Just got hit by a bus

[dmethvin]

7 hours ago, YoshiSkySun said:

It happens to the best of us, so be prepared...like mama said, “Always wear protection.”

Shower thought: If mama had listened to her own advice, you might not be here. 

[dpong]

Don't drive in traffic.  Just don't. 

Right or wrong.  Makes no difference. 

[mezzanine]

This event has caused me to shift my attitude towards bad drivers.  I've been trying to be somewhat of an ambassador for EUCs in the couple of months I've been riding.  My default prior to getting an EUC was more aggressive when presented with situations where I'm forced to confront a driver. 

I had an incident maybe a month ago where a guy in a truck yelled at me and I told him I'd gladly kick his ass right here in the street.  I recognized that such an attitude will cause me more problems than it will solve, and resolved myself to be calm and passive in future situations.  I can sense that I'm losing that zen calm with more time and more negative experiences like the bus one. 

It's bizarre how bad the average driver is.  I know I have to adapt to it or I'll drive myself crazy by being reactive and emotional, but it's going to be a bigger challenge than I realized when I made the decision to use the EUC as my primary means of transport. 

[WARPed1701D]

1 hour ago, mezzanine said:

This event has caused me to shift my attitude towards bad drivers.  I've been trying to be somewhat of an ambassador for EUCs in the couple of months I've been riding.  My default prior to getting an EUC was more aggressive when presented with situations where I'm forced to confront a driver. 

I had an incident maybe a month ago where a guy in a truck yelled at me and I told him I'd gladly kick his ass right here in the street.  I recognized that such an attitude will cause me more problems than it will solve, and resolved myself to be calm and passive in future situations.  I can sense that I'm losing that zen calm with more time and more negative experiences like the bus one. 

It's bizarre how bad the average driver is.  I know I have to adapt to it or I'll drive myself crazy by being reactive and emotional, but it's going to be a bigger challenge than I realized when I made the decision to use the EUC as my primary means of transport. 

Experience it, learn from it, and then let it go. 

I'm awesome at dispensing advice and shit at following it, especially when some dickhead driver nearly kills me on my EUC or bike. However, these are strange times and I'm learning that regardless of how deserving my outbursts may be it is them that are more likely to get me killed than the instigating incident. I don't know how it is in your neck of the woods but round here people think nothing of pulling a gun on you and taking a shot if it protects their bruised ego. Better to avoid the situation in the first place. Adjust your ride routes to reduce risk and confrontation. Your days will be much better for it. 

[mezzanine]

3 minutes ago, WARPed1701D said:

Experience it, learn from it, and then let it go. 

I'm awesome at dispensing advice and shit at following it, especially when shine dickhead driver nearly kills me on my EUC or bike. However, these are strange times and I'm learning that regardless of how deserving my outbursts may be it is them that are more likely to get me killed than the instigating incident. I don't know how it is in your neck of the woods but round here people think nothing of pulling a gun on you and taking a shot if it protects their bruised ego. Better to avoid the situation in the first place. Adjust your ride routes to reduce risk and confrontation. Your days will be much better for it. 

Luckily Canadians aren't as gun-happy as our friends south of the border, but I agree with your point.  I'm going to re-resolve to be calm and handle such provocative incidents with intelligence.  I think there's a therapeutic element to writing about my frustration and acknowledging that my patience has been eroding, unconsciously.  It forces me to recognize that I'm headed in a bad direction. 

I'm going to try to do more sidewalk riding and minimize the street traffic situations that give rise to the more dangerous incidents.  More than that, though, I'm going to have to consciously work to avoid allowing my emotions to boil up without realizing it.  I swear, I had the thought tonight of carrying a can of spray paint in my pocket and tagging cars that nearly hit me.  Smashing my wrist-guards into their vehicle, while gratifying, is a loud invitation to escalate the situation.

Going to make an effort to get more zen about the problem. 

[WARPed1701D]

14 minutes ago, mezzanine said:

Going to make an effort to get more zen about the problem. 

The thing is, most of these arseholes will never admit or even consider they are in the wrong. You could shout and rant at them until the cows come home and the only difference it will make is you are either going to get shot, in the absence of a gun they might back up over you, or they will drive off thinking you are the one with the problem (because they are never wrong) while you stew in your own frustration and take a few weeks off you life thanks to the stress of it all.

I know of what I speak and, as already stated, am crap at following my own advice. It sucks to live in the current climate when you believe it really shouldn't be hard for everyone to show each other just a little bit of decency and realize how much nicer the world would be as a result. 

Sigh... 

[mezzanine]

17 minutes ago, WARPed1701D said:

The thing is, most of these arseholes will never admit or even consider they are in the wrong. You could shout and rant at them until the cows come home and the only difference it will make is you are either going to get shot, in the absence of a gun they might back up over you, or they will drive off thinking you are the one with the problem (because they are never wrong) while you stew in your own frustration and take a few weeks off you life thanks to the stress of it all.

I know of what I speak and, as already stated, am crap at following my own advice. It sucks to live in the current climate when you believe it really shouldn't be hard for everyone to show each other just a little bit of decency and realize how much nicer the world would be as a result. 

Sigh... 

 

I'm giving more serious consideration to the camera idea after our conversation here.  I'm going to work on my own attitude and perspective, but I think knowing I can sue the hell out of whatever terrible driver hits me will give me some misguided relief. 

I genuinely didn't realize it would be quite as bad as it is.  I've lived in Florida and the drivers there are even worse, if that's possible.  I've always driven a car and haven't been exposed to the world of cyclists/EUCs.  My experience as a pedestrian has been bad enough. 

It's been spoiling my attitude to the people who approach me about the EUC.  I'm in a bad mood from dealing with terrible drivers and it just carries over. 

[Marty Backe]

27 minutes ago, WARPed1701D said:

Experience it, learn from it, and then let it go. 

I'm awesome at dispensing advice and shit at following it, especially when shine dickhead driver nearly kills me on my EUC or bike. However, these are strange times and I'm learning that regardless of how deserving my outbursts may be it is them that are more likely to get me killed than the instigating incident. I don't know how it is in your neck of the woods but round here people think nothing of pulling a gun on you and taking a shot if it protects their bruised ego. Better to avoid the situation in the first place. Adjust your ride routes to reduce risk and confrontation. Your days will be much better for it. 

There's no exaggeration here? How many people actually pull guns and take shots at semi-random people because of their ego, in your neck of the woods. I hope you were just being poetic in your description 

I know that I'm guilty of being a bad driver sometimes. How many times have you been on your wheel and have a car drive up to and into the cross-walk of an intersection while looking in the opposite direction. I always have a little spike of negative emotion, but then I remember that I'll often catch myself doing the same thing when I'm the car. I think I've gotten better looking for pedestrians now that I wheel everywhere, but I still catch myself doing it.

So yeah, try and stay in the Zen moment when a car ignores you 

[Marty Backe]

15 minutes ago, mezzanine said:

 

I'm giving more serious consideration to the camera idea after our conversation here.  I'm going to work on my own attitude and perspective, but I think knowing I can sue the hell out of whatever terrible driver hits me will give me some misguided relief. 

I genuinely didn't realize it would be quite as bad as it is.  I've lived in Florida and the drivers there are even worse, if that's possible.  I've always driven a car and haven't been exposed to the world of cyclists/EUCs.  My experience as a pedestrian has been bad enough. 

It's been spoiling my attitude to the people who approach me about the EUC.  I'm in a bad mood from dealing with terrible drivers and it just carries over. 

All you guys with 'bad' drivers. I suspect Californian drivers are just as bad, but I honestly don't notice it much. Why? Because I am an incredibly defensive rider, looking multiple times before crossing streets, assuming that drivers will do the worse thing, never riding near the front of a car unless our eyes meet (for tinted window cars I will actually just stop and wait for them to move on), etc.

So I have absolutely no fear of cars and never have had any bad experiences. 

[mezzanine]

Just now, Marty Backe said:

All you guys with 'bad' drivers. I suspect Californian drivers are just as bad, but I honestly don't notice it much. Why? Because I am an incredibly defensive rider, looking multiple times before crossing streets, assuming that drivers will do the worse thing, never riding near the front of a car unless our eyes meet (for tinted window cars I will actually just stop and wait for them to move on).

So I have absolutely no fear of cars and never have had any bad experiences. 

Yeah, becoming more defensive is going to be the key to managing the problem, more than being zen or any other tactic.  I've always viewed myself as an unusually defensive driver, but I'm going to have re-evaluate.  I think that might be why I've been too reactive; I feel like I'm already being defensive and am running into these situations.  The answer is to be even more defensive. 

One thing that is different with your environment is that you have accessible trails.  I think if I was able to do my pleasure riding on trails, it would help me be more calm when I'm out on the roads.  Sometimes I just want to go for a ride and I end up dealing with all sorts of heavy traffic. 

I'm curious about how houseofjob and Tishawn handle the NYC traffic.  I know Tishawn has said he uses his wheels to commute to work a fair distance within the city. 

[Hansolo]

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/venture-the-world-s-most-versatile-camera-technology/x/8220981#/

A camera to use as dashcam

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

I'm always in a happy mood to be riding so not much fazes me.  There was that one dude driving by in an SUV who was being a jerk for no good reason, but unfortunately there's no cure for stupidity.    Just keep dabbing on them haters.

I don't have any urges to mount a .50 CAL Browning on my Tesla.  Maybe it's just the  places I choose to ride there isn't a huge interaction with vehicles.  I usually ride on sidewalks and pathways although sometimes I'll scoot around the neighbourhood roads.  It's all in your mind how you react to things.  Riding when you're tired or not having enough sleep or water intake can shorten one's temper easily.  With the short days and colder weather it can be taxing as well.

When I'm riding I have this mindset that I'm doing something not many other people are, and it's pretty cool.  I'm an ambassador for the sport/hobby so I'm always representing in the best way possible.  Also it's quite illegal here so as long as I roll under the radar I think it helps to be a courteous and defensive rider.  

[Meng Yang]

2 hours ago, Hansolo said:

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/venture-the-world-s-most-versatile-camera-technology/x/8220981#/

A camera to use as dashcam

Cool little camera, but when worn on glasses and the head starts panning left and right, 1080p30fps will become limiting. I feel 30 fps is good only for a uni-directional view while 60 fps should be minimum for a multi-directional view. > 90 fps is better for fast movement. And for details, its 1080p or more for me.

[WARPed1701D]

10 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

There's no exaggeration here? How many people actually pull guns and take shots at semi-random people because of their ego, in your neck of the woods. I hope you were just being poetic in your description 

I know that I'm guilty of being a bad driver sometimes. How many times have you been on your wheel and have a car drive up to and into the cross-walk of an intersection while looking in the opposite direction. I always have a little spike of negative emotion, but then I remember that I'll often catch myself doing the same thing when I'm the car. I think I've gotten better looking for pedestrians now that I wheel everywhere, but I still catch myself doing it.

So yeah, try and stay in the Zen moment when a car ignores you 

I would say random acts of violence born out of impulse from negative situations is on the rise and it is not uncommon to hear of these events in Pinellas County which is in fact by far the most populous county in Florida (even more so than Broward). It is 53rd most populous in the US and has a population that exceeds at least 8 entire states in their own right. With 1300 people per sq km there is little escape from those around you and ill will towards others creates a knock on effect that cascades throughout the day and those around you. It is a very angry place with a much higher violent crime rate than Florida or the US as a whole. This is different from being crime ridden. Pinellas actually has a property crime rate on par with the state, but this kind of crime is premeditated, not heat of the moment like most violent attacks which as I just mentioned is quite high. 

I know you also live in a highly populated area but in Pinellas the primary industry is tourism which means a lot of lower educated and younger people live here. Drink and drugs goes with the poorly educated sun and beach lifestyle and is rampant. This not only increases the chances of a altercation on the road but also of a negative outcome born from reduced cognitive reasoning. There are also many snowbirds here. Age results in their poor driving ability and they are surprisingly quick to pull a weapon to defend themselves as they feel particularly vulnerable.

Am I exaggerating the risk of being shot/run over. Maybe. But the risk is there and it is real and you never know when you will be the statistic. Zen is the way to go.

FInally regarding bad drivers. We all make mistakes behind the wheel. But acknowledging the mistake to the offended party with a nod or raised apologetic hand (sans middle finger) goes a long way towards diffusing the situation. A sorry costs nothing.

[LanghamP]

54 minutes ago, WARPed1701D said:

Finally regarding bad drivers. We all make mistakes behind the wheel. But acknowledging the mistake to the offended driver with a nod or raised apologetic hand (sans middle finger) goes a long way towards diffusing the situation. A sorry costs nothing.

Honest mistakes born of indifference don't bother most of us. Probably what does irritate us is when drivers are enraged that we dare to slow them down when we force them to pause as we cross. 

About once every week or so I'll get someone who lays on the horn I delay him by crossing on a pedestrian light. While he's on red no less. And I've even had them swerve at me just to teach me a lesson. And they'd be right; to kill or injure a pedestrian isn't a punishable crime at where I live. 

[Marty Backe]

2 hours ago, WARPed1701D said:

I would say random acts of violence born out of impulse from negative situations is on the rise and it is not uncommon to hear of these events in Pinellas County which is in fact by far the most populous county in Florida (even more so than Broward). It is 53rd most populous in the US and has a population that exceeds at least 8 entire states in their own right. With 1300 people per sq km there is little escape from those around you and ill will towards others creates a knock on effect that cascades throughout the day and those around you. It is a very angry place with a much higher violent crime rate than Florida or the US as a whole. This is different from being crime ridden. Pinellas actually has a property crime rate on par with the state, but this kind of crime is premeditated, not heat of the moment like most violent attacks which as I just mentioned is quite high. 

I know you also live in a highly populated area but in Pinellas the primary industry is tourism which means a lot of lower educated and younger people live here. Drink and drugs goes with the poorly educated sun and beach lifestyle and is rampant. This not only increases the chances of a altercation on the road but also of a negative outcome born from reduced cognitive reasoning. There are also many snowbirds here. Age results in their poor driving ability and they are surprisingly quick to pull a weapon to defend themselves as they feel particularly vulnerable.

Am I exaggerating the risk of being shot/run over. Maybe. But the risk is there and it is real and you never know when you will be the statistic. Zen is the way to go.

FInally regarding bad drivers. We all make mistakes behind the wheel. But acknowledging the mistake to the offended party with a nod or raised apologetic hand (sans middle finger) goes a long way towards diffusing the situation. A sorry costs nothing.

I feel for all of you guys who live in areas like this. I've never experienced hostility towards me and my wheel while riding in Southern California. So I guess I can't relate 

[WARPed1701D]

2 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I feel for all of you guys who live in areas like this. I've never experienced hostility towards me and my wheel while riding in Southern California. So I guess I can't relate 

My wife grew up in Tallahassee but lived in San Diego and then Ventura for 5 years before ending up back in FL in St Pete. She said that compared to FL the roads in So. Cal were crazy busy but people seemed to drive with a sense of purpose and she saw no where near the level of dangerous and disrespectful driving as she sees here. Likewise, CA has its share of 'Fruits and Nuts' as she put it, but the level of stupidity and ignorance her is shocking. 

We are done with St Pete (and FL) in general. Our attempt to go back to the UK has failed this time around so we are now looking to head to the west coast sometime this year. 

[litewave]

11 hours ago, mezzanine said:

 

I'm giving more serious consideration to the camera idea after our conversation here.  I'm going to work on my own attitude and perspective, but I think knowing I can sue the hell out of whatever terrible driver hits me will give me some misguided relief. 

I genuinely didn't realize it would be quite as bad as it is.  I've lived in Florida and the drivers there are even worse, if that's possible.  I've always driven a car and haven't been exposed to the world of cyclists/EUCs.  My experience as a pedestrian has been bad enough. 

It's been spoiling my attitude to the people who approach me about the EUC.  I'm in a bad mood from dealing with terrible drivers and it just carries over. 

Cars and trucks are the apex predators, pedestrians are the deer, and we are the insects. That's the natural law in the west, with some minor variation between countries. If you are struck while riding an EUC, presumption will be against you.

Most everyone is feeling so injured and determined to see justice, watching their rights, money, power, resources, etc. being siphoned away by (insert your favorite enemy). It can feel good knowing you are prepared for worst-case scenarios by wearing/carrying a camera or weapon, but I'm convinced that only exacerbates the problem. From my experience both on and off an EUC, you have little chance of holding anyone accountable for a collision, unless you are well-connected and/or wealthy. Legal retaliation/justice has a very low probability of success and will consume much of your time and money, unless you are struck by a wealthy celebrity. If you use a weapon preemptively, your life will change forever for the worse, and you are 99% going to jail. If you use it for retaliation, a very bad outcome is guaranteed. 

[Marty Backe]

25 minutes ago, WARPed1701D said:

My wife grew up in Tallahassee but lived in San Diego and then Ventura for 5 years before ending up back in FL in St Pete. She said that compared to FL the roads in So. Cal were crazy busy but people seemed to drive with a sense of purpose and she saw no where near the level of dangerous and disrespectful driving as she sees here. Likewise, CA has its share of 'Fruits and Nuts' as she put it, but the level of stupidity and ignorance her is shocking. 

We are done with St Pete (and FL) in general. Our attempt to go back to the UK has failed this time around so we are now looking to head to the west coast sometime this year. 

Hopefully at least one positive benefit to coming to the west coast (California?) is the new riding trails to explore. I don't know if I would enjoying riding as much if I didn't have access to all of the mountainous trails to explore.

[novazeus]

starting in 2013 with the first one being a 19 yo girl with no insurance t-boning my 2012 z06(which i had intended on keeping as a collectble because of the 427 engine), a millisecond slower thru the intersection, me and two young girls in the passenger seat surely would have died on impact. 3 more accidents, not my fault, subsequent to this one.

so, these days, Bob and I use this when we have to use the roads around here.

 

[Smoother]

Wow, you guys make America and Canada sound like shit.  I lived there  (USA) 28 years and loved it.  The freedom, the wide open spaces, the lifestyle, the weather. AND the people.  Yes, the people!  Sure you run into your fair share of ass-holes, but that's true everywhere.  Plenty of "arse"-holes here in England, people! And I'm sure other nationalities represented on this forum, have their own ass-hole stories, I'm reminded of @Pingouin s recent run in, in France. Given the right personal circumstances, I'd move back to the US in a Heartbeat. Despite the current political situation, and the lack of affordable health care, America is still one of the greatest places in the world to live; not every neighborhood in every city, sure, but overall, absolutely. 

 @WARPed1701D YES, MOVE if that county is so terrible. Choose better next time.

As for sharing roads with drivers, I don't do it much, only when I have to, or when the roads are quiet.  If traffic builds up, I hop up onto the sidewalk.  I don't like riding in traffic, too dangerous.  I don't even ride motorcycles anymore because of the danger.

As for retaliation or verbal fights; EUCs are illegal here, so I'm automatically in the wrong place.  Add to that I've only seen one other EUC here, and I'm the only suspect in a confrontation.  It wouldn't be that hard to track me down.  So I take the high road, and do not add my anger to any angry situations. I did join the London EUC FaceTube channel, but I'm always Wheeling on the coast at the weekend when they do their group rides, and I avoid as much as possible going into London (arse-hole central)

I also ride with headphones, so it would be pretty pointless for any ass-hole to shout something rude or stupid at me because I can't hear them anyway, or I can pretend I didn't hear them.  Either way, they end up looking stupid, because they got ignored. No lectures about the dangers of headphones, please.  Remember, I rarely ride in the road, and have my head on a swivel, when I do.

[WARPed1701D]

2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Hopefully at least one positive benefit to coming to the west coast (California?) is the new riding trails to explore. I don't know if I would enjoying riding as much if I didn't have access to all of the mountainous trails to explore.

PNW probably. My wife loved So. Cal. but is concerned about not having a network of friends/family nearby which would would have further north. I'd love to try coastal Northern California if I could find work, otherwise somewhere coastal just north of you. San Fran would be awesome but I'm not kidding myself that I will ever be able to afford to live around there even though it is my industry.

Yes, trails must make riding much more fun. Look at a a map of Pinellas and you will see nothing but roads and houses. There is the Pinellas Trail (converted rail line) but the part near me passes thorough some bad areas. You don't want to be on that alone. This is why I only ride to commute. Fun riding areas that are local are hard to find.

[WARPed1701D]

11 minutes ago, Smoother said:

 @WARPed1701D YES, MOVE if that county is so terrible. Choose better next time.

I never said the US was terrible or that the UK was any better. Britain has more than it's fair share of self induced problems as does the US. The grass is no greener. The weeds are just different giving the wrong impression of a better life on the other side the pond. Been there done that mistake. I live here because my wife is American and we had to decide who was going to move. I chose to leave the UK to marry her. There were no other options. Of where to live. I was planning to return this winter because my parents are getting old and I want to spend time with them and to support them, not because I think Brexit Britain will give me a better life (although less guns would be nice). Xenophobic induced immigration restrictions have made that problematic for me (well my wife actually) at the moment so I have to stay here a little longer.

I'll openly admit that St. Pete and FL are not places I want to stick around in but I have not lived anywhere else so cannot and will not pass judgement on the rest of the country which is why we will try the west coast. We feel that while we are in the US it is a region that better aligns with who we are.

[Smoother]

1 hour ago, WARPed1701D said:

Fun riding areas that are local are hard to find.

I'm smack dab in the middle of suburbia too.  I visit friends and family, and run errands, around here.  If I ride for leisure, its to explore quiet residential roads that I have never driven down.  Most weekends I'm on the coast (Eastbourne to be specific). There I cruise the seafront of that and other local towns Hastings, etc.  Miles of flat hard top with zero traffic.  Last weekend I did Eastbourne on Saturday, and Brighton on Sunday.  Took some hot mulled wine in a Thermos and enjoyed a cheap day out in the fresh sea air.  Yeah, it was cold, but I dress warmly. I think you might have some coastline somewhere near you, no?

[novazeus]

i’m 4th generation floridian. definitely a different florida now from when my childhood was 60+ years ago, like everyplace on earth. i’ve lived in every major city/counties, and spent time traveling to almost everyplace in florida because of my work. 

tampa bay area is the least assholic of anyplace i know of in florida. been a long time since i’ve been to the panhandle but i write that off because it’s too cold.

never been to california and it looks pretty but i’d rather deal with hurricanes than what natural disasters californians have to deal with. my prayers that they get decent weather to battle the fires.