Begode ET MAX Announcement

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, null said:

I would "do it again" (getting a heavy EUC) but it clearly isn't as handy as the Sherman, and 45Kg seems really close to my upper limit.

My original post was mostly to answer YCC asking why anyone would care about the weight of EUCs.

I see.

I can't imagine anyone would not care about weight, if one has to carry up and down steps, or lifting it for whatever reason.

I personally don't even like carrying my 22 kg T3 for 5 steps. What I do now is to lift and roll it up and down the steps without power. The reason for this is because the shell gets in the way of the tire by a little bit. So I have to tilt the wheel to allow the tire to make contact with the leading edge of each step. Hence, I have to roll it without power. I find doing this is easier than carrying the full weight of the T3.

Edited February 2 by techyiam

[mhpr262]

Wow, this wheel is 2kg heavier than my EX20 with a 3.6kWh battery, and the EX20 is already built like a tank. Where did all the weight go?

[Rawnei]

Start working out when you place the order by the time it arrives no problem. 💪

[Rawnei]

1 hour ago, mhpr262 said:

Wow, this wheel is 2kg heavier than my EX20 with a 3.6kWh battery, and the EX20 is already built like a tank. Where did all the weight go?

Cybertruck material is heavy.

[Mono]

22 hours ago, YCC said:

Does the weight of EUC matter? Why some riders care so much, likewise, should I care the weight of motorcycle and sedan? 

You bet I cared about the weight of my motorcycles, in particular when I was going offroad.

For the EUC, as mentioned by others, I care for the ease of manual handling. I carry my EUC through about 18 flights of stairs on the days when I happen to have a day in the office. All of these are avoidable, but being forced to take the elevator all the time would be a serious downer for me. I take the EUC regularly in high speed trains with quite elevated passenger platforms and rather unavoidable stairs. The increased injury risk from weight is a secondary factor.

[YCC]

3 hours ago, Mono said:

I take the EUC regularly in high speed trains with quite elevated passenger platforms and rather unavoidable stairs. The increased injury risk from weight is a secondary factor.

Indeed, some elevated platform may have a huge gap of stair to take the train. However, I tried my 20 inch wheel which is able to roll on platform and cross the gap . Therefore, I believe that the 22 inch wheel may be very easy to cross this gap from platform.  What is your wheel? 

[mhpr262]

7 hours ago, YCC said:

some elevated platform may have a huge gap of stair to take the train. However, I tried my 20 inch wheel which is able to roll on platform and cross the gap

Hahaha, I wish some gaps were the only things I have to deal with in Germany. Almost all normal trains I have to get on and off look like this, plus two or three additional steep steps that are missing in the commuter train in this picture, and usually the entrance will also be narrower. Now imagine having to get a 105lbs wheel in and out of the train in addition to all of your gear and your backpack.

 

[v8nice]

2 hours ago, mhpr262 said:

Hahaha, I wish some gaps were the only things I have to deal with in Germany. Almost all normal trains I have to get on and off look like this, plus two or three additional steep steps that are missing in the commuter train in this picture, and usually the entrance will also be narrower. Now imagine having to get a 105lbs wheel in and out of the train in addition to all of your gear and your backpack.

 

Where do you ride a monowheel in Germany? Is it completely forbidden in your area?

[mhpr262]

1 hour ago, v8nice said:

Where do you ride a monowheel in Germany? Is it completely forbidden in your area?

Yes, it is completely forbidden everywhere in Germany. The police either ignored me or looked the other way for the last three and a half years, but a couple of weeks ago I was stopped by some officer who had put in some research. It probably wont be too bad this time as I feigned ignorance of the law but the cop already warned me that if they caught me again it would mean a fine well north of 1.000€  

I havent stopped riding but now I stick to the tiniest agricultural roads and cycle paths out in the country where you almost never meet the police. No more riding in my hometown, which is a shame because urban traffic is where EUCs shine the most.

[Mono]

11 hours ago, YCC said:

Indeed, some elevated platform may have a huge gap of stair to take the train. However, I tried my 20 inch wheel which is able to roll on platform and cross the gap . Therefore, I believe that the 22 inch wheel may be very easy to cross this gap from platform.  What is your wheel? 

Officially derailing the thread. These are the kind of stairs in European high speed trains I can't quite always avoid (or I pretend I sit in a wheelchair in which case they provide access without passing stairs). I have a V8F which weighs 17kg and has a (comparatively) ergonomic grip and shape to carry.

[Mono]

43 minutes ago, mhpr262 said:

It probably wont be too bad this time as I feigned ignorance of the law but the cop already warned me that if they caught me again it would mean a fine well north of 1.000€ 

Even when charges are brought, I have seen they are sometimes (often?) dismissed by the judges, not sure exactly why because the law seems quite clear to me. The few hundred km I rode around in German cities I was kindly ignored too.

Edited February 3 by Mono

[Cerbera]

As fascinating as seeing the stairs on various trains around the world might be, isn't it something of a moot point, or will be sometime soon given the ever-increasing trends for just banning PEVs on trains full stop, like they have over here in the UK. We can't take them on any public transport at all, (with some rare exceptions).

Any of you guys who do that now are surely gonna find that one day they just say no, and that'll be the end of that ! :/

Edited February 3 by Cerbera

[Mono]

21 minutes ago, Cerbera said:

As fascinating as seeing the stairs on various trains around the world might be, isn't it something of a moot point, or will be sometime soon given the ever-increasing trends for just banning PEVs on trains full stop. Any of you guys who do that now are surely gonna find that one day they just say no, and that'll be the end of that ! :/

We don't know, hence it's not a moot point. AFAIK it's mainly/only the UK prohibiting PEVs in trains so far, so you probably have a biased perception of where things go. Last time I officially asked, I even got a green light to take an EUC in the Eurostar train which tunnels between the European mainland and London. We might see some prohibitions (e.g. for the tunnel under the Channel), however I suspect we are not likely to see a comprehensive prohibition of PEVs in all European trains any time soon if ever.

Edited February 3 by Mono

[Cerbera]

46 minutes ago, Mono said:

We don't know, hence it's not a moot point. AFAIK it's mainly/only the UK prohibiting PEVs in trains so far, so you probably have a biased perception of where things go.

Yes, I think you may be right about that to some extent. And it's encouraging to be reminded that Europe tends to be more progressive than we are on our curmudgeonly little island, and even more so to think I could maybe get a wheel on a train from London to Europe, which I didn't think was possible, even if I had to physically ride to London to get it to the start point !

 

 

 

 

[Spiwrs]

1 hour ago, mhpr262 said:

Yes, it is completely forbidden everywhere in Germany. The police either ignored me or looked the other way for the last three and a half years, but a couple of weeks ago I was stopped by some officer who had put in some research. It probably wont be too bad this time as I feigned ignorance of the law but the cop already warned me that if they caught me again it would mean a fine well north of 1.000€  

I havent stopped riding but now I stick to the tiniest agricultural roads and cycle paths out in the country where you almost never meet the police. No more riding in my hometown, which is a shame because urban traffic is where EUCs shine the most.

Did you see this video where he was pulled over on his EUC whilst riding on the back roads in Germany?

 

 

[Tomallo]

1 hour ago, Spiwrs said:

Did you see this video where he was pulled over on his EUC whilst riding on the back roads in Germany?

 

 

Damn, so painful to watch... bummer

[Raptor]

On 2/2/2024 at 12:58 PM, null said:

It's not "that bad" luckily, but it is a bit slow and tedious. I can even just carry it both up and down in spite of it being 60% of my weight, but I feel my back isn't happy about it. There is really a big difference in lifting between the Shermans 35Kg and the EBCPs close to 45Kg on the scale. (for my medium build anyway).

I would "do it again" (getting a heavy EUC) but it clearly isn't as handy as the Sherman, and 45Kg seems really close to my upper limit.

My original post was mostly to answer YCC asking why anyone would care about the weight of EUCs.

own experience, I dare to say that Begode Master goes up the stairs by himself with a slight push! I have not once carried him up the stairs in a year and a half. However, the previous and lighter EUCs needed to be carried! Both Kingsong 18 and Gotway MSP were too low to push up the stairs! So for me it's the opposite . In the case of a heavier EUC, getting to the second floor is much less effort-intensive

[mhpr262]

1 hour ago, Spiwrs said:

Did you see this video where he was pulled over on his EUC whilst riding on the back roads in Germany?

 

No. I hadn't seen that. He mentioned he was around 30-40 minutes away from Erding where I live... it really bothers me that I cant tell from the video where he was riding, LOL. I ought to know every road  around here, but I cant figure it out. There are a bunch of those long, straight roads between Erding and Munich, south of the B388, but I dont recognize any of those industrial buildings.

Edited February 3 by mhpr262

[Mono]

10 minutes ago, Raptor said:

own experience, I dare to say that Begode Master goes up the stairs by himself with a slight push! I have not once carried him up the stairs in a year and a half. However, the previous and lighter EUCs needed to be carried! Both Kingsong 18 and Gotway MSP were too low to push up the stairs! So for me it's the opposite . In the case of a heavier EUC, getting to the second floor is much less effort-intensive

Do you have a street tire? What happens if the tire is wet? I also suspect you use both hands to do this reliably? I also suspect it's much slower than I usually pass through stairs 

[null]

5 hours ago, Raptor said:

own experience, I dare to say that Begode Master goes up the stairs by himself with a slight push! I have not once carried him up the stairs in a year and a half. However, the previous and lighter EUCs needed to be carried! Both Kingsong 18 and Gotway MSP were too low to push up the stairs! So for me it's the opposite . In the case of a heavier EUC, getting to the second floor is much less effort-intensive

Thanks for the comment, maybe I've just not dared pushing it hard enough, as it is I dont lift so very much but I "follow" it very steadily. It's a street tire but I will avoid the rain at the moment anyway. It's true the taller EUC makes it easier to push compared to the lower ones, probably the lever effect as well as not standing so bent.

edit: everyone: I suppose this is a bit derailing of the thread, but as some people worry about the ETM's 49Kg the subject might have its place.

Edited February 3 by null

[techyiam]

4 hours ago, null said:

edit: everyone: I suppose this is a bit derailing of the thread, but as some people worry about the ETM's 49Kg the subject might have its place.

For those who are contemplating to buy a ET Max, and has stairs to contend with, I think this topic is relevant.

I primarily have 5 steps that I need to deal with for each trip I take. But I ride all year round. And it rains a lot here. It snows too, but not often.

I roll all my wheels up the steps now, including my T3, but when I do the T3, it is powered off.

There is a difference between pushing up the V12/S22 and the Abrams.

Even though the V12 is lightest, it doesn't necessarily mean it is the easiest to push up.

The biggest issue is traction, especially when the steps are wet.

It is important to get the technique right, especially when the steps are wet.

What I found is that when pushing the wheel from behind, maximum traction is obtained when the hands are pushing lower down, closer to the leader edge of the next step, height wise. The tire needs sufficient "normal" (orthogonal) force against the step to generate enough traction. You won't get maximum traction force when pushing higher up on the wheel.

For the V12/S22, the pedal assist for acceleration is quite strong (also wheel diameters are smaller). So, it doesn't take much forward tilting of the wheel to get the motor to engage with enough torque to roll the wheel up each step.

However, not so with the Abrams. The pedal assist for the Abrams is not strong enough. And hence, one needs to tilt the wheel forward enough in order for the motor to torque the wheel up each step. Luckily the Abrams is taller.

One would think that by pushing the Abrams high up from behind, then there wouldn't be enough traction. But that is not the case. I think 22" diameter tire helps the situation.

Come to think of it, when the steps are wet, the V12 slips the easiest. I need to push at a lower point in the back to get more traction.

On the S22, I can push a little higher up.

And I can push at the highest height on the Abrams.

Traction is probably dependent on the tire too.

The ET Max has a 20" tire; so it shouldn't be too bad for grip. If the tire has a tread made from a softer compound, it would help even more, especially if the steps are wet.

I don't know how strong is the pedal assist for acceleration on the ET Max. The high height of the wheel may not help too much here. What is important though, is whether there are points on the back that is suitable for pushing the wheel from behind, and whether the pedal assist is strong enough.

Edited February 4 by techyiam

[Raptor]

5 hours ago, Mono said:

Do you have a street tire? What happens if the tire is wet? I also suspect you use both hands to do this reliably? I also suspect it's much slower than I usually pass through stairs 

My slightly modified Begode Master weighs 43 kg and I use a street tire 90/90 14 . It is very easy to push up the stairs. It is necessary to push but not lift. You go up the stairs at normal walking speed. I also drive in rain and snow. If the tire is wet, I deliberately let the tire slide a little on the outdoor stairs. Cleans quickly. forward is already movement without slipping

Edited February 3 by Raptor

[techyiam]

5 hours ago, Raptor said:

a street tire 90/90 14

What tire is that? How do you like the riding performance of this tire in the rain?

Edited February 4 by techyiam

[alcatraz]

21 hours ago, mhpr262 said:

Hahaha, I wish some gaps were the only things I have to deal with in Germany. Almost all normal trains I have to get on and off look like this, plus two or three additional steep steps that are missing in the commuter train in this picture, and usually the entrance will also be narrower. Now imagine having to get a 105lbs wheel in and out of the train in addition to all of your gear and your backpack.

 

You'll have no choice but to use the ramp for disabled people, if there is one 

[Raptor]

10 hours ago, techyiam said:

What tire is that? How do you like the riding performance of this tire in the rain?

I already forgot that it is not a very smooth road tire :). it is 90/90 14 Heidenau 66 . The driving characteristics are very pleasant. It is very easy to make sharp turns and bends. The handling is also good on forest roads and it is good in asphalt bends and rain .