Popular Post travsformation Posted January 27, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 27, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, MikeTheCreator said: I don’t get why some people are so passionately against this. It’s totally smart to be mentally prepared. Of course studying how to fall would benefit us! Disagreeing is at the heart of every forum I can only speak for myself, but in my case I'm neither passionate about the subject nor against this. I see nothing wrong with knowing/learning how to fall and think it can be useful in certain situations. But for the most part, in my experience, falls are often too unpredictable to be able to prepare for them or to be able to apply your falling skills. There's also the fact, and this might be the reason some people are very vocal about it, that believing that your "falling skills" can save you from getting hurt can lead to a false sense of confidence. If you believe there's not much you can do in the event of the fall, on the other hand, it's much more likely that your focus will be not to fall in the first place, meaning that you'll probably be more cautious. Having said that, a very important skill in terms of minimizing damage in a fall is environmental awareness. More important than how you land is where or on what you land: hitting a curb, a lamp post, a parked car, a rail, etc., are things you definitely want to prevent at all costs, so it's important to be aware of your environment. Incidentally, it's also one of the most important factors involved in preventing falls and accidents in the first place, so it's definitely a skill (or a mindset) worth developing. That doesn't mean you have to be paranoid, watching out for potential "death traps" the entire time you're riding. It's just a matter of being cautious, scanning your surroundings for speed bumps, pot holes, potential jaywalkers, etc., and keeping a prudent distance from parked cars (doors can fly open in the blink of an eye) to prevent avoidable accidents. And in the event of getting speed wobbles that you aren't sure you're going to be able to control, for example, being aware of your environment can help you assess whether/when to bail or which direction you definitely don't want to fall in (because there's a curb or a lamp post); your instincts will take care of the rest. It's probably also worth mentioning that scanning your environment isn't something you should have to do/can do in that split second before the fall; if you're doing things right you should already be aware of your environment before that happens (and can hopefully prevent the fall in the first place) Edited January 27, 2020 by travsformation 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 6 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said: Because you cannot be mentally prepared the entire time you ride unless you want it to be the most stressful thing you do all day. This has been brought up numerous times on these boards. I repeat, you cannot be mentally prepared to fall unless you want to hate riding EUC’s. Riding is supposed to be liberating. Freeing. To have falling at the forefront of your mind the entire time you ride would almost certainly induce wobbles at speed, and would completely go against the point of riding. It’s like If you’re a gear guy and you forget your gloves or wrist guards at home. All of a sudden the ride is incredibly stressful and you no longer feel relaxed. Your speed slows considerably and you’re scanning the road for anything foreign even though you know it like the back of your hand. Paranoid that you’ll look like you ran your hands through a cheese grater real soon. Perfectly stated 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTheCreator Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 I guess this all depends on the person. But I understand both positions. On top of everything. I think environmental awareness is the biggest key. Also wearing all of the proper gear. I really appreciate all of your inputs. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ben Kim Posted January 29, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 29, 2020 Buddy of mine cut out on his MSX at 47 mph the other day, broke his fibula. Problem was he instinctually tried to run it off and it was way too fast for this. At those speeds, you need to go limp and into a slide position; fighting the fall will make the injuries worse. Running off a fall is probably suited to 15 mph or slower. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_bike_kite Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 On 1/25/2020 at 5:50 PM, travsformation said: How does a high-speed fall play out with motorcycle gloves? (I ask because I don't know). How does the increased friction translate? I've crashed a lot of motorcycles, sometimes through hedges, sometimes colliding with vehicles, low sides, high sides and even a few head on's. I'll admit I wasn't the safest rider on the road but I was spectacularly good at crashing - and usually, but not always, walking away. You don't have a huge amount of time to react in a bike crash because you tend to be riding fairly quickly but there is some time and I found there were a few golden rules. Decide whether you're going to swerve or brake - doing both just loses traction. Apply moderate braking before slamming on the anchors - this stops the front wheel from skidding. Use both brakes - sure the rear might provide less braking but it still provides some. When I knew I was going to hit something I'd always stand out of the saddle - it tended to put a bit more weight on the front tyre, which is good for braking, but it also tended to throw you off the bike in an impact rather than getting you caught up in your handlebars or going through the other guys windscreen. Never try and put your arms out to stop the impact with the road - it just breaks your arms/shoulders/wrists and, in all honesty, just sliding down the road isn't all that bad assuming your dressed for it. I think EUC accidents are different to motorcycle accidents though because they don't tend to involve another vehicle (fewer impact injuries) and there's almost no warning of what's about to happen so it's almost impossible to prepare (we'll ignore that incessant beeping). EUC riders also tend to wear less protective gear so end up with more light abrasions. The other difference is that bike riders tend to be flung horizontally down the road while EUC riders initially hit the road standing vertically, once their feet hit the road their upper body gets flung down at the ground (like snowboarding) and that's where the wrist guards come in. Decent leather motorcycle gloves will survive a couple of decent slides down the road but eventually either the leather goes or the stitching goes. Leather provides more friction than synthetic gloves but friction itself doesn't play any useful role in a crash (unless your heading towards a cliff). Synthetic gloves and jackets will only last one crash. Both only protect you from abrasion injuries so you'll still break your arm/shoulder/wrist if you try and stop the impact. The gloves tend to be only useful in the initial contact with the road and, after that, you tend to be sliding on your hips/arse/elbows and shoulders. All the same, if you crash at a moderate pace with no protection on your hands then you'll loose the skin and flesh. (sorry for going on a bit) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonesq Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 5 hours ago, Ben Kim said: Buddy of mine cut out on his MSX at 47 mph the other day, broke his fibula. Problem was he instinctually tried to run it off and it was way too fast for this. At those speeds, you need to go limp and into a slide position; fighting the fall will make the injuries worse. Running off a fall is probably suited to 15 mph or slower. is 47mph a new record? How is that MSX spec'd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post tenofnine Posted January 29, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 29, 2020 57 minutes ago, Jonesq said: is 47mph a new record? How is that MSX spec'd? Didn't chooch tech get like 49 mph out of his 100v MSX going down a mountain road in Flagstaff (on video)? But then again he weighs 120 and isn't very tall, dude has some of the biggest EUC balls....but really unwise to go as fast as he does on these things. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Kim Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Jonesq said: is 47mph a new record? How is that MSX spec'd? it was on flat, the loomo 100V 2200Wh MSX. He was passing me thinking i was going slow, but i was actually going 39 mph on my Monster. We were on a suicide run on a freeway service road in NYC. Id post videos, but i’d get everyone saying how we’re gonna get EUCs banned, so i will refrain. The damage to his wheel is pretty significant, cracked outer shell, needs new headlight, tail light, pedal rods are toast, but i think the inner shell survived since he had these big custom pads on it. Edited January 30, 2020 by Ben Kim 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Kim Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 2 hours ago, tenofnine said: Didn't chooch tech get like 49 mph out of his 100v MSX going down a mountain road in Flagstaff (on video)? But then again he weighs 120 and isn't very tall, dude has some of the biggest EUC balls....but really unwise to go as fast as he does on these things. downhill, the MSX can hit 50 if the battery is completely full, you have a long enough road and you don’t sag the battery too much. Guys in NYC regularly hit 45 MPH on a 20 degree decline in what we call “cutout tunnel”. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 The 80% alarm on the 100V MSX at 100% battery is at 69kph/43mph. If we assume 80% means 80%, the motor cut-off/no-torque speed is 69/0.8 = 86kph/53mph. I don't think even a decline can save you then. Tips on falling properly? Don't fall because you don't ride that stupidly fast. The alarm is there for a reason. Listen to the alarms so you don't fall from an overlean. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Kim Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: The 80% alarm on the 100V MSX at 100% battery is at 69kph/43mph. If we assume 80% means 80%, the motor cut-off/no-torque speed is 69/0.8 = 86kph/53mph. I don't think even a decline can save you then. Tips on falling properly? Don't fall because you don't ride that stupidly fast. The alarm is there for a reason. Listen to the alarms so you don't fall from an overlean. You have maybe 3-4 mph to play with when that 80% alarm triggers at any given moment, but even then a bump in the road and your face is meeting pavement. One of our local riders found this out the hard way cutting out at 41 mph from hitting a bump on his Monster V2 the other day. His shell is completely toast. My one experience from an almost-cutout was with the Mten3, pedals dipped on flat at 26 mph. You could say there is quite a proliferation of suicidal riders in NYC that this forum never hears about. other people’s misfortunes keep me educated on what I can and can’t do on this wheel. Edited January 30, 2020 by Ben Kim 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Skecys Posted January 31, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 31, 2020 I don't think you can really "prepare" yourself for a fall. Some of the video's posted here about falling are nice but people that skateboard or do martial arts fall A LOT, it is part of the sport. EUC riders tend to fall rarely. Sure somebody that does other kinds of active sports and has a strong core/joints will absorb any impact much better then someone totally out of shape, that is a given. But I think wearing the right gear and having great situational awareness is way more important on an EUC. The easiest way to be safe is not to ride faster then you can sprint. If you do want more speed, wear full protection. Also if you have to ride at night, only use roads you have been on before. Some simple beginners tips; always bend your knees, this will help absorb unseen bumps and potholes immensely. Also consider installing "Kuji pads" if your EUC is not too heavy. These will allow you to jump small obstacles and lower the chance of you sliding off the pedals. When you do finally jump off during a crash try to do so behind your wheel, or to the side. This is especially important for new riders during the learning process. I have yet to put my hands on the ground since I started riding, always have been able to run off a crash, but during my learning experience my ankles were swollen and blue from all the pedal strikes (EUC hitting my ankles after I jumped off). 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M640x Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 I fell a lot at first and because of that I started practicing falling. I wear elbow, knee, wrist pads and helmet every time I ride. I remember my first two weeks of Aikido all we did was learn to fall and that's what lead me to start practicing for the EUC and Onewheel. I ride standard foot on my Onewheel so I researched and practiced how I would most likely fall when using that device. I found that using the same technique worked with my EUC riding. The natural reaction is to throw the arms out when losing control/falling It's not natural and difficult to stop but I practiced not putting the arms out and just allowing myself to fall and immediately forcing a roll. I immediately tuck into a loose fetal position. Forcing a roll appears to spread the energy out and keep any one body part from absorbing all the falling force. I'd practice it out in the yard or carpet in the house before riding my Onewheel. I'm sure the neighbors probably got a kick out of watching some geezer rolling around in the yard lol. To my amazement so far it has worked 100% of the time plus the pads/helmet in keeping me from getting any injuries. Knocking on wood here lol. It even worked one time when I was dumb enuf to ride my Onewheel without pads/helmet and took a tumble on cement. My way of falling works for me and is listed here for informational purposes only. Any use of the information contained within this post is at your own risk and I am not responsible for any injury you may incur. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Senior Coffee said: I fell a lot at first and because of that I started practicing falling. I wear elbow, knee, wrist pads and helmet every time I ride. I remember my first two weeks of Aikido all we did was learn to fall and that's what lead me to start practicing for the EUC and Onewheel. I ride standard foot on my Onewheel so I researched and practiced how I would most likely fall when using that device. I found that using the same technique worked with my EUC riding. The natural reaction is to throw the arms out when losing control/falling It's not natural and difficult to stop but I practiced not putting the arms out and just allowing myself to fall and immediately forcing a roll. I immediately tuck into a loose fetal position. Forcing a roll appears to spread the energy out and keep any one body part from absorbing all the falling force. I'd practice it out in the yard or carpet in the house before riding my Onewheel. I'm sure the neighbors probably got a kick out of watching some geezer rolling around in the yard lol. To my amazement so far it has worked 100% of the time plus the pads/helmet in keeping me from getting any injuries. Knocking on wood here lol. It even worked one time when I was dumb enuf to ride my Onewheel without pads/helmet and took a tumble on cement. My way of falling works for me and is listed here for informational purposes only. Any use of the information contained within this post is at your own risk and I am not responsible for any injury you may incur. Good advice and very practical when you can foresee a fall. Unfortunately some of my bad falls were unexpected and so sudden that I was impacting the ground before I knew what was happening. I have successful fallen off the wheel with a roll but only when I anticipated that I might come off the wheel. So it comes down randomness/luck. Do you think this guy could have rolled? Wear your full face helmet when possible. Edited June 6, 2020 by Marty Backe 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 accept it, expect it, laugh at it and move on? Rinse...repeat until unable to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayBanMonster Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 On 1/23/2020 at 6:48 AM, MikeTheCreator said: Hello everyone. I have really been enjoying my new 18xl. I was wondering if you guys have any tips pointers or advice on how one should fall off properly if the time ever occurs. Thank you so much in advance for any help! I used to have terrible crashes.. 2 weeks out of action type faceplants.. Now I get mild bruising because I imagine the floor is too hot, ( a perception related to speed), if I fall I dont want to touch any of it.. so I lightly touch it quickly with all diff parts of my body. This sets me up to now automatically roll out and through any crash as my default setting. You must keep on moving through it. With this mindset I have gotten up and carried on riding after crashes at 25mph, with bystanders amazed at what they saw. Hope that helps. Just let everything break the fall lightly. Dont listen to anybody that says you need to crash forwards.. thats where the injuries really scale. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBladeOfHades Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 If at all possible never try and run out of a fall, drop to your knees and roll. Trying to run leads to the face smash, just like in the video posted by Marty, your feet become a detriment to your face by dragging you down. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Wesh Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 2 hours ago, TheBladeOfHades said: If at all possible never try and run out of a fall, drop to your knees and roll. Trying to run leads to the face smash, just like in the video posted by Marty, your feet become a detriment to your face by dragging you down. I never try to run out of speeds faster than 15mph it seems. Even though I’m capable of running at 25mph I always fall down on one knee and roll. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennBruce Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 21 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said: Even though I’m capable of running at 25mph I always fall down on one knee and roll. And how far can you run at 25mph? Bruce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Kim Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 23 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said: I never try to run out of speeds faster than 15mph it seems. Even though I’m capable of running at 25mph I always fall down on one knee and roll. Yep, If i'm about to crash above 25 mph its go limp and let the pads take the hit; fighting the fall will just make things worse. Signed, 42 mph cutout survivor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Wesh Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, PennBruce said: And how far can you run at 25mph? Bruce Like 20meters lol. That’s my top speed, a human body can only sustain their top for a second or two. Sustained 22mph in a 100m race. People always say don’t ride faster than you can run, but they forget that you can’t just instantaneously pump out 100% after stepping off a wheel. I imagine I could only produce enough force to get to like 15mph with one step if I were falling. Of course, that could be enough to keep me from crumbling to the ground and able to keep running the momentum off(if my body chose to run it off) Edited June 8, 2020 by Darrell Wesh 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 10 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said: Like 20meters lol. That’s my top speed, a human body can only sustain their top for a second or two. Sustained 22mph in a 100m race. People always say don’t ride faster than you can run, but they forget that you can’t just instantaneously pump out 100% after stepping off a wheel. I imagine I could only produce enough force to get to like 15mph with one step if I were falling. Of course, that could be enough to keep me from crumbling to the ground and able to keep running the momentum off(if my body chose to run it off) the fastest crash ive ever run out was ~30 kph... ive never actually hit the ground from a crash.. this was about three years ago though when i hit a pothole riding in the dark with no healight like an idiot haha... that was the last time ive come off a wheel made sure not to make that mistake again... i was very lucky though because i had warning, not like with an overlean so i was able to prep for a few ms haha, i ran about a city block xD yea coming off a wheel is not comparable to sprinting at all, usually you have zero warning and its not like you can instantaneously run at your absolute top speed with no warning lol you need to build it up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Hatfield Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 I don't think I read the distinction between a controlled and uncontrolled fall, but definitely read people describing both. If I'm repeating what someone already said, apologies In a controlled fall you see it coming, have a few instants to make a quick choice, and hope that the 'training' kicks in. In an uncontrolled fall, there is no warning, just an instant splatter and then one is left picking up the pieces. that is where one needs the protective gear to do it's job, which is why protective gear should aways be worn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterwheel Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 I rarely wear protective gear and yet somehow I've survived more than 15,000 kms of riding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 hour ago, winterwheel said: I rarely wear protective gear and yet somehow I've survived more than 15,000 kms of riding. triple that and never even owned a piece.. though i dont ride in the horrible type of weather you do on vancouver island 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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