride for a couple hours and you stop and have five green lights on the side... then it's a reasonably good indication you started at 80% and now you're now somewhere around 50%. If you see two or three lights... you're on fumes, and the wheel is going to get a lot less fun... (p.s. I always forget the 18xl has 9 LED's instead of 10. But at 80%, two lights from the top are out, so it makes sense just treat each light like it's 10% and pretend there is an extra light down there somewhere...) Edited July 30, 2019 by erk1024 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 29 minutes ago, Jon Stern said: Is that much resolution really helpful? Is their gas gauge even accurate enough to justify that resolution? Actually, it's 5 bars! shows you how much attention i pay to it rofl 19 minutes ago, Azze80 said: Question, are there good quality pictures of the 16x available? no commercial one from KingSong but from you guys that have preordered them, Thanks🙏🏻 why do you need pics when theres dozens of video reviews 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 26 minutes ago, Jon Stern said: There's a difference between accuracy and precision. King Song's indicator may be precise, but is it accurate? well who could know haha.. im not gonna measure the voltage of each cell myself as far as im concerned whatever the app says it is is what it is.. its the firmware that controls the behavior so it doesnt actually matter what it truly is if the firmware says youre on empty and kicks you off it doesnt really matter if its true or not 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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