Sebrios Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 13 minutes ago, Stillhart said: Do you have a source? I've heard this mentioned but never seen any source. How reliable is this information? Follow the Inmotion instagram account.. they post it everytime... they seem to be really mad about it its a shame... I understand its a business, but as Inmotion says,: "not like this" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phong Vu Posted April 9, 2020 Author Share Posted April 9, 2020 14 minutes ago, Sebrios said: but, after reading what Inmotion says that KS basically stole the research, and knowing its not the first time they do it, I wont support them anymore I'm still trying to find out more about this. Do you know anymore details? Really hate this, but don't want to discard the whole company just by allegations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Stillhart said: Do you have a source? I've heard this mentioned but never seen any source. How reliable is this information? Edited April 9, 2020 by AtlasP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Sebrios said: Im a big fan of how the S18 looks. but, after reading what Inmotion says that KS basically stole the research, and knowing its not the first time they do it, I wont support them anymore its just against what I believe business should be.. I'd also like a source, this is getting repeated like it was a fact. "Gotway boss" saying "maybe they used the same tech" is hardly a source to make such allegations. I get that inmotion wanted to keep the spotlight, but that doesn't make EUC suspensions some exclusive IP. Especially that it doesn't even seem to the the same system. Edited April 9, 2020 by null Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stillhart Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Sebrios said: Follow the Inmotion instagram account.. they post it everytime... they seem to be really mad about it its a shame... I understand its a business, but as Inmotion says,: "not like this" Oh, so there's no objective source, just InMotion claiming it? Well I'm not saying they're lying, but I will say I have no reason to believe them over KS (or vice versa). Without any other sources, I can't really base any decisions on it. EDIT - To be clear, I spend way too much time on the internet to take baseless claims at face value. The story above makes a TON of claims with not even a single source to back it up (about them stealing from GW, about them being sued and losing, etc). Edited April 9, 2020 by Stillhart 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 Read the description. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) The significant part is the fact that they already won a court case over this same exact scenario as recently as within the past year, which lends a little more credence than "just an allegation". In the absence of that recent court victory I would've held the same opinion as you, but with the context of that recent court victory I'm a little more likely to believe it's at least plausible/take a wait-and-see approach to see if there's a subsequent legal determination regarding this new instance. Edited April 9, 2020 by AtlasP 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phong Vu Posted April 9, 2020 Author Share Posted April 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, AtlasP said: The fact that they already won a court case over this same exact scenario as recently as within the past year lends a little more credence than "just an allegation". In the absence of that court victory I would've held the same opinion as you, but with the context of that court victory I'm a little more likely to believe them or at least take a wait-and-see approach to see if there's a subsequent legal determination in this new instance. I'm not on Kingsong side, as the matter of fact, you can see my only wheel is an Inmotion but the court case is also only mentioned in the post, tried to google it after read the post ytd, found nothing in English, so, I simply don't know if it's true or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, AtlasP said: The fact that they already won a court case over this same exact scenario as recently as within the past year lends a little more credence than "just an allegation". In the absence of that recent court victory I would've held the same opinion as you, but with the context of that recent court victory I'm a little more likely to believe them or at least take a wait-and-see approach to see if there's a subsequent legal determination regarding this new instance. People asked for suspensions long before inmotion stated they where working on it. "We're working on it" doesn't give you a copyright on an entire basic tech. Without more information inmotion just look sour to me. Its not like they can get an exclusive on suspended EUCs. Competitors bashing a product launch, well duh. Its baseless accusations until they tell us what exactly the "tech" and "research" is, because at the moment we dont even know how V11 suspensions work. They surely dont look the same, and we can see the prototype without the shell. Edited April 9, 2020 by null 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gon2fast Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 for those unfamiliar with the way that rear shocks are set up on bicycles, check out the simple explanation below... https://www.evo.com/guides/mountain-bike-bike-suspension-sag-setup-guide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Wood Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Stillhart said: InMotion claiming it? it's gotway that are saying it, not inmotion.. if you watch duffs latest live stream on youtube they discuss it, the guy who made the claim is one of the bosses at gotway Edited April 9, 2020 by Dave Wood 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rehab1 Posted April 9, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 30 minutes ago, AtlasP said: I'm a little more likely to believe them Edited April 9, 2020 by Rehab1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phong Vu Posted April 9, 2020 Author Share Posted April 9, 2020 ok... Sold my V8 5 minutes ago... I money is ready for whichever wheel come out of the suspension battle... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebrios Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 EUC Suspension is/was a must, and will come for sure... what I think, thou, is that each company should pay for its own research, with their own staff... In the business im in, we are only 4 companies, and 3 out of 4, do not hire guys that worked at the competition before... its kind of a respect for what the others are working on. KS for what I can see, are a "Go-for-it-no-matter-how" company Im interested in seen what GW will come up with... its not hard to guess, as this is mostly taking a view at MTB's and aplying it to euc's what I love about the S18 thou, that has me sold is that they achieved a light weight wheel... thats the most important thing to me, and they did a terrific job there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Sebrios said: In the business im in, we are only 4 companies, and 3 out of 4, do not hire guys that worked at the competition before... its kind of a respect for what the others are working on. That case is 5 year old, beside they should have a non-compete agreement (with corresponding pay) if they dont want their employees to change ship. "No hire" agreements is collusion to kill the job market. If your employee is leaking your secrets you take it to court. But you can't expect your people to stay working with you just because you want it. Quote KS for what I can see, are a "Go-for-it-no-matter-how" company I dont see where you have that from other than competitors slinging dirt. Two cases we know nothing of and that they have made a EUC with suspensions? Edited April 9, 2020 by null 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 18 minutes ago, Sebrios said: In the business im in, we are only 4 companies, and 3 out of 4, do not hire guys that worked at the competition before... its kind of a respect for what the others are working on. That's just a wage suppression tactic and should be cause for an anticompetitive behavior investigation and you asking for a raise. "What are you going to do? Can't go to the competitor that needs your skill after all!" 9 minutes ago, null said: they should have a non-compete agreement (with corresponding pay) if they dont want their employees to change ship. Yep, this is how it's done. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 23 minutes ago, Sebrios said: what I love about the S18 thou, that has me sold is that they achieved a light weight wheel... thats the most important thing to me, and they did a terrific job there 1.4kg of that is the smaller battery compared to the V11 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bigwave Posted April 9, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted April 9, 2020 23 minutes ago, Sebrios said: that has me sold is that they achieved a light weight wheel Thats because they put a less than ideal sized battery in it! 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigwave Posted April 9, 2020 Share Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: 1.4kg of that is the smaller battery compared to the V11 Edited April 9, 2020 by bigwave 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post meepmeepmayer Posted April 9, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted April 9, 2020 Just now, bigwave said: @meepmeepmayer the saying is great minds think alike...and fools seldom differ! In German it's "Zwei Dumme, ein Gedanke" (Two idiots, one thought.) 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stillhart Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 I'm sure there's also a saying that insults everyone who believes anything they read without proof but I will choose not to insult everyone who has a different opinion than mine. Surprising to see a moderator slinging personal insults. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Wood Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 specs wise i don't see how anyone would choose this over the V11 apart from possibly the weight due to a smaller battery, V11 has bigger battery, a smart bms, better lights, 21700 cells! the S18 from what iv read is still using yesteryear 18650 cells (correct me if im wrong)... we've seen both suspension systems working, granted only briefly so far but the v11 seems far smoother, where as the S18 was extremely clumpy and noisy and probably why Kuji added in music to his video to cover it up. i wont even get in to the open body which is a magnet to dust, water and all other debris so i certainly hope it's more resistant to the elements than the 16x was. the only plus sign i could see that the s18 has over the v11 is basically appearance and even that's subjective. it's like nobodies learned their lessons from another wheel that everybody drooled over, the z10. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phong Vu Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Dave Wood said: specs wise i don't see how anyone would choose this over the V11 apart from possibly the weight due to a smaller battery, V11 has bigger battery, a smart bms, better lights, 21700 cells! the S18 from what iv read is still using yesteryear 18650 cells (correct me if im wrong)... we've seen both suspension systems working, granted only briefly so far but the v11 seems far smoother, where as the S18 was extremely clumpy and noisy and probably why Kuji added in music to his video to cover it up. i wont even get in to the open body which is a magnet to dust, water and all other debris so i certainly hope it's more resistant to the elements than the 16x was. the only plus sign i could see that the s18 has over the v11 is basically appearance and even that's subjective. it's like nobodies learned their lessons from another wheel that everybody drooled over, the z10. 1- S18 certainly win over weight competition. 2- I think S18 also use 21700 cells. 3- I will hold on commenting on suspension, V11 do seems smoother, but maybe because all the S18 videos so far are from Kuji, who ride it like a mad men. I do need to wait for more testers riding both wheels. 4- We haven't got any details on trolley handle and pickup handle for S18, but so far, seems that V11 has better design. (I have a feeling pickup handle from S18 is not as good). 5- We still need to see the real life range/speed for both wheels. 6- Indeed I still drooled over Z10 But both S18 and V11 are nice, in a different way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post meepmeepmayer Posted April 10, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted April 10, 2020 30 minutes ago, Stillhart said: Surprising to see a moderator slinging personal insults. Did you read that as an insult? It isn't one! After all I would be calling myself an idiot It's just something you say when two people have the same thought at the same time. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 30 minutes ago, Dave Wood said: 21700 cells! the S18 from what iv read is still using yesteryear 18650 cells (correct me if im wrong) The S18 has 21700 cells! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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