Nikola and Nikola Plus compared to 16X

[Dzlchef]

16 minutes ago, buell47 said:

wow, what do I feel when I switch from the V8 with 1.950 to the 16X or Nikola with 3.0 tyres?

Like you just traded in your Kia for a Cadillac.

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

37 minutes ago, Dzlchef said:

Like you just traded in your Kia for a Cadillac.

Hard to imagine, never had a Kia, only drive a BMW 7 series

[houseofjob]

3 hours ago, Mike Sacristan said:

My friend just received his 100v 1845Wh Nikola. Sadly he is working today and has other business to take care of. Tomorrow we ride.

That must have been something. If the MSX 100V beeps at 69kmh i'm pretty sure the Nik+ would beep at 64.
But you never know. That's a scary speed...

I personally cannot bring myself to push above 35mph, especially on NYC moon crater roads, but we have some crazy younger riders here who are stupid brave.

2 hours ago, UniVehje said:

Very difficult to say exact. You probably have tested V8 and V10, the difference is not quite as drastic as between those two since everything else stays the same, but something like that. 2.5" tire on 16S is much better and it becomes a different wheel. More planted and stable. 

2.5" is pretty optimal but I'm waiting to get a chance to test 16x3" tires soon. 

Yes, I thought this, until the 3" wide EUCs started rolling with the MSX.

Now, being used to 3" wide, 2.5" wide wheels feel like what 2.125" wide tires would feel like.

For bad city streets, all of us in NYC agree that 3" is the perfect tire width.

2 hours ago, UniVehje said:

I don't think 2.125" tires should be used in any size EUC anymore. 

I agree somewhat.

2.125" tired EUCs really should be specialty-type wheels (ala 4.1" wide Z), like for tricks, due to the faster falling or "maneuvering", or perfect pavement carvers/racers (much like racing bikes with their knife blade thin tires).

2 hours ago, UniVehje said:

Let me also add that for me the difference between 16x2.5" V10F and 18x2.5" 18XL feels smaller than the difference between 16x2.5" and 16x2.125" tires. That is one of the reason I, too, believe people have been mistaking the different feel to be mostly about diameter when it's probably much more about width. There just haven't been wheels to test that difference before. 

Yes, I agree with all of this. 

The V10F & 18XL was the first perfect example of width being most important in tire feel, as those wheels (minus the super flat V10 pedal angle) have almost identical tire dynamics.

[Marty Backe]

8 hours ago, Mike Sacristan said:

In Sweden we have a saying "om du känner dig träffad" which translates directly to "if you feel hit/qualified" for the statement.
Like if I wrote "maybe you guys should start thinking about losing that 50 lbs extra weight instead of thinking what your next body armour should be".
I don't mean the skinny guys.

At least when we are on the wheel we finally find balance. 
Unless we find something to complain about while riding.

Same here. Right in the soul. Hence my sabbatical. I need to sort this out and find a middle ground.
Ambition is one thing, nothing being good enough is another.

I was actually seeing much of this discussion as a Pepsi vs Coke thing rather than a wine connoisseur thing. Then we have all other types of cola as well. They are all on the market.
Usually if we have a fridge full of Coke we won't go buy Pepsi but rather Fanta Orange. I wouldn't drink a glass of Pepsi and say WOW I COULD REALLY GO FOR A TAB COLA. TAB! 

This brings us to the wheels and their feels, or tastes. We have the new breed of wheel, the 16 inch (17" diameter) wheels that weigh 25kg and have 3" wide tyres.
They will feel predominantly as they should in accordance to their physical dimensions, tyre dimensions, pedal height, pedal angle and then we have the motor, tuning, power, etc.

Previously we have only had the Nikola and now we have the 16X. So we can choose which kind of fizzy cola drink we want.

Nikola 100v is faster. We still don't know about the 5 beeps though. Will it have more range than the 16X? Probably very similar.
Which one is the more elegant ride? Which one climbs hills better? Which one has better leverage? Which one is more comfortable? Which one has better lights? Which one has better speakers? Which one is more sturdy and dependable? Which one is more water resistant?

Even though the 16X is out now there are so many problems with it that we can't even make a fair assessment. But we can discuss what we know. Which is what we should be doing.

My interests: Headphones, speakers, weightlifting, calisthenics, computers. All things that can be done right or wrong. Or my way.

 

There is no way that the 16X will get the same range as the 100-volt Plus. I'll put money on that. I completed a fast 49-mile ride and still had 30-percent battery remaining.

[Darrell Wesh]

So, just had my first cruise around town with the 100v Nikola Plus. 

I at first omitted from putting the pads on, because the gloss finish looked so nice! I must admit, I spent my first half hour polishing the wheel and applying wax before even stepping on it! This all black version of the wheel is much more a head turner then the 16x can ever be no contest. 

The trolley handle is excellent. It’s nice and wide unlike the thin INMOTION handles. I had no problems wheeling it around and not having it lose control like with the MSX trolley (I once burned up the carpet of a Wendy’s because the MSX trolley sucks) 

The speakers are amazing. It sounds like PA speakers lol, it just projects out of the wheel unlike the Z10 or kingsongs where the sound is muffled. Can go very loud. I will no longer need my portable Bluetooth speakers with this wheel. 

Speaking of speakers, you’ll be happy to know THE SPEED ALARM BEEPS on this wheel are louder than they are on the MSX. 

Which brings me to the speed test.... I actually chickened out.... for the first cruise! I didn’t have the pads on the wheel so I didn’t go anywhere near all out for my first cruise. Without the pads, despite my disposition for a wide stance, the wheel did not feel as stable as I wanted at high speeds. Also, on mounts and dismounts my mount leg was literally sliding off the wheel and not able to control it(probably thanks to the wax I put on it that made it too slick 😅)

 I reached 34mph. I’m not a gripper, but I went back home and slapped the pads on and the wheel felt much better over potholes and bumps and I was able to mount and dismount effortlessly without sliding. 

 

Now for round two! I unfortunately had only 60% battery left as I headed out to do a speed test. I was able to reach 37mph on flat ground with still winds (no tailwind) and barely hit the first beep. I was worried I wouldn’t be able to hear it but it was loud and clear on this wheel. On my MSX 84v, I hit the first beep at 31mph. I weigh 190lbs with gear on. This wheel can absolutely go 40+mph. It’s not as reassuring at high speeds as the MSX, but much more nimble and responsive, acceleration is much easier than the MSX. 

I ended up getting 30miles using 50% battery, going very fast on average. 

[Nils]

16 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Now for round two! I unfortunately had only 60% battery left as I headed out to do a speed test. I was able to reach 37mph on flat ground with still winds (no tailwind) and barely hit the first beep. I was worried I wouldn’t be able to hear it but it was loud and clear on this wheel. On my MSX 84v, I hit the first beep at 31mph. I weigh 190lbs with gear on. This wheel can absolutely go 40+mph. It’s not as reassuring at high speeds as the MSX, but much more nimble and responsive, acceleration is much easier than the MSX.

Thank you, and interesting to hear about your comparison with the MSX. While I don't have the MSX myself, at the times when I've tried it I've always ended up getting more wobbles with the MSX at the similar speeds (which I contribute to it's higher center of gravity), while my (84V) Nikola always have felt more stable and grounded. Have you checked and adjusted your tire pressure?

[Darrell Wesh]

11 minutes ago, Nils said:

Thank you, and interesting to hear about your comparison with the MSX. While I don't have the MSX myself, at the times when I've tried it I've always ended up getting more wobbles with the MSX at the similar speeds (which I contribute to it's higher center of gravity), while my (84V) Nikola always have felt more stable and grounded. Have you checked and adjusted your tire pressure?

The Nikola gave me no wobbles, it feels fine now that I added the stock pads. I have something similar to the powerpads EUCGUY makes for the MSX on my MsuperX so of course I have a lot more stability and control and comfort over bumps at speed. 

The MSX is much more reassuring at high speeds than the Nikola due to the larger tire and more aggressive pedal angle forcing you into the wheel. The MSX with powerpads makes you feel invincible. I wouldn’t mind going 50mph on the MSX and feel totally planted on it

Edited August 1, 2019 by Darrell Wesh

[Mike Sacristan]

31 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

So, just had my first cruise around town with the 100v Nikola Plus. 

I at first omitted from putting the pads on, because the gloss finish looked so nice! I must admit, I spent my first half hour polishing the wheel and applying wax before even stepping on it! This all black version of the wheel is much more a head turner then the 16x can ever be no contest. 

The trolley handle is excellent. It’s nice and wide unlike the thin INMOTION handles. I had no problems wheeling it around and not having it lose control like with the MSX trolley (I once burned up the carpet of a Wendy’s because the MSX trolley sucks) 

The speakers are amazing. It sounds like PA speakers lol, it just projects out of the wheel unlike the Z10 or kingsongs where the sound is muffled. Can go very loud. I will no longer need my portable Bluetooth speakers with this wheel. 

Speaking of speakers, you’ll be happy to know THE SPEED ALARM BEEPS on this wheel are louder than they are on the MSX. 

Which brings me to the speed test.... I actually chickened out.... for the first cruise! I didn’t have the pads on the wheel so I didn’t go anywhere near all out for my first cruise. Without the pads, despite my disposition for a wide stance, the wheel did not feel as stable as I wanted at high speeds. Also, on mounts and dismounts my mount leg was literally sliding off the wheel and not able to control it(probably thanks to the wax I put on it that made it too slick 😅)

 I reached 34mph. I’m not a gripper, but I went back home and slapped the pads on and the wheel felt much better over potholes and bumps and I was able to mount and dismount effortlessly without sliding. 

 

Now for round two! I unfortunately had only 60% battery left as I headed out to do a speed test. I was able to reach 37mph on flat ground with still winds (no tailwind) and barely hit the first beep. I was worried I wouldn’t be able to hear it but it was loud and clear on this wheel. On my MSX 84v, I hit the first beep at 31mph. I weigh 190lbs with gear on. This wheel can absolutely go 40+mph. It’s not as reassuring at high speeds as the MSX, but much more nimble and responsive, acceleration is much easier than the MSX. 

I ended up getting 30miles using 50% battery, going very fast on average. 

Thanks for the mini-review/impressions! Sounds like a winner! Brave riding as well. 

[BleepBloopBlop]

New PR of 31.5mph today on my 16X. That's about all she has with the tiltback. I could lean into it a little harder but why risk it on V1.01 hahaha

Edited August 1, 2019 by BleepBloopBlop

[Darrell Wesh]

@Marty Backe @houseofjob what tire pressure do you run your Nikola at? 

Edited August 1, 2019 by Darrell Wesh

[houseofjob]

24 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

@Marty Backe @houseofjob what tire pressure do you run your Nikola at? 

36 PSI, but I recently rode a fellow rider's 84V Nikola, which had 40 PSI, and it still felt pretty bouncy, thought it was underinflated for my weight.

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

The speakers are amazing. It sounds like PA speakers lol, it just projects out of the wheel unlike the Z10 or kingsongs where the sound is muffled. Can go very loud. I will no longer need my portable Bluetooth speakers with this wheel. 

Make sure to do the hydrophobic cloth mod for rain, as the speakers have no protection through the inner hole in the shell.

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Speaking of speakers, you’ll be happy to know THE SPEED ALARM BEEPS on this wheel are louder than they are on the MSX. 

Check where they installed your beeper, it might be able to be even louder just by positioning it.

The MSX beeper is soft partly because it is mounted in the shell the farthest away from your ears, near the pedal (and also blocked in the "ear"line to your ear by the bulge of the battery).

One of the Nik+'s of a fellow rider's I worked on, they mounted the beeper in that similar area near the pedals, instead of how the rest of our Nik+'s had the beeper mounted near the top, where there is a fixture for it.

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Also, on mounts and dismounts my mount leg was literally sliding off the wheel and not able to control it(probably thanks to the wax I put on it that made it too slick 😅)

 I reached 34mph. I’m not a gripper, but I went back home and slapped the pads on and the wheel felt much better over potholes and bumps and I was able to mount and dismount effortlessly without sliding. 

I know at my 5'8" Asian frame, the very top protruding shell near the top of the handle digs into my knee, only when mounting, so I'm looking for a clear pad option to stick there.

Also, common to these glossy LED shell covered EUC's, skin on glossy shell tends to stick, esp in the summer heat, which is a bit frustrating, but oh well.

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Without the pads, despite my disposition for a wide stance, the wheel did not feel as stable as I wanted at high speeds. Also, on mounts and dismounts my mount leg was literally sliding off the wheel and not able to control it(probably thanks to the wax I put on it that made it too slick 😅)

 I reached 34mph. I’m not a gripper, but I went back home and slapped the pads on and the wheel felt much better over potholes and bumps and I was able to mount and dismount effortlessly without sliding. 

Now for round two! I unfortunately had only 60% battery left as I headed out to do a speed test. I was able to reach 37mph on flat ground with still winds (no tailwind) and barely hit the first beep. I was worried I wouldn’t be able to hear it but it was loud and clear on this wheel. On my MSX 84v, I hit the first beep at 31mph. I weigh 190lbs with gear on. This wheel can absolutely go 40+mph. It’s not as reassuring at high speeds as the MSX, but much more nimble and responsive, acceleration is much easier than the MSX. 

I ended up getting 30miles using 50% battery, going very fast on average. 

I don't remember if you're a Gotway Hard mode guy, but I wonder if this is the issue.

I just tried the Hard mode on the Nikola and hated it; it behaved like no other Gotway Hard mode I've ever felt: the press was actually a little softer than a real Hard mode initial press, then the pedals kind of lean forward in a pedal dip and lock (which feels really sketchy), with braking being the only normal hard response of your typical Gotway hard mode.

Do me a favor and try the Nik+'s soft mode, even if you're not used to Gotway soft mode in general. It's more rubbery resistant than the free&wide-swinging Gotway soft modes of past, and honestly makes the control way better than the Hard mode on this Nik+ IMHO.

Edited August 1, 2019 by houseofjob

[Darrell Wesh]

10 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

36 PSI, but I recently rode a fellow rider's 84V Nikola, which had 40 PSI, and it still felt pretty bouncy, thought it was underinflated for my weight.

Do you mean it felt overinflated? Im thinking about lowering mine to 35 from 38. 

Also, forget to mention seated riding is absolutely not an option on this wheel at only 5’11. You were right and that you sink into the back of the shell when trying to ride seated and can’t relax at all doing so. Huge bummer right there .

[Marty Backe]

41 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

@Marty Backe @houseofjob what tire pressure do you run your Nikola at? 

~40psi.

[Marty Backe]

5 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Do you mean it felt overinflated? Im thinking about lowering mine to 35 from 38. 

Also, forget to mention seated riding is absolutely not an option on this wheel at only 5’11. You were right and that you sink into the back of the shell when trying to ride seated and can’t relax at all doing so. Huge bummer right there .

Have you seen the prototype seat from Gotway that they have been posting on Facebook?

[houseofjob]

3 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Do you mean it felt overinflated? Im thinking about lowering mine to 35 from 38. 

Nope, even at 40 PSI, I felt like I wanted to pump it some more for fear of underinflation weirdly (I get paranoid I have an inner tube leak when it's too springy, though I aim for a springy feel)

3 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Also, forget to mention seated riding is absolutely not an option on this wheel at only 5’11. You were right and that you sink into the back of the shell when trying to ride seated and can’t relax at all doing so. Huge bummer right there .

Yup, which is why Gotway is doing this banana hammock seat, which I'm conflicted about, mainly cuz of the optics (probably gonna cave and get it at some point tho *ugh)

[Marty Backe]

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

So, just had my first cruise around town with the 100v Nikola Plus. 

I at first omitted from putting the pads on, because the gloss finish looked so nice! I must admit, I spent my first half hour polishing the wheel and applying wax before even stepping on it! This all black version of the wheel is much more a head turner then the 16x can ever be no contest. 

The trolley handle is excellent. It’s nice and wide unlike the thin INMOTION handles. I had no problems wheeling it around and not having it lose control like with the MSX trolley (I once burned up the carpet of a Wendy’s because the MSX trolley sucks) 

The speakers are amazing. It sounds like PA speakers lol, it just projects out of the wheel unlike the Z10 or kingsongs where the sound is muffled. Can go very loud. I will no longer need my portable Bluetooth speakers with this wheel. 

Speaking of speakers, you’ll be happy to know THE SPEED ALARM BEEPS on this wheel are louder than they are on the MSX. 

Which brings me to the speed test.... I actually chickened out.... for the first cruise! I didn’t have the pads on the wheel so I didn’t go anywhere near all out for my first cruise. Without the pads, despite my disposition for a wide stance, the wheel did not feel as stable as I wanted at high speeds. Also, on mounts and dismounts my mount leg was literally sliding off the wheel and not able to control it(probably thanks to the wax I put on it that made it too slick 😅)

 I reached 34mph. I’m not a gripper, but I went back home and slapped the pads on and the wheel felt much better over potholes and bumps and I was able to mount and dismount effortlessly without sliding. 

 

Now for round two! I unfortunately had only 60% battery left as I headed out to do a speed test. I was able to reach 37mph on flat ground with still winds (no tailwind) and barely hit the first beep. I was worried I wouldn’t be able to hear it but it was loud and clear on this wheel. On my MSX 84v, I hit the first beep at 31mph. I weigh 190lbs with gear on. This wheel can absolutely go 40+mph. It’s not as reassuring at high speeds as the MSX, but much more nimble and responsive, acceleration is much easier than the MSX. 

I ended up getting 30miles using 50% battery, going very fast on average. 

Yeah, I really did not like the Nikola without the pads. My legs were sliding all around on the shell.

I think you're going to love the Nikola as much as me and everyone else is.

And yeah, I think this is a much sexier looking wheel than the 16X. The 16X reminds me of the unsexy ACM. Nice like tanks, but not eye candy.

[ir_fuel]

5 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

The 16X reminds me of the unsexy ACM. Nice like tanks, but not eye candy.

It does look better than an ACM, but I know what you mean. The Nikola looks more what you would expect an EUC to look (if all you know are the old Ninebots).

[Darrell Wesh]

Woww soft mode is great! Thanks @houseofjob

[houseofjob]

1 minute ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Woww soft mode is great! Thanks @houseofjob

[Darrell Wesh]

I was trying so hard to hit 80% alarm but couldn’t. 38.7 with only two beeps 

[houseofjob]

1 minute ago, Darrell Wesh said:

I was trying so hard to hit 80% alarm but couldn’t. 38.7 with only two beeps 

Damn, thanks for the report! Don't go too crazy the first day I think.

[meepmeepmayer]

Someone just do a lift test already!You don't have to ride that speed.

[Darrell Wesh]

5 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Damn, thanks for the report! Don't go too crazy the first day I think.

Yeah I’m hinging so low for suspension/stability but it sacrifices some speed by putting my center of mass too far back. Once I get more comfortable with how it reacts at speed I can Definitely  go faster more reliably

This thing has more speed than I need in a 16”! 

Edited August 1, 2019 by Darrell Wesh

[Darrell Wesh]

4 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Someone just do a lift test already!You don't have to ride that speed.

Eh, my roads are relatively smooth here and I’m not trying to exceed the 5 beeps, just trying to reach it.... for science!

[houseofjob]

3 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Yeah I’m hinging so low for suspension/stability but it sacrifices some speed by putting my center of mass too far back. Once I get more comfortable with how it reacts at speed I can Definitely  go faster more reliably

This thing has more speed than I need in a 16”! 

Yup, this.

I dunno, I feel like they proportioned everything right (high pedals, even higher wheel body and wheel body girth) so you CAN go crazy speeds if you want to, even being 16, especially with the sponginess 3" wide base of the CST tire.