supercurio Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) After less than 140km ridden and some immense fun, on street and off-road a couple days ago with @Rawnei, my S22 motor started to make bad sounds. It wasn't the fender, not the bearing either, nope. Seemed to be coming from the motor itself. It was quickly confirmed by the sound increasing after small accelerations or braking. I was riding again with @Rawnei today, just left home we decided to ride back the 1-2km to back slowly. Once back home, I tried to see if the sound would appear on free-spinning with the idea of making a video. It did, and it disappeared! It was unlikely that would be an actual fix so I tried more. Changing direction back and forth was stuttering a bit, and the sound would disappear and re-appear sometimes worse. Then I grabbed the camera to show the bad sound issue for warranty purposes and, well, see for yourself: List of possibly relevant issues identified with this wheel: Controller making significant coil noise according to how the motor was driven. Noticed in the beginning of the awesome off-road ride in Ekerö: odd rubbing-like sound, more when turning right than left which fixed itself after a few km (we thought it could have been the poorly seated tire/fender) Noticed since the beginning: vertical oscillations beyond 50kph, which I attributed to the tire. Noticed since yesterday: vibrations when self-balancing, more apparent at 0 or low speeds. I compared with @Rawnei's S22 today, his was very stable and had 0 motor vibration. I had concerns due to the controller "singing" and motor vibrations and considered requesting replacements. If not another - working wheel, that will require new, hopefully reliable controllers and motor now. What a bummer. QC at its worst. On the plus side (almost) not riding a wheel exhibiting a fault prevented a crash, so at least there's that. Make sure to not ride you S22 if its motor makes any unexpected sound. Edited August 14, 2022 by supercurio 1 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wstuart Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, supercurio said: After less than 140km ridden and some immense fun, on street and off-road a couple days ago with @Rawnei, my S22 motor started to make bad sounds. It wasn't the fender, not the bearing either, nope. Seemed to be coming from the motor itself. It was quickly confirmed by the sound increasing after small accelerations or braking. I was riding again with @Rawnei today and pretty bumped, we decided to ride back the 2km to home slowly. Once back home, I tried to see if the sound would appear on free-spinning with the idea of making a video. It did, and it disappeared! It was unlikely that would be an actual fix so I tried more. Changing direction back and forth was stuttering a bit, and the sound would disappear and re-appear sometimes worse. Then I grabbed the camera to show the bad sound issue for warranty purposes and, well, see for yourself: List of possibly relevant issues identified with this wheel: Controller making significant coil noise according to how the motor was driven. Noticed in the beginning of the awesome off-road ride in Ekerö: odd rubbing-like sound, more when turning right than left which fixed itself after a few km (we thought it could have been the poorly seated tire/fender) Noticed since the beginning: vertical oscillations beyond 50kph, which I attributed to the tire. Noticed since yesterday: vibrations when self-balancing, more apparent at 0 or low speeds. I compared with @Rawnei's S22 today, his was very stable and had 0 motor vibration. I had concerns due to the controller "singing" and motor vibrations and considered requesting replacements. If not another - working wheel, that will require new, hopefully reliable controllers and motor now. What a bummer. QC at its worst. On the plus side (almost) not riding a wheel exhibiting a fault prevented a crash, so at least there's that. Make sure to not ride you S22 if its motor makes any unexpected sound. BUMMER!!!! Every time I'm about to pull the trigger on my S22 pre order, I see a post like this....... maybe it's a sign??? I'm considering switching to the T4. - didn't you post a video with that wheel earlier where you tested for bad mosfets by picking it up and tilting it back and forth? Maybe that test caused this? - maybe the motor bearing wasn't seated correctly causing rubbing in the motor. Early Begode EXs suffer from this, but the motor sounds don't get that bad. Edited August 14, 2022 by wstuart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercurio Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 14 minutes ago, wstuart said: BUMMER!!!! Only an educated guess until the motor is opened, but I suspect loose motor coils or magnet(s). I don't think bearings are involved since the issue was amplified by motor torque (aka coils pulling on magnets), and torque has essentially no impact on the bearings. You're right, the V12-style spin test highlighted some strong clonks, uncommon - no other wheel does that. Possibly an indicator of the issue ahead of time? Today the issue started a minute after some off-road, going over roots and rocks. I still recommend the test every owner. If there's a defect, you want the wheel to fail early when it's indisputably under warranty, and when you're not risking to crash. Because yes, even riding "like Marty" and without testing, that one would have failed sooner or later. Edited August 14, 2022 by supercurio 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miko.cz Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 23 minutes ago, supercurio said: After less than 140km ridden and some immense fun, on street and off-road a couple days ago with @Rawnei, my S22 motor started to make bad sounds. Sorry to hear that. Im afraid I have some issue with my motor too (after 80km). Distributor will check it tommorow. But its different sound - its a clang-clang-clang (not every wheel turn), random appearing, with much higher probability when turning left. Sometimes 5km nothing, completely irrelevant on surface ridden or speed or power demands. Only sound, nothing else affected (yet). Edited August 14, 2022 by Miko.cz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercurio Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) @Miko.cz very similar description to what happened first, sounds louder on one side than another, which eventually disappeared after riding at 55kph+. Centrifugal force might have helped to put things back in place at the time. I would not recommend riding it, and see what happens with the spin test. That's pretty much what finished mine. Although maybe not the best idea since it's likely to also fry the board. But yes, no doubt must be checked. Edited August 14, 2022 by supercurio 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul g Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 (edited) @supercurio is very probable the hall sensors got loose and detached. Does the seller allow you to open the motor? @Miko.cz, the same. The sensor hits the internal ribs of the side panel. You could have the some magnets that got loose, as you say, but that is worse than just a hall sensor busted. Edited August 15, 2022 by Paul g Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercurio Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 8 minutes ago, Paul g said: @supercurio is very probable the hall sensors got loose and detached. Does the seller allow you to open the motor? @Miko.cz, the same. The sensor hits the internal ribs of the side panel. Yes possible that the hall sensor got detached instead, your hypothesis makes a lot of sense. Do you know on which side the hall sensor is supposed to be? Poorly attached hall sensor would also explain the motor vibrations. Then the early symptoms would have appeared only after the first street ride - with power pads where I rode aggressively. That also means that bumps - brilliantly handled by the suspension would have triggered the issue, not the spin test. Opening the motor is not my priority since I have a bunch more work to complete first, to get another unavailable, poorly QC'd wheel back in working order (my own Sherman Max). If I open this motor, that would be to investigate but not to attempt to repair it, I'll demand a working replacement part. At no point the wheel indicated any hall sensor or other error BTW. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NErider Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 Since making full payment on my S22 confirming my pre-order, I was really hoping that I would not be seeing the type of posts that have been popping up here in the past few days. Lol For the above possible motor issue, I did see a vid about KS finding metallic debris inside the motor stuck to the magnet causing faults. And the repair was to disassemble, wipe it away, and put back into service. But the board may have already smoked too so...? Best wishes? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miko.cz Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 Well, we will see. Distributor is not expecting magnet or some free debris as it could totaly crash the motor. Expected some particulary/half loosed part. But thats the speculation for now only, I will let you know. Im also changing coil from 750 to 450lbs same time. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forwardnbak Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 KINGSONG?? anyone going to help all these nice folks with issues? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forwardnbak Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 mine is down now just on advice from KS, noise in motor 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wstuart Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Forwardnbak said: mine is down now just on advice from KS, noise in motor I saw you mentioned that slight motor noise in your last video. I was a little surprised because from your videos it seems like you are pretty gentle on that wheel. So Kingsong told you to not ride your wheel because of that small intermitent clicking sound from the motor?? Edited August 15, 2022 by wstuart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forwardnbak Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, wstuart said: I saw you mentioned that slight motor noise in your last video. So Kingsong told you to not ride your wheel because of that small intermitent clicking sound from the motor?? yep, i’ve shot 2 more videos since that one. In the vid today i took time to get some better audio of it and sent it to KS. They spoke with engineers and told me to stop riding as it’s my motor. Told me to contact my dealer which is already helping, i asked the dealer if it’s too late and can i switch to v13. Waited a long time and not even a week in its down, just like so many others - shame Edited August 15, 2022 by Forwardnbak 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wstuart Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 Just now, Forwardnbak said: yep, i’ve shot 2 more videos since that one. In the vid today i took time to get some better audio of it and sent it do KS. They spoke with engineers and told me to stop riding as it’s my motor. Told me to contact my dealer which is already helping, i asked the dealer if it’s too late and can i switch to v13. Waited a long time and not even a week in its down, just like so many others - shame So sorry to hear that man! Yeah thats not fair - you waited a long time and deserved to have a good wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 1 minute ago, Forwardnbak said: yep, i’ve shot 2 more videos since that one. In the vid today i took time to get some better audio of it and sent it to KS. They spoke with engineers and told me to stop riding as it’s my motor. Told me to contact my dealer which is already helping, i asked the dealer if it’s too late and can i switch to v13. Waited a long time and not even a week in its down, just like so many others - shame The problem is due to poor QC and there is nothing saying that Inmotion has better QC with all the problems they have been having with V12 HS and HT, if they send you a new motor where they know the issue has been identified and fixed that would be a very good option. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forwardnbak Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 1 minute ago, Rawnei said: The problem is due to poor QC and there is nothing saying that Inmotion has better QC with all the problems they have been having with V12 HS and HT, if they send you a new motor where they know the issue has been identified and fixed that would be a very good option. it’s the silence from KS, and the long long time they had to fix these issues. Inmotion for me has been a flawless experience. I understand they have issues. It is what it is but my confidence has kind of gone from KS at this point. I asked if they could elaborate on the cause? updated motors available? new control boards? they couldn’t offer anything so not too sure they have a fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, Forwardnbak said: it’s the silence from KS, and the long long time they had to fix these issues. Inmotion for me has been a flawless experience. I understand they have issues. It is what it is but my confidence has kind of gone from KS at this point. I asked if they could elaborate on the cause? updated motors available? new control boards? they couldn’t offer anything so not too sure they have a fix. Having had problems both with V11 and V12 they we're far from flawless for me, one required motor change, same predicament you are in now, other required a brand new control board design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forwardnbak Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 5 minutes ago, Rawnei said: Having had problems both with V11 and V12 they we're far from flawless for me, one required motor change, same predicament you are in now, other required a brand new control board design. damn that sucks you had such a bad run, i guess that’s how brand loyalty starts both good and bad. My experience with inmotion has been ok. I like that they step up and offer solutions is what i’ve seen of them. Silence from KS worries me, plus the amount i am seeing down without them responding. I know 2 that landed in my state in the last week and both now down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, Forwardnbak said: damn that sucks you had such a bad run, i guess that’s how brand loyalty starts both good and bad. My experience with inmotion has been ok. I like that they step up and offer solutions is what i’ve seen of them. Silence from KS worries me, plus the amount i am seeing down without them responding. I know 2 that landed in my state in the last week and both now down. The best we can do is put pressure on them together with the resellers, the resellers are in a bad situation as well as all the problems are eating up their margins. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robse Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 Excuses given: my comment is of no practical use for anyone, but this is so bad reading, even worse than the V12 mosfet story, that i have to say something: I'm sad for all the "proud" owners of this wheel. I'm gratefull to the gods of wheels that in a dream told me to NOT TO buy a suspension wheel...and NOT TO buy another 16" (V12) OMG!!! If it had been me, i would probably have traveled to *****, found the people responsible, made them drink 10 liters of vinegar and told them how bad i think they are acting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Guy Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 Can this break KingSong? :-( They haven’t announced a new wheel for almost a year now… 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel1234 Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 (edited) 15 hours ago, supercurio said: After less than 140km ridden and some immense fun, on street and off-road a couple days ago with @Rawnei, my S22 motor started to make bad sounds. It wasn't the fender, not the bearing either, nope. Seemed to be coming from the motor itself. It was quickly confirmed by the sound increasing after small accelerations or braking. I was riding again with @Rawnei today, just left home we decided to ride back the 1-2km to back slowly. Once back home, I tried to see if the sound would appear on free-spinning with the idea of making a video. It did, and it disappeared! It was unlikely that would be an actual fix so I tried more. Changing direction back and forth was stuttering a bit, and the sound would disappear and re-appear sometimes worse. Then I grabbed the camera to show the bad sound issue for warranty purposes and, well, see for yourself: List of possibly relevant issues identified with this wheel: Controller making significant coil noise according to how the motor was driven. Noticed in the beginning of the awesome off-road ride in Ekerö: odd rubbing-like sound, more when turning right than left which fixed itself after a few km (we thought it could have been the poorly seated tire/fender) Noticed since the beginning: vertical oscillations beyond 50kph, which I attributed to the tire. Noticed since yesterday: vibrations when self-balancing, more apparent at 0 or low speeds. I compared with @Rawnei's S22 today, his was very stable and had 0 motor vibration. I had concerns due to the controller "singing" and motor vibrations and considered requesting replacements. If not another - working wheel, that will require new, hopefully reliable controllers and motor now. What a bummer. QC at its worst. On the plus side (almost) not riding a wheel exhibiting a fault prevented a crash, so at least there's that. Make sure to not ride you S22 if its motor makes any unexpected sound. We have one s22 with same problem in Brno czech republic from first batch -> it went to reseller for repair. It sucks that is so hard to take motor apart - there will be just some mess around magnets. Clinging noise slowly getting worse - rider rather stopped riding wheel. Edited August 15, 2022 by daniel1234 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forwardnbak Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Rawnei said: The best we can do is put pressure on them together with the resellers, the resellers are in a bad situation as well as all the problems are eating up their margins. i agree i’ve stuck by my reseller and think heaps about them. I understand their position. As a consumer i’ve let ks know my thoughts, i think dealers need to be stronger with them. These aren’t cheap and people and dealers feel it $ also it just bums you out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wstuart Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 28 minutes ago, That Guy said: Can this break KingSong? :-( They haven’t announced a new wheel for almost a year now… I wondered that too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post supercurio Posted August 15, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted August 15, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, daniel1234 said: We have one s22 with same problem in Brno czech republic from first batch -> it went to reseller for repair. It sucks that is so hard to take motor apart - there will be just some mess around magnets. Clinging noise slowly getting worse - rider rather stopped riding wheel. Thanks for the details. I wonder if there was also metallic dirt it my motor as shown in the Kingsong video, or if the issue was different. Could the debris cause small vibrations at low/no speed self balancing, or is it something else? I wonder if @Forwardnbak you have these vibrations too. Maybe there are multiple separate issues at play. Then about the noise, they can be hard to diagnose since they're intermittent and can go away. For very first symptoms I naively thought it was the tire (kind of wobbly, oscillating at speed, needed to be reseated) and fender, the sound coming from inside the motor didn't cross my mind. So it's good that we talk about this clearly common issue here so owners can easily identify it instead of dismissing it as something else. In my case, even if the motor would have been fixable by basic cleaning (not convinced atm), I was only trying to capture a better video to send to support without risking crashing - anticipating the whole thing could fail, thinking my first videos were not very good and the sound could be mistaken for something else (rock, fender). So yeah what can happen is kind of scary. I can totally imagine someone riding instead of walking back from far away after noticing that bad sound, and eating it. Edited August 15, 2022 by supercurio 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.