King Song S18 Discussion

[Zopper]

On 6/18/2020 at 12:01 AM, Flyboy10 said:

[most of the post cut]

I hope to ride both wheels more especially at high speed over bumps. But both of these wheels are amazing in their own way. If you are primarily a night rider than you should get the V11, if you are a daytime skatepark and quarry rider, the S18. I'll edit this as I think of more stuff but these are my initial thoughts.

Nice summary. I will throw in my 2 cents. I'm mostly a commuting + offroad rider. And I'm getting more and more inclined towards V11, first because of the greater range and also because it seems sturdier. E.g. the unprotected wires on S18 make me cringe every time I imagine crashing this part of S18 against a sharper rock (see this picture). Bad luck happens and this is begging for an accident. For me, those are probably the two parameters that will decide which of the two wheels will I get. Still, I'm willing to wait for the spring - my times as a public beta tester of new products are gone. :-)

Edited June 22, 2020 by Zopper
the pic hosting prevents embedding, so I added it as a link instead.

[Unventor]

On 6/20/2020 at 6:16 AM, chrisdab said:

The image above from eWheels shows the airflow cooling the lights and fan pushing air through and around the internals. Take it for what it's worth, it's just an illustration.

Now I will not go into details here. But Inmotion said repeatedly this is not any issue. I expect this is due to being a waterproof fan. The internals use a heat pipe like way to move heat away in an enclosed system. So it should be weatherproof too. It is test and made to operate in weather. They even said you can rinse the wheel briefly with a shower to clean from dirt, just don't do it with pressure water jets. And don't ride in water deeper than pedals height.

So Inmotion active made efforts to weatherproofing their wheel. KS said early on they didn't have this in focus and made no extra effort compared to KS16X.

This is top reason why I don't find KS S16 interesting. Along with battery capacity and the overall open design, and 1st batch owner experience with KS (2 wheels). And how I expect Inmotion to do, owning 2 of their wheels too.

Now we all chose wheels for different reasons. I hope no mater what you as ride chose that you are happy with those choices 3-6-12 months later. 

Suspension wise KS might be more flexible than IM solution. But as a total wheel package I still thing the IM V11 is an overall much more compelling package. 

[Unventor]

1 hour ago, Zopper said:

Nice summary. I will throw in my 2 cents. I'm mostly a commuting + offroad rider. And I'm getting more and more inclined towards V11, first because of the greater range and also because it seems sturdier. E.g. the unprotected wires on S18 make me cringe every time I imagine crashing this part of S18 against a sharper rock (see the picture). Bad luck happens and this is begging for an accident. For me, those are probably the two parameters that will decide which of the two wheels will I get. Still, I'm willing to wait for the spring - my times as a public beta tester of new products are gone. :-)

I think that is very wise way to go about this. 

I have bad knees so I see this as huge improvement compared to my current wheels. And well I just couldn't resist the V11.

I too use it 90% for commuting 10% pleasure or fun rides. I will keep my other wheels as they all have their benefits. But I expect the V11 to become my main wheel (atleast in summer time and good weather, mainly to avoid extra maintenance/ cleaning to suspension).

I just didn't get that same gut feeling about KS S18 (at all)

[FinRider]

2 hours ago, Unventor said:

 

Now we all chose wheels for different reasons. I hope no mater what you as ride chose that you are happy with those choices 3-6-12 months later. 

Suspension wise KS might be more flexible than IM solution.

There are so many pros and cons for both these suspension wheels... i just can get over the sex-appeal of the KS with the high-tech-looking suspension. To me the aestethics alone put ks ahead of inmotion.

[c5flybyu]

10 hours ago, FreeRide said:

Interesting is that so far only Kuji has mentioned adjusting the Height of the footplates so the built-in Kuji pads fit your ankle. It seems like this is exactly what was needed in this case.
 

i wonder if the height adjustment is not officially supported, is not very easy,  or they will be changing it so Kingsong has not been having the reviewers discuss it. Seems like it would be a major feature, the lack of discussion on this point by the early reviewers is puzzling.  

Kuji stated that the footplate adjustment is official on the production and that it's easy to do.  You loosen the two screws that are above the footplates and two screws below.  You slide the footplate up and down according to your shoe and how it fits the opening, then you tighten the four screws back up.  I saw a youtube video where the reviewer talked to Kuji and got the instructions but I don't remember which video it was...  Hope that helps!

Edited June 22, 2020 by c5flybyu

[FreeRide]

7 minutes ago, c5flybyu said:

Kuji stated that the footplate adjustment is official on the production and that it's easy to do.  You loosen the two screws that are above the footplates and two screws below.  You slide the footplate up and down according to your shoe and how it fits the opening, then you tighten the four screws back up.  I saw a youtube video where the reviewer talked to Kuji and got the instructions but I don't remember which video it was...  Hope that helps!

Good to know, do you remember how much movement was possible?  Still wonder why no one else is talking about it; that is what is puzzling because it seems so important with this design. Personally I'm not too worried as I won't be in for one of the first batch of the s18, but I really like the concepts behind the suspension design and super interested to see a real world comparisons with the V11.  For many reasons I'm on the V11 train, but I definitely want more trains going down this track for the future.

[AtlasP]

Even though the pads/shape of the S18 was designed 'for' Kuji, he had to lower the pedals in order to make the pads/shape fit right.

I imagine a large part of why this isn't being widely acknowledged is that it could mean lower-than-advertised pedal clearance for many (most?) buyers.

Edited June 22, 2020 by AtlasP

[Daniel Hollinghurst]

20 minutes ago, AtlasP said:

Even though the pads/shape of the S18 was designed 'for' Kuji, he had to lower the pedals in order to make the pads/shape fit right.

I imagine a large part of why this isn't being widely acknowledged is that it could mean lower-than-advertised pedal clearance for many (most?) buyers.

hmm kuji moves his down 1cm, and still cant scrape pedals, so i doubt that is an issue. 

also for anyone wondering, the final S18 product has thicker pads at the top for improved stability. in the kuji review, he adds his own padding at the top. hopefully this helps with the tank slap seen in the speedyfeet review too

22 hours ago, Jack King Song said:

In the final unit, we'll use better pads that are more durable and thicker for better handling. 

hurray

[Ben Kim]

Did this wheel enter production at all yet?  Or are they still finalizing materials and such?  I ordered one, seller claims it should ship end of this month, but haven't been following up on Kingsong too much.

Looking at the top of the wheel, it appears that it shouldn't be TOO difficult to fabricate a proper seat for this wheel with its sharp angles and all; did Kingsong ever say if a seat is in the works for this wheel?  Definitely would want a suspension seated wheel.  If not, I'll get to work.  

Edited June 23, 2020 by Ben Kim

[redfoxdude]

59 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

Did this wheel enter production at all yet?  Or are they still finalizing materials and such?  I ordered one, seller claims it should ship end of this month, but haven't been following up on Kingsong too much.

Looking at the top of the wheel, it appears that it shouldn't be TOO difficult to fabricate a proper seat for this wheel with its sharp angles and all; did Kingsong ever say if a seat is in the works for this wheel?  Definitely would want a suspension seated wheel.  If not, I'll get to work.  

Last I heard was a few weeks ago, that they were planning on starting production right about now... Not sure if that's actually occurred, however.
 

I agree about the seat potential! I haven't seen anything about a seat from King Song, but I have a couple ideas to get a seat that'll work, too.

[.....]

Sharp angles only have to fear my dremel and sandpaper... I'd imagine after a good smash or two, ANY sharp edges that cause cuts, will be such a source of anger, that they will no longer be an issue. The s18 does look as a good candidate for a seat, much better than the v11 setup would be. Somehow I am over being too worried and now am just choosing to be irritated by the way I can't lift the damn thing w/o hitting a button and lifting a handle. Well, adding speakers entered my mind, but what a pita.  But, if thats all i got to bitch about this week, its shaping out just fine! I'm definitely waiting for e-wheels to hit me up for some more casholla soon! I also now see that I will be investing or building a 5amp charger soon.

Edited June 23, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Steven89]

Hi all,

I'm a EUC rider from little more that 1 year and decided to preorded the S18 over the V11 for his aesthetic and less weight (I'm a city driver (Florence)).

The question is.. I had added to my last wheel some sort of "stand" so that when shut down it could self stand on his own. I saw Inmotion added that feature on the V11 and wanted to ask if anyone has any idea of how could I do something like that for the S18 (if it's doable at all.)

Thank you  and sorry for the bad english :D

[Electric Dreams]

1 hour ago, Steven89 said:

Hi all,

I'm a EUC rider from little more that 1 year and decided to preorded the S18 over the V11 for his aesthetic and less weight (I'm a city driver (Florence)).

The question is.. I had added to my last wheel some sort of "stand" so that when shut down it could self stand on his own. I saw Inmotion added that feature on the V11 and wanted to ask if anyone has any idea of how could I do something like that for the S18 (if it's doable at all.)

Thank you  and sorry for the bad english

You can lean the wheel forward and it can stand on it's own, however you may end up with a few minor scratches 

[Rehab1]

Well I sold my Z10 and immediately sent the funds to Jason as a secondary installment on the S18. I didn't want my wife to get her hands on the cash.   I now only owe Ewheels a small remainder which is a good  feeling.

[FinRider]

34 minutes ago, Rehab1 said:

Well I sold my Z10 and immediately sent the funds to Jason as a secondary installment on the S18. I didn't want my wife to get her hands on the cash.   I now only owe Ewheels a small remainder which is a good  feeling.

I have filled out the required 3 forms to the ”government” for release of funds towards my new toy but it has sadly not been approved yet 😎

Edited June 23, 2020 by FinRider

[Zwheeler]

3 hours ago, FinRider said:

I have filled out the required 3 forms to the ”government” for release of funds towards my new toy but it has sadly not been approved yet 😎

How about the good old "Look, honey what I found. It just followed me home" 

-Z-

Edited June 23, 2020 by Zwheeler
typo

[AtlasP]

12 hours ago, Steven89 said:

I'm a EUC rider from little more that 1 year and decided to preorded the S18 over the V11 for his aesthetic and less weight (I'm a city driver (Florence)).

 

Just FYI, the weight of the S18 has been increased to 25kg--just 2kg shy of the V11.

[stephen]

12 hours ago, Steven89 said:

(I'm a city driver (Florence))

I thought the v11 would suit city riding

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

24 minutes ago, stephen said:

I thought the v11 would suit city riding

Yeah, but only city riding! But maybe he doesn't want to miss the option of real offroad riding? 

[stephen]

37 minutes ago, buell47 said:

Yeah, but only city riding! But maybe he doesn't want to miss the option of real offroad riding? 

😁😁 Can't wait to see more videos that's all i can say 

[mrelwood]

10 hours ago, buell47 said:

Yeah, but only city riding!

I don’t get where this view comes from. Off-roadability by feature:

Battery capacity, V11.

Tire, V11.

Dustworthyness, V11.

Mud/grass/branch/pinecone/etc-ability, V11.

Lights, V11.

Handle, V11.

Pedal height, V11/tie.

Clearance right next to the tire, S18.

Firmware behaviour / pedal modes, unknown.

 To me the S18 is the obvious city wheel of the two, loud and clear.

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

For my purposes neither the S18 nor the V11 is a real improvement over the 16X. Optical aspects left out. I am mainly interested in the suspension of my next wheel and there the V11 is in my eyes the absolute loser.

1. two separate air dampers are absolutely stupid (I hope I don't have to explain why?) 

2. no adjustment of the rebound

3. sliding rails rather suboptimal for offroad (dirt)

4. no chance to add power-pads or jump-pads

But it's also clear that I'm not a fan of the S18 (except visually and the general structure of the suspension)

Edited June 24, 2020 by buell47

[mike_bike_kite]

You left out sprung to unsprung weight ratio which is probably the biggest advantage that the S18 has over the V11.

[wwwooooqq]

56 minutes ago, buell47 said:

two separate air dampers are absolutely stupid (I hope I don't have to explain why?) 

why？

[mrelwood]

2 hours ago, buell47 said:

For my purposes neither the S18 nor the V11 is a real improvement over the 16X.

Makes sense, if you completely disregard suspension. From what I’ve heard, it makes an awfully huge difference to the riding experience and comfort.

As for which suspension wheel is better for off-road, you then mainly talk about suspension features. If suspension in general is not a real improvement to you, how come it suddenly has so much power to determine which wheel is suitable for off-road?

Quote

1. two separate air dampers are absolutely stupid (I hope I don't have to explain why?) 

2. no adjustment of the rebound

I’m sure I’m not alone in saying that so far the best wheel for off-road has been the MSX/MSP. V11 has the same tire that’s used on many MSXs, MSX style torque, more narrow and nimble, more comfortable riding posture, and almost the same battery capacity, albeit with noticeably deeper discharge limit. Do you really think that the suspension on the V11 will be so crappy that it would make an otherwise a seemingly good off-roader not suitable for off-road at all? I see zero sense in that view.

Quote

3. sliding rails rather suboptimal for offroad (dirt)

Remains to be seen I guess. I see no issue bigger than with the S18.

Quote

4. no chance to add power-pads or jump-pads

Sure there is. Inmotion has planned an official after market add-on themselves. And I can show you a photo of my DIY when I get mine installed. After the wheel arrives of course.