Extremebull Commander Pro (134.4v,3600wh,suspension)

[BKW]

I'm half-tempted to wait a few more months and see what the future batches will be like and I might just purchase it because I'm simply not as excited about any other wheel still. The Sherman-S is a great wheel but I already have the SherMax, and a 100volt. I've said all this before, but next wheel I buy will be the last one I get for a long time so I'm looking for something almost identical to the Commander-Pro (minus the crappy parts). It simply fits most of what I'm looking for... yeah, I think I'm going to wait it out a few more months or so and see what happens with all these new wheels

[techyiam]

I am now curious as to how peppy the Sherman-S 16" going to be with a 16" wheel, and 126V.

I am hoping that it would be as peppy as the Commander Pro, perhaps with a lower top speed, but with Sherman-S build quality.

2220Wh battery would be enough range for me.

That is the other angle I am looking at.

[Paradox]

5 hours ago, BKW said:

I'm half-tempted to wait a few more months and see what the future batches will be like

The problem might be that if you wait a few months and the CP does not sell well you may be buying a first batch wheel even months from now.

A reputable seller would know which batch wheel you're buying.

[BKW]

53 minutes ago, Paradox said:

The problem might be that if you wait a few months and the CP does not sell well you may be buying a first batch wheel even months from now.

A wheel that doesn't sell would be harder to get parts for, you think?

[Paradox]

11 minutes ago, BKW said:

A wheel that doesn't sell would be harder to get parts for, you think?

Begode seems likely to abandon a wheel if it has poor sales so spare parts might be hard to find later.  Another issue that affects Begode wheels is when they update the model with newer parts time and time again.  When and if you need a spare part you have to make sure it will work with your version of the wheel.

[DragonFZ]

7 hours ago, BKW said:

I'm half-tempted to wait a few more months and see what the future batches will be like and I might just purchase it because I'm simply not as excited about any other wheel still. The Sherman-S is a great wheel but I already have the SherMax, and a 100volt. I've said all this before, but next wheel I buy will be the last one I get for a long time so I'm looking for something almost identical to the Commander-Pro (minus the crappy parts). It simply fits most of what I'm looking for... yeah, I think I'm going to wait it out a few more months or so and see what happens with all these new wheels

Yeah... I agree, waiting is the best option. Both the Sherman S and CPro new implementation of suspension are still untested for the long term. EX30 has good reviews so far and might be an improved version of all the shortcomings of All Begode wheels. Better linkage, battery casing and put together well (according to Eevee's teardown video).

[BKW]

36 minutes ago, DragonFZ said:

Yeah... I agree, waiting is the best option. Both the Sherman S and CPro new implementation of suspension are still untested for the long term. EX30 has good reviews so far and might be an improved version of all the shortcomings of All Begode wheels. Better linkage, battery casing and put together well (according to Eevee's teardown video).

I hear you. I'm just not that interested in the EX30 for some reason (likely because I plan on using my next EUC for a special use case). I'll probably end up getting the Sherman-S over the EX30 if it came down to it. There is no denying there was thought  put into the "quality" production of the EX30

Edited February 9, 2023 by BKW

[The Brahan Seer]

8 hours ago, BKW said:

I'm half-tempted to wait a few more months and see what the future batches will be like and I might just purchase it because I'm simply not as excited about any other wheel still. The Sherman-S is a great wheel but I already have the SherMax, and a 100volt. I've said all this before, but next wheel I buy will be the last one I get for a long time so I'm looking for something almost identical to the Commander-Pro (minus the crappy parts). It simply fits most of what I'm looking for... yeah, I think I'm going to wait it out a few more months or so and see what happens with all these new wheels

This is pretty much my thinking too. Although I don't think the CP design is an after thought at all. I think the person who designed it just didn't get enough time to do a better job. All or many of the issues may be fixed now if they are smart. A connector for the back light wire and seal for the motor. Would we be able to source one and install it ourselves if need be?

3 hours ago, Paradox said:

The problem might be that if you wait a few months and the CP does not sell well you may be buying a first batch wheel even months from now.

A reputable seller would know which batch wheel you're buying.

This is a very good point, if it doesn't sell well the price will change but the updates might need doing. 

 

2 hours ago, BKW said:

A wheel that doesn't sell would be harder to get parts for, you think?

This is very valid as well. Hopefully as they use shared parts with Begode (that seem fairly inter-changeable) this might actually be a positive. One down side I see with the V13, Sherman is the rather specialist and expensive parts used on their wheels.  Higher quality for sure but higher costs to fix and we can't get insurance yet. 

2 hours ago, Paradox said:

Another issue that affects Begode wheels is when they update the model with newer parts time and time again.  When and if you need a spare part you have to make sure it will work with your version of the wheel.

Yes true. They do need to stop doing this. It can't make much financial sense for them either. Plus it looks very unprofessional.

[BKW]

1 hour ago, The Brahan Seer said:

One down side I see with the V13, Sherman is the rather specialist and expensive parts used on their wheels.  Higher quality for sure but higher costs to fix and we can't get insurance yet.

This hasn't stopped begode from selling their machines/parts at the same price or higher regardless of quality. It'll likely be the same price for begode parts as other EUC company parts. But I kind of see your point because the V13 likely has more complex things to work on; more specialized.

On a side note: buying the Sherman-S will almost certainly come with pedal upgrades because the pedals suck, so you're throwing another 300 dollars at a 4K wheel automatically -- and yes, the special hanger/foot plates are likely more premium to fix/replace. However, I think I heard somewhere LeaperKim plans on fixing/replacing the crappy Sherman-S pedals in future batches?

Considering the quality issues of the Commander Pro and the possibility of Sherman-S upgrading their pedals in future batches, it might be best to wait for future batches for all these wheels anyway. Who knows how the EX30 will fair after a month or two? Everything points to "waiting" as the best bet imo unless someone has a better option/view to give?

Edited February 9, 2023 by BKW

[GHOSTTE]

1 hour ago, BKW said:

On a side note: buying the Sherman-S will almost certainly come with pedal upgrades because the pedals suck, so you're throwing another 300 dollars at a 4K wheel automatically -- and yes, the special hanger/foot plates are likely more premium to fix/replace. However, I think I heard somewhere LeaperKim plans on fixing/replacing the crappy Sherman-S pedals in future batches?

Yup, the Sherman S definitely needs aftermarket pedals because the stock ones suck. At least the CP and Begode wheels come with decent stock pedals. From everything coming out on the EX30, I'd venture that even the first batch will be decent compared to other wheels (on pre-order here so eating my own words)

[BKW]

I re-watched Marty's assembly video and took some notes. I'm still looking over this wheel and wanted to watch it again, and here are the notes I took:

1. If you look at the motor wire that goes up the side, how easy would that be to tear/shear if something got caught in the wheel? It’s literally exposed freely to penetration by outside elements if anything goes into the wheel. @13:12 After looking at it from this angle @18:28, I think the wire is somewhat protected by the battery housings on either side of the wire, but it’s still exposed to possible sheering I think, especially if something gets caught in the spokes of the wheel.

2. If you look at the speakers, I personally think they designed the “chassis” first with the speaker placement in mind, then they found out the Sherman-S was going to have magnesium shelling and so they scrambled to do one as well without really addressing how it blocks the speakers (signs of rushing production). This is all assumption on my part, but, really, WHY would you block the speakers like that? This reeks of “afterthought” and/or a rushed product that ran out of time. @14:17

3. The rear taillight is a disaster of both waterproofing as well as soldering-job. Looking at it in this video is insulting to me they’d just leave it like that, especially knowing you have to take the taillight off to gain access to the motherboard. @17:22

4. What kind of tape is that on the charging board? Why would they just leave that there? @15:48

5. I personally like the trolley handle, but I don’t like the area that can collect water, but I’m also naively optimistic about this section as far as allowing water away from the electronics inside. BUT, I have to admit, it’s just not smart to allow a way water to collect and then literally go through the electronic housing section – this section should be the LAST place you want water to drain through! As I set here and think I have an idea that could channel the water away from the electrical housing, so even a birdbrain like me can think of better ways, and these guys are designers and engineers! @15:57

6. I can’t say much about the exposure of the suspension at the bottom. I’m not too knowledgeable about what this may cause or not cause, but they are very exposed. Personally, I’m not worried about the exposure of the suspension. @18:44

7. Once again, the motor cable is exposed to anything that may get caught up in the wheel @19:35

8. The display is supposedly crap in the daylight, and it needs some type of shaded film on it to discern the numbers in the daylight.

9. Nothing major, but of course the mud guard on the back is just more evidence that they aren’t putting much thought or concern into it by giving you wrong screws, wrong hole sizes, etc. For a 4K wheel, this is another thing that adds to the “Insult-o-meter”.

10. More evidence that this may have been a rushed product is the holes on the front and back bumper sections of the wheel. On the Mten4, Begode also left holes on the back portion; later we find out you will need to buy a 60 dollar trolley handle to make use of these holes they left behind. It is my assumption they will do the same with the Commander Pro, where you will need to buy parts to add to the front and back of the wheel for an extra fee – additional fees on top of a 4K wheel.

11. Charge ports? More evidence of a rushed product, but also insulting considering how this can supposedly blow your charger or your wheel if mistakenly use the wrong plug, etc. Begode has said they will fix this on the next batch, but this doesn’t instill confidence that they willfully allowed this to be for the world to see and criticize in the first place – rushed product pressure, or some other negative reason.

12. Once again, not much to say on the suspension. There hasn’t been much learned about it beyond feel.

13. The “onetime usage” padding doesn’t concern me. Easy fix with Velcro.

14. Overall, even though I really wanted this wheel to succeed, so many negatives here.

 

[BKW]

8 minutes ago, BKW said:

I re-watched Marty's assembly video and took some notes. I'm still looking over this wheel and wanted to watch it again, and here are the notes I took:

1. If you look at the motor wire that goes up the side, how easy would that be to tear/shear if something got caught in the wheel? It’s literally exposed freely to penetration by outside elements if anything goes into the wheel. @13:12 After looking at it from this angle @18:28, I think the wire is somewhat protected by the battery housings on either side of the wire, but it’s still exposed to possible sheering I think, especially if something gets caught in the spokes of the wheel.

    

2. If you look at the speakers, I personally think they designed the “chassis” first with the speaker placement in mind, then they found out the Sherman-S was going to have magnesium shelling and so they scrambled to do one as well without really addressing how it blocks the speakers (signs of rushing production). This is all assumption on my part, but, really, WHY would you block the speakers like that? This reeks of “afterthought” and/or a rushed product that ran out of time. @14:17

    

3. The rear taillight is a disaster of both waterproofing as well as soldering-job. Looking at it in this video is insulting to me they’d just leave it like that, especially knowing you have to take the taillight off to gain access to the motherboard. @17:22

    

4. What kind of tape is that on the charging board? Why would they just leave that there? @15:48

    

5. I personally like the trolley handle, but I don’t like the area that can collect water, but I’m also naively optimistic about this section as far as allowing water away from the electronics inside. BUT, I have to admit, it’s just not smart to allow a way water to collect and then literally go through the electronic housing section – this section should be the LAST place you want water to drain through! As I set here and think I have an idea that could channel the water away from the electrical housing, so even a birdbrain like me can think of better ways, and these guys are designers and engineers! @15:57

    

6. I can’t say much about the exposure of the suspension at the bottom. I’m not too knowledgeable about what this may cause or not cause, but they are very exposed. Personally, I’m not worried about the exposure of the suspension. @18:44

    

7. Once again, the motor cable is exposed to anything that may get caught up in the wheel @19:35

    

8. The display is supposedly crap in the daylight, and it needs some type of shaded film on it to discern the numbers in the daylight.

    

9. Nothing major, but of course the mud guard on the back is just more evidence that they aren’t putting much thought or concern into it by giving you wrong screws, wrong hole sizes, etc. For a 4K wheel, this is another thing that adds to the “Insult-o-meter”.

    

10. More evidence that this may have been a rushed product is the holes on the front and back bumper sections of the wheel. On the Mten4, Begode also left holes on the back portion; later we find out you will need to buy a 60 dollar trolley handle to make use of these holes they left behind. It is my assumption they will do the same with the Commander Pro, where you will need to buy parts to add to the front and back of the wheel for an extra fee – additional fees on top of a 4K wheel.

     

11. Charge ports? More evidence of a rushed product, but also insulting considering how this can supposedly blow your charger or your wheel if mistakenly use the wrong plug, etc. Begode has said they will fix this on the next batch, but this doesn’t instill confidence that they willfully allowed this to be for the world to see and criticize in the first place – rushed product pressure, or some other negative reason.

     

12. Once again, not much to say on the suspension. There hasn’t been much learned about it beyond feel.

     

13. The “onetime usage” padding doesn’t concern me. Easy fix with Velcro.

     

14. Overall, even though I really wanted this wheel to succeed, so many negatives here.

 

 

 

For all these reasons, unless the next batch shows signs of major improvement, I think there is just too much to fix for Begode to address with this wheel. I hope I'm wrong, but there seems too much to address here if quality is your concern

Edited February 10, 2023 by BKW

[techyiam]

52 minutes ago, BKW said:

If you look at the motor wire that goes up the side, how easy would that be to tear/shear if something got caught in the wheel? It’s literally exposed freely to penetration by outside elements if anything goes into the wheel. @13:12 After looking at it from this angle @18:28, I think the wire is somewhat protected by the battery housings on either side of the wire, but it’s still exposed to possible sheering I think, especially if something gets caught in the spokes of the wheel.

Disagreed. I went to rewatch EEVEES teardown video, and it showed the motor cable bundle going up the suspension leg fit inside the center tunnel of the battery pack. I believe the clearance between the wheel and the inboard side of the battery packs is not much. There isn't going to be much debris that can fit through.

When I see one in person, I can better evaluate it. Right now, it is not apparent to me there is an issue.

57 minutes ago, BKW said:

The rear taillight is a disaster of both waterproofing as well as soldering-job. Looking at it in this video is insulting to me they’d just leave it like that, especially knowing you have to take the taillight off to gain access to the motherboard. @17:22

Simple fix. I would use GOOP to seal the whole board. It needs a quick-disconnect wire connector though.

1 hour ago, BKW said:

I personally like the trolley handle, but I don’t like the area that can collect water, but I’m also naively optimistic about this section as far as allowing water away from the electronics inside. BUT, I have to admit, it’s just not smart to allow a way water to collect and then literally go through the electronic housing section – this section should be the LAST place you want water to drain through! As I set here and think I have an idea that could channel the water away from the electrical housing, so even a birdbrain like me can think of better ways, and these guys are designers and engineers!

Not seeing the difficulty in waterproofing this on my own.

1 hour ago, BKW said:

The display is supposedly crap in the daylight, and it needs some type of shaded film on it to discern the numbers in the daylight.

Same display on the T3 and other Begode wheels. I don't mind it. It does the job for me. Around here, if it is not raining, it is be overcast. 

 

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, BKW said:

For all these reasons, unless the next batch shows signs of major improvement, I think there is just too much to fix for Begode to address with this wheel. I hope I'm wrong, but there seems too much to address here if quality is your concern

For me, I find it difficult to access quality without seeing it in person. 

I was surprised how premium and refined the V13 was in person, for example.  The videos don't do it justice. 

In person, one can really tell the lesser quality of the Master Pro, in comparison side-by-side.

 

[The Brahan Seer]

2 hours ago, BKW said:

This reeks of “afterthought”

Yes I agree. I stand corrected! This certainly was a knee jerk reaction to the Sherman S rather than a planned decision.

 

2 hours ago, BKW said:

if something got caught in the wheel?

Probably the least of our worries if this happened though.

 

Certainly the wheel isn't worth what they are asking but it is worth $2500. I won't be buying this wheel unfortunately

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

For me, I find it difficult to access quality without seeing it in person. 

Yes its very tough to guess. We rely so much on the opinion of others unfortunately

[techyiam]

Here is a positive data point from someone on Facebook. I don't how she managed to get to ride both a Commander Pro and the EX30 already. 

Quote

Anna Baranova

Top contributor

I still prefer Commander Pro riding over this Ex30. Commander is more nimble and for me has more torque.

What a pity this wheel is not finished yet. Have to wait.

Quote

Justin Ellis-Johnson

Author

Top contributor

Anna Baranova what do you mean the commander pro has more torque? Have you actually tried the ex30 yourself? The c40 motor in the ex30 should have way more torque than the commander pro.. the c40 motor is known to be both a high torque and high speed motor combined.. the low battery position of the ex30 makes it more nimble/ carveable compared to eg. A master or master pro which are more top heavy

Quote

Anna Baranova

Top contributor

Justin Ellis-Johnson I tried both myself. Yes.

I feel commander easier to go from still staying. Maybe torque is not the right definition though. Didn't try them on mountains like our Chinese friends

 

Quote

Anna Baranova

Top contributor

Justin Ellis-Johnson it's simple. I'm 57 kg and commander feels like a bigger 16X to me. I push a bit or goes. I want to turn it turns. Nimble and light feeling when riding.

Ex30 is anvil on my feet...

Quote

Anna Baranova

Top contributor

And the suspension on CP is waaaay better...

Quote

Doug Hnut

Top contributor

Anna Baranova ive also tried both the CP and EX30. i understand how CP feels easier to accelerate. the pedals are softer than the EX30, both in hard mode. this makes it much easier to go, especially for a light rider like yourself. and yes, out of the box, the CP suspension feels much better.

 

[Rawnei]

LOL what's up with that motor cable just levitating there in the air next to motor cover and tire. 😂😂😂

[techyiam]

It sounding more like the EX30 is an updated EX20S, which feels like an anvil. 

The all new, from the ground up chassis of the Commander Pro appears to be showcasing Begode's next generation suspension design. Or, is it truly Extreme Bull's own design, and Begode is not privy to it.

It is still early yet, but based on reports we have been getting from the wild, the hydraulic suspensions of the Sherman-S and Commander Pro are being praised to being class leading suspensions. Each leg of the suspension is all in one sealed unit lubricated in oil.

Edited February 10, 2023 by techyiam

[GHOSTTE]

4 hours ago, techyiam said:

Here is a positive data point from someone on Facebook. I don't how she managed to get to ride both a Commander Pro and the EX30 already. 

 

 

Interesting perspective, I hope more people can weigh in like this.

My thoughts, considering how light she is (~125 lbs) it's possible the Commander Pro feels like it "goes" is because it likely has a higher center of gravity over the EX30 due to the battery placement. Because Anna so light, the CP's higher center of gravity would help contribute to leaning forward for her compared to the EX30 making the wheel "go". She comments on this in her last comment:

4 hours ago, techyiam said:

this makes it much easier to go, especially for a light rider like yourself.

I'm willing to bet if it were a male testing the two wheels it would be a different opinion given men generally have more weight and higher centers of gravity than women. Hope we can get more input on this though.

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, GHOSTTE said:

I'm willing to bet if it were a male testing the two wheels it would be a different opinion given men generally have more weight and higher centers of gravity than women. Hope we can get more input on this though.

Although it is possible, Dawn got the Knight Riders to go up and down a parking lot and asked for their very raw first impressions of the Commander Pro that she brought there. I recall the consensus was that the Commander Pro was quick like the Master, and didn't take that much effort to go.

@Clem604 should be testing one soon. And the Youtuber reviews should be coming out soon too

It will be interesting if true.

[BKW]

12 hours ago, techyiam said:

• Disagreed. I went to rewatch EEVEES teardown video, and it showed the motor cable bundle going up the suspension leg fit inside the center tunnel of the battery pack. I believe the clearance between the wheel and the inboard side of the battery packs is not much. There isn't going to be much debris that can fit through.
• Simple fix. I would use GOOP to seal the whole board. It needs a quick-disconnect wire connector though.
• Not seeing the difficulty in waterproofing this on my own.

 

I hope you're right. Would be curious to see how all this waterproofing would actually happen.

[BKW]

Marty facebook post about mileage on commander pro ( https://www.facebook.com/groups/ElectricUnicycle/permalink/5882800091817905/  ):

Edited February 10, 2023 by BKW

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

On 2/10/2023 at 8:06 AM, BKW said:

and these guys are designers and engineers!

I doubt that very much.

Have you seen their bachelor's or master's degree?

If so, I think you can buy it in China with good connections, if that is even necessary in China to sell life-threatening products around the globe. 

[BKW]

1 hour ago, EUC Custom Power-Pads said:

I doubt that very much.

Have you seen their bachelor's or master's degree?

If so, I think you can buy it in China with good connections, if that is even necessary in China to sell life-threatening products around the globe. 

Good point. I suppose I am assuming this.

[BKW]

Tempting. What do you guys think?

Only 3K for the original from China (18 units available). Should arrive by 2/21/23.

Some others on Aliexpress say they are used, but this one doesn't.

This wheel seems like if you buy it, no matter the batch, you'll probably have to add modifications anyway you go about it, so buying this at 3K for the original may be a good deal?

Also consider the price of the Sherman-S with additional pedal costs, making that wheel closer to 4.5K by comparison, etc.

I doubt of any warranty.

Edited February 11, 2023 by BKW