The Gotway Tesla 1020wh Model Open Box and Initial thoughts

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

1 hour ago, ir_fuel said:

Seriously hesitating myself. I want more power for off-road riding.

Wait for that Ninebot Z series to come to market

Wait for the KingSong KS18L to come to market (I really don't like the big KingSong box form factor)

Get the new Rockwheel GT16 (but that's 16")

Get Robocop protection and order a Gotway MSuper V3?

Or do as Marty does and buy all the above.  

[US69]

2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

I believe Rockwheel Store has a warehouse in the Netherlands, so that may explain the lack of import costs for the buyers.

Nope, thats on nearly all EUC sellers...must be a aliexpress partner in netherlands.

But its true that Rockwheel Store now has a partner in europe, where GT16 are stocked...he is doing promotion that you have the wheel in 5-7 days....

@ir_fuel so if you want a Gt16, i would ask rockwheel.

The french forum used a 1000dollar -rockwheel- offer for the 858wh and brought it further down by a kind of "payback-thing" in france (5% extra down).....so that i goes out to 820euro.

Look at the france forum for more info-espritroue.fr

[Meng Yang]

9 hours ago, mezzanine said:

 

Picking up this airwheel x3 for $100 will hopefully be a worthwhile investment in helping me to make a final decision on a real wheel. 

The funny thing is that it's hard to know exactly what kind of rider I'll be.  I am definitely looking for practical transportation as my primary objective, but I've read so accounts of people going straight for the higher powered models once they get a taste.  

And I sadly have to agree with you about Aliexpress, at least as a Canadian.  Makes the idea of gambling on a Gotway a riskier proposition, I think.  Still thinking about getting in touch with the company out in Vancouver to ask them about their after-sales service on the ACM. 

I was really hoping the internals or QC would show signs of significant improvement with the Tesla after all the recent trouble, but that doesn't appear to be the case.   

 

Glad I picked up a $150 Airwheel X3 when I was a newbie. Got all my learning, thrashing, smashing and scratching done on this learner's wheel. Doesn't matter that it's all scratched up with a broken pedal, because I've become a confident rider, ready for the ultimate wheel. Well, that was Q4 2016, and the best wheel (for my purpose - short sprints around the neighborhood to buy stuff and carry the wheel up 4 flight of stairs multiple times a day) was the V8.  So yeah, I'm happy with the V8 for my purpose. I hardly drop it; and its got a protective cover around, so its still in great condition and the LEDs are beautiful.

My point is, do all you learning on the cheapo wheel and enjoy the performance of an expensive wheel without the scratches. 

That said, I've discovered I like to use my EUC more than just my initial intention of running errands at work. Thus, as I go further, I found the 30 kph top speed to be limiting. So I'm buying a 2nd wheel - the Tesla - with one for work and one for play.

On reflection, if I were able to re-buy my real first wheel after my X3, I would have straight away jumped onto the Tesla and skipped the V8, coz its got practically everything the V8 has and more. Its got better speed and acceleration (likely due to higher torque). Its likely to be less responsive than the V8 (V8 has the hardest pedal setting of all), but should be fine. Both has trolley handle (which I can't do without). Both has beautiful LEDs. Its got a lower CG and should feel more stable. It may be less agile than V8 (very fun) but would be better for cruising. Its got much better range (V8 is pathetic! Only 80%-100% battery is fun. After than, you can feel the drop in power). It may be almost 6 kg heavier, but I can still handle it. I'm not too worried about Gotway's well-known QC for its wheels coz I ordered it from a reputable local shop, whom I'm sure will help out when problem arises.

Well, just sharing my experience.

[houseofjob]

10 minutes ago, Meng Yang said:

Its likely to be less responsive than the V8 (V8 has the hardest pedal setting of all), but should be fine.

Tesla is on the harder side of responses for Gotway, but yes, V8 is harder (not by much though).

 

10 minutes ago, Meng Yang said:

Both has trolley handle (which I can't do without).

Tesla trolley feels thinner and thus, not as sturdy-feeling as the V8 trolley, but does the job.

 

10 minutes ago, Meng Yang said:

Its got a lower CG and should feel more stable.

Tesla absolutely feels more stable (V8 always felt a bit top-heavy to me).

The Tesla, dare I say, felt like the most stable 16" I've ever been on, and that includes, Ninebot Ones, ACM, KS16 series, V8, GT16. Really felt like the rubbery and heavier-end CST tire plus egg-shaped design, what with the weight distribution, contributes to this.

 

10 minutes ago, Meng Yang said:

I'm not too worried about Gotway's well-known QC for its wheels coz I ordered it from a reputable local shop, whom I'm sure will help out when problem arises.

Chinese forums are saying the Tesla board has been improved to run cooler than previous MSuperV3/ACM/Monster 84V boards. Plus, they quote the same "dual-redundancy" that is stated on the Ninebot One Z10 marketing points (still not sure what this is). As well, they say the shell construction (carbon fiber, constitution, etc) seems better.

Personally, I look at the Gotway Tesla quality / engineering as an extension of the improvements brought upon by the MSuperV3/ACM/Monster, as the design is not original (see MCM4), and the internal components carry all the improvement signatures seen adopted in its current predecessors. 

Unless you're really trying to carry out the trifecta process of running a wheel into the ground (heavyweight rider + super prolonged inclines + tropical climates), doubt we'll see the same frequency in the same issues we've seen this past year in Gotway.

[mezzanine]

22 minutes ago, Meng Yang said:

Glad I picked up a $150 Airwheel X3 when I was a newbie. Got all my learning, thrashing, smashing and scratching done on this learner's wheel. Doesn't matter that it's all scratched up with a broken pedal, because I've become a confident rider, ready for the ultimate wheel. Well, that was Q4 2016, and the best wheel (for my purpose - short sprints around the neighborhood to buy stuff and carry the wheel up 4 flight of stairs multiple times a day) was the V8.  So yeah, I'm happy with the V8 for my purpose. I hardly drop it; and its got a protective cover around, so its still in great condition and the LEDs are beautiful.

My point is, do all you learning on the cheapo wheel and enjoy the performance of an expensive wheel without the scratches. 

That said, I've discovered I like to use my EUC more than just my initial intention of running errands at work. Thus, as I go further, I found the 30 kph top speed to be limiting. So I'm buying a 2nd wheel - the Tesla - with one for work and one for play.

On reflection, if I were able to re-buy my real first wheel after my X3, I would have straight away jumped onto the Tesla and skipped the V8, coz its got practically everything the V8 has and more. Its got better speed and acceleration (likely due to higher torque). Its likely to be less responsive than the V8 (V8 has the hardest pedal setting of all), but should be fine. Both has trolley handle (which I can't do without). Both has beautiful LEDs. Its got a lower CG and should feel more stable. It may be less agile than V8 (very fun) but would be better for cruising. Its got much better range (V8 is pathetic! Only 80%-100% battery is fun. After than, you can feel the drop in power). It may be almost 6 kg heavier, but I can still handle it. I'm not too worried about Gotway's well-known QC for its wheels coz I ordered it from a reputable local shop, whom I'm sure will help out when problem arises.

Well, just sharing my experience.

 

I had a funny moment earlier this afternoon when I realized I'd been fully infected by you all here.  I was thinking about whether I should even bother with the x3 considering I'm going to get a more significant wheel regardless.  I said to myself, "well, you should probably get the x3 anyway as a back up wheel."  This from someone who didn't know about EUCs a week ago and doesn't yet own a wheel. 

Your comment about skipping the V8 and going straight to the Tesla is the dilemma I'm facing.  I'm concerned about the V8 battery and hadn't read anyone mention before about the power to the wheel decreasing substantially once you're out of the initial fully-charged range. 

I did an experiment today while at the gym to determine whether the additional weight of the Tesla would make it much less transportable than I imagine the V8 to be.  My expectation was that the Tesla would cross the weight threshold at which I would feel comfortable lugging the EUC up stairs.  In fact, I think I would manage the Tesla just fine and won't use weight as a factor in my final decision.         

[HermanTheGerman]

If I ever would try a Gotway, then it would be the Tesla. 

I'm thinking about upgrading from my KS16B to the KS16S, but I'll see if I can try a Tesla before.

[who_the]

Everybody should start with a cheap wheel. Beat it to crap, don't worry about how it looks or what a beating it takes. Because your wheel will take a beating while you learn, it's just the way it works. Learning isn't easy either, it's frustrating, time-consuming, and painful.

But it's all worth it.

[meepmeepmayer]

@ir_fuel What wheel do you have now? Other than that, the msuper is perfectly fine and a known quantity. If you stress it extremely (aka constant steep inclines for minutes), the motor cables will melt, but other than that there are no issues (like when going just very high speed or offroad). But you'll have to know what wheel you want.

@mezzanine We got you! (infected) Actually, the wheels got you (and us) and we helped them get you (we had no choice).

If you're already worried about range/battery now, you'll probably not be happy with the V8. The V8 also is on the slower end of wheels and you might even think it is too slow (I'm recently and unexpectedly hitting my self-imposed 30 km/h limit all the time on my ACM and would not want a wheel where 30 is the end like the V8 - and that maybe only when the battery is closer to full, not sure). Cold temperatures (Canada cliche) also don't help getting the most out of your batteries, so some extra capacity may be nice.

Depending on price, either the Tesla or the Rockwheel GT16 seem like the best options for you in my view. ACM is so unwieldy to carry/not ride - but maybe the other wheels aren't so much better for that, they all weigh more or less the same after all.

[Meng Yang]

1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Depending on price, either the Tesla or the Rockwheel GT16 seem like the best options for you in my view. ACM is so unwieldy to carry/not ride - but maybe the other wheels aren't so much better for that, they all weigh more or less the same after all.

Yeah. GT16 seems cool. I've only had a 30 sec ride on it and it already feels like a great wheel. Its more stable than V8, way faster, not too much heavier and turns almost as great as my V8. Only things that worry me are (1) the lack of an extensible trolley and (2) since it has open vents for cooling the mainboard, I'm afraid water will get in.

ACM is great but its even heavier, lacks trolley, has low footrests (I've already scraped my footrests on sharp cornering with my V8 - and got a few good scare), but is the most powerful 16" with a stable ride.

KS-16S is the best all-round package (until Tesla arrives), coz its well-designed, has trolley and is stable at speeds. Unfortunately, its only limited to a lowly 35 km/h. I'm pretty sure I need something at least 40 kph-capable to be happy.

KS-18S has been praised everywhere, but for me, I'll miss the acceleration & sharp turns of the 16".

Z10 was all the rave until (1) recent videos seem to show its lacking in power, (2) 1800W isn't gonna accelerate the huge 4.1"-wide tire any faster than the KS-18S, (3) should weigh more than 20 kg and (4) external trolley may break upon a tumble.

Thus, TESLA seems to be a God-sent for me! Its everything I need. 

[US69]

5 hours ago, who_the said:

Everybody should start with a cheap wheel. Beat it to crap, don't worry about how it looks or what a beating it takes. Because your wheel will take a beating while you learn, it's just the way it works. Learning isn't easy either, it's frustrating, time-consuming, and painful.

But it's all worth it.

I see it the other way around....dont waste your time and money with learning on a cheap wheel.

A cheap wheel did not bring the experince a quality wheel will, it may even push you away from EUC again as cheap wheels have speed and cut-out problems....and even for a cheap one you have to invest about 300bucks or so.(and it will be hard to sell that crap later)

from my view, you should get the best EUC that fits your needs and you find attractive, pad it up and protext ot with foam as hell, and you are good to go. As soon as you are able to drive (30minutes-5hours)...the beating-wheel-time is over, and you will be happy not to stand on a chinese generic :-)

but theopinion about this thematic  is split into 2 devisions here since day one :-)

everyone has to decide that for himself...

[Bambino]

Hello Hello

 

Yes, i buy from Rockwheel Store on ali express. They have a warehouse in Netherlands and i didn´t pay taxes in Portugal.

The seller is great ( i bought Kingsong 18 s 1500w/1680wh), and i gave me all the help i need with a lilte problem i have.

 

I recommend to all this seller and this wheel (KS 18S).

I like Msuper but i never had one... maybe someday.... or not.... because the Gotway Tesla i think is good, and i am waiting to see KS 18L.

 

 

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

  That's a pretty steep hill climb... even for Marty.   You know something is going scary fast when the Chinese put on a full face helmet and wear safety gear.  

There's also some Monster Westerner weight testing video as well that follows... 

Looks like a sales video:

 

[Marty Backe]

1 hour ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

  That's a pretty steep hill climb... even for Marty.   You know something is going scary fast when the Chinese put on a full face helmet and wear safety gear.  

There's also some Monster Westerner weight testing video as well that follows... 

Looks like a sales video:

 

Looks like some fun hill climbing. Much funner on grass versus the gravel and dirt hills I climb. And nice job by the guy that comes down the hill, backwards 

Yeah, carrying that guy doesn't look exactly fun.

[Barry Chen]

On 2017/9/17 at 5:29 AM, ir_fuel said:

Seriously hesitating myself. I want more power for off-road riding.

Wait for that Ninebot Z series to come to market

Wait for the KingSong KS18L to come to market (I really don't like the big KingSong box form factor)

Get the new Rockwheel GT16 (but that's 16")

Get Robocop protection and order a Gotway MSuper V3?

18" will be the best choice I guess.

 

Then again, might be better to just wait until spring 2018.

Maybe all almost Euc fans who had rided Rockwheel GT16 know that perfromance is its standard.GT16 had resived and upgraded for the former model occur so many problem.

And now ,whatever for its quality or its speed have a great improvement.The high speed can up to 50KM/H.In same kind of 16" ,the price of GT16 is one of the best  affordable.

As I know .Whatever V8 or ACM3 their power and speed can't reach to GT16.

[ir_fuel]

On 17/09/2017 at 10:44 AM, meepmeepmayer said:

@ir_fuel What wheel do you have now? Other than that, the msuper is perfectly fine and a known quantity. If you stress it extremely (aka constant steep inclines for minutes), the motor cables will melt, but other than that there are no issues (like when going just very high speed or offroad). But you'll have to know what wheel you want.

Inmotion V8.

[ir_fuel]

On 17/09/2017 at 8:42 AM, who_the said:

Everybody should start with a cheap wheel. Beat it to crap, don't worry about how it looks or what a beating it takes. Because your wheel will take a beating while you learn, it's just the way it works. Learning isn't easy either, it's frustrating, time-consuming, and painful.

But it's all worth it.

That's what I did too.

And I still use the cheap generic one for learning new stuff (e.g. riding backwards, or on one foot). So in my case the "after one week you don't use it anymore" isn't true.

 

[ir_fuel]

On 17/09/2017 at 6:26 AM, Meng Yang said:

That said, I've discovered I like to use my EUC more than just my initial intention of running errands at work. Thus, as I go further, I found the 30 kph top speed to be limiting. So I'm buying a 2nd wheel - the Tesla - with one for work and one for play.

The issue is also about how far you want to go wearing protective gear. I am cruising around at 25-28 km/h with my V8, but once you go 35-50 km/h you need motorcycle gear to protect yourself (especially for the face, because a faceplant will be horrendous at 45 km/h). I don't want to suit up for 5 minutes everytime I go out, so it might be wiser to use a lower speed limit wheel so you don't get tempted to go 45 km/h in shorts and t shirt, with a simple bicycle helmet "just for once".

And for me it's not about going faster top speed wise, I want to be able to go faster on more difficult terrain uphill, so it's torque you need.

[Scatcat]

On 2017-09-17 at 12:25 PM, Meng Yang said:

Yeah. GT16 seems cool. I've only had a 30 sec ride on it and it already feels like a great wheel. Its more stable than V8, way faster, not too much heavier and turns almost as great as my V8. Only things that worry me are (1) the lack of an extensible trolley and (2) since it has open vents for cooling the mainboard, I'm afraid water will get in.

ACM is great but its even heavier, lacks trolley, has low footrests (I've already scraped my footrests on sharp cornering with my V8 - and got a few good scare), but is the most powerful 16" with a stable ride.

KS-16S is the best all-round package (until Tesla arrives), coz its well-designed, has trolley and is stable at speeds. Unfortunately, its only limited to a lowly 35 km/h. I'm pretty sure I need something at least 40 kph-capable to be happy.

KS-18S has been praised everywhere, but for me, I'll miss the acceleration & sharp turns of the 16".

Z10 was all the rave until (1) recent videos seem to show its lacking in power, (2) 1800W isn't gonna accelerate the huge 4.1"-wide tire any faster than the KS-18S, (3) should weigh more than 20 kg and (4) external trolley may break upon a tumble.

Thus, TESLA seems to be a God-sent for me! Its everything I need. 

If you look into the open vents on the GT16, you'll see a minuscule hole in the middle behind the light-/charger-assembly. That is an air-duct and the only way in for water into the controller compartment. The other, bigger holes are to the cooling sink, and will not let water into the same compartment as the controller or cables.

The small air-duct is the only really vulnerable point for the controller compartment, especially on V2, where the sealing of the control-box has become better. My own solution to the smallish risk of a splash leading to a drop of water or two getting into the controller compartment, was getting myself some conformal coating spray. When I changed boards for a totally different reason (broken gyro), I sprayed the new board with a nice coating on the top-side. It won't help if there's a lot of water getting in, but will protect from stray drops getting sucked in and landing on the board.

But let's not overinflate the risks involved. Unless you hose it down or try riding through a car washer just for fun, the risk of water getting into the control-board compartment is really small on the newer version. On the older ones, the sealing of the power-button and LEDs where not as good, but the new ones seem really solid.

There are four areas of potential vulnerability to water in the GT16 V2:

1. The small holes I spoke of.
2. The seal for the cables from the lights and charging port.
3. The plastic wall between the wheel and the cable compartment.
4. The lid of the control-box.

1. The holes will only be vulnerable to water spraying in from the sides and hitting just wrong, which isn't bloody likely.

2. The cables are sealed with silicone, but if that fails for some reason, small amount of water might get in. Actually shorting something and doing damage isn't very likely.

3. The plastic wall is sealed with silicone, and unless some physical object succeeds in getting in and doing some serious damage, it won't be a problem. Even so it has to create a serious leak for enough water to get in to short anything.

4. The lids, especially the new ones, are by no means leaky, but there IS a plastic and a metallic lip that connects and that has to connect perfectly. If by any chance any of the brackets holding them together breaks, I would seal with tape or silicone. If you have the old variant, I would advice to pop the power button flap that is on top of the lid, and put a couple of pieces of scotch beneath it to seal the two holes beneath it. It may not be necessary, but it bloody well can't hurt.

I ride my GT16 in all weathers, and I'm not overly worried.

[steve454]

9 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

You know something is going scary fast when the Chinese put on a full face helmet and wear safety gear.  

52kmh is crazy fast.  That road looked super smooth though.  Those covered bicycles that carry 3 and sometimes 4 people are pretty interesting.

[meepmeepmayer]

The hill climbing is really nice Too bad you can't do it for long or the motor cables would melt

[xebeche]

12 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

  That's a pretty steep hill climb... even for Marty.   You know something is going scary fast when the Chinese put on a full face helmet and wear safety gear.  

There's also some Monster Westerner weight testing video as well that follows... 

Looks like a sales video:

Unfortunately it seems that "wild spin" still remains a known Gotway "feature" even on new Tesla (look at 1:53 and 2:22)

 

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

21 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

The hill climbing is really nice Too bad you can't do it for long or the motor cables would melt

As a theoretical exercise, I wonder if one had larger axles and covered the motor cables from the control board to the copper windings in the motor with Techflex Insultherm tubing which is rated up to 1200° F whether one could hill climb indefinitely.  One likely would need to have offset screw attached wire mounts on the control board like what the KingSongs have and crimped connectors to avoid solder melting weak spots.  If you could cool the control board with fans and supplemental CO₂ / ethylene glycol liquid cooling to create a high temperature ceiling I bet theoretically you could create a wheel that climbs a certain grade indefinitely.  Any engineers out there?

[meepmeepmayer]

Yea, or you just use thicker cables

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

Naaaw that would be too simple.  I want to see CO₂ vapours shooting out vents on the side!    Yeah, thick ass cables would likely work.     Buuuuut you still would need something to keep the MOSFETs from frying as that happens too.

[xebeche]

Looks like a casual test ride by our Russian friends: