DragonFZ Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 8 hours ago, techyiam said: I can see why EEVEES is taking a "wait and see" strategy with some of Begode's new models. I agree... especially when Begode was just dumping their 1st 2 versions. Like an idiot, we keep buying them. Someone has to step up and stop this nonsense. Lesson of the day: Without government regulations or oversight, the consumers are idiots that will buy anything. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonFZ Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 8 hours ago, oktothorpe said: It's also why I don't understand people getting upset at, say, the Master with it's multiple revisions. I want a company that wants to improve it's products. I agree... revision is good. But they skipped a few steps. Refinement engineering on the working Prototype. Simple things like making the wires the correct length, using the right material with the correct strength for the weight and potential speeds. Begode are making high speed toys. Which was great a few years ago when top speed was under 30 mph. We are at car speeds now. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brahan Seer Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 This great analysis will help explain why different people have different views at different times Esp re suspension, worth a look.. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, techyiam said: You must mean the turbochargers. The scroll cage does resemble the shell of a snail. This the first time I come across the use of snail in this context. Cool car. My nephew test drove his friends 720S, and he thought it accelerated as quick as a motorcycle. I can't imagine what your 950HP MP4-12C could do. Yup was using Pure900 turbos. I still have them because I gutted the car of all it's aftermarket parts before insurance took it away Edited January 27, 2023 by oktothorpe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 1 hour ago, DragonFZ said: Lesson of the day: Without government regulations or oversight, the consumers are idiots that will buy anything. Caveat Emptor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 33 minutes ago, The Brahan Seer said: This great analysis will help explain why different people have different views at different times Esp re suspension, worth a look.. That’s a full hour long analysis. Did you catch any specific spots where she talks about the suspension? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 3 hours ago, mrelwood said: … who commonly have a technology background of nothing at all. I wouldn’t trust any EUC reviewer explaining how stuff works. Look at Chooch for example, he rarely gets anything technical right in his ramblings. Even Marty gets stuff wrong here and there. “All the V13 safety features” are managed by the firmware alone, which takes less power than your phone at maximum. Even if the V13 firmware processor took ten times the amount of energy compared to others, it would be a fly’s fart compared to what it takes to balance a rider on a single wheel. Let alone accelerate. The processor’s power consumption absolutely can’t have any notable effect in the wheel’s power delivery. Have you seen the teardown of the V13 and the Raptor Controller? There is active cooling with two fans pointing directly at the heatsink of the controller. Additionally there is a video of the Raptor Controller being separated from the heatsink revealing a copious amount of thermal paste. Both of these design choices indicate a lot of heat dissipation, meaning a lot of power consumption much more than your phone. Fans pointing directly at heatsing @ 2:14 Ungodly amount of thermal paste between Raptor Controller and heatsink for passive cooling @ 9:08 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 18 minutes ago, mrelwood said: That’s a full hour long analysis. Did you catch any specific spots where she talks about the suspension? Dawn says this @ the 50 second mark Quote Pretty much everyone there loved it over the Sherman S @ 5:35 Quote The suspension is really nice. Lots of people have said the suspension is really nice and that the suspension is very similar to the Sherman S Edited January 27, 2023 by oktothorpe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brahan Seer Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 20 minutes ago, mrelwood said: That’s a full hour long analysis. Did you catch any specific spots where she talks about the suspension? What and spoil your enjoyment watching it! , some things are like Pink Floyd albums and need to experienced all the way through for the best experience. ok I forgot where sorry, double speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brahan Seer Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 14 minutes ago, oktothorpe said: Pretty much everyone there loved it over the Sherman S There is so much more than this mere trinket! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) I have some bad news for the first batch EBCPs, just got this email from Jason @ eWheels Quote Levi/BG just responded, he said that each charging adapter is a single wire on this round, that should be limited to 4A. With both charge ports, this still equates to >1kW of power. Big oof. I'm asking if pre-orders will be given anything in the future when later batches have their ports changed. This changes my opinion and I may not go for the pre-order now. Edited January 27, 2023 by oktothorpe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clem604 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 28 minutes ago, oktothorpe said: I have some bad news for the first batch EBCPs, just got this email from Jason @ eWheels Big oof. I'm asking if pre-orders will be given anything in the future when later batches have their ports changed. This changes my opinion and I may not go for the pre-order now. Yeah if you're not in a rush you should definitely wait for a later batch. I would want the fast charging as an option should I need it. Edited January 27, 2023 by Clem604 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Update from Jason @ eWheels Quote Once they're back from holiday, will see if it's simply possible to swap out the GX16-5s to GX20-4s, there's no reason that I can think of why this cannot be done. Fingers crossed, there's hope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeforester Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 8 hours ago, UPONIT said: Anyway, back to the CPro: is there a good quality teardown video yet? It would be nice to compare with SS. I smell an oxymoron there: can you tear down a CPro and find good quality? It would indeed be nice to compare with SS, but, comparatively speaking, it seems to me to be all ‘134v’ and no knickers, but hey - the fifth batch may have a fast charge-capable pair of ports that do actually accept the correct charge plugs! But why let this trifling matter dampen the squib? It’s a Begode, by any other name, to be realistic, after all…🤔😳😆 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 4 hours ago, oktothorpe said: Have you seen the teardown of the V13 and the Raptor Controller? There is active cooling with two fans pointing directly at the heatsink of the controller. Have you disassembled or seen a disassembly of literally any other EUC? The fans and the whole thermal cooling mechanism exists for the mosfets. The ones that power the motor. Not related to “all the safety features”. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKW Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) someone posted a new video of the CP 5 hours ago... and i MISSED it!? Edited January 27, 2023 by BKW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 8 minutes ago, mrelwood said: Have you disassembled or seen a disassembly of literally any other EUC? The fans and the whole thermal cooling mechanism exists for the mosfets. The ones that power the motor. Not related to “all the safety features”. InMotion literally says it's for the Raptor Controller's safety margin under any extreme condition, it is a safety feature of the V13 Quote To ensure the driver board always has enough safety margin under any extreme conditions, we decided to use 42 MOSFETs with a nominal withstand voltage of 200V. That's 58% more than the Challenger's peak voltage allowing for nearly 1000A continuous current. This means the Challenger can provide tremendous acceleration and deceleration without damaging the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 14 minutes ago, oktothorpe said: Raptor Controller's safety margin under any extreme condition, it is a safety feature of the V13 Comment from another thread. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Paul A said: Comment from another thread. Exactly. More MOSFETs also mean more heat generated in a smaller space that could be managed by less MOSFETs of a higher quality that are more expensive. I agree with @Tawpie that this "safety feature" by InMotion is shortsighted. It also furthers my stance that I'll never buy a V13. Edited January 27, 2023 by oktothorpe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradox Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Does anybody know if the Commander Pro has a hollow bearing setup? The OG Commander had the old style axle and bearings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Paradox said: Does anybody know if the Commander Pro has a hollow bearing setup? The OG Commander had the old style axle and bearings. It's the C38 right? Wouldn't it be the same as other Begode wheels? Scratch that. I would assume it would be similar to other Begode wheels using the C38 rim but who knows Edited January 27, 2023 by oktothorpe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, oktothorpe said: InMotion literally says it's for the Raptor Controller's safety margin under any extreme condition, it is a safety feature of the V13 You are talking about three different things lumped into one here. 1. Your said that the safety features on the V13 use a lot of power, and that reviewers have commented on it also. You have misunderstood. 2. You mentioned that Dawn didn’t like all the safety features. She didn’t refer to the large amount of power available for balancing as a safety feature she didn’t like. 3. You brought up cooling, and that Inmotion advertises the large amount of available power as a safety feature. And therefore you said that the safety features use a lot of power. The large amount of available power can be called a safety feature, but not that the safety features consume a lot of power. These are not related. Calling something a “safety feature” doesn’t make it the same as another “safety feature”. Inmotion advertises that the large amount of available power is the safety feature, which is absolutely true in self-balancing vehicles. I’m sure you’ll agree that this is not something that Dawn opposes to. The safety features that separate the V13 from the rest are battery cell packaging, thick wires, smart BMS, etc. And the firmware related features such as tilt-back in various situations. The tilt-back and warnings are the only parts of the safety features that concern the rider while riding. And these are what riders coming from Begode and Veteran wheels sometimes dislike. Not the safer BMS, thicker wires, or battery cell packaging. 2 hours ago, oktothorpe said: I agree with @Tawpie that this "safety feature" by InMotion is shortsighted. Maybe you didn’t read all the way through. @Tawpie said that them can’t find fault in Inmotion’s decision to increase the Mosfet count. And that them agrees, IM had no choice but to do so for such a powerful EUC. 2 hours ago, oktothorpe said: It also furthers my stance that I'll never buy a V13. Me neither, but for very different reasons. So far everything I’ve quoted from you has been misinformation and misunderstandings. Edited January 28, 2023 by mrelwood 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHOSTTE Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 4 minutes ago, mrelwood said: You are talking about three different things lumped into one here. 1. Your said that the safety features on the V13 use a lot of power, and that reviewers have commented on it also. You have misunderstood. 2. You mentioned that Dawn didn’t like all the safety features. She didn’t refer to the large amount of power available for balancing as a safety feature she didn’t like. 3. You brought up cooling, and that Inmotion advertises the large amount of available power as a safety feature. And therefore you said that the safety features use a lot of power. The large amount of available power can be called a safety feature, but not that the safety features consume a lot of power. These are not related. Calling something a “safety feature” doesn’t make it the same as another “safety feature”. Inmotion advertises that the large amount of available power is the safety feature, which is absolutely true in self-balancing vehicles. I’m sure you’ll agree that this is not something that Dawn opposes to. The safety features that separate the V13 from the rest are battery cell packaging, thick wires, smart BMS, etc. And the firmware related features such as tilt-back in various situations. The tilt-back and warnings are the only parts of the safety features that concern the rider while riding. And these are what riders coming from Begode and Veteran wheels sometimes dislike. Not the safer BMS, thicker wires, or battery cell packaging. Maybe you didn’t read all the way through. @Tawpie said that them can’t find fault in Inmotion’s decision to increase the Mosfet count. And that them agrees, IM had no choice but to do so for such a powerful EUC. Me neither, but for very different reasons. So far everything I’ve quoted from you has been misinformation and misunderstandings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 2 minutes ago, oktothorpe said: Well put! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UPONIT Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 9 hours ago, oktothorpe said: Have you seen the teardown of the V13 and the Raptor Controller? There is active cooling with two fans pointing directly at the heatsink of the controller. Additionally there is a video of the Raptor Controller being separated from the heatsink revealing a copious amount of thermal paste. Both of these design choices indicate a lot of heat dissipation, meaning a lot of power consumption much more than your phone. Fans pointing directly at heatsing @ 2:14 Ungodly amount of thermal paste between Raptor Controller and heatsink for passive cooling @ 9:08 All of what @mrelwood said, plus: I'm not positive that you are completely familiar with thermal management in electronic devices. Nothing you mentioned is necessarily a bad thing. Fans? Yes. Lots of thermal paste? Wasteful maybe, but better than too little. 3 hours ago, oktothorpe said: Exactly. More MOSFETs also mean more heat generated in a smaller space that could be managed by less MOSFETs of a higher quality that are more expensive. I agree with @Tawpie that this "safety feature" by InMotion is shortsighted. It also furthers my stance that I'll never buy a V13. Again, what @mrelwood said, plus: that's not how MOSFETs work... It's fine that you don't want a V13. But the factual parts of our discussions here should at least try to be accurate, IMHO. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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