New Veteran "Abrams" 22-inch Wheel

[Tawpie]

2 hours ago, Tasku said:

The bumbs do not look horribly big but the speed is often closer to top performance in these cases

That's how I got dumped on my MTen... 46% battery, 14 mph seems safe enough right? Nope. A crease where asphalt met concrete, maybe 3/4 inch tall and the wheel cutout. Reviewing the incident in my head, the wheel was trying to lift itself and me 3/4 of an inch while at the same time it realized that I was tipping forward. The combination was 'excessive' and it showed me why I subscribe to ATGATT.

Do not underestimate the instantaneous power demand of a bump. When you're at speed, you might not have the headroom you hoped for.

[Jpd]

Finally got some good weather for riding, so I did a mini range test today. I will try to do a full range test soon. 
My riding weight is 200lbs, trail was a flat paved surface temp was mid 50s

[Tawpie]

That's really good! You'll get 4 solid hours of fun at 19 mph, what more can one hope for? 

[Silver]

I decided to email Ewheels and get there opinion about the reported cutouts on the Abrams since the have access to alot more data then anyone on the forums. I asked if in their opinion they thought it was a wide spread problem and they responded as following.

Quote

This is a tricky question to answer. We've had one cut-out report from one of our customers, - and we're not really sure what caused it. For Wrong Way (Adam), something seems very peculiar with his particular Wheel, and we've followed that one to see if there's any update there (none so far). Veteran did release a firmware update that's meant to stabilize issues like these, but even so, - actually it's been perhaps surprisingly quiet on the Abrams complaints. 

 

At the end of the day, it's always statistical when it comes to cutouts, and quite frankly - based on only our customers/Abrams batch, this is up there with the best. 

 

 

Out of all of the Abrams Ewheels has sold they have only had one reported cut-out so far. Also because I am really convinced that something was wrong with Wrongways Abrams and I really don't buy that hitting a bump the size of that man hole cover would cause a cut out I decided to do some testing on my Abrams. There are some speed bumps that I like to hit on my RS for fun to see how much air I can get, when showing off a bit on group rides with my E-skate friends. I normally wouldn't try to jump them faster then like 25 but for the sake of proving my point I decided to try to hit them going the speed Adam was when he had his cut off. I hit the first one at 32mph (51kph) and the second one at 28mph (45kph)

I had some speed wobbles after landing from the first one so I decided to not push my luck after my first run but it felt rock solid and I didn't get any dip on either. I weigh 250lbs so I don't think most riders have to worry about hitting a manhole cover. With the 22in wheel I can barely even feel stuff like man hole covers. I can't fathom that a bump as minor as a manhole cover would cause any modern wheel to cut out unless you are riding past the beeps (other then on something like the mten3) 

[JoeBean]

More like 250g of crap with the little bits and puddle of juice

 

[Kekafuch]

22 minutes ago, JoeBean said:

More like 250g of crap with the little bits and puddle of juice

 

Was your wheel shipped with the tire inflated or deflated? I notice that some wheels on YouTube were deflated out of the box. I wonder if that has any effect in the slime becoming solidified? Mine was shipped inflated and the tire spins up balanced looking. 

[JoeBean]

52 minutes ago, Kekafuch said:

Was your wheel shipped with the tire inflated or deflated? I notice that some wheels on YouTube were deflated out of the box. I wonder if that has any effect in the slime becoming solidified? Mine was shipped inflated and the tire spins up balanced looking. 

I got it inflated from the retailer but they performed the cut out tests on it before sending it to me so I don't know for sure.

It was extremely unbalanced with that thing in it

Edited March 29, 2022 by JoeBean

[Mordraug]

18 hours ago, Silver said:

I decided to email Ewheels and get there opinion about the reported cutouts on the Abrams since the have access to alot more data then anyone on the forums. I asked if in their opinion they thought it was a wide spread problem and they responded as following.

 

Out of all of the Abrams Ewheels has sold they have only had one reported cut-out so far. Also because I am really convinced that something was wrong with Wrongways Abrams and I really don't buy that hitting a bump the size of that man hole cover would cause a cut out I decided to do some testing on my Abrams. There are some speed bumps that I like to hit on my RS for fun to see how much air I can get, when showing off a bit on group rides with my E-skate friends. I normally wouldn't try to jump them faster then like 25 but for the sake of proving my point I decided to try to hit them going the speed Adam was when he had his cut off. I hit the first one at 32mph (51kph) and the second one at 28mph (45kph)

I had some speed wobbles after landing from the first one so I decided to not push my luck after my first run but it felt rock solid and I didn't get any dip on either. I weigh 250lbs so I don't think most riders have to worry about hitting a manhole cover. With the 22in wheel I can barely even feel stuff like man hole covers. I can't fathom that a bump as minor as a manhole cover would cause any modern wheel to cut out unless you are riding past the beeps (other then on something like the mten3) 

Nice, did you record data to csv maybe? I'm following the issue closely, gathering data, plotting it and comparing to see if maybe there are some symptoms that would signal something is wrong.

[Silver]

1 hour ago, Mordraug said:

Nice, did you record data to csv maybe?

What's that? I just have the data euc world tracks but I can run another test if you want to add mine to your data

[Mordraug]

On 3/29/2022 at 11:04 PM, Silver said:

What's that? I just have the data euc world tracks but I can run another test if you want to add mine to your data

Euc World have that little "file" icon in top right with "csv" written on it. You can use it to start recording all the readings to the file, it's separate from the tour recording.

[Planemo]

5 minutes ago, Mordraug said:

Euc World have that little "file" icon in top right with "csv" written on it. You can use it to start recording all the readings to the file, it's separate from the tour recording.

I would always suggest that riders set the csv logging to start automatically with every ride. It can be hugely beneficial as the data is far more precise than what might be displayed in the tour log. If a problem occurs with the wheel that can't be easily explained when looking at the data on the tour log, someone like @Seba can read the csv logs like someone out of the Matrix and find things that you would never see in the tour log view.

[Paradox]

eWheels showing Abrams in stock!

https://www.ewheels.com/product/veteran-abrams-2700wh-battery-3500w-motor/

[Jpd]

My take on the abrams after 150miles:

first of all don’t believe what Adam from wrong way says about the abrams, he had to have gotten a lemon. 
I’ve found acceleration to be decent and the braking,although harder than some wheels, it’s not bad. 
The range seems to be really good until you get over 30mph then it drains much faster. The ride is smooth although a little “grunty” like the old MSX. 
If you like seated riding then you will love riding the abrams, it’s hands down the best seated ride available.

The wheel is definitely not perfect, here are some of what I consider weak  points: THE ABRAMS IS NOT AN OFF-ROAD WHEEL! No way in hell! It is way too hard to maneuver off road, the abrams is imo a purely street wheel. A long distance cruiser. 
It is a very tall wheel and if you are not at least 5’10” then I don’t recommend the abrams for you. If you are taller I think you will enjoy the size. 
The trolley handle is pretty flimsy, you have to be careful when using it. 
Pedal dipping is present at tight turns but not as bad as some have said. 
And last but not least is the weight. This thing weighs a ton! It doesn’t weigh 88lbs like the websites say, it weighs 97lbs. That’s a lot to have to load in and out of your car or carry up and down stairs. 
 

That’s my opinion of the abrams. 
Although I like the abrams it is too tall for my height, and I have traded it for another wheel. 

Edited April 3, 2022 by Jpd

[Hellkitten]

@Jpd thanks for the decent review! I am curious, what wheel did you pick to replace the Abrams? 

[Jpd]

16 minutes ago, Hellkitten said:

@Jpd thanks for the decent review! I am curious, what wheel did you pick to replace the Abrams? 

I accepted a trade for an upgraded begode e.x 

[Silver]

On 4/2/2022 at 6:22 AM, Mordraug said:

Euc World have that little "file" icon in top right with "csv" written on it. You can use it to start recording all the readings to the file, it's separate from the tour recording.

@Mordraug here is a short bit of CSV data from a short ride going up a steep hill and hitting some bumps. It's been hot out so It was a bit slower as I wasn't wearing my motorcycle jacket but hope it helps with your stuff.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/10oAkqDrSI6zUbxqSqqWGiBCfX9ybc-O9/view?usp=sharing

[Mrd777]

On 4/2/2022 at 6:23 PM, Paradox said:

eWheels showing Abrams in stock!

https://www.ewheels.com/product/veteran-abrams-2700wh-battery-3500w-motor/

My theory seems accurate that when we first hear of a new wheel they are never quite available until 9 months has passed, and that’s if you are in on the first batch. Lots of waiting in this game.

[Brianr058]

I think jpd made a fair assessment. I just hit 150 miles also and haven't had any problems. I did do an update and it made a difference just like he stated.  I'm 265lbs and don't push it as it's my first wheel but I love it 😁

Edited April 8, 2022 by Brianr058

[kiitick]

Holy crap, this wheel is big! Like, make my Sherman look small and lightweight big. It's too big for my brother who's 5'7", and almost too big for me at 5'11". It's really wide, and I feel a little bow legged riding it. I can't imagine how people are riding the s22 when it's even bigger.

That being said, it's pretty stable once you learn it. And pads are a must! I'd recommend Shayne's pads, as they are awesome. 

Does anyone know if there are honeycomb pedals available for the Abrams? I like the spikes, but think the in motion v12 honeycomb pedals are the best I've ever used on anything.

[kiitick]

I've now got over 150 miles on the Abrams.  I love it more each time a ride.  I will admit, that it's learning curve is bigger than any other wheel, and it's bruised my knees up, just like learning to ride bruised up my shins.  I'm starting to get "calluses" where it touches my legs. I'm 101kg (224 lbs) with no gear, and ride with the tire pressure at 40. I have found that this wheel requires more whole body movement, turning my feet, bending my knees, and locking my other leg for turns. Once you get the feel for it, especially the wide stance, it is SO FUN to ride.

My longest ride was 35 miles or so, over the course of 3 hours, cruising at an average of 15 mph, but top speed at 36 for several lengths.  At the end of the ride, I was down to 3 bars left on the wheel.  My voltage was 84.8, and EUC world said my battery percent was 38%. 

I haven't done a full sprint how far how fast yet, but I've been really pleased with the range.  My feet, legs, and hips are ready to be done long before the wheel is.  I've also been commuting with it every day from work. I ride at close to 36 mph for 5 miles, then 25 for the other 2.5 miles.  With that kind of riding, my lowest percentage on the wheel says 70%, but I'm only missing one bar at the end.

I've taken it on dirt, gravel, and grass.  My commute road has LOTS of bumps, and even a part where the road has no asphalt due to construction. The only time I've dropped it is when I've been stopped, and learning to cradle it in my leg like my other wheels. (It's heavy at 100 lbs). 

 

[Ronin Ryder]

It seems that these abrams random cutouts are due to bad quality hall sensor, according to a video from euc sale. Issue supposedly fixed with a software update but thats just a bandaid. Question:is it possible to replace the hall sensor? And does it need to be one from Veteran? 

At 26:30

Edited April 21, 2022 by Ronin Ryder

[Silver]

10 hours ago, Ronin Ryder said:

Question:is it possible to replace the hall sensor? And does it need to be one from Veteran? 

Denis said in an earlier video that EUC sale would be replacing there abrams hall sensors with there own sensors. So no, it wouldn't need to be one from veteran. 

[mrelwood]

15 hours ago, Ronin Ryder said:

Question:is it possible to replace the hall sensor? And does it need to be one from Veteran? 

I have replaced the hall sensors on an MSX, and rewired the whole motor. Hall sensors are very simple devices that only report yes/no based on the magnetic field. There are of course several models available, but for EUC operation the specs don't even have to match all that closely.

So yes, they can be replaced with just some bulk ones from the nearest electronics shop, as long as you check that the parameters somewhat match with the originals.

[Silver]

Now that I've been riding the Abrams for a while I've noticed that when I'm riding near the safety margen alarm in euc world (around 43mph at medium battery) I will sometimes get some type of motor vibration. It goes away if I back off and slow down a little. It's hard to describe but it's definitely not speed wobbles, it feels like the pavement suddenly changed and has bunch of tiny bumps. 

 

Has anyone else experienced this? Is it something to do with getting close to over powering the wheel? I'm not going fast enough to set off the wheels alarm just euc world's which is more conservative.

[Dan Hillary]

20 minutes ago, Silver said:

Now that I've been riding the Abrams for a while I've noticed that when I'm riding near the safety margen alarm in euc world (around 43mph at medium battery) I will sometimes get some type of motor vibration. It goes away if I back off and slow down a little. It's hard to describe but it's definitely not speed wobbles, it feels like the pavement suddenly changed and has bunch of tiny bumps. 

 

Has anyone else experienced this? Is it something to do with getting close to over powering the wheel? I'm not going fast enough to set off the wheels alarm just euc world's which is more conservative.

Yep, I've felt that. I chalked it up to some combination of the square-wave controller that it's my understanding that the Abrams has and some resonant frequency that the stock tire makes at that speed. I'll be curious to see if it still happens when I change to the Pilot Street 2 street tire.