INMOTION V11 (2020)

[meepmeepmayer]

I suspect this wheel has actual ergonomics (from the looks of their ambition), and it might very well be that once you try the suspension, every suspensionless wheel will feel outdated and uncomfortable afterwards.

This is the most "real life decides how good it is" wheel ever, the specs mean little. Can't wait to hear and see some impressions. When can we expect those?

[RoadRunner]

 

[RoadRunner]

38 minutes ago, Unventor said:

I heard same thing about Z10 at first and again on the Nikola and again on KS16x. 

Thing is most people don't like chane in general. But once people get used to the new it becomes the "old" usual...

Not for me.

Did not like the looks of the Nikola in the beginning and still don’t like it.

Loved the look of the 16X from day one, and still do.

 

[stephen]

15 minutes ago, RoadRunner said:

Not for me.

Did not like the looks of the Nikola in the beginning and still don’t like it.

Loved the look of the 16X from day one, and still do.

 

I'll second that👍

[.....]

10 minutes ago, stephen said:

I'll second that👍

Im a fan of the simplicity designs. This new design seems to be the OTHER end of the spectrum.  The suspension intrigues me, but nothing else about it, really holds any interest.  I applaud them for bringing something new to the table, and just because it isnt anywhere near my likings of visual flavor or specs, anything to propel the industry, is a good thing. Even if the V11 was a flop, it at least lets the other manufacturers know what NOT to do next. If the suspension is a winner, im sure itll be implemented in much better stylings, across more brands in the future.  Im sure theyll sell a few,  people will throw BIG money at something unproven and not even released yet. Bless the test rats, their fat pockets and unending hopes!

[SamSuffit]

I was really wondering about several points before the presentation, notably about:

• Suspension => not many details given, we'll have to wait for the tests by the usual suspects on Youtube
• Speed: 50 kmh is ok as long as it is not limited quickly by the battery and the power in reserve is ok
• Battery: not huge, but big enough to be ok. HOWEVER: the battery is in the best spot we could hope for, and the wheel is not to fat because of it. So the balance of the wheel should be good, close to the ground.
• Trolley handle: the look of the old scorpion handle from Inmotion (Ugly) or Gotway Nikola (Impractical) made me very worried. And they nailed it for the V11! (the cut off button is perfect also)
• Waterproof!!!!! IP55 is currently the best standard for EUC, and it is kept for this wheel

So the only really bad news for me are the price and the weight. Let's wait for the suspension and feeling of the wheel to be tested before any conclusion.

Edited April 3, 2020 by SamSuffit

[.....]

Being an 'off road' vehicle, I wonder how all those protruding angles and open cooling area, will do when its slammed into a mud puddle and bounces off a rock, BEFORE happening to stop right where it needs to, so you can land back on it and crack a rib? Having a headlight that pisses everyone off coming at you, and is attached to a constantly bouncing and swinging body, while generating heat to be pulled thru the shroud? DId anyone else notice how narrow the stand was and how carefully it was placed on the podium (level/flat)? I wanna see how NZrolls manages to handle this one? My euc happily lays on its side when its parked in the wild, protected by neoprene. How odd, my off road motorcycles NEVER had a stand as its OFF ROAD!! Seems like the developers got confused. Lets make it for off road, but focus on highway lighting, body stylings and a kick stand.

[WaveCut]

1 minute ago, ShanesPlanet said:

Having a headlight that pisses everyone off coming at you

It's lensed, will work the same as autoomobile light, not blinding ppl in front but laying the beam gently

[Unventor]

1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said:

I suspect this wheel has actual ergonomics (from the looks of their ambition), and it might very well be that once you try the suspension, every suspensionless wheel will feel outdated and uncomfortable afterwards.

This is the most "real life decides how good it is" wheel ever, the specs mean little. Can't wait to hear and see some impressions. When can we expect those?

I fully agree on this. 

Liam suggested waigly that they are going to test 1st batch prototype first. Then they should enter some type of test/review. Maybe late May. This was the reply he gave to my question about demos or reviews by public.

I have been thinking a bit about the motor. I think this is one major and important thing people overlooked. In general we are used to smaller rim = more torque. This is because more or less motors have same diameter. So to make a bigger wheel a rim extention is added. But they said they made their own motor design and it is bigger (without any details). 

So by bigger you could make the actual motor diameter bigger without the rim extention. Or make it wider due to a wider rim/tyre. Or even both. Doing this would add weight. There isn't really two ways about it. 

So considering this I think this would explain too why they settled on the battery size/capacity as they did. Bigger battery adds both weight/size/cost. Having a suspension system takes room and weight too. 

So to accommodate this, it is a compromise, do you need side lights/speakers. Also the heavier it is the more does it take to drive it forward aka response feel and battery power. 

So what on paper at first glance look like a 85% top wheel, might not be that bad if ride comfort and cruise commuting is your game. 

So as far as price goes...I expect they need to give so heavy discounts to early buyers. They need riders to say this is an good wheel. And that the suspension really works. Because if it only okey, why would most people they pay that extra cash and in a aftermatch of covid-19 in a struggling world economy....

Also comming mid summer  or late. Means when word of mouth spreads it is end of season for countries around me. Not all live in southern California.

Today we got first glance. Next month we might be a little wiser on what it can do.

[Marty Backe]

1 hour ago, Sebrios said:

I wasn't impressed with the specs either. HOWEVER, something I was thinking about a few mins ago, is that they spec the wheel @50km/h

GW and KS spec theirs at 20mph.

Remember one thing is what the specs say, and a VERY DIFFERENT what the wheel can actually do.

Hoping to see some Russians do a scary speed test to know the reality.

 

Using the V10 as the Inmotion model, I expect this to be a 50km/h wheel for the first 20% of the battery. And I bet even at 100% battery it will be tilting back gently before 50km/h

It's just part of Inmotions MO. Knowing wrong with that. But if they are going to compete with the big boys (KingSong and Gotway) then they have to deliver the goods.

Can't wait to see how this actually performs during a 80-km ride

[.....]

the new hid style headlights in cars also blind people and are both a cutting color and excessively bright. All speculation tho, we havent seen it in person. I just know that my euc headlight is not very usefull as my euc tends to waver more than a car. They are touting an insane ammount of lumens, so no doubt it will be bright. Just dont lean back with traffic in front of you. Beam direction is more important than intensity.

Edited April 3, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Unventor]

@ShanesPlanet the headlight is a high and low beam design. So exactly how the power is decided between there de don know. But looking at KS16X that have something similar is acturly really good imho. Let's say it is a 40% long beam and 60% wide narrow pointing down beam it would not need to blind people that much. It is about direction, and if it can dim down smartly. 

Yet something we might see more about in a practical review. And maybe something that can be tweaked in firmware from rides feedback. 

Now on the ceo interview they talked about using AI in upcoming wheels. But V11 is not utilizing this (at least as next upcoming wheel). That is still not the same that AI can help them collect data that can be used in other wheels for fine tuning lights at a later point. 

I just can't help thinking of the other next wheel, why it does that take 6 months more to develop. 

Now they did mention in the interview they have more wheels in thoughts that they view as performance wheels. So if that is the case then it is interesting they are widening their product range. I  view this as a good thing as it means you might find a wheel that suits you as a rider better.

Moving away from one wheel to rule them all.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Unventor

[.....]

I just wanted to see a wheel that was no frills and could get me down the road at 45mph. Im not a speed demon, its just 45mph is the speed to safely keep up with residential traffic (and rural) and not get run over. I am beginning to think that we need an incredible update to battery or motor tech, to get this done. Of course, these are designed in China. Obviously they have different traffic patterns and speeds. Here in the USA, 45mph isnt that fast, nor is it uncommon to need to go that fast to NOT be a detriment to traffic.  I was really expecting something new in the works for power/speed ability. Im glad they are trying out new things, they just didnt quite cater to the things i was hoping to see. A REAL pro euc would push the envelopes of speed, durability and power. When i think PRO, i dont assume safety should be a primary concern. Bright lights are nice, but i got easy solutions for that and they can be aimed(how do you keep a headlight aimed on an euc that moves in all direction at random as you ride?). Some cars came with moving headlights to help with this, but man what a nightmare to keep them operating for any length of time. I dont have an easy solution to keeping up with standard traffic. I'm eagerly awaiting what KS comes up with, as they ALREADY meet the specs of this NEW euc, in the places that I find value. I wonder if those pedals are Chinese feet sized or big American foot sized?

Edited April 3, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Unventor]

@Marty Backe have you heard anything from Inmotion or @Jason McNeil about test rides yet that you can mention  (unless you are on a nda😉)?

[Unventor]

7 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

Here in the USA, 45mph isnt that fast, nor is it uncommon to need to go that fast to NOT be a detriment to traffic.  I was really expecting something new in the works for power/speed ability.

Well in an EUC ride and faceplant situation even with a off helmet I think 45mph is scary speed. I really doubt how much you can recover from such an accident. I doubt it to being back to normal in a reasonable time, if ever.

The second part as a loose wheel travels onwards at those speeds and at its weight, I hope not for it to hit an innocent pedestrian or cyclist, adult or kid matters less as both would be harmed pretty badly. 

Edited April 3, 2020 by Unventor

[.....]

Ive hit the ground more than once in excess of 40mph, you can survive and recover(dirt bikes, bicycles, street bikes). The debate is safety vs speed i guess. When i hear 'pro', I assume that 'safety' falls further down the list. Riding along a canyon edge or near 60mph traffic... safe?  Maybe it would be the end an euc company IF they catered to the individual that accepts risk and chooses to push it or not. Fwiw, i was never normal, so hitting the pavement hard, wont fix that.  I'd imagine the guys involved in X-games, are aware of the deadly risks they take, yet they still take them. I would suspect that IF an euc maker made a model that would realistically keep up with traffic, helmet laws would begin being written into the books. Hell, i could foresee them being mandated to be insured as well. At a certain threshold, politics surely do interfere. Streetable Scooters vs mopeds illustrate that fairly well.

Edited April 3, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Stillhart]

15 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

I just wanted to see a wheel that was no frills and could get me down the road at 45mph. Im not a speed demon, its just 45mph is the speed to safely keep up with residential traffic (and rural) and not get run over. I am beginning to think that we need an incredible update to battery or motor tech, to get this done. Of course, these are designed in China. Obviously they have different traffic patterns and speeds. Here in the USA, 45mph isnt that fast, nor is it uncommon to need to go that fast to NOT be a detriment to traffic.  I was really expecting something new in the works for power/speed ability. Im glad they are trying out new things, they just didnt quite cater to the things i was hoping to see. A REAL pro euc would push the envelopes of speed, durability and power. When i think PRO, i dont assume safety should be a primary concern. Bright lights are nice, but i got easy solutions for that and they can be aimed(how do you keep a headlight aimed on an euc that moves in all direction at random as you ride?). Some cars came with moving headlights to help with this, but man what a nightmare to keep them operating for any length of time. I dont have an easy solution to keeping up with standard traffic. I'm eagerly awaiting what KS comes up with, as they ALREADY meet the specs of this NEW euc, in the places that I find value. I wonder if those pedals are Chinese feet sized or big American foot sized?

I don't know man, maybe an EUC just isn't suited for your needs?  There are plenty of other devices you can use to go 45mph more safely than on an EUC.

[.....]

Its not wrong of me to WISH for something that hasnt been designed yet. I have vehicles to fit speed needs, I just wouldnt mind having other options too. If we all just decided that good enough was 'good enough', there wouldnt be a suspension on this one. I could easily say... 'if you want to offroad with a suspension, perhaps you need something other than an euc."  Until today, there was no option. The refusal to accept the status quo as 'good enough', is exactly waht propels change. And safety? GIve me a break guys, the moment you buy an euc, you are obviously accepting increased danger to enjoy something. You want safe... dont get in a car, dont walk in public and dont eat fast food.  Its all about acceptable risk. 200mph on a sportbike is acceptable risk for me, for some it isnt.  Opinions vary, and it seems my willingness to accept risk in the pursuit of enjoyment, must be the vast minority. I'll bow out of this thread now, as I can tell im not doing anything but becoming a negative nancy. Fwiw, im glad they came out with something new, and Im sure it's meeting the wants of many. Hooray for new ideas!

Edited April 3, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[houseofjob]

9 hours ago, Jason McNeil said:

Suspension: it's a pity the presentation didn't include any video clips showing this key feature in action, this is after all the main selling point of the V11.  

Hey Jason, hope you're well and well bunkered~

Out of curiosity and boredom, did InMotion reveal how they're implementing this suspension? Are the air springs anchored to the axles first, then attached to some combo assembly of upper handle shell + pedals & pedal arm support? Or is it axle to support posts to spring to pedals to upper assembly? Or another method?

Also, any mention on whether the air in the springs can be tuned to the rider payload?

 

Edited April 3, 2020 by houseofjob

[bigwave]

3 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Also, any mention on whether the air in the springs can be tuned to the rider payload?

From what little I know about "Air Suspension " its application is primarily for heavy vehicles (buses , heavy equipment etc) or in a racing application used to smooth out bumps encountered on a track. My truck for instance, has air suspension but it only activates when I'm towing say, a  heavy trailer . The main issue with air suspension is controlling the compression and the rebound . Without control of those two factors ,the potential for a "pogo stick" feeling is possible. 

Since they did not expand on what components are being used ,its just all speculation at this point. I would think there would have to be an adjustment system available because there will be a vast range of rider weight to accommodate . It will be air adjustment (if any) because there is no access to "a spring style shock" to adjust the compression and/or rebound .An air system on something this small might do very well in smoothing out the ride without the need for over engineering.

[Phong Vu]

@ShanesPlanet Could be my bad English, but why you sound so angry man?  
Chill out and look other way if this not fit your wish/need.

For me, this wheel have the look of Z10, the performance at least on pair with 16X, if not 18XL and the practical + reliability of the Inmotion.
Looking forward for those first reviewers.

The price is a little bit much for pre-order tho  

[.....]

16 minutes ago, Phong Vu said:

@ShanesPlanet Could be my bad English, but why you sound so angry man?  
Chill out and look other way if this not fit your wish/need.

For me, this wheel have the look of Z10, the performance at least on pair with 16X, if not 18XL and the practical + reliability of the Inmotion.
Looking forward for those first reviewers.

The price is a little bit much for pre-order tho  

sorry, not angry, just a little disappointed. Its my own fault as I always have expectations that are not so reasonable. I was REALLY hoping THIS was going to force me to buy another wheel.  Being told that I shouldn't want something to be 'better' and should buy something else entirely (things i already own), rubs me a little tho. Being told that something is too dangerous is also not something I enjoy. But you are right, I come off angry and because of this, I keep few friends and imagine people groan as I approach. Your view is noted and I will try to restrain myself from being the devil's advocate, more often. I DO make everyone else seem more tolerable, so there's always that!

Edited April 4, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Marty Backe]

22 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

sorry, not angry, just a little disappointed. Its my own fault as I always have expectations that are not so reasonable. I was REALLY hoping THIS was going to force me to buy another wheel.  Being told that I shouldn't want something to be 'better' and should buy something else entirely (things i already own), rubs me a little tho. Being told that something is too dangerous is also not something I enjoy. But you are right, I come off angry and because of this, I keep few friends and imagine people groan as I approach. Your view is noted and I will try to restrain myself from being the devil's advocate, more often. I DO make everyone else seem more tolerable, so there's always that!

You are far from annoying. Read the last few years of this forum and you'll find some true examples of annoying 

So far, "angry" is not a an adjective that I'd apply you. I reserve the right to change my opinion 

Stick around 

[Marty Backe]

2 hours ago, Unventor said:

@Marty Backe have you heard anything from Inmotion or @Jason McNeil about test rides yet that you can mention  (unless you are on a nda😉)?

I don't have any expectations of getting access to one of these wheels unless I buy one, which isn't in the cards right now.

[Stillhart]

32 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

sorry, not angry, just a little disappointed. Its my own fault as I always have expectations that are not so reasonable. I was REALLY hoping THIS was going to force me to buy another wheel.  Being told that I shouldn't want something to be 'better' and should buy something else entirely (things i already own), rubs me a little tho. Being told that something is too dangerous is also not something I enjoy. But you are right, I come off angry and because of this, I keep few friends and imagine people groan as I approach. Your view is noted and I will try to restrain myself from being the devil's advocate, more often. I DO make everyone else seem more tolerable, so there's always that!

I apologize if what I said "rubs you".  I was trying to be as gentle as possible but you can never tell how someone will react.  But I stand by my comment.  There's nothing wrong with wanting to see things improve, but you are asking for things that aren't possible and you admitted it yourself.  You said "we need an incredible update to battery or motor tech, to get this done". 

EUC's fit in a niche among many other PEV's.  I think it's far more likely that we'll see the kinds of innovations the V11 is coming up with rather than a technological revolution.  The benefits of innovating within their niche far outweigh the risks of innovating outside their niche, where they have to compete with other established devices.  There's tons of room for improvements like the V11 brings.  Financially, it's a safer bet and these companies are here to make money.

So what I was trying to suggest, and clearly I did a poor job of it, is that bemoaning something that is highly unlikely will keep you constantly disappointed.  Setting your expectations to something more realistic might lower the instances of you posting disappointed, annoyed rants. 

Again, I apologize.  You're an adult and you will make your own decisions.  I wasn't trying to tell you want to do or think.  Just making a suggestion on another way to think about things that might make you slightly less unhappy.