Begode EX20S 3600wh: 100V, suspension, 104lb

[mike_bike_kite]

37 minutes ago, Freeforester said:

It’s cool!

 

I'm always impressed by the confidence of youth, riding along at 45mph in a T-shirt.

[meepmeepmayer]

Passive cooling is so important! Nobody wants to hear a noisy fan as soon as you stop (or even during riding). And it's not hard to do passive cooling, even Begode can do it We must always remember: half of the reason why any EUC electronics get hot is because they are undersized to begin with. Electronic parts are not supposed to get hot in the first place.

Passive cooling should be the goal for any future wheel by any manufacturer.

Rant over. For the things that Begode do wrong with the EX20S (still not over the weight, everybody seems to think it's just too damn heavy), they do some things very right.

[Planemo]

Tbf, many high power fets run 'hot', its why they often have bolt holes to affix to a heatsink after all but yes you're right, nearly all other components should run at ambient ideally.

And I agree, having passive cooling is far better. The problem we have nowadays is having a piece of metal big enough to deal with the amount of heat that riders demand from their wheels. Even the Z10 heatsink is massive and that doesnt run anything like the power of say a Sherman. I guess I'm saying that I would still rather run fans than the manufacturers get pushed into 'not quite good enough' heatsinks just because its what the riders demand or its seen as 'better'. The issue with passive is that the metal can get saturated quite easily, its why cars still have fans despite massive radiators. I appreciate that euc's dont really sit in static traffic like cars, but many riders may sit at say 15mph for prolonged periods and unless the airflow is well designed (which I havent seen yet) it could be a problem at really high ambients.

And I'm one that isnt the slightest bit fussed about fan noise. I never hear them when riding and they are far from loud when stationary. The only thing I dont like about them is its a failure point of course.

[EUC Sharkman]

4 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

 

Rant over. For the things that Begode do wrong with the EX20S (still not over the weight, everybody seems to think it's just too damn heavy), they do some things very right.

Not everybody! I think people see the 108 lb. number on paper and overestimate how much that affects the ride. People who have ridden mine agree the weight is noticible at first, but get used to it quickly like with any new wheel. What they really notice is the suspension/comfort and stability.

 

Sure, the weight is there when you need to lift it up over stairs and to put in your car, but when riding it, it is not super noticeable. The acceleration isn't as fast as an EXN or a Commander, but I suspect it's about the same acceleration if you ride those wheels with a heavy backpack equivalent the extra weight of the wheel. EUCs seem to be have been trending heavier over the years in 10-15 pound Increments, and riders have adapted.

 

For maneuverability, having the 20" tire makes a big difference over larger wheels like the Monster/Pro or Abrams. I can turn and be agile without having to throw my body into it, but having a good pad setup helps a lot. Honestly having a real blast with mine. Range, comfort, and speed with minimal compromises.

Edited May 23, 2022 by TheSlyGiraffEV

[GoGeorgeGo]

To add to the cooling discussion. Its about 68-70 degrees today. Just got home from work. Traveling a similar 30-35 most of the 18 mile trip. Topped out at 47 mph. My highest temperature was 119 degrees. This wheel is ice cold. My exn would have been huffing a puffing riding it that hard for that long

[Tawpie]

26 minutes ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

This wheel is ice cold. My exn would have been huffing a puffing riding it that hard for that long

Ice cold is always refreshing (in the heat of summer). Great to hear BG has a solution!

How does it do going not-so-fast up a long grade? Not Pikes Peak, just a normal long hill—say at a very pedestrian speed, 20 mph? Lower volume of airflow with (as mentioned by earlier observers) time for heat to build in the heatsink is a test for convection cooling.

[GoGeorgeGo]

10 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

Ice cold is always refreshing (in the heat of summer). Great to hear BG has a solution!

How does it do going not-so-fast up a long grade? Not Pikes Peak, just a normal long hill—say at a very pedestrian speed, 20 mph? Lower volume of airflow with (as mentioned by earlier observers) time for heat to build in the heatsink is a test for convection cooling.

I mean i live in new england, its all hills here. Up and down and up and down so dependa what you mean by long but over 18 miles there is plenty of elevation change

[Tawpie]

6 minutes ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

dependa what you mean by long

Ah, New England... I wanna come ride there in the fall one of these years.

"Long" and "steep" are kind of like "fast" and "comfy" aren't they? I used to think Oklahoma was dead flat… until I went on a bike tour in the summer.

It's probably enough to know that "regular hills in New England" are not at all a problem during the summer and that it's a remarkable improvement over your EX.N. Progress is a good thing!

[Pingouin]

Hello guys !

I juste tested out the Begode EX20S C38 and here are a few things I can say. For the background I have tested other suspension EUCs (V11, EX, S18).

- The algorithm is very smooth, one of the best I have tried out on a Begode wheel
- The motor doesn't grind at all, it doesn't make any noise its on pair with the Inmotion V12 motor which is really great
- Boot up sounds are different from what I was used to on RS & Commander, I would say nicer
- On the road, it rides smoothly and with half rebound setting its absorbs every road imperfection with ease
- Offroad, it absorbs evert bumbs like nothing was there, it really makes the ride much less tiring than with a non suspension EUC

- It is very heavy (49kg) and not easy to lift
- It seems top heavy and therefore does not handle very well at low speeds with the stock offraod tire
- At speed its very stable
- It is the best seated EUC I have ever tried, I can break quite easily, accelerating needs some effort though
- You are very high up the ground, higher than the EX, V11 and V12 from my experience
- The front headlight is bright but doesn't shine far, it does not blind people though
- The tailight would look great if it actually worked..its kinda dim but on the model I tested it only blinks in purple
- Pads are ok, they are usable
- It seems a little faster than the Commander HT in our testing
- Its a shame that it doesn't have a display as there is tons of space in front of the EX20S

- When it came, it didn't take the charge because of an issue with the charge board for some reason

Overall, I really enjoyed this EUC, its really meant for long comfortable rides cruising mostly in straight lines, I would not pick this EUC for busy urban areas as its tiring to turn with it even though its totally possible. Its size was not shocking to me but its weight is really something else. It has a great behavior overall, still some Begode QC issues though
I hope to test the Master soon to be able to compare it to the EX20S

[EUC Sharkman]

I do think the turning and handling takes some time to get used to for sure. Two weeks ago, I did a group ride and there were some tight narrow turns as part of the route. Back then, I still had under 50 miles on the wheel and on those tight turns, I looked like a total beginner...waving my arms around, super shaky...mostly not being familiar with the wheel and that I didn't have the suspension tuned to my weight properly.

 

Just yesterday I did the same route with the group and when we came up on those turns, I laughed at how much easier it was, especially since I remembered how awkward it was last time. I definitely feel much more nimble with the wheel on turns, though I do admit, a big part of it is having the street tire and not the stock knobby.

 

I had some experienced riders in the group try the wheel out and they all looked exactly how I did two weeks ago when turning. I'd even argue even worse so because now that the suspension was better tuned to my (heavier) riding weight, the lighter weight riders were riding up tall, which I imagine really messed with their usual turning technique. Riders closer to my weight looked much more comfortable with the suspension tuning. Once it's tuned though, suspension is pretty amazing. Will be hard to go back.

 

[Paradox]

WrongWay posted a review!

 

[EUC Sharkman]

Strangest thing about Adam's review was his issues with torque. For a Begode HT wheel to have that much trouble, even with the added weight, is fairly odd, whereas it should act more like the Commander HT or EXN HT. I have not had any issues like that with my C30 version, and I'm a hefty 240 lbs riding weight, though admittedly I haven't seeked out steep slopes on my rides thus far. Of the few times I did happen to encounter steep slopes, I had no issues, even going slow speeds.

 

I have a group ride coming up that goes through steep streets so will keep an eye out for that motor crunching behavior on that ride.

[GoGeorgeGo]

3 hours ago, TheSlyGiraffEV said:

Strangest thing about Adam's review was his issues with torque. For a Begode HT wheel to have that much trouble, even with the added weight, is fairly odd, whereas it should act more like the Commander HT or EXN HT. I have not had any issues like that with my C30 version, and I'm a hefty 240 lbs riding weight, though admittedly I haven't seeked out steep slopes on my rides thus far. Of the few times I did happen to encounter steep slopes, I had no issues, even going slow speeds.

 

I have a group ride coming up that goes through steep streets so will keep an eye out for that motor crunching behavior on that ride.

 

Yeah i have some intense hills in providence we hit routinely and my c30 carrys me up and down no issues. I was really suprised how poor his unit was reacting to those conditions. 

Makes me think he is still on the original firmware it shipped with or maybe he actually has a c30 version and was mistaken in thinking it was a c38

[meepmeepmayer]

19 hours ago, Paradox said:

WrongWay posted a review!

Another one of these wheels (like the Master) where half of it is an absolute dream and I want it so bad, and the other (smaller) half is "uuhh mmmh not like this".

Can't wait for the EX30 with 134V and 3600Wh and every issue with the EX20S/Master fixed and improved... that is what will happen, right? Right?

[Freeforester]

 

[GoGeorgeGo]

2 hours ago, Freeforester said:

 

The new one just baaaaarely fits in the same spot so long as you break off the plastic brackets. Not only should the light not blow this one, i can now run the usb ports and the light at the same time. 

Depending on the light you choose, the other buck converter will still work fine but this light is amazing and it draws 120w. 

I wish i could find 12 or 13 amp fuses though. For blade fuses i cant find anything available other than 10 and 15. A 10 was to strong to protect the 10 amp step down. Hopefully a 15 isnt to strong for a 15 amp step down . Not that i anticipate overdrawing again, but never know.

I was running 120w through the light , 5w through the tail light, and 15w on standby in the usb slots , at least 1w draw from the little indicator light.  So figure i was drawing between about 126w standard with 156w as the max draw i believe if i plug in both usb. So 126w is 10.5 amps, which blew the 10 amp converter after not that long really. Few long rides is all it lasted. 

But 156w maximum draw potential is only 13 amps through the buck converter. So figure with a 15 amp max on this one, i should be well in the clear

Edited May 28, 2022 by GoGeorgeGo

[GoGeorgeGo]

Also, while i was working on it today, i took the opportunity to wrap all the connections with electrical tape to improve its water proofing. At least now im not worried about some light water on the ground. I still need to design a front mud guard though. 

Also since i am almost at 1000 miles already on this bad boy, i took the time to re-lube all the suspension areas. The main sliders, the swing arm and shocks. I just took off the shock, undid the back swing arm conncection, and generously sprayed it down with a dry lube that seems to have worked fantastically.

When i tested it again after it was like brand new again. Over the 1000 miles ot had certainly lost some of the sensitivity in the suspension. Just wasnt as smooth as day 1 was. But now after being lubed up its soooo smooth once again. I had forgot just how buttery it was originally just as it gradually developed some stiction. 

Im thinking since it was so easy to do, i will just start lubeing it down every 500 miles or so. Took maybe 25-35 minutes to take it apart, clean everything, lube, and reassemble. 

I used PB Blaster dry lube because its safe for use near plastics which means it wont corrode my sest or wires or anything if it accidentally got on some (it did)

[GoGeorgeGo]

Well, here we go. Just as i cross 1000 miles on the ex20 and am prepping to film a full review this week, i have my first real issue with machine itself.

I was cruising to work on a main road down in woonsocket. Probably doing in the range of 35 mph, no faster than 40 mph. I absolutely CREAMED a pothole. It was way deeper than i realized and had a really sharp front lip so really i basically ran right into a 3" stair/curb at 35 mph without even trying to soften the impact. As soon as i hit it i bottomed out my suspension hard even though i ride with relatively high suspension pressure and relatively low tire pressure.

The good news is, i hardly flinched while riding lol. It didnt throw me even a little, the torque was more than enough to hold me up which after seeing wrong ways video is a bit of a suprise. And it was pretty smooth considering how hard i smashed it, so the suspension did a great job of providing me a safer ride. So i just kept riding without even slowing down. 

I immediately thought i must have fucked my rim up good on that. I didnt feel anything at the time though so i didnt even stop i just kept cruising all the way to work. Got to work, checked my tire, was pristine. Very impressed i didnt do anything to the rim at all. Parked it, plugged it in to charge, qhent about my day.

I go to leave work, and i step up on the machine and realize the suspension is deflated. Im super bummed thinking i must have blown a seal in the shock again...

Anyone following along knows all my issues have been with the shocks themselves and not the machine to this point. So i ride it home and go check the shock to see whats up. I go to pump some air in the shock to see whats up and turns out its still holding the same pressure.  

Upon further inspection, i realize the screws on the upper swing arm rod look loose. I thought maybe i just failed to tighten them enough when i was lubing up the machine last week (will be in a video drop soon)

I go to tighten them and thats when i find out what really happened

[GoGeorgeGo]

TLDR : hit a pothole really hard. Snapped one of my suspension swing arm rods. Surprisingly no rim damage though and the torque was good enough to hold me up even though the impact was literally hard enough to snap a piece of steel lol

 

If anyone has any suggestions on how i could find a replacement for this piece faster than the slow boat from china im all ears 

[Freeforester]

Bad luck George, but it looks like the least costly item to replace, hopefully. Someone handy in a machine shop might even be able to turn and tap one for you, and quite possibly not out of ‘Chinesium’ either! Still, fair play, you know it took an almighty wallop, and if something has to give, best it’s not the shock unit but something altogether more modestly priced to replace.

[GoGeorgeGo]

1 minute ago, Freeforester said:

Bad luck George, but it looks like the least costly item to replace, hopefully. Someone handy in a machine shop might even be able to turn and tap one for you, and quite possibly not out of ‘Chinesium’ either! Still, fair play, you know it took an almighty wallop, and if something has to give, best it’s not the shock unit but something altogether more modestly priced to replace.

Yeah i mean if i had to choose between this and a rim or a shock ill take this all day lol.

Just going to be slightly harder to replace since i dont even know what to call it. Im gunna head to a hardware store today and see what i can find. If i can just figure out how to tap it with an internal female for the screws i can probably find and cut a rod easily enough 

I will make/buy 2 just so i have one on retainer 

[GoGeorgeGo]

There are two of the exact same rods on the suspension arm. I will put the correct part where the broke  rod was since that takes way more stress. And i will repkace the rod i move with this since its a pivot point and ahoyld take less strain

 

 

[Tawpie]

Think about using bushings to keep the threads from galling everything up. Your suspension linkage is Al, that bolt is (probably) steel. Also choose the 'bolt' carefully, you don't want one that'll bend, nor do you want one that'll break (but breaking is arguably less bad than bending and getting stuck)

[GoGeorgeGo]

12 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

Think about using bushings to keep the threads from galling everything up. Your suspension linkage is Al, that bolt is (probably) steel. Also choose the 'bolt' carefully, you don't want one that'll bend, nor do you want one that'll break (but breaking is arguably less bad than bending and getting stuck)

Where i plan to put this luckily it would be easy to cut if it bent. It has little copper or brass bushings in the swing arm eyelets. And the sleeve will do a lot of the work as well.

I just rigged it up and it seems to hold well.

Still looking to get stock replacement parts though as i cant find anything with the exact size i need.

The rod in question is 11.9 mm to fit the 12 mm shock and is 100 mm long. 

[GoGeorgeGo]