KingSong 16X 1554Wh 2200W 16*3in (Released July 2019)

[stephen]

So received my ks16x just now 😁 

To impatient to set anything up so thought I'd do something different .a no messing straight out of the box test , I'll do proper videos later 

Only been on it 10 minutes ,, what can i say but WOW,, FEELS LOVELY,, i know it's only a short one but here's the video , it's now on my 5amp charger and I'll do the speed settings but i want it full battery to really test it ,, tyre feels great btw

It definitely has the feeling of been a good trial/woods EUC feels so nimble and sets off so quick and I've not even tried yet😊

Sorry about the editing i didn't do any,, nothing prepared 😁😂 just straight out the box and ride 👍

 

Edited September 3, 2019 by stephen

[chrisjunlee]

58 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

I own, as you do, both the Nikola Plus and KS16X. IMO the 16X is quicker, more balanced and most importantly definitely more stable at higher speeds. So since the Nikola is the flagship wheel of Gotway (for now at least)  I don’t really see how you can say that it is “light-years” ahead. 

Interesting that several people have said the 16X is faster acceleration than the Nikola. I would love to do a side by side video analysis once I settle down

The 16X motor:

• grinds/vibrates at low speeds like a restaurant pager on steroids. It's possible it's Kingsong proprietary anti-fatigue deep tissue foot massage technology.
• easy to pedal dip, aka overlean, especially above 20 mph
• goes up to 30 mph. This is close to cutoff, since we have at least one case of someone overleaning on a flat surface (hi @BleepBloopBlop)

The Nikola 100V:

• buttery smooth, no grinding at all - like rolling a bowing ball down a smooth astroglided bowling lane 
• zero pedal zip, even at 30mph
• goes up to 40 mph (I've hit 42.3 mph). That works out to 2.25x more power output than the 16X. And it did not feel sketchy at all.

And I'm starting to notice something odd with the performance of the Nikola Plus: battery life is awful - I'm getting 45 miles of usable range, vs the 65 miles on the 16X. 

58 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

I understand the Plus will go 40 mph but I can’t seem to get past 25 mph without the thing shaking all over the place. 

This is something subtle I haven't noticed anyone mention: each wheel's stock tire may have been chosen with different "gyro assistance" speeds in mind.

The KS16X has a gyro heavy tire, and the gyro assist kicks in around 15-20 mph. My no effort point is 22 mph (that's also what KS firmware seems to dial you in towards).

The Nikola has a gyro light tire: to feel the same gyro effect, it's 30+ mph IMHO. My no effort point is 30+mph. 

 

Edited September 3, 2019 by chrisjunlee

[Marty Backe]

37 minutes ago, stephen said:

So received my ks16x just now 😁 

To impatient to set anything up so thought I'd do something different .a no messing straight out of the box test , I'll do proper videos later 

Only been on it 10 minutes ,, what can i say but WOW,, FEELS LOVELY,, i know it's only a short one but here's the video , it's now on my 5amp charger and I'll do the speed settings but i want it full battery to really test it ,, tyre feels great btw

It definitely has the feeling of been a good trial/woods EUC feels so nimble and sets off so quick and I've not even tried yet😊

Sorry about the editing i didn't do any,, nothing prepared 😁😂 just straight out the box and ride 👍

 

I suspected that Z10 owners would have no issues with the 16X tire handling. Nice 'first look' video 

[Marty Backe]

8 minutes ago, chrisjunlee said:

Interesting that several people have said the 16X is faster acceleration than the Nikola. I would love to do a side by side video analysis once I settle down

The 16X motor:

• grinds/vibrates at low speeds like a restaurant pager on steroids. It's possible it's Kingsong proprietary anti-fatigue deep tissue foot massage technology.
• easy to pedal dip, aka overlean, especially above 20 mph
• goes up to 30 mph. This is close to cutoff, since we have at least one case of someone overleaning on a flat surface (hi @BleepBloopBlop)

The Nikola 100V:

• buttery smooth, no grinding at all - like rolling a bowing ball down a smooth astroglided bowling lane 
• zero pedal zip, even at 30mph
• goes up to 40 mph (I've hit 42.3 mph). That works out to 2.25x more power output than the 16X. And it did not feel sketchy at all.

And I'm starting to notice something odd with the performance of the Nikola Plus: battery life is awful - I'm getting 45 miles of usable range, vs the 65 miles on the 16X. 

This is something subtle I haven't noticed anyone mention: each wheel's stock tire may have been chosen with different "gyro assistance" speeds in mind.

The KS16X has a gyro heavy tire, and the gyro assist kicks in around 15-20 mph. My no effort point is 22 mph (that's also what KS firmware seems to dial you in towards).

The Nikola has a gyro light tire: to feel the same gyro effect, it's 30+ mph IMHO. My no effort point is 30+mph. 

 

Are you riding the Nikola just like the 16X? Speed kills the battery. Set the Nikola tilt-back at 30-mph and than see if the 16X really has more range.

[stephen]

7 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I suspected that Z10 owners would have no issues with the 16X tire handling. Nice 'first look' video 

Cheers Marty .i think the 16x just fits in nice with my msx and Z10👍

[stephen]

1 hour ago, Chili D said:

This point is my reaction. I was looking at this wheel, but it no longer fits into my riding style  and needs. 

 

Glad and I haven’t purchased yet.  

I think kingsong will lower the limit a bit ,,but seriously ,,buy it don't let it stop you it rides lovely

[chrisjunlee]

32 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Are you riding the Nikola just like the 16X? Speed kills the battery. Set the Nikola tilt-back at 30-mph and than see if the 16X really has more range.

It doesn't feel like I'm riding it any differently - still ride within my 80% comfort zone. But yes, 5-10 mph faster than the 16X. 

[Unventor]

38 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I suspected that Z10 owners would have no issues with the 16X tire handling. Nice 'first look' video 

I tested a Z10 briefly. You might recall it what I thought at the time. The Z10 test is what I have to use now as ride style as my gas/brake foot stands do not work for me. 

You might have seen my forum-log (f-log). I have had a blast of a time. Now I am not a Z10 owner but there are similarities definitely. 

But it also have some V8 sensation too. As I don't have same stance as on my KS18L. I only touch the wheel when turning at speeds above 20kmh like @houseofjobdo on the Z10.

Do not ride fast at all. More to come with in my day2 flog. 😁😎

[Patton250]

1 hour ago, chrisjunlee said:

Interesting that several people have said the 16X is faster acceleration than the Nikola. I would love to do a side by side video analysis once I settle down

The 16X motor:

• grinds/vibrates at low speeds like a restaurant pager on steroids. It's possible it's Kingsong proprietary anti-fatigue deep tissue foot massage technology.
• easy to pedal dip, aka overlean, especially above 20 mph
• goes up to 30 mph. This is close to cutoff, since we have at least one case of someone overleaning on a flat surface (hi @BleepBloopBlop)

The Nikola 100V:

• buttery smooth, no grinding at all - like rolling a bowing ball down a smooth astroglided bowling lane 
• zero pedal zip, even at 30mph
• goes up to 40 mph (I've hit 42.3 mph). That works out to 2.25x more power output than the 16X. And it did not feel sketchy at all.

And I'm starting to notice something odd with the performance of the Nikola Plus: battery life is awful - I'm getting 45 miles of usable range, vs the 65 miles on the 16X. 

This is something subtle I haven't noticed anyone mention: each wheel's stock tire may have been chosen with different "gyro assistance" speeds in mind.

The KS16X has a gyro heavy tire, and the gyro assist kicks in around 15-20 mph. My no effort point is 22 mph (that's also what KS firmware seems to dial you in towards).

The Nikola has a gyro light tire: to feel the same gyro effect, it's 30+ mph IMHO. My no effort point is 30+mph. 

 

Sounds to me like something is wrong with your 16X.  I experience ZERO of those noises or problems you listed with mine. I agree the Nikola is most definitely buttery smooth all the way up to 18-22mph where then it wobbles to the point I am too concerned to push it further. 

[Patton250]

1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

Are you riding the Nikola just like the 16X? Speed kills the battery. Set the Nikola tilt-back at 30-mph and than see if the 16X really has more range.

I just took my 16X out for 40 miles this morning.  When I got home and had 30% battery. For me it does not tilt back at 31 mph it just says to decelerate . However once I got below 50% battery it would say to decelerate once I hit 26 mph.  But it didn’t tilt back.  At least not that I could notice.  The fact that you can’t go past 25 mph once it drops below 50% is quite frustrating. With this wheel it’s remarkably easy to get up to 30 mph without blinking.  It’s also easy to stay at that speed and carve quite wonderfully. 

Also the stock CX tire is awesome. I’m definitely not changing it. 

Edited September 3, 2019 by Patton250

[stephen]

4 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

Sounds to me like something is wrong with your 16X.  I experience ZERO of those noises or problems you listed

Me neither it's super quiet at every speed

[chrisjunlee]

4 minutes ago, stephen said:

Me neither it's super quiet at every speed

It's most apparent braking downhill. Try going slow, 2 mph slow, and you'll feel the grinding. 

[Patton250]

9 minutes ago, chrisjunlee said:

It's most apparent braking downhill. Try going slow, 2 mph slow, and you'll feel the grinding. 

 Before the latest firmware update I had grinding at ultra low speed’s going back-and-forth. I thought I posted the video here.  I’ll post it here. After the firmware update it doesn’t do it anymore. 

 

[eddiemoy]

4 hours ago, Garrie Lim said:

I am enjoying my ks16X with 1st batch tire more and more. Riding more confidently and aggressively when I need to and want to. 

 

Tried the new tire today on my friend’s 16X, no gyro but I felt uncomfortable, probably because I was getting used to the 16x 1st tire. 

 

I am loving it more and more!

When you get used to the gyro action, your brain needs 5-10 minutes to swap programs when jumping back on a regular non-gyro wheel.  This is the only reason I didn't stay with the CX tire even though I also learned to love it.  I have other wheels and I don't like the adjustment period between gyro and non-gyro.

[Gustesta]

10 minutes ago, eddiemoy said:

When you get used to the gyro action, your brain needs 5-10 minutes to swap programs when jumping back on a regular non-gyro wheel.  This is the only reason I didn't stay with the CX tire even though I also learned to love it.  I have other wheels and I don't like the adjustment period between gyro and non-gyro.

In terms of acceleration, is the Nikola 100v faster than the 16x?  I’ve been reading mixed reviews about it.

[Marty Backe]

28 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

Sounds to me like something is wrong with your 16X.  I experience ZERO of those noises or problems you listed with mine. I agree the Nikola is most definitely buttery smooth all the way up to 18-22mph where then it wobbles to the point I am too concerned to push it further. 

Maybe the Nikola doesn't match your body. Seriously. Because wobbles are not caused by the wheel but by the rider. 25-mph is not fast on the Nikola and certainly most Nikola riders don't experience wobbles. It can also be experience - I ride a hell of a lot better than I did 3-years ago.

[eddiemoy]

2 hours ago, chrisjunlee said:

It's 1st batch. No matter how much testing you do, there's a certain point you gotta release it. You're not going to catch all the bugs, it's just the way things are.

With that said, I love the 16X motor. It makes the 18XL feel anemic.

Next level up is the Nikola motor. But we all know Gotway is light-years ahead since performance is the main thing they focus on.

with v1.06 on the 16X, it seems quicker to me than the Nik+.  Before I upgraded the firmware(v1.01), the Nik+ seemed quicker at accelerating.  I picked a 100' stretch and had the app running and did about 10 runs from zero and got consistently higher speeds with the 16X(37-38kmph) vs the Nik+(33-35kmph).  You can try the same thing see what you get.

@Gustesta, see my comments above.  acceleration determines quickness, top speed is what we consider fast.  so Nik+ is faster since it is 100V, but the 16X is quicker now with the latest update.

Edited September 3, 2019 by eddiemoy

[Patton250]

4 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Maybe the Nikola doesn't match your body. Seriously. Because wobbles are not caused by the wheel but by the rider. 25-mph is not fast on the Nikola and certainly most Nikola riders don't experience wobbles. It can also be experience - I ride a hell of a lot better than I did 3-years ago.

 I very much would like your statement to be true but there’s a problem. I can hop on my 18XL, MSX, 16X, and go 30 MHP no problem. Very smooth. I can also hop on my Z10 and go 25 MPH no problem and it also very smooth.  So I don’t know what it is. Maybe it is wrong for my body type. I hope not. I really like it.  It’s beautiful. I’m going to keep riding it. What about a tire swap? Could that help? 

[Patton250]

7 minutes ago, Gustesta said:

In terms of acceleration, is the Nikola 100v faster than the 16x?  I’ve been reading mixed reviews about it.

Yes the Nikola Plus is faster it’s supposed to go 40 mph.  As far as acceleration in my opinion the 16 X is faster but not by much. It’s really negligible in my opinion. 

[eddiemoy]

30 minutes ago, chrisjunlee said:

It's most apparent braking downhill. Try going slow, 2 mph slow, and you'll feel the grinding. 

yes, this is the harshness i noticed which is similar when you are trolleying the wheel.  this happened only after the latest firmware update.  I didn't try any of the firmwares between 1.01 to 1.06.  i just jumped to v1.06.  I fine with the harshness at low speeds just don't want it at high speed which they have fixed.  

[Patton250]

7 minutes ago, eddiemoy said:

yes, this is the harshness i noticed which is similar when you are trolleying the wheel.  this happened only after the latest firmware update.  I didn't try any of the firmwares between 1.01 to 1.06.  i just jumped to v1.06.  I fine with the harshness at low speeds just don't want it at high speed which they have fixed.  

 It’s a little scary how these things are so inconsistent. The noise happens on yours with the latest firmware and the latest firmware made the noise go away on mine. Very weird. 

[eddiemoy]

1 minute ago, Patton250 said:

 It’s a little scary how these things are so inconsistent. The noise happens on yours with the latest firmware and the latest firmware made the noise go away on mine. Very weird. 

yes, only if you are going really slow, like slower than walking.  It isn't a big deal.  It is similar to the sound I got when pushing my v100 MSX against a wall.  Kind of a clicking that is felt through the pedals.  I think it is normal for PWM power delivery.  The major concern was the oscillation at 45km and above which is now gone.  

 

[Nathan Gosamo]

Is this wheel fine as my only wheel ?

I have an electric skateboard for shorter trips, to get groceries etc..

[Marty Backe]

18 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

 I very much would like your statement to be true but there’s a problem. I can hop on my 18XL, MSX, 16X, and go 30 MHP no problem. Very smooth. I can also hop on my Z10 and go 25 MPH no problem and it also very smooth.  So I don’t know what it is. Maybe it is wrong for my body type. I hope not. I really like it.  It’s beautiful. I’m going to keep riding it. What about a tire swap? Could that help? 

I suppose your tire/wheel could be out of balance, but certainly you've already checked that. Other than an obvious tire/wheel defect, wobbles are human induced. Like I said, in earnest, maybe there is something about the shape, etc., that doesn't match your body?

I've seen no wobble complaints from all the folks that I know who are 35+ mph Nikola riders.

Your experience is certainly for real. I'm just trying to dispel the notion that the Nikola is prone to wobbles.

Edited September 3, 2019 by Marty Backe

[Patton250]

11 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I suppose your tire/wheel could be out of balance, but certainly you've already checked that. Other than an obvious tire/wheel defect, wobbles are human induced. Like I said, in earnest, maybe there is something about the shape, etc., that doesn't match your body?

I've seen no wobble complaints from all the folks that I know who are 35+ mph Nikola riders.

Your experience is certainly for real. I'm just trying to dispel the notion that the Nikola is prone to wobbles.

 Another thing I forgot to mention is out of all my wheels I love the thickness of the Nikola the best.  I don’t use the pads so without those the way I straddle it feels most comfortable of any wheel.  I’m just going to keep at it. Couple of members here that have been very helpful suggest that time will make the wobble  go away. I hope so. To me the Nic+ is a keeper.