Does Veteran have a tire problem? Tire off the rim?

[mrelwood]

1 hour ago, Fiori said:

Edit: also on another note I'm wondering how the rim even separates from the motor? 

It doesn’t. The rim is a fixed part of the motor construction on all EUCs.

[DjPanJan]

10 hours ago, EMA said:

i have tried 2 KENDA K340 and both do the same shit:

it's not a setting or fitting issue, is just the tire too big for the rim:

you put the first side on the rim - ok
then you put the inner tube - ok
after that, putting the other side into the rim require no effort...but the first side automatically go out !

when you manage to fit both side inside the rim you really need to pump it really carefull checking that the tire remain in it's position, i've put 20psi tring to center it and it goes off the rim just with me standing on the wheel.
 

good job thank you for testing and share you findings.

Is then cst 1488  solution for "old" rims?

And potentialy "original" knoby tire is  is +- Ok if you have luck?

Just my sci-fi idea is possible remake veteran rim for tubeless tire this can be maybee solution for cuting iner tube if tire move? (sorry my naive questions im realy noob in this tire universe) 

[Fiori]

12 hours ago, mrelwood said:

It doesn’t. The rim is a fixed part of the motor construction on all EUCs.

That's what I figured. Wasn't sure if they would send a rim with magnets attached and then you would move stator over to new rim. Seems pretty expensive to have to buy 100 complete motors just for the rim. 

6 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

good job thank you for testing and share you findings.

Is then cst 1488  solution for "old" rims?

And potentialy "original" knoby tire is  is +- Ok if you have luck?

Just my sci-fi idea is possible remake veteran rim for tubeless tire this can be maybee solution for cuting iner tube if tire move? (sorry my naive questions im realy noob in this tire universe) 

Keep in mind he has an EX-N not a Sherman, which may be different. But the issue seems very similar. And having the same issue on a different wheel with the same tire does seem to point towards a tire issue instead of a rim one. However, it's all speculations until one of us with this issue tries another tire and or rim. 

I would love if they went tubeless, but I'm doubtful it will happen. The tolerances on tubeless wheels have to be much tighter. I assume that's why we have tubed wheels/tires in the first place because it's easier to produce and install. 

[Finn Bjerke]

Is it possible for you to measure the rim? 

[EMA]

9 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

good job thank you for testing and share you findings.

Is then cst 1488  solution for "old" rims?

And potentialy "original" knoby tire is  is +- Ok if you have luck?

Just my sci-fi idea is possible remake veteran rim for tubeless tire this can be maybee solution for cuting iner tube if tire move? (sorry my naive questions im realy noob in this tire universe) 

never had issue with 1488 in my exp, tried also cst 186 with no issue on different wheels

2 hours ago, Fiori said:

Keep in mind he has an EX-N not a Sherman, which may be different. But the issue seems very similar. And having the same issue on a different wheel with the same tire does seem to point towards a tire issue instead of a rim one. However, it's all speculations until one of us with this issue tries another tire and or rim. 

i have the EX

at first i thought the same becouse the EX has a new rim/motor so maybe......but after seing how easy the k340 don't stay in the rim i change my mind

i think this is confirmed with the cst 1488 which fit perfectly

and today i've put the cst c113 that seems perfect too

[Finn Bjerke]

Some tyres are made for tubeless some are not. I suspect the knobby tire was made for a different type of wheel, and a different size of wheel. 

KNobby is very softy Im told, maybe thats the problem ?  It it possible to find a tight fitting tyre and maybe fixate the tube with gluing tape? 

Dont forget this is a fast wheel .... 

[roghaj]

On 1/21/2021 at 6:59 PM, mrelwood said:

It doesn’t. The rim is a fixed part of the motor construction on all EUCs.

The motor is easily removed from the rim.  Replacement rims come with the magnets.  I broke and replaced my rim myself. Takes nearly no more time than a tire change.

[Sebaszz]

just to give some feedback after some more miles....

I'm convinced that a lot wobbles had to do with my rusty riding skills. I can now easily push it to the speed I want.

But i'm realizing I need to respect the wheel and gain experience.

[Skuratovich]

Будет ли новый обод для мотоциклетных шин?

[null]

6 minutes ago, Skuratovich said:

Will there be a new rim for motorcycle tires?

Hi and welcome. As forum language is English, please use translation. Deepl.com gives very good results.

To answer your question: the old rim already takes motorcycle tires, but it had some issues, and the new production apparently has an improved rim.

Edited February 8, 2021 by null

[Skuratovich]

Will the new batches of veteran Sherman have a different rim?

[null]

yes 👍🏻

[Skuratovich]

Veteran confirmed it?

[null]

Someone else will have to answer that one, but it's been mentioned here and there.

[Skuratovich]

Okay, thank you.

[Finn Bjerke]

Newsflash Feb 2021. 
New Veteran Sherman have wider rim 60mm instead of 40mm. Knobby Tyre (Kenda something) is rubbing against the shell, the street not so much. 
Depressing. 

Knobby Tire 14x2.75” Kenda K262:
Street Tire 14x2.75” Kenda K340:

PSI max: 33 according the Kenda info.  

Edited February 8, 2021 by Finn Bjerke
precise info

[Kekafuch]

28 minutes ago, Finn Bjerke said:

Newsflash Feb 2021. 
New Veteran Sherman have wider rim 60mm instead of 40mm. Knobby Tyre (Kenda something) is rubbing against the shell, the street not so much. 
Depressing. 

Knobby Tire 14x2.75” Kenda K262:
Street Tire 14x2.75” Kenda K340:

PSI max: 33 according the Kenda info.  

Can you share the source?

[EMA]

12 hours ago, Finn Bjerke said:

New Veteran Sherman have wider rim 60mm instead of 40mm

this numbers has no sense, people should think before write something so unreal pls...

let's wait for something confirmed and measured not random numbers

[Marco73]

On 04/01/2021 at 19:55, Finn Bjerke said:

Le mantra est le suivant: ne soyez jamais le premier intervenant sur un nouvel EUC. attendez que d'autres pilotes soient des bêta-testeurs pour vous. Thx pour un bon compagnon d'information.  

when I read this I tell myself that if everyone thinks like you, then the EUC world is no longer developing and ultimately will no longer exist. Thank you to the brave who took the risk of riding with the very first wheels, sorry to tell you but you should not be part of it.

[Boogieman]

Just a question.

Isnt it possible to use "tyre mounting paste" - same as they use on cars.
Then over pump the tube (not till it explodes but, high) and have the tyre self centre itself?
Then deflate to wanted pressure.

I know its not tubeless so the bead settings is different, but could it be a solution?
@mrelwood Knows his tyres, what do You reckon?

 

EDIT: Seems like its there for a diferent reason than easy install. Also talcum inside tube on bike tyres also seems like a myth
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/talcum.html

And I guess You dont want it to be "slippery" towards the rim
Slippery when mounting, then FIXED when pumped up would be great. Like a vaporizing liquid or something

 

EDIT 2: As per point 17 in this article, temporary over inflating seems like a helpful option, for clinchers if it wont pop.
https://road.cc/content/feature/how-fit-clincher-tyres-164887
And even more tips toward the end of this article. Note this is for bicycles - with tyres that fit to begin with. Soap on a bad fitting tyre might maybe not be the best of ideas?
https://www.roadbikerider.com/tubed-bicycle-tire-seat-correctly/

(I have tried the soap trick once, when I tried to fit a tyre without inner tube onto my Tesla Never got it to set properly though so gave up)

 

EDIT 3: An information filled page on bicycle tyres.
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/tyres.html

Edited February 10, 2021 by Boogieman

[mrelwood]

On 2/10/2021 at 9:05 PM, Boogieman said:

have the tyre self centre itself?

If there was something that would guide the tire to be centered, this would be ideal. But there isn’t. The bead part of the rim that is supposed to do that is too small for that purpose in all EUCs I’ve inspected.

Edited February 11, 2021 by mrelwood

[WI_Hedgehog]

On 1/21/2021 at 8:59 PM, mrelwood said:

It doesn’t. The rim is a fixed part of the motor construction on all EUCs.

Only because they're commonly sold that way, but rims and motors are completely separate items. Sometimes motors are difficult to install (which is why rims with motors are commonly sold as a single unit), but the Sherman is difficult get the wheel and motor out of to begin with.

Example: Gotway Monster rim (& magnets) only (no motor):

(That should be a tubeless rim, don't you think? If only they'd add a lip to land the bead.)

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by WI_Hedgehog
Added picture

[WI_Hedgehog]

I see @ShanesPlanet hasn't changed...LOL. Hey buddy, you shouldn't be worried, you're the one EUC superhero that can run off an impending disaster and laugh about it!
-----

I import stuff from China all the time, and if you expect quality...reset your expectations. Generally a company produces good test units (in this case rims), perhaps also a good initial (small) first-run of units (rims), but the first bulk order you place will have 50% (or more) rejects--50% junk. Half of the rest of the units are out of spec, maybe you can use them. Out of the last 1/4 of your order, figure most of the units (rims, in this case) are just barely within specifications*, 10% of your order is "reasonable" and 5% is good--which you marvel at. Recapping:

50% junk--throw it away.
25% out of spec, maybe you can find a way to make it work.
10% to 13% barely within spec.*, strongly contributes to "stacking error"
7 to 10% within spec.
3-5% is actually good & will make for a good product.

*not the build specifications you gave the manufacturer which are much tighter than your actual, internal specs--you do this just so you get "some" good product out of them. These are your actual, usable part specs where the product "should still work;" if you wanted "quality parts" you'd buy stuff made in Poland.

The other thing you have to understand: It's hot. The country is hot. (Or cold, it depends on the season.) Working conditions kind of suck. (I'm being kind, they suck.) Fans circulate the air and you get used to others' lack of hygiene. Employees are paid by how many units they produce, though not paid well. ("Paid" is kind of an exaggeration, they work really hard and don't get much for it.) Employee focus is on them making as much money as they can so their family 1.) has shelter, 2.) can eat. Shortcuts are a way of life (it's called chabuduo).

You expect to get a good rim the second time around so the problem is fixed? Ha! Have you looked at the tire???!!!

You're going to get a cheap rim that's not even designed to hold a tire bead--it just looks like a rim. (And a tire to match.) Chabuduo.

You're going to stand on that wheel and do 52MPH? Good luck.

If you've watched enough EUC videos out of China you've maybe come to notice they usually don't wear safety gear (or shoes). If they do wear gear it's wrist guards. If they don't want to get hurt they don't go so fast...kind of an obvious conclusion, when you think about it.

 

What you honestly, truly need to realize is: You're riding on the dark side, where the bead doesn't fit, and handling is sh!t.

-Hedge

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by WI_Hedgehog

[Finn Bjerke]

Long thread many interesting ideas and facts - to me the important thing is: Are the new V. Sherman EUCs better or do you still have a risc of wasting your money? 

Is the problem related to tire / Wheel misfit ? Have they tried to solve it ? 

[.....]

3 hours ago, Finn Bjerke said:

Long thread many interesting ideas and facts - to me the important thing is: Are the new V. Sherman EUCs better or do you still have a risc of wasting your money? 

Is the problem related to tire / Wheel misfit ? Have they tried to solve it ? 

Just got back from riding all my wheels today , including the sherman. 1st batch, money well spent.... Could it be better? Yes! Is it still Chinese quality? Yes! Do I expect more for what I spent? Yes. Is the euc world full of options and I can be picky and demand high quality? No.  Reality hurts. We either enjoy 'the dark side" as @WI_Hedgehogput it, and enjoy fun while taking risk and overpaying for it. OR, we join just about ANY OTHER motorsports activity that has machines that put the euc to shame.  I prefer to do both, but bitch about it.