Seba Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 8 hours ago, FTW said: Just to add a little more clarification, my 18XL was locked out of the KS app Actually, wheel lock effect isn't immediate. It's possible that your wheel was locked by KS app, but you noticed it after turning your wheel off and on again. I don't think it's a bug in firmware. For me it makes sense what @Jack King Song wrote - some problem on the KS server side caused app to activate lock. This kind of lock is a two-stage operation: lock wheel and set some unknown password to prevent further unlocking. Doesn't look like a bug in firmware. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 (edited) Aside from all the reasons and excuses and blah blah blah, this only worries me, as now we KNOW that any glitch on a server on the other side of the planet, can cost us a wheel. Even if this isnt something Kingsong meant to happen, this just illustrates that theres a 'backdoor' to our wheels and its not a secret. I trust Seba completely and I'm pretty sure his allegiance lies with the customer and the community as a whole. When he tells me something is up and there's nothing can be done.... I am a gone gone KS user. MY horse in this race is my first euc i ever purchased. I had NO IDEA about all this app stuff and wheel region and speed limits or even wtf the battery size meant. I purchased mine with a few miles, USED from an ebay seller. I didnt get a steal of a deal, but it was enough savings from a brand new wheel, that I bit the bullet and bought one. At the time, I had NO IDEA how much fun an euc was. All i knew is that they were ungodly expensive and I'd never seen one in person. KS had the specs to match what I wanted... something reliable and somewhat refined. Had I NOT found a good used price, I may have NOT thought to buy one as I was also looking into other things. After over 400 miles and a few months, I don't have a clue where my wheel REALLY came from. Im an idiot and registered my wheel with the KS when I got it. Then the apps went to unuseabe crapolla, asked for a million permissions and made me VERY uneasy. Somewhere along the line, my wheel mysteriously unlocked to full speed and I found eucw. Seeing these wheels get locked, applies to me, as mine can also be locked and I have no idea the region. Hell, if a 'glitch' can lock one, shouldnt we ALL be worried? I'm very tempted to update to fw 2.03 from 2.0, as Seba (and others) keep assuring me it wont be an issue. I'll have to look into what benefits 2.03 has, but it just feels like a risk to me, even yet. Now I have an s18 on order too. Im buying from e-wheels, but WTF does ewheels have to do about it if its a 'glitch'? I won't own a satellite controlled car, but my wheel is? SonofaBitch! I bet i dont have this issue with the Sherman otw.... Take note KS, theres many choices afoot. Even a customer that likes to patron the same brand when possible, isnt a given or done deal... We are ALL looking around and watching... Even if we dont get locked out, SOME of us don't like to hear anyone in the community being threatened by a company. Get a grip on resellers, sue them, don't piss off the customer. Besides, it aint like China is known for it uber high moral code when it comes to trying to make $$. I'd bet KS themselves, shop around for best prices on even build materials... Edited July 2, 2020 by ShanesPlanet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeRide Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Good time to edit the title of this thead to something more appropriate. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagu81 Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Seba said: Actually, wheel lock effect isn't immediate. It's possible that your wheel was locked by KS app, but you noticed it after turning your wheel off and on again. I don't think it's a bug in firmware. For me it makes sense what @Jack King Song wrote - some problem on the KS server side caused app to activate lock. This kind of lock is a two-stage operation: lock wheel and set some unknown password to prevent further unlocking. Doesn't look like a bug in firmware. Hello dear Seba,i get same problem with my ks16x, same situation as described in my post. i was riding with ks16x from home to work, when i arrived to work i make screen picture of app for save all data of my ride, after that the app get stuck and crash, i forced close the crashed app and the wheel get locked by itself.who can help me? very thanks everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 3 minutes ago, pagu81 said: Hello dear Seba,i get same problem with my ks16x, same situation as described in my post. i was riding with ks16x from home to work, when i arrived to work i make screen picture of app for save all data of my ride, after that the app get stuck and crash, i forced close the crashed app and the wheel get locked by itself.who can help me? very thanks everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted July 2, 2020 Author Share Posted July 2, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, FTW said: It just surprised me when doing extensive research here on the forum after my wheel got locked this morning to find so many people referring to KS’s habit of locking wheels bought direct from China without finding anyone posting about having actually encountered this problem. They did, until late last year, (other example, or in this very thread, just search for registration) and AFAIK the only reason it was put aside was because the old official app was falling apart and the new one got rejected from the app stores (hence a few months of softuner). Even here Jack King Song is confirming it's a server side activation glitch. Why would the mechanism even exist if it isn't to use it? They did it before, and the glitch only touched unofficial import wheels. It was called registration and was basically activation on their servers based on your serial number. If you didn't register / activate, the wheel was locked to 20km/h, so fairly useless. The only reason there wasn't more uproar is that it was easy to dodge: you could activate by phone number (hard coded country) or email (you set the country manually (here Ali buyers would choose a different country)) an activation code for the app was sent to you. The process by mail was very buggy and some had to ask KS directly, who would exceptionally whitelist their wheel. Even buying from the official importer you where at the mercy of that activation server, it randomly didn't work, and it could loose activation if you had reinstalled the app. So although it wasn't enforced the hard way, there was indeed a region lock. Now "Wheel has been locked" in the app code smells a lot like a return.. Edited July 2, 2020 by null 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 A small official local KS distributor showed us an email he’d gotten from KS early this year. It said that in support of official distributors, KS will start locking unofficial wheels with with the new app. The app has now been available for a while, and no large scale locks seem to have taken place. Jack King Song said that KS wouldn’t do such thing, but he is a new KS employee. All in all, in my eyes the threat for locking related issues does exist. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mango Posted July 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted July 2, 2020 I’m fairly new to EUCS so this topic is eye opening for me. Remote locking and disabling by the company after I have purchased a wheel is simply unacceptable regardless of their reasons and justifications. I simply will not buy or consider buying any Kingsong product in the future. I bought an inmotion product and do need to register the wheel’s serial number using their app to unlock. This is also something I will keep in mind. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ilya Shkolnik Posted July 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted July 2, 2020 23 hours ago, Chriull said: I can't destify anything for darknessbot, but it seems to be "just" a KS app issue. @Seba stated that no locking will happen with euc world. @Ilya Shkolnik could tell in regard to darknessbot DarknessBot has never locked and will not lock EUCs remotely. All work with your EUC takes place only locally. You can also remove the pin code via the serial number (Paste method). In the near future we will update the UI to reset the pin code for KS (input serial number) 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lever Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Glad to know i just bought a giant paperweight... Here's hoping the reputable dealer I got it from can help with the beeping and not moving. Just took it out of the shipping material from china and its locked alright. Tried the fix in the thread, but it just says 'ks14d not logged in' and beeps some more. Connects in three apps, but I deleted the kingsong app because a side-loaded app with that level of permission makes me nervous. So far the euc is not as fun as I'd hoped ,🥺 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Simon Lever said: Just took it out of the shipping material from china and its locked alright. All wheels are locked in the packaging, that is the point of locking them (so they don't turn on and possibly burn themselves out in transit). You should be able to unlock it in all apps. Try a third party app (they are just generally better) - EUC World on Android or DarknessBot on iOS - and unlock it. Only if that suddenly does not work you should worry about what's going on Edited July 2, 2020 by meepmeepmayer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSFET Electric Dreams Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Simon Lever said: Glad to know i just bought a giant paperweight... Here's hoping the reputable dealer I got it from can help with the beeping and not moving. Just took it out of the shipping material from china and its locked alright. Tried the fix in the thread, but it just says 'ks14d not logged in' and beeps some more. Connects in three apps, but I deleted the kingsong app because a side-loaded app with that level of permission makes me nervous. So far the euc is not as fun as I'd hoped ,🥺 The wheel locking out of the box is a safety feature. Activation lock and wheel lock are two different things. Please check DM. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 8 hours ago, Mango said: I’m fairly new to EUCS so this topic is eye opening for me. Remote locking and disabling by the company after I have purchased a wheel is simply unacceptable regardless of their reasons and justifications. I simply will not buy or consider buying any Kingsong product in the future. I bought an inmotion product and do need to register the wheel’s serial number using their app to unlock. This is also something I will keep in mind. they dont do this.. it was a glitch.. ks just said they have a new apk on their website that will resolve the issue for anyone thats having it https://www.kingsong.com/list-30.html 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eve Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 (edited) @Seba Im pretty new to EUC. Can you help me with some questions? So there is actually no reason to use an official kingsong app and everything including unlocking the wheel/calibration/unlocking speed/updating fw can be done trough EUC World or darknessbot? Off-topic: I ordered an S18 from China and i would have no problems ordering from and official distributor but EU prices are plain stupidity. 2200€ for S18? Its 1450€ from China. 1617€ from eWheels US if you convert the dollars to euro. So why am i supposed to pay 580€ more (which is 680USD btw) for a wheel just because i live in Europe? I mean, ppl from US would you buy the 1900USD S18 for 2580USD? If i lived in US i would no questions asked ordered from ewheels. Prices are very fair! (BTW a shop in my country, i dont think they are official distributors are selling S18 for 2350€) Well ill be buying wheels from China until EU shops start selling wheels for a normal price. Edited August 11, 2020 by eve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 17 minutes ago, eve said: @Seba Im pretty new to EUC. Can you help me with some questions? So there is actually no reason to use an official kingsong app and everything including unlocking the wheel/calibration/unlocking speed/updating fw can be done trough EUC World or darknessbot? It can be done - but not for chinese wheels euc world and darknesbot won't offer these functions for chinese wheels - that was their agreement. They got the protocoll details and now have to comply with ks policies... 17 minutes ago, eve said: Off-topic: I ordered an S18 from China and i would have no problems ordering from and official distributor but EU prices are plain stupidity. 2200€ for S18? Its 1450€ from China. 1617€ from eWheels US if you convert the dollars to euro. So why am i supposed to pay 580€ more (which is 680USD btw) for a wheel just because i live in Europe? US shops don't include sales tax (afaik), but theirs are ower and wont influence the price diffetence too much. 17 minutes ago, eve said: I mean, ppl from US would you buy the 1900USD S18 for 2580USD? If i lived in US i would no questions asked ordered from ewheels. Prices are very fair! (BTW a shop in my country, i dont think they are official distributors are selling S18 for 2350€) We are f***ed up in europe. 17 minutes ago, eve said: Well ill be buying wheels from China until EU shops start selling wheels for a normal price. I'd worry about unlocking... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mi-K-L Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 (edited) Hi! My turn to get locked. Having a KS18L since 2018 bought on aliE. I was using the official app v3.40 very often this summer, it never locked. I was not aware of the risk. Today I have updated the app to v3.50, connected to the wheel and got the wheel locked A friend succeed to unlock using soft tuner. But now we cannot change any setting. EUC World Premium says wheel "not supported". A password seems to have been applied but we don't know it. Whatever the password we put, EUC World connect to the wheel. But does not allow the set the wheel. @Seba ? Edited August 11, 2020 by Mi-K-L Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rywokast Posted August 11, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 11, 2020 i guess i have to change my statement then, they did say they would not do this but the evidence is too strong now, seems they have changed their mind on the matter and decided to "lock" down on this..... tisk tisk this is very bad business and you will lose many potential customers unless you get your shit together kingsong 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post null Posted August 11, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted August 11, 2020 (edited) Looks like we'll have to cook together some software combination of fake GPS and Chinese IP. If your wheel isn't locked yet, stop using Kingsong apps. Set your speed alarms knowing you might never be able to change them again. I don't even use KS apps with my supposedly legit wheels, never know when a server "bug" might render it unusable. @Jack King Song you can tell your colleagues I don't congratulate them. This is either sabotage or incompetence. I won't recommend buying a Kingsong wheel as long as this BS goes on. Edited August 11, 2020 by null 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 1 minute ago, null said: Looks like we'll have to cook together some software combination of fake GPS and Chinese IP. If your wheel isn't locked yet, stop using Kingsong apps. Set your speed alarms knowing you might never be able to change them again. I don't even use KS apps with my supposedly legit wheels, never know when a server "bug" might render it unusable. @Jack King Song you can tell your colleagues I don't congratulate them. This is either sabotage or incompetence. I won't recommend buying a KS wheel as long as this BS goes on. agreed... there is absolutely no need to use official apps for anything nowadays.... so just dont even bother, just knowing they have that ability and have seen them exercise it, i will not use the official apps now... unfortunately, unless you happen to be on this forum, no one else would know that and they would follow the instructions on the box/manual and get the official app first 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post eve Posted August 11, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 11, 2020 (edited) @Rywokast Seems like ill be riding my S18 on stock fw. If something like this happened with Inmotion. The wheel would be unlocked immediately within minutes. No questions asked. The fact KIngsong does this is pure bs. And lets be honest here. We knew from the start V11 will outsell S18. Its a cruiser a common wheel with great technology, motor, headlight, etc. But Kingsong are i think trying to bury themselves. If they intend on continuing these practicese S18 will be my first and last Kingsong wheel. Edited August 11, 2020 by eve 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartL Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 See the comment from @Jack King Song here confirming that King Song are actively locking wheels bought in the Chinese market. He does say that this only applies to wheels bought in 2020 with a P in the serial number and wheels bought earlier which have been locked can be unlocked by contacting him. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onizukagto Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 10 hours ago, eve said: @Rywokast Seems like ill be riding my S18 on stock fw. If something like this happened with Inmotion. The wheel would be unlocked immediately within minutes. No questions asked. The fact KIngsong does this is pure bs. And lets be honest here. We knew from the start V11 will outsell S18. Its a cruiser a common wheel with great technology, motor, headlight, etc. But Kingsong are i think trying to bury themselves. If they intend on continuing these practicese S18 will be my first and last Kingsong wheel. I think the quote from Gotway CEO is applicable here ~ (paraphasing): "Inmotion is run by an engineer, Kingsong is run by a businessman" 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Feynman Posted August 12, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 12, 2020 Regardless of whether wheels are being 'bricked', I find it troubling that the KS App has any control over the wheel except local and monitoring/diagnostic controls. Period. I paid for the wheel. I own the wheel. I should be able to use the wheel wherever I want and however I want. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Circuitmage Posted August 12, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 12, 2020 Chinese guy goes to USA and invents EUC wheels. Chinese companies steal his idea, and guy says it's OK...he understands that's how Chinese business models work Chinese company (Kingsong) makes a bunch of wheels and builds a great business Other Chinese companies steal/resell Kingson wheels KS gets mad and shuts them all down. Irony? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feynman Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Circuitmage said: Chinese guy goes to USA and USA company invents X. Chinese companies steal his idea, and guy says it's OK...he understands that's how Chinese business models work but it's impossible to defend IP in China Chinese company (Kingsong) makes a bunch of wheels and builds a great business makes similar product, but cheaper Other Chinese companies steal/resell Kingson wheels Americans buy Chinese product because we're addicted to cheap sh$t US company goes under Irony? That's been the Chinese model of 'innovation' for the past 30 years. Edited August 12, 2020 by Feynman Fixed Chinese MO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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