Electroman Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 Hey, at least Marty is open about loving the Gotways, aka being a fan shall we say? ? Too early for me to say what I like the most without testing many models first but I have to admit I like the option of turning off alarms and respect the one I cannot turn off, yes I wish Gotway could offer more but hopefully evolution will move forward next few years, think we as riders will always value different aspects of wheels from different manufacturers and hard to cram in all you want into one and the same wheel. I think we all care about safety though, hopefully some form of redundancy in combination with smarter systems can find it's way out in a near future without making the wheels costing much, much more, could help us all no matter what brand and model just not sure how to implement that in cost effective way? Smarter people than us or at very least myself I should say will find a way with time, or I am hopeful at least? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 9 minutes ago, Electroman said: Hey, at least Marty is open about loving the Gotways, aka being a fan shall we say? ? Too early for me to say what I like the most without testing many models first but I have to admit I like the option of turning off alarms and respect the one I cannot turn off, yes I wish Gotway could offer more but hopefully evolution will move forward next few years, think we as riders will always value different aspects of wheels from different manufacturers and hard to cram in all you want into one and the same wheel. I think we all care about safety though, hopefully some form of redundancy in combination with smarter systems can find it's way out in a near future without making the wheels costing much, much more, could help us all no matter what brand and model just not sure how to implement that in cost effective way? Smarter people than us or at very least myself I should say will find a way with time, or I am hopeful at least? Problem with fanboyism is they are not objective. So it is hard to trust their opinion as it is one sided. Always rosy and any issue glossed over or there is always an excuse for everything. He is a trusted member of the community. New folks rely on opinions to make decision on purchases. The IPS S5 looks like a step in the right direction in terms of redundancy for the sake of safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 1 minute ago, eddiemoy said: Problem with fanboyism is they are not objective. Sounds like your average BMW enthousiast Or Tesla owner ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 Just now, ir_fuel said: Sounds like your average BMW enthousiast No, Tesla fanboys are the absolute worst! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 1 minute ago, eddiemoy said: No, Tesla fanboys are the absolute worst! Check the second line of my post ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 3 minutes ago, ir_fuel said: Check the second line of my post ? So weird I didn't see the second line! LOL I'm a Tesla owner, but not a fanboy. I like to think I'm objective. Been battling Tesla fanboys for the last 5 years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 4 minutes ago, eddiemoy said: Problem with fanboyism is they are not objective. So it is hard to trust their opinion as it is one sided. Always rosy and any issue glossed over or there is always an excuse for everything. He is a trusted member of the community. New folks rely on opinions to make decision on purchases. The IPS S5 looks like a step in the right direction in terms of redundancy for the sake of safety. Eddie, do you honestly feel that I don't highlight the various problems with Gotway and steer more cautious people towards KingSong? Although I'm a big fan of Gotway and am personally willing to overlook QC issues, I've tried to be honest with people about the problems that Gotway does have. I feel that you think I'm doing a disservice to the community here by expressing my views. Or maybe your view is that I should never recommend Gotway, period? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 Just now, eddiemoy said: So weird I didn't see the second line! LOL I'm a Tesla owner, but not a fanboy. I like to think I'm objective. Been battling Tesla fanboys for the last 5 years! Friend of mine is the same. Has just bought his second Model S ( this time a 100D ), and can't stand all this "religious" crap around the brand. He likes the car a lot (wouldn't have gotten a second one after 4 years otherwise) but he sure knows its shortcomings, unlike some other owners I know who just became annoying. You know, like those vegans that need to point out to non-vegans how "bad" they are, constantly comparing ICE cars to "dinosaurs", exhaust sounds to "energy loss", and of course pray 5 times a day to the Church of Elon. FFS .... ? Its a pity, because (just like BMW in Europe in the nineties) it creates this bad association around the brand. A brand that for me has a lot of upsides and they sure did and are doing an incredible revolutionary job in the automotive world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 Just now, Marty Backe said: Eddie, do you honestly feel that I don't highlight the various problems with Gotway and steer more cautious people towards KingSong? Although I'm a big fan of Gotway and am personally willing to overlook QC issues, I've tried to be honest with people about the problems that Gotway does have. I feel that you think I'm doing a disservice to the community here by expressing my views. Or maybe your view is that I should never recommend Gotway, period? I'm sorry, I didn't mean it that way Marty. I just mean you have great influence in what people purchase and when giving your opinion should read it over to see if you have some bias. I know sometimes it is hard to see. I've notice you have tone it down quite a bit and are pointing out stuff more objectively. I know I took offense when people point out that I'm a GW basher. I'm NOT. I'm sorry poking fun at you being a GW fanboy. I know it can be annoying. I'll stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trya Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 You may want to review this article from @EcoDrift. Lots of pictures and interesting notes. link with google auto-translate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 1 minute ago, ir_fuel said: Friend of mine is the same. Has just bought his second Model S ( this time a 100D ), and can't stand all this "religious" crap around the brand. He likes the car a lot (wouldn't have gotten a second one after 4 years otherwise) but he sure knows its shortcomings, unlike some other owners I know who just became annoying. You know, like those vegans that need to point out to non-vegans how "bad" they are, constantly comparing ICE cars to "dinosaurs", exhaust sounds to "energy loss", and of course pray 5 times a day to the Church of Elon. FFS .... ? Its a pity, because (just like BMW in Europe in the nineties) it creates this bad association around the brand. A brand that for me has a lot of upsides and they sure did and are doing an incredible revolutionary job in the automotive world. This is off track but yes I like Tesla, but not afraid to point out it's many deficiencies and how it can't always get shit right. I wish them to succeed, but only if they deserve success, not because they should succeed. Hope that makes sense. I want them to succeed on their own merit and they won't when everyone ignores their deficiencies. Or gives them a free pass that they would normally not for another company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electroman Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 7 minutes ago, eddiemoy said: Problem with fanboyism is they are not objective. So it is hard to trust their opinion as it is one sided. Always rosy and any issue glossed over or there is always an excuse for everything. He is a trusted member of the community. New folks rely on opinions to make decision on purchases. The IPS S5 looks like a step in the right direction in terms of redundancy for the sake of safety. Yes I think you are indeed correct, thing is I thin most of us possibly suffer a bit from it whether we recognize that in ourselves or admit it? A bit of a human flaw imho, but hey that's just my theory and maybe I am dead wrong, I do realize some are far worse for sure and if looking at myself closely and as openly as I can I can see that I am likely to fall into that trap myself and I am trying to be neutral or as neutral as I can at least but sometimes write something I reflect over at a later stage and pick up on where it all went wrong hehe. Ok cool, thanks for info, been looking at the S5 a short distance commuter wheel but did not know, will read more about it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 Friend of mine is a Tesla mechanic (for quite a few years now) and they have come a long way wrt build quality. Even before the facelift there is a huge difference between the Model S of the first year and the last ones pre-facelift. All under the hood of course and a customer wouldn't notice this. In a way it's like Gotway Which brings us back on topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 4 minutes ago, trya said: You may want to review this article from @EcoDrift. Lots of pictures and interesting notes. link with google auto-translate thanks! they posted some previews FB this morning. Leg pain due to bad padding. the padding ripped too. some people dismissed the leg pain saying it shouldn't matter when you are an experience rider. But that is just not looking at the whole picture. Not everyone buys the MSX to ride in a straight line. People do one legged tricks or go off road, when they do, the padding is critical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 2 minutes ago, ir_fuel said: Friend of mine is a Tesla mechanic (for quite a few years now) and they have come a long way wrt build quality. Even before the facelift there is a huge difference between the Model S of the first year and the last ones pre-facelift. All under the hood of course and a customer wouldn't notice this. In a way it's like Gotway Which brings us back on topic. LOL, quality was shit in the beginning. The big gaps in the panels, misaligned. Not the product that you would get for a $80-160K luxury car. Shows how new they are to manufacturing. Tolerances are shit. They have definitely made some incremental improvements. You are right, they are like Gotway! LOL But with Tesla, they do over the air updates, with GW, it is still like an old car where you have to take it to the dealer to update the firmware. Even with a few recalls, Tesla was able to just push an update to fix. In the beginning, their service was over service, very little cars out there. Then when they had more cars on the street, had to play catch up. For a time Tesla service was taking 2 months to schedule an appointment. They since brought it down significantly. I had to wait for 2-4 issues to build up before I bring the car in. Got so annoying! LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcglider Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 7 minutes ago, eddiemoy said: Or gives them a free pass that they would normally not for another company. @eddiemoy yesterday you wrote What inmotion did was a total surprise. Looks like they rushed out the firmware. They made improvements and setbacks in the update. Yes I’m sure they will fix it. It isn’t as bad as the gotway firmware mistake. At least this could be fixed by the user over the air so to speak. There is no such thing on gotway. They still haven’t figured it how to join the 21st century. Smells like a little Bias and Hypocrisy... If I were to guess and not to speak for @Marty Backe but it may be this and not that he is offended by you calling him a FanBoy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiemoy Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 21 minutes ago, Marcglider said: @eddiemoy yesterday you wrote What inmotion did was a total surprise. Looks like they rushed out the firmware. They made improvements and setbacks in the update. Yes I’m sure they will fix it. It isn’t as bad as the gotway firmware mistake. At least this could be fixed by the user over the air so to speak. There is no such thing on gotway. They still haven’t figured it how to join the 21st century. Smells like a little Bias and Hypocrisy... If I were to guess and not to speak for @Marty Backe but it may be this and not that he is offended by you calling him a FanBoy... Easy to see it isn’t the same. And that is what I pointed out. Inmotion firmware mess up is early speed limit and worse tilt-back. They did improve acceleration. For those who don’t go all out and ride the limit, it isn’t a big deal. Are you serious about this giving inmotion a free pass? I don’t see that as giving Inmotion a free pass. The gotway firmware issue hurt people. They released the wheel like that. Some have had it for a long time not knowing their falls are due to bad firmware until marty caught it on film. Marty has toned down his fanyboyism and I apologized for calling him that as I’ve see him be a lot more objective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 49 minutes ago, trya said: You may want to review this article from @EcoDrift. Lots of pictures and interesting notes. link with google auto-translate Thanks for bringing this to attention. Build quality can only be described as LOL. Note to self: never buy a GW wheel where they introduce even the slightest new thing they can do badly, because they will. The Russians' quote says it best: Quote Well, Gotway does not know how to do such things well at the first try. None of these findings make me afraid of a potential hardware failure, though. So no safety issues there. Board is nice! Please do a 16 incher with this kind of board and 1600+Wh next! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electroman Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 11 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Thanks for bringing this to attention. Build quality can only be described as LOL. Note to self: never buy a GW wheel where they introduce even the slightest new thing they can do badly, because they will. The Russians' quote says it best: None of these findings make me afraid of a potential hardware failure, though. So no safety issues there. Board is nice! Please do a 16 incher with this kind of board and 1600+Wh next! Yeah that was not good, makes me worried about my coming MSX hehe? ? Yes please, Tesla v2 with all the extra bells and whistles, or possibly ACM if they going to be stubborn and keep same the shell to fit the batt packs, although maybe I feel like that cause I have been kind of lucky so far with my ACM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcglider Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 38 minutes ago, eddiemoy said: Are you serious about this giving inmotion a free pass? I don’t see that as giving Inmotion a free pass. Not sure what post you are referring to regarding "FREE PASS"... it is not what I wrote, I wrote... 40 minutes ago, eddiemoy said: Smells like a little Bias and Hypocrisy... If this is going to go down a road of "micro-disection" of the degree of screw-up, Im not interested... If you go back and actually read my posts, you will see that numerous times I agree with your opinions, and I also had a positive remark on your inmotion video... That being said, my concern and issue is people can come on this forum, get honest, un-bias information so they can make educated decisions. @meepmeepmayer wrote a post yesterday explaining how to understand Safety VS Quality which I thought was SPOT-ON... We all will have preferences, and certainly free to voice that and the reasons why... maybe your mirror needs a little windex so you can see clearer that putting too much focus on the past as opposed to the current situation is not helpful or objective for us reading the posts here. If you like the Tesla but think the case is Shit, that's fine but it is certainly not a "safety" issue. Lastly, I own 3 kingsongs and haven't received my MCM5 yet and going to order a Tesla in a few days, so I am not a Gotway Guy (yet), I love my Kingsongs, so before you throw me under the Bus, I am telling you as a "consumer" on this Forum, your posts are coming off mostly negative and that your not being objective, at least to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 1 hour ago, eddiemoy said: thanks! they posted some previews FB this morning. Leg pain due to bad padding. the padding ripped too. some people dismissed the leg pain saying it shouldn't matter when you are an experience rider. But that is just not looking at the whole picture. Not everyone buys the MSX to ride in a straight line. People do one legged tricks or go off road, when they do, the padding is critical. I think the pads on the MSX are universally disliked. Aesthetically and functionally, they are a big miss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 2 hours ago, eddiemoy said: I'm sorry, I didn't mean it that way Marty. I just mean you have great influence in what people purchase and when giving your opinion should read it over to see if you have some bias. I know sometimes it is hard to see. I've notice you have tone it down quite a bit and are pointing out stuff more objectively. I know I took offense when people point out that I'm a GW basher. I'm NOT. I'm sorry poking fun at you being a GW fanboy. I know it can be annoying. I'll stop. You can still poke fun at me. This Forum wouldn't feel the same if you were nice to me all the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikas Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 43 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: You can still poke fun at me. This Forum wouldn't feel the same if you were nice to me all the time Marty you are able to convey exactitudes and specificities sequestered with a crackling personality indeed. My hat is off to you.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electroman Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Marty Backe said: I think the pads on the MSX are universally disliked. Aesthetically and functionally, they are a big miss Indeed, perhaps foamed neoprene or other though but soft enough closed cell foam and cut out my own the way I want them? Then just attach using some industrial strength adhesive, I am not the biggest fan of 3M 9448A myself but there's better options available for sure, including some superb spray glues on bottle I could experiment on, but of course great if can be removed too the day I want to swap it out. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 4 hours ago, eddiemoy said: when giving your opinion should read it over to see if you have some bias. I know sometimes it is hard to see. I know I took offense when people point out that I'm a GW basher. I'm NOT. I'm sorry poking fun at you being a GW fanboy. 4 hours ago, eddiemoy said: Problem with fanboyism is they are not objective. So it is hard to trust their opinion as it is one sided. 4 hours ago, eddiemoy said: I'm a Tesla owner, but not a fanboy. I like to think I'm objective. Been battling Tesla fanboys for the last 5 years! Eddiemoy, with all respect, you are not more objective than the rest of us. You also are a human being. Being loud about it and getting offended about who is a basher, who is a fanboy, topped with your view on how you see yourself as objective but others not... Can you see how that reads at a forum as you not being very objective at all? You have your personal values and yardsticks, and the Gotway firmware issue seem to have crossed a line for you. Please try to understand that it is only your personal line, based on your opinions and expectations. Nothing objective about that. We all are here to share our opinions. Saying fanboys are not objective but you think you are doesn't quite come out the way you hoped. Disclaimer: I am a brand-gnostic basher and a fanboy, incapable of being truly objective. GW "rodeo" crossed a line for me too, how they handled it was inexcusable. I'm waiting for my first GW, the Msuper X. 4 hours ago, trya said: You may want to review this article from @EcoDrift. Lots of pictures and interesting notes. link with google auto-translate Great teardown and analysis! Luckily no safety related issues. Recap: Msuper X seems good for tinkerers, others need to wait. Gotway really only changes the individual things that break a lot. Their only strong suit is the instant idea-to-product speed, but what new they design they get wrong. Others are also at 2kW and 50km/h now. If some other name manufacturer starts slabbing 1600Wh batteries on their wheels, Gotway needs a really fast company overhaul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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