Rehab1 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Unventor said: As far as I understand it is supposed to transfer away from impact zone. Thanks. That sounds logical but the actual diameter of the material is so small that the impact zone would be limited. I can envision myself falling and the only thing racing through my head is: “I must contact the impact zone” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 7 minutes ago, Rehab1 said: Thanks. That sounds logical but the actual diameter of the material is so small that the impact zone would be limited. I can envision myself falling and the only thing racing through my head is: “I must contact the impact zone” Bulls eye center on a dart board is small too 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Just now, Unventor said: Bulls eye center on a dart board is small too 😉 And I never hit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 7 hours ago, Marty Backe said: this part of my arm Might be where the hard edge of your helmet smashed into the muscle of your upper arm. (with your out stretched arm on landing) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingfelder Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 4 hours ago, Marty Backe said: No, the primary impact was on the upper inside of my arm (who knows how). That caused the bruising. The impact traveled further up my arm and into my shoulder where all the pain is. There's zero pain in the bruised area. I've read that impacts can work like bullets, doing more disruption further in than they do in the small area they hit immediately. The example of a small hole in the chest from a bullet wound and a bigger exit wound with lots of tissue damage in the back, comes to mind. (disregarding things like the bullet smashing or spinning or splitting into fragments) Some martial artists can transfer force the same way, hitting a stack of bricks and deciding which one to break -- top, middle, or bottom. I used to do that myself. So you may not have weirdly taken that impact primarily on the inner arm (it sounds like you thought it was weird), but just had the force transferred there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 hours ago, Marty Backe said: I really want the thick padding in the shoulders, arms, and ribs. The Demon X2 provides that. Help me understand this. @Rehab1 damaged his shoulder from shock transfer up his arm. You think you did something similar, and yet there is this constant thread of shoulder padding. I've face planted more times than I care to remember, but I've never hit my shoulder directly on anything. So between the three of us that's about 20 face plants and no shoulder contact. What am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 7 minutes ago, Smoother said: Help me understand this. @Rehab1 damaged his shoulder from shock transfer up his arm. You think you did something similar, and yet there is this constant thread of shoulder padding. I've face planted more times than I care to remember, but I've never hit my shoulder directly on anything. So between the three of us that's about 20 face plants and no shoulder contact. What am I missing? Although everything happened very fast, I can tell you that I landed on my side. Can't speak to @Rehab1's theory, but I believe my trauma was caused by a direct impact to my shoulder, not some indirect transfer from my hand or such. The Demon gear that I'm getting has padding on the shoulder and padding over the area that is currently bruised. I can't prevent all injuries, but if I have a helmet, wrist guards, and body armor, my odds of escaping a repeat injury seem pretty good to me. Try not to make me too paranoid about ever riding again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elder Meat Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 17 minutes ago, Dingfelder said: The example of a small hole in the chest from a bullet wound and a bigger exit wound with lots of tissue damage in the back, comes to mind. This is totally off topic, but what you describe is caused either by an expanding hollow point bullet or bullet tumble (in the case of relatively long, skinny rifle bullets). Not related at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 10 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Although everything happened very fast, I can tell you that I landed on my side. Can't speak to @Rehab1's theory, but I believe my trauma was caused by a direct impact to my shoulder, not some indirect transfer from my hand or such. The Demon gear that I'm getting has padding on the shoulder and padding over the area that is currently bruised. I can't prevent all injuries, but if I have a helmet, wrist guards, and body armor, my odds of escaping a repeat injury seem pretty good to me. Try not to make me too paranoid about ever riding again Is there a bruise on your shoulder? What ripped the puck off your right wrist guard? FYI I don't see any reason not to get all protected up, no argument there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 55 minutes ago, Smoother said: Help me understand this. @Rehab1 damaged his shoulder from shock transfer up his arm. 42 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Although everything happened very fast, I can tell you that I landed on my side. Can't speak to @Rehab1's theory, but I believe my trauma was caused by a direct impact to my shoulder, not some indirect transfer from my hand or such. On my accident my left elbow did hit first. The blunt force impact transferred the forces up the humeral shaft to the head shattering it. If Marty hit his elbow first then there should be some trauma in that region. I agree he probably landed on his shoulder. Best he didn’t follow my lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 45 minutes ago, Smoother said: Is there a bruise on your shoulder? What ripped the puck off your right wrist guard? FYI I don't see any reason not to get all protected up, no argument there. The puck on the Flexmeter actually ripped off a year or so ago. And not by an accident, but I think it got caught on something and pulled off the wristguard. I noticed it missing one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 12 minutes ago, Rehab1 said: On my accident my left elbow did hit first. The blunt force impact transferred the forces up the humeral shaft to the head shattering it. If Marty hit his elbow first then there should be some trauma in that region. I agree he probably landed on his shoulder. Best he didn’t follow my lead. Although my elbow was bloody, it was from road rash. There's no bruising or bump on my elbow. Dan, just to put a nice bow on what may have happened to me, was your elbow bruised/banged up? Was your shoulder area bruised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 @Marty Backe Emergency care is available 24 hours a day, seven days a week at: Downey Medical Center 9333 Imperial Highway Downey, CA 90242 562-657-9000 24 hours, 7 days a week 'Good luck' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 12 minutes ago, Bob Eisenman said: @Marty Backe Emergency care is available 24 hours a day, seven days a week at: Downey Medical Center 9333 Imperial Highway Downey, CA 90242 562-657-9000 24 hours, 7 days a week 'Good luck' Funny. Of course there's 24-hour care everywhere around me. But it's not free is it? And I'm not indigent. I just don't want to spend my required $3k deductible unless I really have to. So I don't visit the doctor or ER at the drop of a hat. So far my injuries are trending in a favorable direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingfelder Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 hours ago, Elder Meat said: This is totally off topic, but what you describe is caused either by an expanding hollow point bullet or bullet tumble (in the case of relatively long, skinny rifle bullets). Not related at all. Nope, as I said, not entirely true and at any rate not relevant in this case. The example I provided of force transferring through bricks illustrates that the force to break one can go through others, leaving them intact. Similarly, force adequate to cause deeper wounds doesn't necessarily do so. It depends how it is delivered. Somewhat similarly, force can be transferred in a judo fall to either less vulnerable points or more vulnerable points. Injury isn't always greatest at point of impact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 4 hours ago, Marty Backe said: I don't visit the doctor or ER at the drop of a hat. Aside from a general evaluation (BP, etc) they'll likely want to x-rays (depending on their evaluation...anywhere from the hand , the elbow or up to the contusion / shoulder). Within an hour or so (after being interpreted) make an evaluation and perhaps schedule and MRI (magnetic resonance image) and a follow up exam. It seems 'tacky' but you could call them ( in advance) and discuss your insurance/deductible position with them before committing to anything further. If comfortable maybe discuss the incident/injury. 3k flat rate deductible before the insurance covers something seems harsh and anti-patient treatment but I'm just guessing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 That’s quite a nasty looking contusion. Not gonna touch that one with Photoshop. Just yet. You know best, of course, but maybe a preliminary MD check of the area for a few hundred bucks might be a wise choice. It likely can be difficult to make a comprehensive, conclusive diagnosis without xrays, but maybe they don’t need to take it all the way to the MRI step. I’m no MD (although I sometimes play one online ), but likely MRI’s aren’t always required in every case. Maybe @Mono can comment / advise further? In my case I had no swelling or bruising, but some spots around my shoulder were tender. I couldn’t sleep on my left side, push up from sitting on the floor, or do much reaching around or up to wash hair or back that well. I gave it a few weeks, but even still I was about to go get it checked over. It ended up getting better after many months, but I did see a physiotherapist which helped a bit also. But do you remember @The Fat Unicyclist‘s elbow injury? He didn’t feel much pain either, but it ended up differently than he thought... let me find that thread... In any case, don’t mean to keep giving unsolicited advice as I’m sure you know yourself best. Just gotta make sure my star client can still provide my 10% royalty cheques which for some reason seem to be delayed. Most likely due to the recent Canada Post strike I’m guessing? Hello? Marty? Marty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 6 hours ago, Marty Backe said:Although my elbow was bloody, it was from road rash. There's no bruising or bump on my elbow. Dan, just to put a nice bow on what may have happened to me, was your elbow bruised/banged up? Was your shoulder area bruised? My bruising started around the bicep area and eventually worked it’s way up to the shoulder. Yes my elbow was banged up. I wish you would go see a doctor just for piece of mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrikandersCW Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 7 hours ago, Rehab1 said: On my accident my left elbow did hit first. The blunt force impact transferred the forces up the humeral shaft to the head shattering it. If Marty hit his elbow first then there should be some trauma in that region. I agree he probably landed on his shoulder. Best he didn’t follow my lead. That's what happen with my right shoulder. Hard impact on albove. Chartered round bone in shoulder. Didn't get any odd colors on my arm, and i just couldn't move my arm up in front movement. Got a x-ray that showed that the round bone, had been chattered, but had grown back together again, by itself. I made some exercise with my arm, so i didn't get a frozen shoulder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 How much pain was there @Rehab1? When you palpated the shoulder area was it quite tender to pressure? Did you experience any symptoms of shock riding home, or did you have to call an ambulance? I can’t remember exactly. Did you know right away that something was broken? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: How much pain was there @Rehab1? When you palpated the shoulder area was it quite tender to pressure? Did you experience any symptoms of shock riding home, or did you have to call an ambulance? I can’t remember exactly. Did you know right away that something was broken? I must have been in shock as the pain was minimal. I was directly across from Toledo Hospital but decided to ride the ACM back to my truck and drive home instead. I was in denial that I broke anything. My wife then drove me to urgent care, xray ...still couldn’t believe it. I greatly appreciate all of the questions but being this is Marty’s thread I think we should focus on his injury until he is out of the woods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanzen Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 4 hours ago, Bob Eisenman said: Aside from a general evaluation (BP, etc) they'll likely want to x-rays (depending on their evaluation...anywhere from the hand , the elbow or up to the contusion / shoulder). Within an hour or so (after being interpreted) make an evaluation and perhaps schedule and MRI (magnetic resonance image) and a follow up exam. It seems 'tacky' but you could call them ( in advance) and discuss your insurance/deductible position with them before committing to anything further. If comfortable maybe discuss the incident/injury. 3k flat rate deductible before the insurance covers something seems harsh and anti-patient treatment but I'm just guessing. From France this is sureal In our "socialist" country as some (few ?) americains wrongly like to aprehend it, if I had Marty's accident, here is what would have happened : If in too much pain and worry I decided to see my generalist, thanks to what we call "universal coverage" from social security it would have costed me like 3 bucks. If in doubt my generalist had sent me to some Xray or MRI it would have costed me like 20$. If then in case I had needed a surgery, whatever the extent or the time I would have to spent at the hospital it would have costed me no more than 100$. And if after I had been in need of some physical training and reeducatiion with a therapist whatever the length of that therapy it would have costed me close to nothing ... GOOD luck with everything Marty, and the best will still be you needed absolutely no medical attention free or not ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 48 minutes ago, Vanzen said: From France this is sureal In our "socialist" country as some (few ?) americains wrongly like to aprehend it, if I had Marty's accident, here is what would have happened : If in too much pain and worry I decided to see my generalist, thanks to what we call "universal coverage" from social security it would have costed me like 3 bucks. If in doubt my generalist had sent me to some Xray or MRI it would have costed me like 20$. If then in case I had needed a surgery, whatever the extent or the time I would have to spent at the hospital it would have costed me no more than 100$. And if after I had been in need of some physical training and reeducatiion with a therapist whatever the length of that therapy it would have costed me close to nothing ... GOOD luck with everything Marty, and the best will still be you needed absolutely no medical attention free or not ! Don't start the medical cost discussion again. The yanks are fiercely proud of their system. FYI. I find YOUR costs shockingly high. The most that accident would cost here in the UK is £8.40 per month per prescription medication. ZERO for everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 36 minutes ago, Smoother said: Don't start the medical cost discussion again. The yanks are fiercely proud of their system. FYI. I find YOUR costs shockingly high. The most that accident would cost hereini the UK is £8.40 per month per prescription medication. ZERO for everything else. Hope we don't get to use it 😀 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Smoother said: Don't start the medical cost discussion again. The yanks are fiercely proud of their system. FYI. I find YOUR costs shockingly high. The most that accident would cost here in the UK is £8.40 per month per prescription medication. ZERO for everything else. Despite what some people inside the UKsay/think, I can tell you it is the best service and friendly people I met. I lived in Nottingham for 3 years and have nothing but praise for the service they provided. It beats both Danish and Swedish healthcare by miles. Especially when you need to say hello to e.a. aka after an accident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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