Paul g Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 43 minutes ago, techyiam said: I just turned on my V12. All the temperatures were essentially the same at startup. The motor temperature was 1C lower than the board. The CPU temperature was climbing. The motor temperature was lowest and steady. Makes sense since the wheel was stationary not being ridden. The mosfet temperature was gradually going up. I didn't have a thermometer with me at the time, but I would say the initial just turned-on temperatured were in the right ballpark. All the reporting I did was with the old board and old firmware. Things might have changed. I also had a thermometer in the room so I could compare the V12 reported T and the actual one in the room, with the machine just started in the morning. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techyiam Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, techyiam said: just curiosity, were they close to ambient on start? OK, I got the ambient temperature. I used a refrigerator thermometer. You won't believe this. Ambient Temperature 22C. I believe they all started at 22C. It just that my the time I got to the temperature screen, the temperatures climbed 1C, of course except for the motor temperature which doesn't change. Consolidating from last post. After approximately 5 minutes leaning against a wall: Temperatures Ambient Temperature 22C. Motor 22C didn't change Board 27C Mosfet 34C CPU 37C Edited July 30, 2022 by techyiam 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, techyiam said: OK, I got the ambient temperature. I used a refrigerator thermometer. You won't believe this. Ambient Temperature 22C. I believe they all started at 22C. It just that my the time I got to the temperature screen, the temperatures climbed 1C, of course except for the motor temperature which doesn't change. thanks, all this sounds just fine. Nothing like a KS. So the mystery of how ks runs so cool, is solved I think Edited July 30, 2022 by enaon 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techyiam Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 5 minutes ago, enaon said: thanks, all this sounds just fine. Nothing like KS Good to know. I used no thermal compound on the thermal pad nor on the mosfets. And I tightened the mosfets firmly to the heatsink. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 Nice. I am not saying ks is not good, the s18, that I have extensively tested, is excellent on heat dissipation. Just not magic after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techyiam Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 5 minutes ago, enaon said: Nice. I am not saying ks is not good, the s18, that I have extensively tested, is excellent on heat dissipation. Just not magic after all. Just curious, would say the heat dissipation of the S18 better, the same, or worse than my V12? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, techyiam said: Just curious, would say the heat dissipation of the S18 better, the same, or worse than my V12? by design I think the s18/s22 is better, bigger heatsink, more surface of the heatsink exposed, better exposed overall. Edited July 30, 2022 by enaon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techyiam Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 5 minutes ago, enaon said: by design I think the s18/s22 is better, bigger heatsink, more surface of the heatsink exposed, better exposed overall. Does your S18 report mosfet temperatures? If yes, how hot do your mosfets get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 From building gaming PC's we can observe how much a difference in heat dissipation there is with different heatsink designs, sometimes they can look similar but one much more effective than the other, also one advantage of the S22 is the open design below the electronics letting air/wind in there which I imagine is very effective for heat management. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, techyiam said: Does your S18 report mosfet temperatures? If yes, how hot do your mosfets get? the s18 reports mosfets and motortemp, like all ks's. For the mosfets temp is has a dedicated probe that fits in a groove inside the heatsink, between the two mosfets rows, perfect placement. For the motor, it has one that is siliconed on the copper winding. they both report the same temp, so the motor one is of no use user wise, and the one on the heatsink missreports by some 8degrees celcius anyway. so to answer you question, it is known that an s18 will report (with the rider on, riding on flat terrain) cooler on the mosfets heatsink that ambient temp. I don't know why we did't mind all this time, maybe we wanted a miracle. This is the main point of my post, if one cares to verify it will ne nice. Edited July 30, 2022 by enaon 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawpie Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 20 minutes ago, enaon said: For the mosfets temp is has a dedicated probe that fits in a groove inside the heatsink, between the two mosfets rows, perfect placement. Is this the "Temperature" reading that EUCWorld reports or is MOSFET temperature an EUCWatch special? Y'all got me curious now (not that it really matters) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Tawpie said: Is this the "Temperature" reading that EUCWorld reports or is MOSFET temperature an EUCWatch special? Y'all got me curious now (not that it really matters) the temperature on EWorld is the one I called "mosfets" because the probe is at the heatsink, it should be the same, the motor temp field I got from softtuner decompiling. Please check both temps as reported from EWorld if you get some time it doesn't matter because it works fine, but it is annoying if they indeed misreport temps, it adds confusion when comparing makers. Edited July 30, 2022 by enaon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawpie Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 Haha... it was 72.8 Freedom units in the wheelhouse, S18 at power up reported 55F as the "Temperature", 55F as the "Motor Temperature" to EUCWorld. After about 5 seconds the "Temperature" bounced up to 57F. On both SoftTuner and the iOS KS app, "Temperature" was 18C and "Motor Temperature" was 15C (time with power on was about 2-3 minutes. I'll let things settle a bit, it gets quite cool here at night and we're just starting the morning warmup, nevertheless the overnight low in the wheelhouse was 66 F so yeah, my S18's MOSFET temperature also has some sort of offset! Oddly, the 16XS.LR also powered up at 55F and bounced to 57F. Not sure if there anything to be said there other than it's unlikely to be a fault in the temperature sensors. S18 is firmware 2.16, 16XS is 2.09 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Tawpie said: On both SoftTuner and the iOS KS app, "Temperature" was 18C and "Motor Temperature" was 15C (time with power on was about 2-3 minutes. so you do get different temps on main/motor with ks apps, but not on euc World? Strange, I used the same field softtuner uses for motor temp, maybe they only display the init value on their apps for motor temp?. Thanks for testing. Edited July 30, 2022 by enaon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawpie Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) I did EUCW first, wheel had been on for (more like 1) a couple of minutes before I thought about checking with other apps so it had a chance to warm up a bit. The conversion is off though, 55 Freedom units should be 13 C. Charging the Rock to see what the watch has to say about the situation. You know, for science. Or to support rumor mongering, finger pointing, FUD, and many clicks... Edited July 30, 2022 by Tawpie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chanman Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) I get different motor/mosfet temps on the S18, motor is significantly hotter than board after riding hard. I also get the cooler than room temp readings when powered on after sitting inside all night, so I'd imagine there's some offset or poor calibration at room temps going on. Is the S22 the same way? Edited July 30, 2022 by chanman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post dycus Posted July 30, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2022 Let's take all the S18 temperature talk to the S18 thread 2 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 2 minutes ago, chanman said: I get different motor/mosfet temps on the S18, motor is significantly hotter than board after riding hard. nice, thanks, I have an stm32 based s18, so stuck in firm 206, maybe this is the reason my motor temp is looking fake to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enaon Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 2 minutes ago, dycus said: Let's take all the S18 temperature talk to the S18 thread i think it is ks related in general, but you are correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rawnei Posted July 30, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2022 (edited) 11 hours ago, Rawnei said: Climbing on steep loose dirt can be difficult for any wheel but not because of lack of torque because if the tire starts slipping it's a slippery slope (pun intended), it leads to the tire bouncing, motor gaining speed, pedals tilting, you tilting with the pedals so on, in those scenarios you try to power through and hope for the best but if the wheel can not regain traction nothing will save the situation, in this scenario perhaps the S22 will have a smaller margin before cutting the motor compared to say a Begode C38 wheel but I don't think it matters because if you already lost so much traction for that to happen you wouldn't regain it anyway. Tire is more important in this scenario, for instance the knobby Kenda 262 is very poor for this kind of scenarios because it digs in and spits out the dirt and loses traction instead, a street tire is probably better. So if we discount this situation the question is how steep and how long can we climb? So far S22 seems strong enough to climb so it becomes a question of heat, will it overheat on long climbs or not? Case in point, went up a steep (probably around 30-35 degrees) loose grass/dirt hill today on the S22, tire lost traction near the top of the hill, I immediately leaned back a bit to let it regain traction then leaned forward again to continue the ascent, the wheel itself never struggle, motor hummed beautifully and there was no beeps. Edit: @Mike Sacristan filmed it so here's two short videos, too big to upload here so put them on google drive, it's difficult to see the tire slip in the first video but it's there, in the second video I totally did not notice before it was too late that there was a big gap between the grass and the slope but suspension made it much easier to counter. 😂 https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cLx-RaiPrUq8aBZj7anEXIRhzoawqlnZ/view?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cRgU2WFDjjnL1q5np8Wf8q12DqjNPnvO/view?usp=sharing Edited July 30, 2022 by Rawnei Added Videos 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul g Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 @Rawnei , if you ever check the temperatures on your S22, could you please let us know as well? You seem to be among the few around here to be able to do that at this moment. Thanks, in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 Just now, Paul g said: @Rawnei , if you ever check the temperatures on your S22, could you please let us know as well? You seem to be among the few around here to be able to do that at this moment. Thanks, in advance! Operating temperatures are very low both for board and motor, highest peaks I've seen only once is 41c (board) and 77c (motor) respectively (EUC World data). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul g Posted July 30, 2022 Share Posted July 30, 2022 Just now, Rawnei said: Operating temperatures are very low both for board and motor, highest peaks I've seen only once is 41c (board) and 77c (motor) respectively (EUC World data). We are interested at cold start, after it wasn’t use for a good time, so that all the wheel got to the same (room) temperature. The idea is to check the room temp with a thermometer and then turn on the wheel and check all the temperatures reported by the wheel. If the software reports the same temps for all components and is similar to the thermometer then all is reported correctly, if not then we have a fake temp reported by the wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rawnei Posted July 30, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2022 15 minutes ago, Paul g said: We are interested at cold start, after it wasn’t use for a good time, so that all the wheel got to the same (room) temperature. The idea is to check the room temp with a thermometer and then turn on the wheel and check all the temperatures reported by the wheel. If the software reports the same temps for all components and is similar to the thermometer then all is reported correctly, if not then we have a fake temp reported by the wheel. I see, I can't right now but maybe later. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted July 31, 2022 Share Posted July 31, 2022 13 hours ago, Paul g said: We are interested at cold start, after it wasn’t use for a good time, so that all the wheel got to the same (room) temperature. The idea is to check the room temp with a thermometer and then turn on the wheel and check all the temperatures reported by the wheel. If the software reports the same temps for all components and is similar to the thermometer then all is reported correctly, if not then we have a fake temp reported by the wheel. Room temperature 24c, board temperature 18c, battery temperature 27c, motor temperature 18c. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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