swvision Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 22 hours ago, swvision said: This is what I posted on it yesterday(sorry, I'm a bit tired): "I'm actually happy that something like that happened. It could've been way worse if the wheel was by the edge of the cliff. took a lyft home...but I did notice that while the wheel was jumping over bumps on my way down the trail that it felt like a cable was rattling inside the case. I think its one of the color wires that connects the motherboard to the hal sensor. It could be possible that the connector has been burned or pulled apart on the bumps. I noticed another thread that addressed this concern where the connectors were not soldered and just crimped on. This makes the most sense since the motherboard powers on and all the lights work, Bluetooth works, app shows batteries are good and temps are good; the only thing that doesn't work is the wheel isn't spinning. So, my guess is that one of the blue, yellow, red wires are loose. I'll open it up tomorrow and fix it. I'm not worried. I just have to make sure to check on the solidity of the internals a little better for our next run. It was a quite a workout pushing this 40-50 lbs weight down hill and up hill at times, made me real tired. I'll keep you all posted. Our ride was really fun though. I just wish i could've continued the Beverly Hills run over to Griffith Park but it just wasn't in the cards." Long story short: My Gotway Msuper V3S+ stopped spinning and balancing while riding with @jrkline, @Marty Backe on a mountain trail going up a steep hill. So, my suspicions were valid. It seems like there wasn't enough solder on the connector and/or it wasn't crimped. Is it because it wasn't both crimped and soldered that the join came off? The connectors have the Gotway name on them; I'm assuming they were made to address this issue. Here are some pics: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swvision Posted January 31, 2017 Author Share Posted January 31, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 52 minutes ago, swvision said: Long story short: My Gotway Msuper V3S+ stopped spinning and balancing while riding with @jrkline, @Marty Backe on a mountain trail going up a steep hill. So, my suspicions were valid. It seems like there wasn't enough solder on the connector and/or it wasn't crimped. Is it because it wasn't both crimped and soldered that the join came off? The connectors have the Gotway name on them; I'm assuming they were made to address this issue. Here are some pics: That's great that it's an easy fix and no serious harm. But on the other hand it's very worrisome. I really do not want to open all my wheels to check for this. For a wheel to fail because of connector issues is beyond belief. Considering what's at stake (bodily injury) Gotway's manufacturing design for simple things like wires should be bullet proof You really should post this picture and experience to the Gotway Facebook group so that it might get their attention (bad press does wonders sometimes). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 I just posted this on the Gotway Facebook page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 again and again and again Gotway does not stop with this bullshit.....also thought of this fault when i read about that stop: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myfunwheel Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 Scary!! I'll be soldering all of my wheels from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swvision Posted January 31, 2017 Author Share Posted January 31, 2017 43 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: I just posted this on the Gotway Facebook page Thank you Marty, I'll do a write-up of how to easily fix the problem. I think that applying a bit of 100% silicone on the rear plastic portion off the connectors should hold them in place,(maybe). But yeah, I'm just really happy i didn't fly off the edge of a canyon from something as simple as a wire connector being put together the wrong way, not to glorious if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 9 minutes ago, swvision said: Thank you Marty, I'll do a write-up of how to easily fix the problem. I think that applying a bit of 100% silicone on the rear plastic portion off the connectors should hold them in place,(maybe). But yeah, I'm just really happy i didn't fly off the edge of a canyon from something as simple as a wire connector being put together the wrong way, not to glorious if you ask me. Since you'll be maintaining your own wheel I would solder the connections. At least now you'll be more confident in the wheel for future rides. One of these days we'll make it to the top of that hill I need to remember this story when I'm riding too close to the edge of the mountain trails, and not do that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 27 minutes ago, swvision said: Thank you Marty, I'll do a write-up of how to easily fix the problem. I think that applying a bit of 100% silicone on the rear plastic portion off the connectors should hold them in place,(maybe). But yeah, I'm just really happy i didn't fly off the edge of a canyon from something as simple as a wire connector being put together the wrong way, not to glorious if you ask me. look to the suggestions in the thread i linked... There are very high amps running through this motor connections...getting hot and then loose.....Has to become a very good solder! Its mostly not because of bumps or shaking... @zlymex decribed how to solder correctly.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OliverH Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 This is not automotive business. No ISO 9001 quality management. EUCs are by today not devices with safety build in. Personal Light Electric Vehicle (PLEV) will change that, if a manufacturer follows this trail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swvision Posted January 31, 2017 Author Share Posted January 31, 2017 5 minutes ago, KingSong69 said: look to the suggestions in the thread i linked... There are very high amps running through this motor connections...getting hot and then loose.....Has to become a very good solder! Its mostly not because of bumps or shaking... @zlymex decribed how to solder correctly.... I will do that KingSong69. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xebeche Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 Looking at that cable and silicone mess for sure does not evoke feeling of quality, safety and attention to detail . It's really no wonder that something in there gets disconnected or worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 8 hours ago, swvision said: So, my suspicions were valid. It seems like there wasn't enough solder on the connector and/or it wasn't crimped. Is it because it wasn't both crimped and soldered that the join came off? The connectors have the Gotway name on them; I'm assuming they were made to address this issue. Very concerning since I just purchased a Gotway ACM 1600 Mh. When you first evaluated the wiring was this picture an example of how you immediately saw the disconnect with the wiring lying side by side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duf Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 Not sure what to say that has not already been said about the blatant lack of quality control at Gotway. I have yet to hear any representatives from the company address these inexcusable and dangerous examples of negligence when assembling their products. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSport Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 I'm trying to study the photos closely to figure out what happened here. It appears it was likely a cold solder joint. Looking at this on my phone last night, I was thinking that maybe the wire heated up enough to desolder the connection, but now that I'm on my big screen PC, I don't see any signs of that much heat anywhere else. I can confirm that I found a Cold Solder Joint on my Charging Port on my MSuper V3 820 when I took it apart to do some painting. When I removed the Hot Glue that holds the port in place, the wire fell right out. That is also a fire hazard since we leave our chargers plugged in for hours, let alone if the charger port wire had grounded and caused the battery to overheat. Hopefully the BMS would take care of it, but... I still think the GotWay product is the best overall right now, but these sort of issues can take them down quickly. It seems to me that each individual component is a good product, but the assembly process and QC is lacking. Inmotion appears to have quality control figured out, but they don't make any long distance wheels. KingSong and their overheating, and of course, NineBot, Poof.... basically gone It appears GotWay has at least one person doing soldering that should not be. Maybe he/she should be required to ride each wheel along a cliff after they solder them just to prove they are ok with their soldering job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Duf said: Not sure what to say that has not already been said about the blatant lack of quality control at Gotway. I have yet to hear any representatives from the company address these inexcusable and dangerous examples of negligence when assembling their products. Don't hold your breath. It's extremely rare to get any feedback from Gotway, here or in Facebook. They know we exist and at least one person there knows English well enough. They just must not care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duf Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 Do you think a ceramic terminal like this would make for a worthy replacement of the Gotway connectors? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01JRA8HEE/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slaughthammer Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 That thing is rated at 30A... Between motor and controller can easily flow up to 160A. So no, would just make things worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted January 31, 2017 Share Posted January 31, 2017 The Paris Gotway dealer Urban360 will use XT150 connectors,^1 but considers this as excessive. MT60^2 is apparently used in all ACMs without problems (according to Gotway France).^3 ^1 https://www.espritroue.fr/topic/2074-rappel-monoroues-gotway-pour-contrôle-et-correctif/?page=2#comment-38268 ^2 https://www.espritroue.fr/topic/2074-rappel-monoroues-gotway-pour-contrôle-et-correctif/?page=2#comment-38162^3 https://www.espritroue.fr/topic/2074-rappel-monoroues-gotway-pour-contrôle-et-correctif/?page=2#comment-38207 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted February 1, 2017 Share Posted February 1, 2017 I wonder if using a higher melting temperature solder would help. I think it was discussed before that perhaps a connector that incorporates both mechanical and chemical retention would be best for these critical components. If I bought a Gotway, the first thing I would do would be to open it up and identify all the possible points of failure. Maybe adding silicone and heat shrink tubing to help physically join the connector end to the wire would be added insurance. If that solder though is not of a high enough grade to withstand the temperatures through the connector it might be best to swap the connectors out and redo them. @Cloud how did your V3 repair go with the connectors you bought? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSport Posted February 1, 2017 Share Posted February 1, 2017 I was thinking the exact same thing on my ride tonight. Also, if their solder is cheap, it could fail easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted February 1, 2017 Share Posted February 1, 2017 I think the thing about made in China items is that people can easily forget that there can be a lot of short cuts when it comes to quality if steps aren't taken to check the specifications in the manufacturing process. If the smallest thing isn't specified they could be using inferior screws, solder, etc which could fail and end up being a very bad day cruising at higher speeds. I hope @Marty Backe has taken his Monster apart to check all the components. @EUC Extreme once posted a photo of one of his wires coming loose from the control board due to the solder becoming molten. If things are getting that hot, a crimped connector might be a better choice to help lock things down. It would be interesting to place some temperature probes on different parts connected to a logger to see how hot the temperatures are actually getting. With the high capacity batteries we're seeing, they likely pack quite a punch in terms of current so I think Gotway might need to reassess the stresses on their components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted February 1, 2017 Share Posted February 1, 2017 11 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: one of his wires coming loose from the control board due to the solder becoming molten It seems there must be industrial or maybe scientific applications in which the solution to this problem has already been figured out. Gotway engineers should do some research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSport Posted February 1, 2017 Share Posted February 1, 2017 2 minutes ago, MaxLinux said: It seems there must be industrial or maybe scientific applications in which the solution to this problem has already been figured out. Gotway engineers should do some research. I've been looking at Aerospace connectors, but so far, nothing that seems right. I was thinking that would be the highest quality for obvious reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted February 1, 2017 Share Posted February 1, 2017 1 hour ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: <snip> I hope @Marty Backe has taken his Monster apart to check all the components. <snip> No. Right now I'm rolling the dice. Most wheels don't seem to be failing so the odds are in my favor. It's laziness I know. During my lunch break today I was riding my ACM V2s down at the beach, cruising at 20+mph, thinking about this thread. I realize that maybe I shouldn't be reading this forum if I'm going to continue to ride Gotway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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