INMOTION V11 (2020)

[Vagrant Sneaker]

13 minutes ago, Jpd said:

I am your same riding weight, I have the psi on mine set at 100 bottom and 50 on top. What did you set yours at?

I set mine to 100 at the bottom and 55 on top. Tonight, I will go to 90 at the bottom and 50 on top.

[EUChristian]

1 hour ago, Jonesq said:

That saddle looks to be the weak point on the wheel. I just hope that it was intentionally designed that way to preserve the other more important parts and that replacing the saddle is relatively cheap. 

Does anyone with a V11 think this will work in lieu of pads? https://eucsale.com/jumping-pads-for-euc-karambits.html

Chooch used some sort of furniture bumper...it’s placed on furniture when you move it...unsure which type he used but they worked well for him. 

[Vagrant Sneaker]

2 hours ago, Jonesq said:

 
Does anyone with a V11 think this will work in lieu of pads? https://eucsale.com/jumping-pads-for-euc-karambits.html

Most likely from the look it. You can place those on the saddle. You just have to see the measurements so that nothing sticks off the saddle. I'm gonna wait until I see what Inmotions pads look like.

[musk]

 @Hsiang's video shows the pedal bracket detached.  Normally this is attached to the aluminum bar via 6 screws.  Did this come detached by shearing the 6 screws or by ripping them out of their tapped holes?

[Shield]

20 minutes ago, musk said:

 @Hsiang's video shows the pedal bracket detached.  Normally this is attached to the aluminum bar via 6 screws.  Did this come detached by shearing the 6 screws or by ripping them out of their tapped holes?

I can't say for sure but it appears to me that this part of the video was taken after he disassembled the wheel. A reenactment for the current upload.

[Vagrant Sneaker]

Anyone ever think to put this under their pedals or something similar?

Scratch Guards

Edited August 15, 2020 by Vagrant Sneaker

[Unventor]

14 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I love how they say it's fixed when they have no idea what failed on my board. That really is an impossibility.

Just like I surmised, Inmotion would say the production wheels don't have any problems because it's a different board. And we are supposed to believe them without knowing what changed.

Would anyone fly on the Boeing 737 MAX without know what Boeing did to fix the original problems? It's magical thinking  

Now they could have seen this problem in development and testing. It isn't like they don't have mountains in China. 

And about planes I don't need to know what is done as long at it isn't ground by authority. They should not clear something they have banned unless they are sure it us fixed. 

Now the overheat hill you are testing, it a nice test, but I am not riding that hill, nor any other hills like that. 

If you followed telegram you would have seen other pushing very hard on production models but couldn't get the V11 to fail. It will report in advance this happen, and let you know it needs a break. 

[Zopper]

6 hours ago, EUChristian said:

My issue is the wheel is basically destroyed now from one fall. And no one seems to recognize the issue that will cause - this rolls on you and you now are down a unicycle. 

From the description of the events and given the ripped-off pedal and so on, I dare to bet that any other wheel would be in a similar shape*. EUC falls a lot, yes, but they rarely hit a slab of steel still going at a high speed. This wasn't a tumble on an empty street, but likely a 20mph heads-on crash. Heck, look what happens with normal cars at that speed: 

*Not that sure about Sherman, the frame would probably dissipated some of the energy, but it would be still on the bad side.

[tenofnine]

Just caught up on Hsiang's vid about wrecking his v11....sorry if this has been fully discussed, but it seems obvious what happened.

He bottomed out his tire from the massive terrain differential at speed. The tire spread out and up as it flattened to the rim and it got snagged by the terrible sharp casing geometry around the pedals. This easily tore a hole from the sheer force and stopped the wheel from balancing as well as popping the tire.

Am I missing something or am I way off?

This definitely makes me want a V11 less, I already knew that suspension would be delicate and not handle falls or crashes. But I never liked how close the tire was to the walls and casing, and how sharp the geometry looked (this incident seems to back up my paranoia)

[Zopper]

4 minutes ago, tenofnine said:

Just caught up on Hsiang's vid about wrecking his v11....sorry if this has been fully discussed, but it seems obvious what happened.

He bottomed out his tire from the massive terrain differential at speed. The tire spread out and up as it flattened to the rim and it got snagged by the terrible sharp casing geometry around the pedals. This easily tore a hole from the sheer force and stopped the wheel from balancing as well as popping the tire.

Am I missing something or am I way off?

This definitely makes me want a V11 less, I already knew that suspension would be delicate and not handle falls or crashes. But I never liked how close the tire was to the walls and casing, and how sharp the geometry looked (this incident seems to back up my paranoia)

It's not obvious. The mark on the front/side wall of the wheel is too high for bottoming, it's about the height of a curb edge. So it didn't happen there. And it couldn't be pinched under the pedals, as the rim is out of the wheel's body there. So it would have to be right at the front corner. And I can't spot any damage there in the video. Moreover, it's the outer side of the tire that got damaged. The one that had no speed difference on itself and had a better grip. If it was as you describe, then I think the hole should be on the side of the tire, as that would be the place that suddenly and at a high speed got pressed against something.

The cause can be a bottoming out, but if so, it would be in a way that would happen even if the rim was uncovered all around as with S18. A tire defect would be the most likely to manifest and make a hole exactly at that moment.

[mrelwood]

 

7 hours ago, EUChristian said:

My issue is the wheel is basically destroyed now from one fall. And no one seems to recognize the issue that will cause - this rolls on you and you now are down a unicycle. 

Wheel shells getting completely shattered from a single fall has been just another day in the GW camp for years. And those are on flat pavement, not banging head on to sharp steel contraptions at speed.

 

31 minutes ago, tenofnine said:

The tire spread out and up as it flattened to the rim and it got snagged by the terrible sharp casing geometry around the pedals.

A pressurized rubber tire does not behave like that. No matter what speed you flatten the tire at, the receiver is instant, and by the time the rubber leaves the ground, it has already (at least mostly) recovered. It doesn’t remain flat for a section of the rotation.

 Besides, none of the shapes feel at all sharp to the finger, and having worked with tires a bit, they are really stubborn mofos.

[WebDev]

6 hours ago, EUChristian said:

Chooch used some sort of furniture bumper...it’s placed on furniture when you move it...unsure which type he used but they worked well for him. 

You can find this stuff here.  I got some of it a few days ago:  https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07CQT344B

[eve]

8 hours ago, musk said:

"Remindings: Please prevent your hands from being pinche while using the putter."

I think Hsiang must have not read this and he got pinched mid ride! 

@Vagrant Sneaker Thx for the photos. What PSI do you have in the negative chamber? From what ive seen is that for high speed riding you need much lover PSI to make the wheel less bouncy altought dont know how relevant it is considering V11 is no Gotway.

7 hours ago, Jonesq said:

Does anyone with a V11 think this will work in lieu of pads? https://eucsale.com/jumping-pads-for-euc-karambits.html

Looks bad and very uncomfortable and its wider then the saddles thinnest part at the bottom.

[onizukagto]

Actually I remember Inmotion pushing the V11 (1st batch)  up a 30~40° slope in China, it made our to the top. However they tried a Sherman and that burned out half way up. 

So I guess if you based it upon that "test" it at least beat the veteran. 

I can't remember where I saw that clip, have to fine it and add it back here post edit. 

V11 climbing a steep slope. 

This was the same slope in China that killed a production veteran Sherman. 

Sherman dying on China's version of overheat Hill. 

Edited August 15, 2020 by onizukagto
Found the video!

[Zopper]

I tried to put all the issues that were and are into a single post together with their current status. In this thread the updates are getting lost. Let me know if I forgot anything.

 

[Unventor]

1 hour ago, tenofnine said:

Am I missing something or am I way off?

Yes you are way off.

None knows exactly what happend. 

1 hour ago, tenofnine said:

He bottomed out his tire from the massive terrain differential at speed. The tire spread out and up as it flattened to the rim and it got snagged by the terrible sharp casing geometry around the pedals. This easily tore a hole from the sheer force and stopped the wheel from balancing as well as popping the tire.

Even @Hsiang don't know this so how you can conclude this is far fetched imo. 

I don't think we ever know the real reason. One thing is sure. It is something we all want to avoid, only problem is how when we don't know why. 

I do think from what we see from riders reporting on bend rims# that one of 2 things is happening.

1 ) People are not fully understanding the forces happening that the suspension is cushioning.

2 ) People are testing grounds to limits that the suspension can't protect.

And maybe riding with normal tire pressure not realising the stress the tire experience during hard edges of potholes. 

[EUChristian]

1 hour ago, Zopper said:

From the description of the events and given the ripped-off pedal and so on, I dare to bet that any other wheel would be in a similar shape*. EUC falls a lot, yes, but they rarely hit a slab of steel still going at a high speed. This wasn't a tumble on an empty street, but likely a 20mph heads-on crash. Heck, look what happens with normal cars at that speed: 

*Not that sure about Sherman, the frame would probably dissipated some of the energy, but it would be still on the bad side.

Absolutely disagree. I’ve flung my Mten3s into walls. I’ve had a KS16 go head over tails down down a rocky dirt Mountain road - twice - along with at least 3 higher speed crashes where the wheel went flying. I’ve watched my daughters V8 roll across the street and slam into a guard rail. I “dare say” not one of them blew to pieces. Come on now...the design of the trolley handle is clearly going to lend to destruction. 
 

I will agree that this is a single incident and therefore it is what it is. But this was the first fall the unit took...high speed, wall, whatever the unit is dead from one fall. 

Edited August 15, 2020 by EUChristian

[IamIan]

We don't know allot about Hsiang's crash  .. but just to add my 2 bits ..

Just because the crash happened at that location .. that does not necessarily mean all of the related damage / influence that contributed to the crash all happened together simultaneously.

Just a thought .. but .. if he was previously hopping down curbs/steps/etc .. and trying to jump up steps/curbs/etc .. and any other ~30MPH city street .. pot holes , road debris , glass , metal , etc .. etc.

I know in previously years on my bicycle I've had road debris damage the tire (cut it , poke it, etc) .. the tube inside not fail instantly with the damage to the outer tire .. we don't know if the tire was (prior to that one specific crash location) already weakened / compromised .. by some other previous event or events.

Although it might not happen often .. tires do fail from time to time .. cars , mountain bikes , etc , etc .. I don't know if anyone in the real world has the spiderman level reflexes and acrobatics to be able to not crash a EUC if the one and only tire you are riding on at ~30mph fails / pops / etc.

[Zopper]

49 minutes ago, EUChristian said:

Absolutely disagree. I’ve flung my Mten3s into walls. I’ve had a KS16 go head over tails down down a rocky dirt Mountain road - twice - along with at least 3 higher speed crashes where the wheel went flying. I’ve watched my daughters V8 roll across the street and slam into a guard rail. I “dare say” not one of them blew to pieces. Come on now...the design of the trolley handle is clearly going to lend to destruction. 
 

I will agree that this is a single incident and therefore it is what it is. But this was the first fall the unit took...high speed, wall, whatever the unit is dead from one fall. 

But the speed is really important. V8 has a top speed 20 mph - did your daughter rode at the top speed when her V8 slammed the guard rail? I guess not. Also, the V8 weights about half, so it has much less energy to dissipate - a heavier wheel will always take a bigger hit, no matter what. IOW, if you want to compare these two situations, take in mind that the V11 had about 4 times bigger kinetic energy. (Assuming the V8 going about 12mph. Even if the V8 would really go at full 20 mph, in it's tiltback speed, it would still have just half of the energy.)

I've seen a video with V11 going down a rocky hill, off a trail, and it was just a bit scratched up. And if a wheel takes into the air, or tumbles, that is fine - it means that the energy that could destroy it just got redirected. Instead of one big hit, you get multiple smaller hits. Which didn't happen here. And while I too think that the plastic saddle itself is probably easy to break, to destroy the metal frame like that you need a lot of force and I would like to see a plastic shell that would handle it. But whatever. Take a 5 kg (11 lbs) heavy hammer and swing it at a wheel at 40+ miles per hour and tell me the result. That has about the same energy and type of contact as the V11 got.

 

[EUChristian]

7 minutes ago, Zopper said:

But the speed is really important. V8 has a top speed 20 mph - did your daughter rode at the top speed when her V8 slammed the guard rail? I guess not. Also, the V8 weights about half, so it has much less energy to dissipate - a heavier wheel will always take a bigger hit, no matter what. IOW, if you want to compare these two situations, take in mind that the V11 had about 4 times bigger kinetic energy. (Assuming the V8 going about 12mph. Even if the V8 would really go at full 20 mph, in it's tiltback speed, it would still have just half of the energy.)

I've seen a video with V11 going down a rocky hill, off a trail, and it was just a bit scratched up. And if a wheel takes into the air, or tumbles, that is fine - it means that the energy that could destroy it just got redirected. Instead of one big hit, you get multiple smaller hits. Which didn't happen here. And while I too think that the plastic saddle itself is probably easy to break, to destroy the metal frame like that you need a lot of force and I would like to see a plastic shell that would handle it. But whatever. Take a 5 kg (11 lbs) heavy hammer and swing it at a wheel at 40+ miles per hour and tell me the result. That has about the same energy and type of contact as the V11 got.

 

I guess we wait and see. 

[Rywokast]

1 hour ago, EUChristian said:

Absolutely disagree. I’ve flung my Mten3s into walls. I’ve had a KS16 go head over tails down down a rocky dirt Mountain road - twice - along with at least 3 higher speed crashes where the wheel went flying. I’ve watched my daughters V8 roll across the street and slam into a guard rail. I “dare say” not one of them blew to pieces. Come on now...the design of the trolley handle is clearly going to lend to destruction. 
 

I will agree that this is a single incident and therefore it is what it is. But this was the first fall the unit took...high speed, wall, whatever the unit is dead from one fall. 

crashes arent something you can compare unless theyre completely controlled.. you could crash an euc ten times at high speed and it be fine, and on the 11th at half the speed it just happens to hit exactly right to blow it apart... whos to say, and plastic will flex a lot and take much more force to shatter it than this alloy.. however i do agree that the saddles are too thin/weak and i can imagine they will pretty quickly toughen them up a lot since there have been multiple complaints, but regardless just the fact that its a suspension wheel means its gonna be more delicate overall... i dont really care about how tough it is because the chances of having a crash like this are slim to none, that was some sort of freak accident who the hell knows what happened never seen a tire shear like that that wasnt on a car

[Vagrant Sneaker]

2 hours ago, eve said:

 

@Vagrant Sneaker Thx for the photos. What PSI do you have in the negative chamber? From what ive seen is that for high speed riding you need much lover PSI to make the wheel less bouncy altought dont know how relevant it is considering V11 is no Gotway.

 I have mine at 55 PSI, but I changed it last night to 50. Bottom is also now 90 PSI. I originally had it at 100. 

[eve]

20 minutes ago, Vagrant Sneaker said:

I have mine at 55 PSI, but I changed it last night to 50. Bottom is also now 90 PSI. I originally had it at 100. 

Thats alot Duf had it at 30 psi and he said it felt like too much in the negative chamber. 

Thank god i ordered an S18 i dont like the V11 shock. Not a lot of settings and we dont even know what the ratios are supposed to be.

[eve]

2 hours ago, onizukagto said:

This was the same slope in China that killed a production veteran Sherman. 

Pre-production.

[Finn Bjerke]

IS this communist propaganda ? 

No its real ppl doing real thangs... maybe?

 

Edited August 15, 2020 by Finn Bjerke