null Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 17 minutes ago, RockyTop said: True ....... But are you guys going to stop saying mileage when you mean......... kilometereage? Hehe, good point, we do in fact say "kilometrage" in metric language, but in English we have to do in Rome what romans do (or something like that) I'd vote for "range", in French we also use "autonomie". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinRider Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 1 hour ago, RockyTop said: True ....... But are you guys going to stop saying mileage when you mean......... kilometereage? And while we’re at it, we probably should stop measuring tire sizes (and EUC’s) in inches as well... although EUC tires are more logical than car tires where the width is measured in imperial as well 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B08AH Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, FinRider said: And while we’re at it, we probably should stop measuring tire sizes (and EUC’s) in inches as well I have a bicycle with 700x40 tire. Metric sizes are already there, just need to start using it. Edited June 16, 2020 by B08AH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post FinRider Posted June 16, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 16, 2020 22 minutes ago, B08AH said: I have a bicycle with 700x40 tire. Metric sizes are already there, just need to start using it. I know... but this is how F’ed up the world deals with shit like this! my car has a 205/60R17 tire. In other words 205 mm wide With 60% sidewall height of the width. These are all nice metric stats... on a 17 inch rim... i also have a 65” TV... i know its about a 2.5x factor to get it to metric.. bit nobody says they have a 165cm TV, and if you did, nobody would have a clue what you are talking about but i am not complaining.. i am just glad i dont have to weigh myself in stones... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 3 hours ago, null said: I've noticed US Americans are adapting a bit to metric regarding EUCs. You can see it from the use of "kph" which is a direct translation of "mph". This is not a very good way of shortening it, because it skips the unit: Meter. kph is Kilo (1000) Per Hour. 1000 what per hour? Doesn't say. kph have been used before, mainly by non metric countries, but that doesn't make it a good habit. The EU, home of metric, uses km/h. kmh is better than kph if you want short. Anything but leaving out the main unit.. </2c rambling> hmmm? kilometre is a word.. kph means kilometres per hour 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davinche Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 20 minutes ago, Rywokast said: hmmm? kilometre is a word.. kph means kilometres per hour But kilometers is abbreviated as km.. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TheBladeOfHades Posted June 16, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 16, 2020 I am kind of disappointed with the s18 reviews, I understand that KS never has a good 1st batch of any wheel but I feel they did no real life testing themselves before the unveiled the wheel. Pads fall off, shock is awkward to pump, tire rubs on the fender because the shock is in the way, and the tilt back is obviously not working properly among other issues I’m sure. These are all problems they should of addressed before they even announced the s18. Sad they pushed it out early to steal Inmotion’s thunder, could of been a way better wheel if they actually put the time in 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBladeOfHades Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 Kph has been used alongside Kmph and km/h since 1911 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davinche Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 12 minutes ago, TheBladeOfHades said: I am kind of disappointed with the s18 reviews, I understand that KS never has a good 1st batch of any wheel but I feel they did no real life testing themselves before the unveiled the wheel. Pads fall off, shock is awkward to pump, tire rubs on the fender because the shock is in the way, and the tilt back is obviously not working properly among other issues I’m sure. These are all problems they should of addressed before they even announced the s18. Sad they pushed it out early to steal Inmotion’s thunder, could of been a way better wheel if they actually put the time in This is just how chinese companies operate. It is the same in the 3D printing community. Where I personally draw the line is if there are things missing that compromise the safety of the user. An example from the 3D printing community is a certain printer (which I will not name) that did not have thermal runaway protection. Malfunctions ended up burning someones house down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 35 minutes ago, davinche said: This is just how chinese companies operate. It is the same in the 3D printing community. Where I personally draw the line is if there are things missing that compromise the safety of the user. An example from the 3D printing community is a certain printer (which I will not name) that did not have thermal runaway protection. Malfunctions ended up burning someones house down. i have an artillery sidewinder... which is on version 4 lmao... creality has like a million printers, even prusa makes iterative upgrades and fixes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jon Stern Posted June 16, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 16, 2020 31 minutes ago, TheBladeOfHades said: Kph has been used alongside Kmph and km/h since 1911 In SI notation (the units used for science) velocity is in meters per second, written as ms-1 or m/s. So it makes sense that a scientifically-literate population (taught SI in school science classes) would use km/h as the everyday (colloquial) notation for speed. KPH creates ambiguity, as it doesn't follow a defined set of rules for how to abbreviate units. Does the person writing mean kilometres per hour, or kilo parsecs per hour? If 'k' is short for kilometer in this context, why is "m" in miles per gallon, not mega meters? There's no rhyme or reason to these abbreviations. To me, use of kph is one of many signs of low science literacy in America. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EUC Custom Power-Pads Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 22 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said: I find it amazing how people are justifying the problems with the wheel, by claiming its a prototype. If you can't get the basics right (like tire rubbing, valve placement, panel glue) in the first stages of ideas, why should we assume it will get better? 1 hour ago, TheBladeOfHades said: Pads fall off, shock is awkward to pump, tire rubs on the fender because the shock is in the way, and the tilt back is obviously not working properly among other issues I’m sure. These are all problems they should of addressed before they even announced the s18. This is what happens when you develop a wheel with a Fox damper and replace it at the end with another cheap piece of junk, where the valve has a different angle and the design is also different and suddenly presses on the fender. This is pure art of engineering. Maybe the problem with the fender will solve itself if the guy does not glue weld the steel suspension elements together correctly. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onizukagto Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Jon Stern said: In SI notation (the units used for science) velocity is in meters per second, written as ms-1 or m/s. So it makes sense that a scientifically-literate population (taught SI in school science classes) would use km/h as the everyday (colloquial) notation for speed. KPH creates ambiguity, as it doesn't follow a defined set of rules for how to abbreviate units. Does the person writing mean kilometres per hour, or kilo parsecs per hour? If 'k' is short for kilometer in this context, why is "m" in miles per gallon, not mega meters? There's no rhyme or reason to these abbreviations. To me, use of kph is one of many signs of low science literacy you aren't wrong, but its still a bit mean. At least they are trying? It's not their fault that they are taught with ”low science”, just have to adapt with what they can. the main thing is that we kinda know what they are talking about and most importantly, it won't catch on outside of the USA..... unless its one of the ”low science” country (North Korea? Afghanistan? ) anyway, it doesn't really affect the S18. it's not exactly a ”speed daemon” like a veteran, msx or v11. Edited June 16, 2020 by onizukagto grammarly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdab Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 24 minutes ago, onizukagto said: anyway, it doesn't really affect the S18. it's not exactly a ”speed daemon” like a veteran, msx or v11. The v11 is a ”speed daemon”? I thought it had the same max speed as the s18? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 2 hours ago, buell47 said: This is what happens when you develop a wheel with a Fox damper and replace it at the end with another cheap piece of junk, where the valve has a different angle and the design is also different and suddenly presses on the fender. That might explain it. So, if they now tweak the design for the cheaper shock, how upgradeable would it then be to the Fox shock (or others)? Hope they'll think it through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retrovertigo Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 So I've just watched an unboxing by EUCO (Electric Unicycle Collective) and they mention that on the production model, the shock will only have one filling valve (???) so how would that work then? Surely it would take away a whole lot of custom tuning....or am I just not understanding how it will work? They have already unboxed a V11 and seem to know their stuff, so I'm guessing they know for sure about the shock? They also said that the customer models will ship with gold suspension mounts as seen in some promo videos. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Retrovertigo said: So I've just watched an unboxing by EUCO (Electric Unicycle Collective) and they mention that on the production model, the shock will only have one filling valve (???) so how would that work then? Surely it would take away a whole lot of custom tuning....or am I just not understanding how it will work? They have already unboxed a V11 and seem to know their stuff, so I'm guessing they know for sure about the shock? They also said that the customer models will ship with gold suspension mounts as seen in some promo videos. I'll have to rewatch that as I didnt recall hearing that they will be changing the shock for production, as they already changed it from the fox... If they do go to single valve, I will cancel my order immediately. If i wanted such little control over shocks, I'd be more enthused towards the v11. Edited June 17, 2020 by ShanesPlanet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retrovertigo Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said: I'll have to rewatch that as I didnt recall hearing that they will be changing the shock for production, as they already changed it from the fox... If they do go to single valve, I will cancel my order immediately. If i wanted such little control over shocks, I'd be more enthused towards the v11. To be honest, although the S18 looks mighty sexy, the more I see of the V11, the more it looks like the "complete" package....apart from speed of course By the way, I did PM you last week I think it was, but it says something about you not being in the conversation anymore? Just in case you thought I was completely ignoring you Start watching that S18 video from about 4:40 , that's where he talks about the gold colour and shock. Edited June 17, 2020 by Retrovertigo 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfoxdude Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said: I'll have to rewatch that as I didnt recall hearing that they will be changing the shock for production, as they already changed it from the fox... If they do go to single valve, I will cancel my order immediately. If i wanted such little control over shocks, I'd be more enthused towards the v11. I saw this mentioned in the King Song Telegram group, and somebody claimed it was gonna be the DNM AO-38RC, but I couldn't find the original source for any of the information, so take it with a grain of salt 🤷♂️ Either way, the AOY-36RC is like an $85 shock isn't it? The S18 just takes a standard sized mountain bike shock, and I imagine it would be pretty straight forward to swap the shock out to whatever tickles one the most. I think the S18 is gonna be a fun wheel for tinkerers, that's for sure. Edit: Looking into different options on the market, it seems like the majority of the dual-chamber shocks only have one fill valve, and the shock handles balancing pressure between positive and negative chambers on its own. The lockout and response knobs control the flow restriction between the two chambers, compression vs rebound. I'm pretty sure the Fox shock they were testing with also has a single fill valve. I suppose that would be easier to setup, which might be more suitable for more people that don't want to tinker as much. Edited June 17, 2020 by redfoxdude 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) So the shock keeps changing the weight keeps changing, ks can't make an app worth shit and the tiltback is unknown. Quite frankly, the way KS has handled this release, My confidence in the wheel is already shot. I can't feel good about supporting such tactics and bullshit. It may be the greatest wheel of all time, but I just feel like I'm being setup and strung along, only to become a damn guinea pig. I'll gladly pad the pockets of e-wheels, but my conviction of KS being able to fully test and complete a reliable wheel, was shaken when they boffed the 16x. It seems to me that not much has changed in the methods of how these companies are too quick to try and get that money, but VERY shady and unreliable with the information even THEY release. I've enough to worry about, and paying $2k for a toy that also makes me worry.... hookers cost less and probably have a better reliability/safety rating. Edited June 17, 2020 by ShanesPlanet 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mrelwood Posted June 17, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) Quote who wants to risk a instaflat? Everyone who's not using Slime, Goop, or other working puncture repair / sealant. I agree completely with @ShanesPlanet (and others) on the S18 and it's first impression videos. Manufacturers are expected to get the wheel basics in order by now, before shipping the units to be publicly reviewed as means to improve sales. Messed up basics is a GW trait, and I believe it to be patented as well... I suspect that Inmotion will lose the first-suspension-to-market game, since they are serious about taking in feedback and actually fixing many of the issues the community is concerned about. They are taking their time to launch a finished product. For KingSong it took 4 years to even fix the horrible whine of the 16S... I'm sad to see some of my favourite YT reviewers turning for the shock-and-awe approach and less actual content. So far the SpeedyFeet review on the S18 is the only actual review I've seen. Others try to amaze with how KingSong is the first company to create an EUC with suspension (it's not), or how suspension in general is better than no suspension at all. Duh. How about reviewing the actual EUC and it's traits, good and bad? I will make a review as detailed and informative as I possibly can on the V11, and compare it with a friend's S18. The video won't beg for anyone to like, subscribe or share, and will feature zero product placement or sponsors. I'm doing it because completely independent and trustworthy reviews are so hard to find, and I want to help the community in making the better choice for their personal use. Not because of personal income or other gain. I won't claim that my review will be completely unbiased though, since all of us are biased for example by our subjective experiences on our past wheels. But I think that's ok, as long as one is open about it. Edited June 17, 2020 by mrelwood 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, mrelwood said: Everyone who's not using Slime, Goop, or other working puncture repair / sealant. literally the only time ive ever had an euc flat was when i used slime/goop ironically...and never once was it able to repair a tire either lol... i actually think it degrades the tubes, either that or its a massive coincidence but it seems completely useless to me because i have only ever got a flat from tube wear or a split at the valve, never from a puncture of any kind im pretty sure unless my euc was dropped directly onto a nail pointing up nothing is going to penetrate the tire because like i said in 45k+ km of riding never had any sort of puncture Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 6 minutes ago, Rywokast said: literally the only time ive ever had an euc flat was when i used slime/goop ironically... What a luck! And hats off to your kilometrage! A few things stand out though: 6 minutes ago, Rywokast said: and never once was it able to repair a tire either lol... "Never once"... meaning the one single time you had a flat, which was caused by: 6 minutes ago, Rywokast said: i have only ever got a flat from tube wear or a split at the valve, never from a puncture of any kind So nothing that any of the sealants even claim to be able to fix. There are many riders having good experiences in (good quality) sealants repairing punctures as advertized. If you ride only on smooth pavement and in places reachable by a cab, sure the risk is much smaller, and you might be ok without. I don't, and Goop has saved my butt in numerous occasions. Which I only learned about when replacing the tire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 9 minutes ago, mrelwood said: What a luck! And hats off to your kilometrage! A few things stand out though: "Never once"... meaning the one single time you had a flat, which was caused by: So nothing that any of the sealants even claim to be able to fix. There are many riders having good experiences in (good quality) sealants repairing punctures as advertized. If you ride only on smooth pavement and in places reachable by a cab, sure the risk is much smaller, and you might be ok without. I don't, and Goop has saved my butt in numerous occasions. Which I only learned about when replacing the tire. yea of course i can only speak for myself, but what i was saying is that out of the i think five or six wheels that i had put slime and goop in when i heard it was all the rage, those all got flats either by splitting or wear, which led me to consider that maybe it actually degrades the tubes in some way because although i do buy and sell a lot of wheels, never has one had a flat that didnt have slime in it O.o could be pure coincidence though.. i know it is only meant for repairing small punctures but apparently im immune from that so i dont worry about it in the slightest... i do however think that it would be a smart thing to carry a small pump and tube of slime just in case you do get a puncture like a nail that you can pull out because in that situation slime could save you at least until you got home rather than having to walk the wheel or call a cab lol.. but i think if you put something in the tire as a preventative measure, goop is the better choice 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Kim Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 The last few pages are tough to read. Seems enthusiasm for this wheel has hit rock bottom! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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