Is a fall inevitable?

[philippe_kruse]

Man I am scared reading all these posts about people crashing and burning on their wheels.

Is it par for the course? Is it unavoidable? I am REALLY bad at falling - I am too tall, too heavy - my center of gravity is not made for falling (don't ever put me on cross country skis again).

Is it wholly unreasonable that I should be able to practice really slowly on grass first, and take it so slow that I will never experience a real fall at speed?

[null]

Nowadays wheel are fairly unlikely to cut off, and the other half is user error, agressive riding, pot hole..
Everything in life is a gamble against odds though, I've fallen twice from EUC without as much as a scratch, but tripped while walking and had pain for months. You might not fall ever though.

There is no way to guarantee against a fall, but a good rule is to not ride faster than what you are ready to fall at. With protective gear adapted to the speed (people riding very fast use motorcycle gear) you should be fairly safe from major damage. Maybe we should have a Bibendum (Michelin guy) onsie costume for EUCing

Edited May 15, 2019 by Mimolette

[Chriull]

41 minutes ago, philippe_kruse said:

Man I am scared reading all these posts about people crashing and burning on their wheels.

Is it par for the course? Is it unavoidable? I am REALLY bad at falling - I am too tall, too heavy - my center of gravity is not made for falling (don't ever put me on cross country skis again).

One has to be prepared that one can have an accident any time - some wheels part malfunctioning (there is just one wheel - if anything fails one is down!) Or some bump/pothole that obe did not notice...

So, yes its inevidable - but as with every/most things in live driving reasonsble and attentively can greatly reduce the risk.

41 minutes ago, philippe_kruse said:

Is it wholly unreasonable that I should be able to practice really slowly on grass first, and take it so slow that I will never experience a real fall at speed?

Driving on grass and driving slowly are two things that are complicated for beginners

[lirva]

You feel more secure, when getting more miles under your belt. 

I have around 400km total and starting to trust the thing finally and feeling more secure -> More fun. 

I fallen few time's on the beginning, usually scraping knees. And I rode without protection, just a helmet. 

 

Only thing i'm scared that my V10 is going to burn up my house. 

Edited May 15, 2019 by lirva

[philippe_kruse]

What are the situations where you fell? Pothole? Wheel gave up? Cat crossing the road?

[Rehab1]

10 minutes ago, philippe_kruse said:

What are the situations where you fell? Pothole? Wheel gave up? Cat crossing the road?

My pothole crash was a combination of events: Distraction-Dusk-Dumb.

 

[lirva]

First was a kid crossing road suddenly. Try to avoid, but ended up faceplanting. -> Bloody knees 

Second was sudden tilt back while going down hill, Got scared ->  try to run out of the thing, but faceplanted. Again hole in knee.

Both situation wouldn't be issues anymore, but while starting to learn, coudn't handle. I'm 184cm with 100kg so not the most agile form to land but maybe the beer belly helps. 

Full face helmet is my main protection, sometimes upperbody armour and knee pads if planning to ride faster.

If you are conserned, put a full motorcycle suit on, used one's are cheap.

[null]

My two EUC falls: 
- People on one side, public kick scooter lying down on the other. I thought the EUC pedal was high enough to go over the scooter handle, but no. I sort of just ran off the EUC. (helps being prepared for the fall)
- Bike-lane suddenly just joins trafic, I keep too much away from the cars and pedal smacks the sidewalk edge. Had a second to fall half controlled backward.
 

Edited May 15, 2019 by Mimolette

[meepmeepmayer]

Inevitable? No. Should you bet on the fact that you'll never have a fall? Probably not. But it's not at all given that everyone has to have a bad fall.

Don't ride too fast. Drive carefully and always look where you are going. Distractions or inattention are what gets you.

And wear protective gear. Wrist guards, (full face) helmet, knee guards, and whatever else you think you should wear.

[Circuitmage]

IMHO, it's a lot like motorcycle riding. I have known people that ride liter bikes and NEVER had a crash or dropped a bike. I would say that's rare. Most people will tell you, "If you ride, you will go down". The good news, is that on an EUC, you are much more in control of the outcome and the cause of the fall. If you go down, it your fault 99.99% of the time. You can do lots of things to mitigate that...
1) Start off slow learning, even when switching wheels, or changing settings.

2) Wear safety gear. For me, it is limited to knees, wrists and a cheap helmet. If I go for long rides at high speed I add elbow guards.

3) Know your paths. Most of the time I have ever gone down...95% I would say, it's due to not being familiar with or paying attention to the terrain. I even hit a tree at night that fell across the sidewalk because I wasn't paying attention. I did slow down enough to where I stayed on my feet...but I've had several times I dropped to my knees.

So far...after 2 years, mostly riding over 20mph, I've had no faceplants, only 1 fall at speed (that resulted in no injury since I landed on dirt and had safety gear on), and several minor falls while learning. I would say of the minor falls, 3 of them (all 3 knee injuries) cause pain...only 1 lasted for ~6 months due to not wearing safety gear and doing something stupid.

It does take some risk/reward mitigation. Is it worth it to you to learn something new and fun if you might experience human pain? If so, what are your limits?

That's pretty much up to you to decide. For me, I don't have a real need to ride backwards or do all kinds of stunts. I'm happy getting from point A to point B.

Your brain/body gets amazingly adapted to the skill and it becomes a very subconscious effort to do whatever it is you want to try.

Also, I have learned from riding 2 wheel scooter, hoverboards and EUC's that the bigger the wheel, the better. I am much more capable of riding over "bad" things on my 18" wheel, than any other scooter I have had.

Edited May 15, 2019 by Circuitmage
Wheel size

[Smoother]

A lot of my falls came from having a small battery (340WH) and not understanding battery dynamics. most of the rest were from hitting something I didn't see or high speed violent tilt back. No major injuries; a bruised wrist (with guards) a few grazes, and a bloody chin once but it didn't hurt much.  If someone had told me before I stated all the wipe outs I was going to have, in detail, I wouldn't have started, but... having had all those wipe out, | have no intention of quitting; partly because my second wheel has an adequate battery, I understand voltage sag, and it's just too damn much fun.

 

[Brian Morris]

if you ride long enough you will fall, there are always exceptions to the rule but when you are riding something that must balance in all directions all the time, falling is inevitable.  Be prepared is the best advice anyone can give you

Safety wise Ill take my fat tired ebike over my euc any day of the week but nothing compares to gliding along on your favorite euc at 30mph on a smooth piece of slightly winding road with the wind at your back and your favorite tune playing...

[DanCar]

Yes, if you ride enough you will fall.  I was wearing bright clothing but twice cars have cut me off, didn't fall, but an example of what might happen.  I saw an experienced EUC rider, riding in the park on a new EUC, went under a tree and didn't see a twig, and fell.  Minor accident.  As you get comfortable, you tend to take more risks, riding faster, paying less attention, playing on phone, so that is when most likely something is going to happen.  Other rule of thumb is when showing off, tired, night riding.

Edited May 15, 2019 by DanCar

[mrelwood]

I have ridden EUCs for 17000km, and besides a few tumbles at walking speed while learning, I have crashed twice.

1) 20km/h, muddy spot in a curve on a dirt road. Fell down, rolled a few times, continued riding. No pain. Dirty jacket.

2) 25km/h, wheel sank in wet gravel. Took two running steps and fell down on my shoulder. Slight pain for a few weeks.

I often ride very fast, and lots of it off-road, so I wear full gear: wrist guard gloves, mc jacket with elbow and shoulder guards, leather pants with knee guards, ankle high riding shoes, and a helmet with a chin shield.

Eventually crashing is probable, so I find protective gear to be important. But of course the most important matter is to ride sensibly.

I will say though, if you only cruise slowly in a peaceful environment, concentrate and have gear, you are a lot less likely to hurt yourself.

But as you can read, riding is so much fun that it is worth the risk for almost all of us!

[FlyboyEUC]

All my falls have been while going less than 3 mph... 

Too steep + loose dirt

Too slow + Big rock

[Gaz Bon]

I crash at least once a week mainly traveling to fast ,lack of traction and incorrect reading of surface conditions 

Last crash was all 3

35Kph and a belly slide ,PPE saved the day again

I ended up between the mud and the wheel

[Demargon]

Ride below your running speed on foot and watch attentive to your surroundings, you will go safely enough to avoid any serious accident. What is more difficult to avoid are the blows to the EUC, since any distraction can cause you to lose your balance, in that moment the experienced pilots know how to recover and the prudent ones let the EUC fall to the ground while they are safe

[travsformation]

12 hours ago, mrelwood said:

I often ride very fast, and lots of it off-road, so I wear full gear: wrist guard gloves, mc jacket with elbow and shoulder guards, leather pants with knee guards, ankle high riding shoes, and a helmet with a chin shield.

I don't mean to go off-topic, but am curious about the protection you're wearing. Which "wrist guard gloves" are you using?

And how well does the MC jacket fare in off-road crashes? Supposing there's no external hard-shell and it's not leather, how well does it slide? Do the elbow protections stay in place?

Thanks!

[Darrell Wesh]

25 minutes ago, travsformation said:

I don't mean to go off-topic, but am curious about the protection you're wearing. Which "wrist guard gloves" are you using?

And how well does the MC jacket fare in off-road crashes? Supposing there's no external hard-shell and it's not leather, how well does it slide? Do the elbow protections stay in place?

Thanks!

😄😄😄😄😄 I remember this conversation 

[travsformation]

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

😄😄😄😄😄 I remember this conversation 

🤣🤣🤣

I haven't given up on my search for a gloved version of the Demon Flexmeters that also protects my hands/knuckles from abrasion (and the cold). There could always be new products on the market I'm not aware of... 😅

You know what they say... 

[LanghamP]

2 hours ago, travsformation said:

my search for a gloved version of the Demon Flexmeters that also protects my hands/knuckles from abrasion (and the cold).

Have you looked at the gauntlet type gloves at your local motorcycle store, or perhaps RevZilla.com or such? There is some overlap between impact protection and abrasion resistance, and in my opinion EUC do need both.

[Smoother]

2 hours ago, travsformation said:

I haven't given up on my search for a gloved version of the Demon Flexmeters that also protects my hands/knuckles from abrasion (and the cold). There could always be new products on the market I'm not aware of... 😅

Have you considered a DIY hybrid?  Cut up a pair of inexpensive gloves and sew the part you need to the Flexmeters. I have a nice pair of lined leather white gardening gloves that only cost about £11 and if i shared your goal, it would be little hardship to sacrifice them for the cause.

[travsformation]

7 hours ago, LanghamP said:

Have you looked at the gauntlet type gloves at your local motorcycle store, or perhaps RevZilla.com or such? There is some overlap between impact protection and abrasion resistance, and in my opinion EUC do need both.

Thanks, Langham! 

Yeah, I've checked out gloves and agree on the overlap, but in my opinion, the wrist mobility required in MC gloves means they don't offer the same level of protection a wrist plate would, particularly in the hyper-extension domain (@Darrell Wesh can attest to the fact that I've laid out said argument, at length and over the course of several pages, in the FlatEarth3D...I mean, Flatland3D thread... ) Although I've discarded the Flatlands as a viable option and am still not too convinced about MC gloves, I still haven't entirely ruled out the latter.

7 hours ago, Smoother said:

Have you considered a DIY hybrid?  Cut up a pair of inexpensive gloves and sew the part you need to the Flexmeters. I have a nice pair of lined leather white gardening gloves that only cost about £11 and if i shared your goal, it would be little hardship to sacrifice them for the cause.

Nice one! Hadn't thought of that! Perhaps because I don't own Flexmeters yet and am not familiar with their exact design and how that could be done. But I'll definitely keep that in mind, cheers!

Edited May 17, 2019 by travsformation

[LanghamP]

11 minutes ago, Smoother said:

Have you considered a DIY hybrid?  Cut up a pair of inexpensive gloves and sew the part you need to the Flexmeters. I have a nice pair of lined leather white gardening gloves that only cost about £11 and if i shared your goal, it would be little hardship to sacrifice them for the cause.

Hmm, I suppose sticking some leather gloves through some extra large flexmasters, then sewing the whole job together, would offer the best of both worlds.

[travsformation]

1 minute ago, LanghamP said:

Hmm, I suppose sticking some leather gloves through some extra large flexmasters, then sewing the whole job together, would offer the best of both worlds.

Yeah, me too (would have upvoted both of your comments but am out of votes today)