Begode Extreme 2400wh: 134V, 16", Suspension, 77lb

[okvp]

6 minutes ago, techyiam said:

 

Mind you the EX30 seemed nice enough out of the box. Begode Extreme could be another step forward. High quality hydraulic shocks are not cheap, so mono-shock based design may prove competitive should someone can figure out how to produce good cost effective sliders.

Cost is probably one of the reasons why motorcycles switched from double shock absorbers to mono, with the swingarm design the weight might be an another. I wonder why the EUC manufacturers haven't introduced a suspension based on a swingarm, one reason might be that the center of the wheel moves a little bit forward and back with the suspension travel. Lukluk's rsht spring wheel seems to be based on a swingarm, but there is not information about it.

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, okvp said:

Cost is probably one of the reasons why motorcycles switched from double shock absorbers to mono, with the swingarm design the weight might be an another.

Mono-shock suspension design was first used on dirt bikes because of the rising rate linkage. Dual shock swingarms are not subjected to bending stresses (only pin-joints), and so can be made cheaper and lighter.

1 hour ago, okvp said:

I wonder why the EUC manufacturers haven't introduced a suspension based on a swingarm, one reason might be that the center of the wheel moves a little bit forward and back with the suspension travel.

This is interesting. I do know the Patton's suspension system works well without quirks. So we do know vertical axle movements are fine.

But it is hard to tell how well an electric wheel would ride with a swingarm type suspension system. There is a prototype out there somewhere. We have to wait and see if it ever get mass produced.

But because the electric wheel market is still small, there may not be enough R&D money to fund such project by the current electric wheel manufacturers.

 

Edited May 20, 2023 by techyiam

[okvp]

29 minutes ago, techyiam said:

Mono-shock suspension design was first used on dirt bikes because of the rising rate linkage. Dual shock swingarms are not subjected to bending stresses (only pin-joints), and so can be made cheaper and lighter.

This is interesting. I do know the Patton's suspension system works well without quirks. So we do know vertical axle movements are fine.

But it is hard to tell how well an electric wheel would ride with a swingarm type suspension system. There is a prototype out there somewhere. We have to wait and see if it ever get mass produced.

But because the electric wheel market is still small, there may not be enough R&D money to fund such project by the current electric wheel manufacturers.

 

Rising rate linkage system was probably the first and biggest reason, althought I had a KTM 250sx and Husaberg which used progressive spring shock without linkages.

Which is cheaper to manufacture two shocks or one bigger shock with sturdier swingarm, probably depends on how complex and good the shocks are...

[The Brahan Seer]

Latest short clip, extremely [blank]...

 

[Drunkard]

^{I'm having some serious doubts about how tall this wheel is.. I know they want to have it a lot of suspension travel but it just looks like it's going to be shit to ride}

[Rollin-on-1]

Pedal dip or loss of traction?

 

[Rawnei]

20 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

Pedal dip or loss of traction?

 

It's a combination of harsh transition and very steep hill, if transition was smoother perhaps traction would be possible but we can only guess.

[Rollin-on-1]

29 minutes ago, Rawnei said:

It's a combination of harsh transition and very steep hill, if transition was smoother perhaps traction would be possible but we can only guess.

Something about the way it dips when it hits the harsh transition looks off though...like the PID needs more tuning.   No doubt it would be tough for any wheel to make the initial transition, but it just looks off to me, like soft mode or something.

Edited May 31, 2023 by Rollin-on-1

[Rawnei]

23 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

Something about the way it dips when it hits the harsh transition looks off though...like the PID needs more tuning.   No doubt it would be tough for any wheel to make the initial transition, but it just looks off to me, like soft mode or something.

They are basically riding into a wall I don't think any amount of tuning will save it. 😂

We've experimented with similar transitions here but even less steep hills, any harsh transition is very difficult to manage, the best technique is usually to start with a bunny hop to avoid the harsh transition, personally I'm not so good at that but we have some skilled riders here who can do some amazing things.

[Drunkard]

I watched this video at 0.25 speed and i don't get one thing.. suspension should be like a great selling point of this wheel at 130mm yet have any of you can see it actually work? I really tried observing them mounting the wheel and none seem to sag down the pedals even an inch after getting on.

At 32 seconds the guy hits a hole while turning and i can kind of tell that it was doing something at that point, but everywhere else it just looks like have the shocks at double what it needs to be.. even when hitting the big rock there is pretty much no cushioning just a bounce back. Am I crazy? 

[Rawnei]

28 minutes ago, Drunkard said:

I watched this video at 0.25 speed and i don't get one thing.. suspension should be like a great selling point of this wheel at 130mm yet have any of you can see it actually work? I really tried observing them mounting the wheel and none seem to sag down the pedals even an inch after getting on.

At 32 seconds the guy hits a hole while turning and i can kind of tell that it was doing something at that point, but everywhere else it just looks like have the shocks at double what it needs to be.. even when hitting the big rock there is pretty much no cushioning just a bounce back. Am I crazy? 

No I don't think Begode has a clue how to design a suspension system and that it will be shit until 3rd party links are on the market.

[The Brahan Seer]

This is a strange looking wheel. I wonder if its look makes it appear top heavy and tall but in reality its more of an optical illusion like the Patton looks very wide.

Will be interesting to fine out what its really like and if the 16" with C40 is a good mix.

[jimjam.nyc]

There is a lot to get excited for with this wheel. I honestly think its main negative point is having all the input on design  come from one person with one thing in mind. 

I see nothing wrong with having a wheel geared toward a niche. But only having one main opinion on how things are designed and feel makes this more of a custom wheel for one user and their followers, rather than something everyone should be excited for.

Still really cool for that group who this is made for. Just I can only get excited for certain features to come in future wheels like smart bms, etc

[Rollin-on-1]

47 minutes ago, jimjam.nyc said:

I honestly think its main negative point is

...Begode.  This will probably be a great wheel once someone dumps an extra $1000 into mods to make it right.

Begode seems to be improving though, so I'll try to keep an open mind.

[Cerbera]

39 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

Begode seems to be improving though, so I'll try to keep an open mind.

Those look like very wide pads, which might mean they don't need immediate swapping out, and if so, that's a big part of aftermarket enhancement avoided...

But the back light looks terribly exposed and plastic-y, and we still have the classic 'Begode gaps' at the top, so maybe we will still need additional fairings.

Don't understand why they are trying to make it go up such ridiculous slopes, unless it's meant to be more a demonstration of the durability after multiple rolls downhill...

 

 

Edited June 1, 2023 by Cerbera

[techyiam]

Well, Chance said on Facebook that the Extreme will be shipped to him soon. 

It shouldn't be long before we will get some more factual details on the Extreme.

He seem to have taken a real liking to the Commander Pro. It would be interesting to see how he compares the two. 

[techyiam]

Begode managed to find a 105 kg man to step on an Extreme and bounced on it. Playback at 1/4 speed, and you may be you able to see the sag when he got off the wheel. Probably need more rebound damping, though. However, unlike what was shown right afterwards that was from an earlier posted clip, this time, the wheel didn't stayed compressed.

Time-stamped. 

 

Edited June 2, 2023 by techyiam

[The Brahan Seer]

Undercover..

 

[mrelwood]

2 hours ago, techyiam said:

and you may be you able to see the sag when he got off the wheel.

But no sag when getting on the wheel. 

[techyiam]

8 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

But no sag when getting on the wheel. 

I think it was delayed. Perhaps they used maximum compression damping, and minimum rebound damping?

[mrelwood]

4 minutes ago, techyiam said:

I think it was delayed.

I can’t see it.

 When he gets off, the sag quite tiny. Nowhere near 30% of the travel, so the shock is clearly very much overinflated.

[Rawnei]

Just don't be surprised when it turns out the suspension is complete shit even though some YouTuber might say it's great, just like the Master I think history will repeat itself, once @EMA designs something for it it will better. 😁

[Cerbera]

19 minutes ago, Rawnei said:

don't be surprised when it turns out the suspension is complete shit even though some YouTuber might say it's great

Don't forget that Begode do usually improve things with every iteration. They will have learned 'linkage lessons' by now (certainly) and probably suspension lessons in general from the models that have gone before, and the exceptionally vocal feedback they will have received in relation to those ! I think the suspension on that will be... OK !

 

[techyiam]

12 hours ago, Cerbera said:

They will have learned 'linkage lessons' by now (certainly) and probably suspension lessons in general from the models that have gone before, and the exceptionally vocal feedback they will have received in relation to those ! I think the suspension on that will be... OK !

Yeah, like the EX30, but it is no Sherman-S nor S22 Pro.

If I value suspension that much and still want to have Begode DNA, I would go with a Commander Pro.

Edited June 3, 2023 by techyiam

[Rawnei]

2 hours ago, Cerbera said:

Don't forget that Begode do usually improve things with every iteration. They will have learned 'linkage lessons' by now (certainly) and probably suspension lessons in general from the models that have gone before, and the exceptionally vocal feedback they will have received in relation to those ! I think the suspension on that will be... OK !

 

No I don't think so, they don't have the expertise and know-how that is needed and they aren't consulting any 3rd party so they have shown time and time again that they are not capable in this area.