Popular Post WARPed1701D Posted June 19, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 19, 2018 @Bobwheel While you are online can you confirm the engineers are also looking into the problem of unnecessary exteme and permenent tiltback? People are getting this when they experience brief overload conditions. I get these overload alerts on my V8 a lot and all it does it sound an klaxon. People with V10s are finding that in this condition the wheel enters full tiltback causing them to step off and requiring a reset to continue. This does not seem like expected behavior based on how the V8 performs. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechShizzle Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 @Bobwheel Are replacement motors going out to dealers as well? I have a bad bearing and @Jason McNeil is waiting on parts to replace my motor... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniVehje Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 47 minutes ago, Bobwheel said: @eddiemoy @Mark Lee I know you've been annoyed by the acceleration of the V10F, especially the not so responsive start. Our team has been working on it for weeks, and there should be an upgraded firmware version released on the App by the end of this week, and we hope you like it. Thanks again for your feedback. This is fantastic. This has been the only negative for me also and so nice to see it fixed. Can’t wait to try it out! Thank you 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniVehje Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 53 minutes ago, soulson said: Any word on whether your team is looking into the frequent overload-type behavior? It seems to be happening (to me at least) more often than it should be. <50°C board temps, <1000W power usage, >60% battery, flat ground, and it throws me off the back very reliably if I accelerate quickly to 35kph. If I could change only one thing about my wheel, it would be that. Otherwise, I really like it. Can you take a video of this happening. Doesn’t sound normal. Today I really tried to replicate this but couldn’t. I’m 73 kg without gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulson Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 (edited) I don't have any equipment with which to do that. But it's not just me having this issue; maybe someone else getting the 45° tilt back can make a video. I am 91kg without gear. Note that originally I was concerned that the V10F didn't accelerate very well.. I don't think that anymore. I just think the lack of acceleration people experience is due to lack of leverage on the wheel from the short pedal arms. I adjusted my footing accordingly and now I can race off the line pretty well with this thing. But it throws me off the back when I do. I'm curious what effect this new firmware will have on my situation, if any. Edited June 19, 2018 by soulson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
that0n3guy Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Bobwheel said: I know you've been annoyed by the acceleration of the V10F, especially the not so responsive start. Our team has been working on it for weeks, and there should be an upgraded firmware version released on the App by the end of this week, and we hope you like it. WOOOT! That's exciting stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 4 hours ago, Bobwheel said: @eddiemoy @Mark Lee I know you've been annoyed by the acceleration of the V10F, especially the not so responsive start. Our team has been working on it for weeks, and there should be an upgraded firmware version released on the App by the end of this week, and we hope you like it. Thanks again for your feedback. Excellent! Will give it a try once it is released! There is one other thing that will make this wheel much better... Any chance you can unlock the wheel to 45kmph? The speed throttling starting from a little less than 100% really makes this wheel kind of the same speed as the KS16S. With 2KW motor, this wheel should be able to safely go 45kmph until well below 50%? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniVehje Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 3 minutes ago, eddiemoy said: Excellent! Will give it a try once it is released! There is one other thing that will make this wheel much better... Any chance you can unlock the wheel to 45kmph? The speed throttling starting from a little less than 100% really makes this wheel kind of the same speed as the KS16S. With 2KW motor, this wheel should be able to safely go 45kmph until well below 50%? DarknessBot should get it to 45 km/h once we get it to recognise the wheel but I wonder how other behaviours will work with it. Warning siren, battery throttling, etc. I would certainly prefer these to be done by the official app and with InMotion's firmware. I kind of understand their point of view also. They might want to see more of these wheels in the wild before relaxing on the safety margins. I suspect the 18L motor is from the same manufacture. Could be exactly the same motor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post WARPed1701D Posted June 19, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 19, 2018 (edited) Personally, rather than seeing the top speed increased I'd prefer to see refinement of the throttling based on battery level and even then only if InMotion believe they have been too conservative in their assessment of the battery's ability to supply current at lower charge levels. In my EUC wishlist a few months back I wrote that I'd like to see a powerful EUC with a conservative speed limit so that even at max speed the motor has loads of power in reserve to be able to get me out of an unexpected/bad pothole or some other high torque demand situation. This torque should be available to keep me safe and not to allow me to speed. Honestly the V10 looks to be that machine and considering InMotion's history of safety I would be dissapointed of the bowed to pressure and increased the V10 above 40kph. You want to go that fast you need a Kingsong or Gotway. Now if it could do 40kph down to 50% battery and still maintain sufficient current supply from the 4P battery to meet unexpected power demands from the 2000W motor then that is great. I'd still like to see intelligent limiting that looks at more than voltage such as recent historical average power demand (to help determine riding environment) and rider weight (as inputted by the user in the app). Edited June 19, 2018 by WARPed1701D 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post beast@tanagra Posted June 19, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 19, 2018 8 hours ago, Bobwheel said: You're right. The scratching noise most likely come from a stone got stuck between the motor and the heat sink inside of the shell. Because the gap of heat sink fins is 3mm, which is the same with the distance between the top of the heat sink to the motor cover, so a small rock can easily got stuck there and make the noise. So the first step is to check if there is any stone got stuck there, and if not, we should suspect the bearing. I hadn't ridden my new V10F since getting the scrapes myself on 6/7, but this post inspired me to take another look. I flipped it on both sides and spun the tire around like I did before, and peeked in with a flashlight. It took repeating the process a couple of times and listening closely, but I did eventually catch a glimpse of gravel caught up in the structure above the axle. After holding the whole EUC literally upside down and shaking it a few times, I was able to get this little tetrahedral chiplet to plink out: A subsequent test drive was free of scrape! As my scrape had appeared on my first charge, at low speed, on sidewalk, I am a little worried that debris entrapment is going to be a recurring hassle with the wheel (Imagine doing the upside down shake repeatedly on a long trail ride!). And I'm still apprehensive that I could be sitting on a bearing time bomb, but... as long as eWheels and/or Inmotion are committed to replacing this motor, either preemptively or down the road as needed, I am satisfied for now and looking forward to the new firmware. I'm not sure how silly I should feel. I'm relatively new to EUC and wouldn't have thought to take a brand new 47-pound machine, hold it upside down, and shake it as a method of troubleshooting. Regardless, I'm kicking myself at having missed out on some good days' rides. 5 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post UniVehje Posted June 19, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 19, 2018 14 minutes ago, beast@tanagra said: I hadn't ridden my new V10F since getting the scrapes myself on 6/7, but this post inspired me to take another look. I flipped it on both sides and spun the tire around like I did before, and peeked in with a flashlight. It took repeating the process a couple of times and listening closely, but I did eventually catch a glimpse of gravel caught up in the structure above the axle. After holding the whole EUC literally upside down and shaking it a few times, I was able to get this little tetrahedral chiplet to plink out: A subsequent test drive was free of scrape! As my scrape had appeared on my first charge, at low speed, on sidewalk, I am a little worried that debris entrapment is going to be a recurring hassle with the wheel (Imagine doing the upside down shake repeatedly on a long trail ride!). And I'm still apprehensive that I could be sitting on a bearing time bomb, but... as long as eWheels and/or Inmotion are committed to replacing this motor, either preemptively or down the road as needed, I am satisfied for now and looking forward to the new firmware. I'm not sure how silly I should feel. I'm relatively new to EUC and wouldn't have thought to take a brand new 47-pound machine, hold it upside down, and shake it as a method of troubleshooting. Regardless, I'm kicking myself at having missed out on some good days' rides. Good that you found it and can continue riding! And don’t worry. I had a lot of gravel going in when the tire was new but it stopped. It’s been a long time since it last happened. I guess the new tire picks them up easier. Some wear and it stops. And I also did the upside down shakeup once. I have a feeling that there are more of these reported bearing problems here that are just stones stuck up there. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jrosenzweig Posted June 19, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 19, 2018 35 minutes ago, beast@tanagra said: I hadn't ridden my new V10F since getting the scrapes myself on 6/7, but this post inspired me to take another look. I flipped it on both sides and spun the tire around like I did before, and peeked in with a flashlight. It took repeating the process a couple of times and listening closely, but I did eventually catch a glimpse of gravel caught up in the structure above the axle. After holding the whole EUC literally upside down and shaking it a few times, I was able to get this little tetrahedral chiplet to plink out: A subsequent test drive was free of scrape! As my scrape had appeared on my first charge, at low speed, on sidewalk, I am a little worried that debris entrapment is going to be a recurring hassle with the wheel (Imagine doing the upside down shake repeatedly on a long trail ride!). And I'm still apprehensive that I could be sitting on a bearing time bomb, but... as long as eWheels and/or Inmotion are committed to replacing this motor, either preemptively or down the road as needed, I am satisfied for now and looking forward to the new firmware. I'm not sure how silly I should feel. I'm relatively new to EUC and wouldn't have thought to take a brand new 47-pound machine, hold it upside down, and shake it as a method of troubleshooting. Regardless, I'm kicking myself at having missed out on some good days' rides. I'm glad this worked for you, I had exactly same experience early on and sent a video recording of this to Inmotion, to their credit that addressed it right away and luckily that evening in the dark with a extremely bright flashlight spotted the tiny scrap of gravel like you encountered, and let them know I was good. Maybe they can redesign the cover to prevent gravel entrapment. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBIKER_SURFER Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 O.k. - so let us go to fitness studios, so we can shake our V10F ? Anyway - I'm excited about delivery of mine next couple of days - hopefully! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastmike Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 21 hours ago, Bobwheel said: The first batch from factory were about 200 units and they had been divided for multiple dealers, because some dealers used air shipment, others use sea shipment, and the customs clearance time varies for different countries, also some dealers fulfill the orders immediately while others may hold a bit, so it's not possible for us to set a deadline date for end customers to judge if they'll have that potential effect, but we're always here to help to replace motor for customers who has this problem. Bob first of all, many thanks for all your honnest replies! That s really help gaining confidence in your brand. Highly appreciated! Hopefully none of the 'bad bearing/motor' wheels got shipped to InMotion France and also that all changes that your engineers are making right now will be software modifications only for all to take benefit of those. kind regards Phil 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniVehje Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 Here’s some data on average energy consumption. My highest trips have been 18 wh/km when I was just riding fast to work in a hurry. I’m 73 kg wihtout gear and usually drive around 30-35 km/h. I also often drive faster and don’t try to save battery. Consumption seemed to be quite a bit lower when I tried the wheel with 4 bar tire pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Blaster Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 3 hours ago, UniVehje said: Here’s some data on average energy consumption. My highest trips have been 18 wh/km when I was just riding fast to work in a hurry. I’m 73 kg wihtout gear and usually drive around 30-35 km/h. I also often drive faster and don’t try to save battery. Consumption seemed to be quite a bit lower when I tried the wheel with 4 bar tire pressure. I need to go on a diet.......I get an average of around 20 W-h/km after close to 400 miles (650km) ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lueksparky Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Unexpected 45 degree tilt back. Went for a long ride today. Approximately seven miles in on a mild uphill, going approximately 15-17mph heard the warning alarm (the one you hear when you exceed the max speed (I'm set at 25mph) and experienced an immediate 45 degree tilt back. I did not get the "Overload, please step off wheel" warning that I have in the past just the alarm followed by the tilt back. Was able to steer it at the shoulder of the road and leap forward and run it out (glad I was going slow enough). The wheel didn't go far (stopped by weeds and sagebrush) lucky it didn't hit any of the soccer ball size rocks along the road. The wheel hadn't shut off and the only thing I could see from the App that might have caused it was a max power of 2562 watts (see below, screen shots are from the end of the ride). The main board temp at the time was 111F the ambient temp during the entire ride was approx. 80F. The ride prior to the hill was flat for 6 miles, riding into a fairly stiff headwind, average speed 18-20mph. With gear I was probably about 205 - 210 lbs. Anybody experience the same? In the past (three times) I've always gotten the warning message (without the alarm) but not this time and the tilt back seemed more immediate and aggressive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maltocs Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 6 minutes ago, Lueksparky said: Unexpected 45 degree tilt back. Went for a long ride today. Approximately seven miles in on a mild uphill, going approximately 15-17mph heard the warning alarm (the one you hear when you exceed the max speed (I'm set at 25mph) and experienced an immediate 45 degree tilt back. I did not get the "Overload, please step off wheel" warning that I have in the past just the alarm followed by the tilt back. Was able to steer it at the shoulder of the road and leap forward and run it out (glad I was going slow enough). The wheel didn't go far (stopped by weeds and sagebrush) lucky it didn't hit any of the soccer ball size rocks along the road. The wheel hadn't shut off and the only thing I could see from the App that might have caused it was a max power of 2562 watts (see below, screen shots are from the end of the ride). The main board temp at the time was 111F the ambient temp during the entire ride was approx. 80F. The ride prior to the hill was flat for 6 miles, riding into a fairly stiff headwind, average speed 18-20mph. With gear I was probably about 205 - 210 lbs. Anybody experience the same? In the past (three times) I've always gotten the warning message (without the alarm) but not this time and the tilt back seemed more immediate and aggressive. 4 I've never gotten 45 degree tilt back without an "overload, please step off" warning, well, except when I lost all my system audio when did the erased command that is. I do notice when i exceed 2000W even at cooler board temps (<50C), I'll get this warning esp when going up hills and i'm trying to push more speed. I've since learned to just slow down when going up a hill to avoid the tilt backs.Kinda like trying to climb a hill in overdrive in a car, you kinda let off and you realize pushing doesn't make you go any faster. NOW there was a time when my battery was lower, under 40%, that it tilted back at <20mph on flat. I don't know what the warning was as I didn't have any audio at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 14 minutes ago, maltocs said: I've never gotten 45 degree tilt back without an "overload, please step off" warning, well, except when I lost all my system audio when did the erased command that is. I do notice when i exceed 2000W even at cooler board temps (<50C), I'll get this warning esp when going up hills and i'm trying to push more speed. I've since learned to just slow down when going up a hill to avoid the tilt backs.Kinda like trying to climb a hill in overdrive in a car, you kinda let off and you realize pushing doesn't make you go any faster. NOW there was a time when my battery was lower, under 40%, that it tilted back at <20mph on flat. I don't know what the warning was as I didn't have any audio at the time. 26 minutes ago, Lueksparky said: Unexpected 45 degree tilt back. Went for a long ride today. Approximately seven miles in on a mild uphill, going approximately 15-17mph heard the warning alarm (the one you hear when you exceed the max speed (I'm set at 25mph) and experienced an immediate 45 degree tilt back. I did not get the "Overload, please step off wheel" warning that I have in the past just the alarm followed by the tilt back. Was able to steer it at the shoulder of the road and leap forward and run it out (glad I was going slow enough). The wheel didn't go far (stopped by weeds and sagebrush) lucky it didn't hit any of the soccer ball size rocks along the road. The wheel hadn't shut off and the only thing I could see from the App that might have caused it was a max power of 2562 watts (see below, screen shots are from the end of the ride). The main board temp at the time was 111F the ambient temp during the entire ride was approx. 80F. The ride prior to the hill was flat for 6 miles, riding into a fairly stiff headwind, average speed 18-20mph. With gear I was probably about 205 - 210 lbs. Anybody experience the same? In the past (three times) I've always gotten the warning message (without the alarm) but not this time and the tilt back seemed more immediate and aggressive. All I can say is, Gotway 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post maltocs Posted June 23, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 23, 2018 I did an ULTIMATE STRESS InMotion V10F testing hills and hot temps today: Palm Springs Area, CA, 113F (weather.com temp) Dry Heat, Climb 1000ft in 1.9 miles, battery start at 82%, battery end at bottom of hill 68%. rider weight 200lbs. Mainboard Temp at start 40C, Mainboard Temp at overload 69C. After my last attempted bumpy trail smart phone video, I thought I got smart and brought a gimbal this time. 1/4mi into the climb the Samsung S9 camera shut down due to heat and would not relaunch. Halfway into the climb, the InMotion app did the same. My spare iPhone 7 (on a different network, you never know) also crapped out due to the heat. I was trying to not stress out the motor by going slower on the steeper climbs. The BAD NEWS, I didn't make it to the top without overloads. About halfway I got my first overload warning. I always wait about a minute or two before continuing on by me squeezing the handle to "reset" it. One time, even after waiting a minute to reset, it immediately gave me another overload warning while i was just walking it to the next place I could safely get on. I waited 10 minutes that time before continuing on. I eventually made it to the top. I think I was more heat stroked and needed a break more than V10F did. The GOOD NEWS is I feel like this thing has enough self-preservation built in to kick me off and last a long time no matter what I throw at it. I was worried that the unit would fry while coming DOWN the hill. I assume braking generates heat. DOES ANYONE KNOW IF IT IS POSSIBLE TO BURN OUT ANYTHING, mosfets or hubs while braking???? 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post maltocs Posted June 23, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 23, 2018 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: All I can say is, Gotway I challenge you to do the heat hill climb I did today with any of your gotways! Can you say SELF PRESERVATION? btw, when i started doing crazy bumpy trail riding, my ankles were killing me, so I pulled out my old MID TOP Merrell shoes. They were still in pretty decent condition. This is how they looked after today. The heat killed them. Edited June 23, 2018 by maltocs 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastmike Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 8 hours ago, maltocs said: I was worried that the unit would fry while coming DOWN the hill. I assume braking generates heat. DOES ANYONE KNOW IF IT IS POSSIBLE TO BURN OUT ANYTHING, mosfets or hubs while braking???? Only InMotion can confirm, but all components might be sized in line with motor specs, and firmware included protection should be here to prevent any possible fire/electronic damage. I would say that the purpose of all the warning and tilt back are their to prevent anyone to go over the limit. Last resort will be a cut out, but electronics should neved got damaged by heat if eveything has been well engineered. That said, already saw complaints of that kind about the V10 not being able to cope in situation not causing any issue with older/smaller wheels (e.g. https://youtu.be/KwoeHF9i9T4) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RelaxMore Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 On 6/19/2018 at 4:00 PM, Bobwheel said: @eddiemoy @Mark Lee I know you've been annoyed by the acceleration of the V10F, especially the not so responsive start. Our team has been working on it for weeks, and there should be an upgraded firmware version released on the App by the end of this week, and we hope you like it. Thanks again for your feedback. Hi Bob, just updated the new firmware for my V10F. Took a short ride and now the wheel feels very unsafe. There are tilt forwards and back even in low speed (15km/h). And it was stated there would be different drive modes. But if I push the button in the App for different drive modes it says this is not available for this model. I don`t want to drive now because the tilt back and forward... Can you help, please? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 (edited) 11 minutes ago, RelaxMore said: Hi Bob, just updated the new firmware for my V10F. Took a short ride and now the wheel feels very unsafe. There are tilt forwards and back even in low speed (15km/h). And it was stated there would be different drive modes. But if I push the button in the App for different drive modes it says this is not available for this model. I don`t want to drive now because the tilt back and forward... Can you help, please? Wooh! Lucky I didn’t update my firmware yet. Anyone else update their firmware? What do you mean tilt forward and backwards? anyway to revert? Downgrade the firmware? Edited June 23, 2018 by eddiemoy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WARPed1701D Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 1 minute ago, eddiemoy said: Wooh! Lucky I didn’t update my firmware yet. Anyone else update their firmware? What do you mean tilt forward and backwards? anyway to revert? Downgrade the firmware? With the additional reference to drive modes I'm guessing the pedals are soft and the firmness level appears unavailable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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