Mten4 announced!

[houseofjob]

Oh man, soooo close, if the shell was just 10mm wider, we could fit some of the wider fat 110/50-6.5 tires for the first [edit: real] 4" EUC 

Edited September 2, 2022 by houseofjob

[mrelwood]

On 8/31/2022 at 8:49 PM, Funky said:

I also would think that 10" wheel would be much, much harder to ride/learn than 14-16". Heck i even have problems riding my dads ks16s. (Yes i can ride it.. I even learned on it, but the euc body is so small/short.) Compared it to my 18" which is bigger, it feels so stable at low speeds and so easy to ride. On the 16s it feels more "twitchy" and so on at walking speeds.

Also turning i always scratch the ground with 16s, because of lower pedals.

It's more about the tire width than diameter. A 2.125" tire in the 16S needs to be tilted more for it to turn than a 2.5" of the 18XL. The 3" tire of the Mten3 makes it magically stable, and it indeed has comparable or even better sub walking speed stability than the Z10. The pedals don't scrape easily because the wheel stays more vertical.

The first time I rode the Mten3, I (193cm/100kg at the time) was instantly able to ride at crawling speeds, turn on a dime, reverse and turn, and stay within a very small area while idling. The narrower the tire, the  worse it is for any of these.

Tire diameter is what makes the wheel more stable over road imperfections. And slower to accelerate and brake.

On 9/1/2022 at 12:31 AM, Frank-oh-boy said:

Also is there any possibility this thing will have a trolley handle addon? 

One of the first videos had an add-on trolley handle, similiar to what some Mten3s can be seen mounted with. I think it's originally an add-on suitcase trolley that was commonly available at Ali.

5 hours ago, jmsjms said:

I would've thought that the smaller the wheel, the more connected to the road you feel... 

Sure, but like @Tawpie described, it's not a good thing. You don't want to be connected to all the bumps. That's why EUCs use a pneumatic tire in the first place, to disconnect the wheel from the ground. And nowadays a suspension to do that even much more.

4 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Oh man, soooo close, if the shell was just 10mm wider, we could fit some of the wider fat 110/50-6.5 tires for the first 4" EUC 

You forget about the Z10!

[houseofjob]

10 hours ago, mrelwood said:

You forget about the Z10!

Ah right, while technically correct, the sharp-sloping motorcycle “street” tire style, gyroscopic wants-to-stay-upright with the sharp sidewall-to-tread border, it never rode like a full 4” contacting the road (not sure if even 3” contacted the road with the rider mounted in rest position).

I meant I want that go kart all-or-most of the 4” tread contacting the pavement feel at all times, we haven’t had that yet in EUC 

Edited September 2, 2022 by houseofjob

[360rumors]

32 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Ah right, while technically correct, the sharp-sloping motorcycle “street” tire style, gyroscopic wants-to-stay-upright with the sharp sidewall-to-tread border, it never rode like a full 4” contacting the road (not sure if even 3” contacted the road with the rider mounted in rest position).

I meant I want that go kart all-or-most of the 4” tread contacting the pavement feel at all times, we haven’t had that yet in EUC 

You can get a Onewheel and put a plywood frame to let you ride it like an EUC 😁

[houseofjob]

2 hours ago, 360rumors said:

You can get a Onewheel and put a plywood frame to let you ride it like an EUC 😁

Um, I’m not paying double price for old underpowered motor tech just to do all that 🤨

[360rumors]

12 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Um, I’m not paying double price for old underpowered motor tech just to do all that 🤨

The other option is to get a dual wheel unicycle like the Inmotion v3 or Airwheel Q series.  I imagine it will behave like an EUC with very wide tires..?

[houseofjob]

4 hours ago, 360rumors said:

The other option is to get a dual wheel unicycle like the Inmotion v3 or Airwheel Q series.  I imagine it will behave like an EUC with very wide tires..?

These wheels and motors are unbelievably outdated now, like going back to the 350-450W nom motor days of 2014-2015, catching 12-15mph max speed momentary cutout and overpower on even the smallest of bumps days, those days sucked, I don’t want to revisit that.

Edited September 2, 2022 by houseofjob

[Funky]

34 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

These wheels and motors are unbelievably outdated now, like going back to the 350-450W nom motor days of 2014-2015, catching 12-15mph max speed momentary cutout and overpower on even the smallest of bumps days, those days sucked, I don’t want to revisit that.

Great small wheels. <3  

Everybody nowadays simply spoiled! With their 140km/h wheels, suspension, led screens..

[houseofjob]

1 hour ago, Funky said:

Great small wheels. <3  

Everybody nowadays simply spoiled! With their 140km/h wheels, suspension, led screens..

LOL you better still own and still ride these wheels to be saying this 

Because many only remember the fond memories they had at that time on XX wheel when there were no other more powerful options, but try jumping back on those wheels after having ridden regularly on your KS18XL and see if you're still saying this 

And if you even follow my profile, you'll know I'm a.) not a speed guy, b.) would rather light my money on fire than buy a big fat suspension wheel with suspension money upsell premium for suspension I don't want on a big wheel that doesn't need it .... and I don't get LCD screens on wheels esp when I can barely ready anything that far away from standing position.

Edited September 2, 2022 by houseofjob

[Funky]

16 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

LOL you better still own and still ride these wheels to be saying this 

Because many only remember the fond memories they had at that time on XX wheel when there were no other more powerful options, but try jumping back on those wheels after having ridden regularly on your KS18XL and see if you're still saying this 

And if you even follow my profile, you'll know I'm a.) not a speed guy, b.) would rather light my money on fire than buy a big fat suspension wheel with suspension money upsell premium for suspension I don't want on a big wheel that doesn't need it .... and I don't get LCD screens on wheels esp when I can barely ready anything that far away from standing position.

Even 18xl is to "big" for me.. Sure i would still love the 50km/h speed that it offers. (Mostly ride 30-40km/h) But i would gladly offer 50% of the battery for lighter wheel. As i don't need range.

I have been saying the same - all these new wheels are big fat turds. 

At least on small wheels, that doesn't go fast.. You don't need gear.  

[houseofjob]

1 hour ago, Funky said:

Even 18xl is to "big" for me.. Sure i would still love the 50km/h speed that it offers. (Mostly ride 30-40km/h) But i would gladly offer 50% of the battery for lighter wheel. As i don't need range.

I have been saying the same - all these new wheels are big fat turds. 

At least on small wheels, that doesn't go fast.. You don't need gear.  

You should have gotten the lighter regular 18L then 

Yes, I'm sure we're not the only ones starved for more reasonably priced, proper compact EUCs, when all we've been getting the past 2 years or so have been humongous suspension fatties. I mean, I still appreciate non-suspension big tire EUCs since forever, but not if it almost weighs as much as I do *smh.

These CN EUC companies are really chabuduo half-assing it just upping voltage and motor power, and thus more unnecessary weight, without even maximizing the existing motor tech in performance-to-weight ratio efficiency, before moving onto the next model, next more powerful motor which means even more metal windings & magnet weight,.... many a fellow engineer EUC rider has mentioned this to me.

But I still want a little more speed from these smaller wheels, like at least 30mph, not because I'm a speed demon, but because I still need to accelerate away from an aggressive car or truck in the city. I remember my 15mph Ninebot days when I would literally have to stop on the side of the road to let such vehicles pass, and I'd rather not have to do that today if I can help it.

 

[FlyingWigs]

3 hours ago, houseofjob said:

You should have gotten the lighter regular 18L then 

Yes, I'm sure we're not the only ones starved for more reasonably priced, proper compact EUCs, when all we've been getting the past 2 years or so have been humongous suspension fatties. I mean, I still appreciate non-suspension big tire EUCs since forever, but not if it almost weighs as much as I do *smh.

These CN EUC companies are really chabuduo half-assing it just upping voltage and motor power, and thus more unnecessary weight, without even maximizing the existing motor tech in performance-to-weight ratio efficiency, before moving onto the next model, next more powerful motor which means even more metal windings & magnet weight,.... many a fellow engineer EUC rider has mentioned this to me.

But I still want a little more speed from these smaller wheels, like at least 30mph, not because I'm a speed demon, but because I still need to accelerate away from an aggressive car or truck in the city. I remember my 15mph Ninebot days when I would literally have to stop on the side of the road to let such vehicles pass, and I'd rather not have to do that today if I can help it.

 

I'd really like to see a wheel that has a good high discharge pack that doesn't need to be huge but has the Kw to handle the short bursts of speed. With some decent motor cooling you can eek out more power per weight of the motor. 

If I was just a bit better with software and pcb design I'd probably attempt to build a controller, but just don't have the time to learn. 

[jcfp]

On 9/1/2022 at 1:41 PM, houseofjob said:

Also, no one has talked about the lack of a good trolley solution for the MTen4 (personally not a fan of hernia-inducing 20 lb+ backpack), which on the MTen3 is a tad easier on account of the built-in handle and body shape (hope that existing screw-and-strap method is still applicable for MTen4).

Eevees says "It will also have an available trolley handle add-on that may be purchased separately."  ...Not sure if this is the official one, as my Korean isn't that good...

 

[houseofjob]

2 minutes ago, jcfp said:

Eevees says "It will also have an available trolley handle add-on that may be purchased separately."  ...Not sure if this is the official one, as my Korean isn't that good...

Then let my Korean help 

It's not the "official one", he went to a luggage shop in Dongdaemun and found the best one he could mod to fit the MTen4

[yoos]

10 hours ago, FlyingWigs said:

I'd really like to see a wheel that has a good high discharge pack that doesn't need to be huge but has the Kw to handle the short bursts of speed. With some decent motor cooling you can eek out more power per weight of the motor. 

That's easily possible with existing hardware, see the link to a custom setup below (20kg, ACM shell, Tesla motor, Nik+ controller, 24s2pSamsung40T battery, 88kph freespin. Real life speed test was not attempted, but 65kph during a ride documented so far). Similarly, I guess one can build a 18" 75kph wheel under 25kg.

 

[GoGeorgeGo]

17 hours ago, Funky said:

Even 18xl is to "big" for me.. Sure i would still love the 50km/h speed that it offers. (Mostly ride 30-40km/h) But i would gladly offer 50% of the battery for lighter wheel. As i don't need range.

I have been saying the same - all these new wheels are big fat turds. 

At least on small wheels, that doesn't go fast.. You don't need gear.  

id argue you need gear just as much since your dramatically more likely to accidentally overlean small slow wheels. depends on your riding style and environment but accidents happen, id wear a helmet if traveling a mile or more

[houseofjob]

2 hours ago, yoos said:

That's easily possible with existing hardware, see the link to a custom setup below (20kg, ACM shell, Tesla motor, Nik+ controller, 24s2pSamsung40T battery, 88kph freespin. Real life speed test was not attempted, but 65kph during a ride documented so far). Similarly, I guess one can build a 18" 75kph wheel under 25kg.

Very interesting, did not see this, thanks!

Did he mod the Tesla motor at all?

Edited September 3, 2022 by houseofjob

[yoos]

2 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Did he mode the Tesla motor at all?

I don't think he did, but I'll rewatch the (russian) videos later and report back.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

id argue you need gear just as much since your dramatically more likely to accidentally overlean small slow wheels. depends on your riding style and environment but accidents happen, id wear a helmet if traveling a mile or more

Best safety gear for small wheels is your brain.

[Funky]

2 hours ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

id argue you need gear just as much since your dramatically more likely to accidentally overlean small slow wheels. depends on your riding style and environment but accidents happen, id wear a helmet if traveling a mile or more

I normally go 20-25km/h, when i only wear wrist guards. When i go 35-40km/h, then i also wear knee guards and full face helmet. I also live in somewhat "ghost" town. So only accident would happen - when euc suddenly stops working. And i'm okay with that.

I ride very defensively.. Don't ride like madman and you won't fall. (Heck i don't even jump curbs.) -But that's more due my weight.. I don't want to bend/break axle.   

[techyiam]

17 minutes ago, Funky said:

I ride very defensively.. Don't ride like madman and you won't fall. (Heck i don't even jump curbs.) -But that's more due my weight.. I don't want to bend/break axle.

That was what I thought until one day, out of nowhere, I hit a depression in the road that wasn't there the day before. 

On this particular section of a side street, I have ridden on it on a daily basis for months. It was late in the afternoon on a sunny day. The road surface was in the shadow of trees and houses. My eyes were adjusted to the bright sunlight.

The depression was somewhat deep, but not deep enough for the asphalt to crack. I surmised that it was created by a heavy vehicle on a spot where the sub-based layer under the road was softer.

My eyes could not pick up the depression in the road. And I happened to run into it. I fought to stay balanced. But in the end, I crashed. And I was riding below 20 km/h. 

[Funky]

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

That was what I thought until one day, out of nowhere, I hit a depression in the road that wasn't there the day before. 

On this particular section of a side street, I have ridden on it on a daily basis for months. It was late in the afternoon on a sunny day. The road surface was in the shadow of trees and houses. My eyes were adjusted to the bright sunlight.

The depression was somewhat deep, but not deep enough for the asphalt to crack. I surmised that it was created by a heavy vehicle on a spot where the sub-based layer under the road was softer.

My eyes could not pick up the depression in the road. And I happened to run into it. I fought to stay balanced. But in the end, I crashed. And I was riding below 20 km/h. 

I rarely ride with straight legs.. I almost always have bent knees - ready for noneseen bumps. Won't lie, i have hit some "unseen" bumps, but as i ride with bent knees - i have never lost balance.. Maybe my 280lbs weight helps going over bumps and i don't take "air" upwards much. I just feel big dunk on my wheel/tire.

[winterwheel]

Here we go with great again. Everybody I know who has gone into the hospital for wheel accidents this year was wearing full gear. Me, big wheel, no gear, no injuries.

It's not about what you ride, it's about how you ride.

[FlyingWigs]

3 hours ago, winterwheel said:

Here we go with great again. Everybody I know who has gone into the hospital for wheel accidents this year was wearing full gear. Me, big wheel, no gear, no injuries.

It's not about what you ride, it's about how you ride.

Sure it's about how you ride, your confidence or overconfidence, and the environment around you. You can't control a driver pulling out in front of you, a pedestrian suddenly stepping sideways or a dog that wants to bite your tire. I gear up for prevention of things out of my control, and the times things INEVITABLY happen. The fact you wear gear has zero bearing on when injuries happen, just how badly they'll hurt YOU. 

 

Road rash sucks, and will happen if you have a cutout (which any and every wheel can do at any time) you don't have time to react or prepare, it's not humanly possible. 

[techyiam]

15 hours ago, Funky said:

I rarely ride with straight legs.. I almost always have bent knees - ready for noneseen bumps. Won't lie, i have hit some "unseen" bumps, but as i ride with bent knees - i have never lost balance.. Maybe my 280lbs weight helps going over bumps and i don't take "air" upwards much. I just feel big dunk on my wheel/tire.

Actually, I actually ride with my knees bent, in fact, probably more so than average, because the T3 (16x2.125) was my first wheel, and local roads are quite bumpy. 

If bending one's knees is all it takes to prevent losing control when going over large bumps and potholes unexpectedly, many riders would not be as reserved while riding in the dark on unfamiliar roads.

Edited September 4, 2022 by techyiam