Begode T4

[jmsjms]

I don't know if it's been discussed: Would this T-4 wheel have the redundancy precautions that are being hyped and praised on the new Inmotion V-13. I think by now, the EUC industry should have this as one of the top priorities. I didn't even realize until months ago that (as somebody else said) when an electric car/bike's electronics shut off -- you come to a stop; but when an EUC's electronics shut off -- you crash.

[Waulnut]

28 minutes ago, jmsjms said:

I don't know if it's been discussed: Would this T-4 wheel have the redundancy precautions that are being hyped and praised on the new Inmotion V-13. I think by now, the EUC industry should have this as one of the top priorities. I didn't even realize until months ago that (as somebody else said) when an electric car/bike's electronics shut off -- you come to a stop; but when an EUC's electronics shut off -- you crash.

Begode/Gotway and redundancy in the same sentence seems foreign.... 

[Funky]

54 minutes ago, jmsjms said:

I don't know if it's been discussed: Would this T-4 wheel have the redundancy precautions that are being hyped and praised on the new Inmotion V-13. I think by now, the EUC industry should have this as one of the top priorities. I didn't even realize until months ago that (as somebody else said) when an electric car/bike's electronics shut off -- you come to a stop; but when an EUC's electronics shut off -- you crash.

What does reDuNdANcY means? (Gotway engineers.)

 

It doesn't matter how safe you make the wheel - something still can go highwire and you will crash. Euc simply isn't safe in first place. And we the riders know that. And only thing i like in V-13 is the battery casings. (How they are made.) And real smart BMS. 

If i would buy new wheel. I would only look at wheels who has "real" smart BMS. (Maybe solid state batteries in future.) Because anything which doesn't have it, is simply old SHIT wheel at that point of time. As T4 is made the same as Master - both are shit wheels in my eyes.

Edited August 11, 2022 by Funky

[jmsjms]

11 minutes ago, Funky said:

What does reDuNdANcY means? (Gotway engineers.)

 

It doesn't matter how safe you make the wheel - something still can go highwire and you will crash. Euc simply isn't safe in first place. And we the riders know that. And only thing i like in V-13 is the battery casings. (How they are made.) And real smart BMS. 

If i would buy new wheel. i would only look at wheels who has "real" smart BMS. (Maybe solid state batteries in future.) Because anything which doesn't have it, is simply old SHIT wheel at that point of time. As T4 is made the same as Master - both are shit wheels in my eyes.

The engineer on the V-13 promo video explains what the redundancy is; my engineering understanding isn't good, but it's akin to extra safety features in the computer and wiring system in order to prevent cutout.

[techyiam]

On 8/11/2022 at 2:37 PM, jmsjms said:

The engineer on the V-13 promo video explains what the redundancy is; my engineering understanding isn't good, but it's akin to extra safety features in the computer and wiring system in order to prevent cutout.

I believe one redundancy has to do with duplicated sets hall sensors. Another one has to do with communication between the controller and each of the battery packs. There is a direct line and an indirect line of communication. If the direct channel fails, the controller can use the indirect channel. 

Edited August 13, 2022 by techyiam

[Esash]

1 hour ago, jmsjms said:

I don't know if it's been discussed: Would this T-4 wheel have the redundancy precautions that are being hyped and praised on the new Inmotion V-13. I think by now, the EUC industry should have this as one of the top priorities. I didn't even realize until months ago that (as somebody else said) when an electric car/bike's electronics shut off -- you come to a stop; but when an EUC's electronics shut off -- you crash.

I'll bet you (friendly) that the T-4 has better reliability and safety than the V_13.

InMotion has the worst safety/reliability record in recent years, and the T4 uses the most proven and refined technology in the EUC world.

The Begode 100 volt C30-C38 system is tried and true to an extreme degree.  

[techyiam]

33 minutes ago, Esash said:

I'll bet you (friendly) that the T-4 has better reliability and safety than the V_13.

You have to give Begode credit for their strategy when designing new wheels. They don't seem to do all new from the ground up designs.

For example, in their Hero, they kept their 100.8V motor drive system, and put that in their all new from the ground up, next generation suspended metal chassis. Then, they refined the Hero chassis for the EX20S, but still keeping the 100.8V motor drive system, but with a more powerful existing motor. Then came the Master with a chassis based on the EX20S, but with a new from the ground up 134.4V motor drive system. The motor is supposedly be their tried and true C38 motor. The controller, along with the battery packs are all new.

Their T4 is even more conservative. They basically mixed and matched existing parts (perhaps T3 motor,  RS-19 controller, and Master chassis), with some some enhancements. I think the only parts that are from a new design are the battery packs.

 

[meepmeepmayer]

The T4 has redundancy in that if one battery pack fails, the other half of the battery configuration should be able to continue its work unimpeded. But honestly, battery packs failing during riding isn't a thing that happens.

And the board is very proven and good (*knock on wood* unless Begode screw something up).

No worries there

[UtahRider]

On 8/11/2022 at 2:38 PM, jmsjms said:

I don't know if it's been discussed: Would this T-4 wheel have the redundancy precautions that are being hyped and praised on the new Inmotion V-13. I think by now, the EUC industry should have this as one of the top priorities. I didn't even realize until months ago that (as somebody else said) when an electric car/bike's electronics shut off -- you come to a stop; but when an EUC's electronics shut off -- you crash.

Hehehe, it’s made by Begode! But I’m going to get one.

Edited August 13, 2022 by UtahRider

[meepmeepmayer]

eevees lists the T4 at the same price as the EXN and V12 HT.

[wstuart]

I'm strongly considering getting this instead of the s22 for offroad riding.

 

I have 2 questions:

1.  Can I get a knobby for this thing

2.  What's the suspension travel/quality on this thing.  Better than s22? Better than master?

 

This wheel makes a lot of sense for the dusty tight single track mountain bike trails I rider.  I don't need some 20 inch 32 mph wheel for those, I just need something with alot of torque, that's light(ish) and maneuverable.  I rarely go over 20mph on these trails.  The proven Gotway 100v system is vary appealing for this, as I am already riding these trails with my MSP HT.  If I can get kmobby for this, I might just go for this instead of the s22

[Esash]

45 minutes ago, wstuart said:

I'm strongly considering getting this instead of the s22 for offroad riding.

 

I have 2 questions:

1.  Can I get a knobby for this thing

2.  What's the suspension travel/quality on this thing.  Better than s22? Better than master?

 

This wheel makes a lot of sense for the dusty tight single track mountain bike trails I rider.  I don't need some 20 inch 32 mph wheel for those, I just need something with alot of torque, that's light(ish) and maneuverable.  I rarely go over 20mph on these trails.  The proven Gotway 100v system is vary appealing for this, as I am already riding these trails with my MSP HT.  If I can get kmobby for this, I might just go for this instead of the s22

I vaguely remember that the suspension travel is longer than the master. I think 100 mm or something.

Knobby tire I'm not sure about, but my hunch is there's at least something aftermarket that will fit if they don't offer T4 with knobby option.

[EMA]

56 minutes ago, wstuart said:

2.  What's the suspension travel/quality on this thing.  Better than s22? Better than master?

the sliders design is the key feature of Begode right now, simply smooth, simple, solid with no stiction, same as master but it's 100mm (master is 80mm) 
 

[wstuart]

37 minutes ago, EMA said:

the sliders design is the key feature of Begode right now, simply smooth, simple, solid with no stiction, same as master but it's 100mm (master is 80mm) 
 

This is starting to look good!

My other concern is with stability of a 16 inch suspension wheel.  I own a 16x and man that thing is a handful at 25mph.  I'm worried that a 16x with high pedals and a high(er) center of gravity with by super squirely above 25mph.  

This isn't too much of an issue because I rarely go over 20mph when offroading, but a lack of stability may limit the usefulness of the wheel on the street.  

[Tawpie]

3 minutes ago, wstuart said:

I'm worried that a 16x with high pedals and a high(er) center of gravity with by super squirely above 25mph.

To me this is a legit concern, and depends on a lot of things especially when you introduce suspension as a variable. I haven't heard especially bad things about the V12 at 'speed', but based on my 16" experience I'd guess that in reality most folks keep it in the 25 mph range. Suspension should help a ton if its well executed and BGs suspension does seem road oriented so I would only expect it to be a good thing.

What is keeping me from cancelling my S22 is the potential fragility of the T4's top casting—I have no idea if they changed it from Master but Master cracks far too readily. And personally, I find Hero and its progeny to unattractive. Coyote ugly.

But otherwise, it may be the ideal wheel for what I like to do.

[EMA]

35 minutes ago, wstuart said:

This is starting to look good!

My other concern is with stability of a 16 inch suspension wheel.  I own a 16x and man that thing is a handful at 25mph.  I'm worried that a 16x with high pedals and a high(er) center of gravity with by super squirely above 25mph.  

This isn't too much of an issue because I rarely go over 20mph when offroading, but a lack of stability may limit the usefulness of the wheel on the street.  

that's true but it's something you get used to , the suspension help a bit in that scenario 

[wstuart]

1 hour ago, Tawpie said:

To me this is a legit concern, and depends on a lot of things especially when you introduce suspension as a variable. I haven't heard especially bad things about the V12 at 'speed', but based on my 16" experience I'd guess that in reality most folks keep it in the 25 mph range. Suspension should help a ton if its well executed and BGs suspension does seem road oriented so I would only expect it to be a good thing.

What is keeping me from cancelling my S22 is the potential fragility of the T4's top casting—I have no idea if they changed it from Master but Master cracks far too readily. And personally, I find Hero and its progeny to unattractive. Coyote ugly.

But otherwise, it may be the ideal wheel for what I like to do.

I agree.  The fragility has me concerned too.  I was hoping that Clark would do the same thing they did with the master and allow me to cough up an extra $400 so I can wrap this thing in their 3d printed goodness.  Do you think that would solve the fragility issue?  Did the Clark stuff solve it for the master?  

 

[Tawpie]

7 minutes ago, wstuart said:

I was hoping that Clark would do the same thing they did with the master

I'm certain they will... don't all BG wheels have a raft of "build your own shell cuz the OG one isn't sufficient" parts? Part of the BG aura—customization. Personalization!

And yes, I do believe there will be a third party solution that adequately reduces the risk of breakage to an acceptable level. When and at what cost is another question!

Edited August 14, 2022 by Tawpie

[UtahRider]

13 hours ago, wstuart said:

This is starting to look good!

My other concern is with stability of a 16 inch suspension wheel.  I own a 16x and man that thing is a handful at 25mph.  I'm worried that a 16x with high pedals and a high(er) center of gravity with by super squirely above 25mph.  

This isn't too much of an issue because I rarely go over 20mph when offroading, but a lack of stability may limit the usefulness of the wheel on the street.  

I’m considering the T4 for off-road riding primarily, almost strictly because of its wheel size and will only buy thru EWheels to get their 40T packs. My Molicel RST is a capable trail wheel but I need suspension and yes, it’s a Begode so I’ll consider it “fragile” and hope Clark’s makes the fairings/seat combo to wrap it.

[daniel1234]

I sold mine modded master and preorder T4 -> it is hard to take master daily upstairs ! 

 

I have same plan, make aluminum rollcage and replace shock for 750lb spring. Lets be honest riding 70 km/h+ is thrilling but illegal even in cars  in most of parts in my city

[techyiam]

2 minutes ago, daniel1234 said:

I sold mine modded master and preorder T4 -> it is hard to take master daily upstairs ! 

 

I have same plan, make aluminum rollcage and replace shock for 750lb spring. Lets be honest riding 70 km/h+ is thrilling but illegal even in cars  in most of parts in my city

What about headroom?  Do you have to tackle hills while traveling at 50+ km/h? How about acceleration at higher speeds? The T4 only has a 2500W motor, while the Master has a 3500W motor. Having said that, at the end of the day, it is still about matching wheels to your use case.

But somehow, I get the vibe that behind the veil of practical rationalization, your addiction is really what is driving your desire to buy the next new wheel. By Christmas,you will be telling us that you have sold your modded T4, and got a V13 + a Master Pro. 🙂

[EMA]

the master is absolutely insane as a commuter, unbeatable 

[daniel1234]

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

What about headroom?  Do you have to tackle hills while traveling at 50+ km/h? How about acceleration at higher speeds? The T4 only has a 2500W motor, while the Master has a 3500W motor. Having said that, at the end of the day, it is still about matching wheels to your use case.

But somehow, I get the vibe that behind the veil of practical rationalization, your addiction is really what is driving your desire to buy the next new wheel. By Christmas,you will be telling us that you have sold your modded T4, and got a V13 + a Master Pro. 🙂

I rarely exceed 2500 w - if I behave like reasonable person on master and ride within big city speed limits(master goes to 9 kw+ according EUC world magic numbers if you go to 90 percent PWM.) . If they use verified motor from nikola + frame from master + MCU/esc from rs19 it should be fine. I seriously hope it will be nikola-rs19 hybrid with suspension. Master is too stupidly powerful and there are just 2 usable ride modes - it is hard to ride on sidewalks between people. 

Yeah, most likely I will play with T4 and resell it modded suspension same like master.   It is fun to try different wheels, play with them - do some maintenance and observe current state of this technology. 2 year ago this technology was immature and now it is kinda safer, fun and practically usable. 

[meepmeepmayer]

Guys, please remember these motor power numbers mean nothing. It's some strange amalgamation of the motor build and the board/battery capabilities. The exact same motor gets different numbers depending on the wheel. Best to ignore them.

[EMA]

2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Guys, please remember these motor power numbers mean nothing. It's some strange amalgamation of the motor build and the board/battery capabilities. The exact same motor gets different numbers depending on the wheel. Best to ignore them.

according to my wrong EUC data i have the most powerfull motor on the planet, can easy peak at 20kw