Does Veteran have a tire problem? Tire off the rim?

[Kekafuch]

 

[.....]

42 minutes ago, Kekafuch said:

 

OUch! Hopefully we'll get more info once they look in the daylight. Going flat so fast, could this have been a valve tearing, as was mentioned a common issue with MTB tubes in another thread? He didnt seem to complain of any bobble prior to, so perhaps this one wasnt induced by tire bulging/unseating before destroying the tube? Looking forward to more info, as my machine is destined for high speed use in areas that a minor malfunction could be disasterous. We already have enough little glitches to fear, hopefully this instance turns out to be explainable and avoidable. Hopefully road rash was minimal. Whew, what a rush! Thanks for the vid!

Edited January 16, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[Sebaszz]

16 hours ago, Fiori said:

@Sebaszz You should be able to see if it's a tire issue by lifting the wheel and free spinning it. It's going to be kind of hard to tell while riding unless you can video it and look later. It very well could just be you not being used to riding

Thanks! i guess there is some room for improvement....

 

[.....]

5 hours ago, Sebaszz said:

Thanks! i guess there is some room for improvement....

 

Actually, that seems to be pretty damn straight. Me thinks expectations need be lowered, as this IS euc's we're talking and not cars/bikes. How does it feel when you ride it? I havent bothered free spin mine (any of them), as I dont ride it like that anyhow.

[Planemo]

I agree, as EUC's go I don't think its a problem in that example, and I would be surprised if you felt it when riding.

It would still play havoc with my OCD though.

[Sebaszz]

ok interesting. probably i need to adjust my expectations. After some tweaking I think this is the best I can get it.

 

[Fiori]

I do see the up and down wobble in the video. Mine still does a slight side to side. But you can get most of that up/down out by airing the tire down, and using the block of wood or straight edge method above. if a spot is higher(closer to the straight edge) push it in, or pull the side 180* away from it. I know it's annoying and you've probably done it a bunch but I think you can get it to where you are happy with it in a couple minutes. 

 

EDIT: oops, looks like you already got it.

EDIT2: it bothers me too that its not perfect when you look down, but I did get it to where its smooth to ride.

Edited January 16, 2021 by Fiori

[Fiori]

12 hours ago, Kekafuch said:

 

That really sucks. It's hard to tell if the flat caused the bead to come off or vice versa. I'd like to get more info on what ended up happening. 

I have the same worries if something were to happen at high speed. The fitment should be better for sure, and hopefully new rims deliver well on that. The wobble/ manual centering wouldn't bother me(even though I still think you shouldn't have to) if I didn't have to constantly wonder if the wobble was going to turn into my tire flinging off at 35 mph. But I have almost 400 miles since it happened, it rides smooth, it does both me when I look down and I don't see it spinning perfectly true, but it works fine what can i say. Hopefully it ends up being reliable. 

[.....]

1 hour ago, Sebaszz said:

ok interesting. probably i need to adjust my expectations. After some tweaking I think this is the best I can get it.

 

so.... is this merely you being OCD over tolerances that are well within what we expect from chinese euc's, or do you FEEL any kind of ride issue? Verifying wobble and if its an issue, is more something felt. Perhaps you need ride it and get at least a little dirt on it, before you hyper focus on any of it? I've never owned a wheel that looks perfectly straight, yet ALL of my wheels currently ride just fine and smooth. If you knew what they actually paid for the these motors/rims, you'd absolutely be thrilled with the results you are getting. Don't forget, its a larger diameter wheel than you are accustomed to. Any minor shift will look like much more for the same given centerline offset amount on a tiny wheel.  With mileage shown, I seriously doubt the tire has even time to settle from being molded. We cant see the rim, is it tire wobble or rim runout? I find its usually a little of both and I simply ride and get used to it as it settles in.

Edited January 16, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[Sebaszz]

2 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said:

so.... is this merely you being OCD over tolerances that are well within what we expect from chinese euc's, or do you FEEL any kind of ride issue? Verifying wobble and if its an issue, is more something felt. Perhaps you need ride it and get at least a little dirt on it, before you hyper focus on any of it? I've never owned a wheel that looks perfectly straight, yet ALL of my wheels currently ride just fine and smooth. If you knew what they actually paid for the these motors/rims, you'd absolutely be thrilled with the results you are getting. Don't forget, its a larger diameter wheel than you are accustomed to. Any minor shift will look like much more for the same given centerline offset amount on a tiny wheel.  With mileage shown, I seriously doubt the tire has even time to settle from being molded. We cant see the rim, is it tire wobble or rim runout? I find its usually a little of both and I simply ride and get used to it as it settles in.

It started with some serious wobbles during riding above 35km/h. However I   didn't ride any euc before the sherman arrived for 7-8 weeks. My OCD is taking over now 😂 confinced it was not my riding skills that are lacking. You're absolutely right about quality and what to expect. the runout on the rim is negligible. Time to put some miles on it and get used to this beast!

[Finn Bjerke]

I started this debate and I must say Im very greatefull for all the thoughtfull info presented here.  U guys bloody well rule.  regarding the rim problem someone stated the wheel is not aluminium but "chinesium" good one. 


I also notice there is a group of anonymous retards who wants to shut me up. Im being attacked on a personal level in a childish angry way across several platforms. I do apologize for that and Ill do my very best to focus on the topic at hand, instead of hating the haters. Some of them are clearly corrupt people, others are just simple minded turfpissers with agression problems.  "I have dat wheel U critisize Me now Me angry like Trump"   But I digress:

TIRE OF THE RIM is the topic, if you dont like me as a person. Skype me and Ill try to improve myssef. 

A freind of mine rides EUC 8 hours every day, its his job. Off course he now wants the Shermy, maybe he is the best tester we can get really? Urban tester in harsh Scandinavian weather, if the bloody wheel is "chinesium" Im sure he will rapport it. Is it the poor quality of the chinesium wheel that makes the tire 

PS Curing real OCD is my job. 

[.....]

2 hours ago, Sebaszz said:

It started with some serious wobbles during riding above 35km/h. However I   didn't ride any euc before the sherman arrived for 7-8 weeks. My OCD is taking over now 😂 confinced it was not my riding skills that are lacking. You're absolutely right about quality and what to expect. the runout on the rim is negligible. Time to put some miles on it and get used to this beast!

I've found that wobbles are typically a rider induced issue at slower speeds. Not always, but usually that or road conditions. A slightly out of balance or round wheel would probably feel more like a bumpy ride. I had to reseat a tire on another 18L I had, as you could feel the cyclic vibration from it being offset a bit. As for wobbles, i typically get those from just being an idiot and a newbie. You should be able to discern an improper tire LONG before wobbles present themselves. I think you may just be planting a bad seed in your own mind, or at least worrying too soon. Of course the proof is in the pudding. If you feel a vibration and it turns into wobble, its obviously not a mental fixation issue

2 hours ago, Finn Bjerke said:

I started this debate and I must say Im very greatefull for all the thoughtfull info presented here.  U guys bloody well rule.  regarding the rim problem someone stated the wheel is not aluminium but "chinesium" good one. 


I also notice there is a group of anonymous retards who wants to shut me up. Im being attacked on a personal level in a childish angry way across several platforms. I do apologize for that and Ill do my very best to focus on the topic at hand, instead of hating the haters. Some of them are clearly corrupt people, others are just simple minded turfpissers with agression problems.  "I have dat wheel U critisize Me now Me angry like Trump"   But I digress:

TIRE OF THE RIM is the topic, if you dont like me as a person. Skype me and Ill try to improve myssef. 

A freind of mine rides EUC 8 hours every day, its his job. Off course he now wants the Shermy, maybe he is the best tester we can get really? Urban tester in harsh Scandinavian weather, if the bloody wheel is "chinesium" Im sure he will rapport it. Is it the poor quality of the chinesium wheel that makes the tire 

PS Curing real OCD is my job. 

You want to know how to stir up hate really quickly? Point out the faults you find in something and be quick to cuss it's quality. Make sure it something other people really hope is perfect. I got personally attacked about my weight and supposed drug use and intellect in the video I made about that wheel I sold as soon as I rode it. I guess somebody just didnt like my opinion. Funny, they removed the comments, once they realized my quick to judge opinions, were proved true by many others. SOmetimes a smart person can spot a turd w/o having to ponder for weeks about it. Odd, aint it?

[Finn Bjerke]

When it comes to V11 I think its corruption or maybe just folly?  Some folks behae like I stole an election ro something.  When the rubber hits the road we are  2 talk wheels .... nuttin else. 

[mrelwood]

8 hours ago, Sebaszz said:

ok interesting. probably i need to adjust my expectations. After some tweaking I think this is the best I can get it.

 

Wow! You started with a reasonably straight tire that surely wouldn’t cause any issues, and ended up with a tire straight as a bullet, and the straightest tire I’ve seen on an EUC! At least you can be damn sure that the tire on your Shermy won’t be causing any wobbles!

Time to focus on getting relaxed with faster speeds. Maybe check that you’re not standing too far back? It makes relaxing your legs difficult. Centering the balls of your feet and your heels on the pedals (forgetting that you have toes) should work as the optimal spot to stand on.

[mrelwood]

4 hours ago, Finn Bjerke said:

I do apologize for that and Ill do my very best to focus on the topic at hand, instead of hating the haters. Some of them are clearly corrupt people, others are just simple minded turfpissers with agression problems.

Seems you still have some work to do... 

[Ben Hatfield]

My Veteran Sherman arrived with a substantial tire wobble to the point where I though the new unit had a malformed tire (knobby).  I got a replacement knobby, and (on it's install) was when I began to suspect there was an issue between the tire and rim.  That's all been well discussed.

I've ridden the Sherman up to 80% beeps quite a few times at full battery, and I have not noticed any stability issue with the slight tire wobble at speed.  At times I think it might effect tight turns at slow speeds, but that isn't much of an issue - and I could be wrong.  I haven't ridden a Sherman with a perfectly aligned tire, so there's that too... my only experience is with my wheel.

Imo, the biggest issue is this - I'm convince the tire moves after being set, and inflated, while riding - Wrong Way also eluded to this in one of his Veteran videos.  Maybe this is uncommon - but in my case, the last time I checked air pressure, I was surprised to find the stem of the tube almost entirely inside the wheel.  Previously, it had been fully exposed.  There is no question my tube was being stressed.  I un-inflated the tire, and moved the tire (which also moved the inside tube) to re-expose the tube stem.  That also meant I had to re-center the tire before inflating, which on my Sherman is challenging

I think I was riding with tire pressure around 20psi - which makes for a nice ride at my weight 150lbs - but now I don't think I should go lower than 25.  I do not want the tire moving on the rim while riding.  I also plan on replacing the motor/rim with the improved one from eWheels asap

Edited January 17, 2021 by Ben Hatfield

[.....]

1 hour ago, Ben Hatfield said:

My Veteran Sherman arrived with a substantial tire wobble to the point where I though the new unit had a malformed tire (knobby).  I got a replacement knobby, and (on it's install) was when I began to suspect there was an issue between the tire and rim.  That's all been well discussed.

I've ridden the Sherman up to 80% beeps quite a few times at full battery, and I have not noticed any stability issue with the slight tire wobble at speed.  At times I think it might effect tight turns at slow speeds, but that isn't much of an issue - and I could be wrong.  I haven't ridden a Sherman with a perfectly aligned tire, so there's that too... my only experience is with my wheel.

Imo, the biggest issue is this - I'm convince the tire moves after being set, and inflated, while riding - Wrong Way also eluded to this in one of his Veteran videos.  Maybe this is uncommon - but in my case, the last time I checked air pressure, I was surprised to find the stem of the tube almost entirely inside the wheel.  Previously, it had been fully exposed.  There is no question my tube was being stressed.  I un-inflated the tire, and moved the tire (which also moved the inside tube) to re-expose the tube stem.  That also meant I had to re-center the tire before inflating, which on my Sherman is challenging

I think I was riding with tire pressure around 20psi - which makes for a nice ride at my weight 150lbs - but now I don't think I should go lower than 25.  I do not want the tire moving on the rim while riding.  I also plan on replacing the motor/rim with the improved one from eWheels asap

sounds like I need mark my tire and rim and watch that tube. I run low pressure (20psi) and upping it to solve a design or build defect, is not my intentions. I too am an e-wheels customer, but i dont want to cry wolf until I know. Too bad that finding out could be a costly accident. hmm, what to do, what to do? For piece of mind, I'd gladly send a c-note and rely on my ablity to correctly replace and fix any errant problems in build or torque while im at it. Keep me posted how goes. It sure sounds like a tube/tire moving or the valve wouldnt have changed at all. What version did you get? Hard to know for sure, but maybe the serials help? I wonder if you guys who find issue are from close release numbers?

[BajanQQ]

11 hours ago, Sebaszz said:

ok interesting. probably i need to adjust my expectations. After some tweaking I think this is the best I can get it.

 

Wow, that is an awesome result. How did you do it? 

[Ben Hatfield]

I got my Sherman Sept 18th, and think I was one of the early production units.

I know what you are saying pressure wise.  I went up to 27psi, and did not like the ride feel.  I'm settling for 25 for now, but would like to keep it closer 20psi

Based upon observing reading various posts - I'd say that some tire/rim fits are better than others, and may have nothing to worry about in terms of the tire moving after being set.   

[.....]

To minimize losses and since Veteran doesnt fear much for liability (im guessing), I doubt we'll see any definitive way to know beforehand. Even measuring circumferences would be damn tough, especially with any real accuracy. Just for peace of mind, I'll see about getting on the list. I've enough problems and getting run over because of yet another 'maybe', isnt my cup of tea. An ounce of prevention is worth a hospital or morgue pound of cure. Ocd for sure, prolly just paranoid and itll cost me as usual. Marking my tire right now for sure, it does seem my valve has shifted a hair, but maybe its just in my head now! Are we even remotely sure if its the tire or the rim or a little of both? I'd suspect a rim or Jason probably wouldnt be bothering to order a bunch of rims. I prefer to balance the odds to prevent a crash, as I definitely push the odds when it comes to gear for surviving one.

Edited January 17, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[Fiori]

I had almost the same experience as @Sebaszz here I very straight in comparison to the starting point. 

I am #20091012, so not super close in serial to you @Ben Hatfield. I do however feel the tire moves slightly over time, although I've never had it happen to that severity. My initial crash may have been from this exact situation. And it's why I think the method of trying to ride the tire at 5-10 psi and then riding straight line to help seat the tire is an problematic, causes issues and shouldn't be suggested to people. 

I've been almost 400 miles since getting it really straight and do feel it as SLIGHTLY became less perfect visually over that distance. I thought I was being overly critical and overthinking it at first, but maybe not.  I marked the tire and rim and after a couple hundred they hadn't budged, I went to check my marks now and the water has washed my paint marks off the tire :p. Either way it rides great so I've been happy. 

V11 came today and it's a really nice machine. Clean, well built, very good quality. Suspension is pretty cool.  It's definitely more polished than the sherman. But there is just something about the thrill and solidness of riding the Sherman that cant be beat. I should also note that the tire on the V11 doesn't spin pin point perfectly true either, so I'm sure this Sherman tire alignment concern is a mix of an actual real issue and just plain overanalyzing things. That beings said, a set tire should never move on a rim during normal riding and should not require periodic realignment. 

 

Edited January 17, 2021 by Fiori

[Violinfun]

I don't see too many people reporting their experiences with their tire so for the sake of another data point here's mine.

TL;DR I have no issues with my knobby tire after 3k+ miles

Received mid October

Odometer 3217 miles

Knobby tire

PSI between 15-25

Mainly high speed street riding with plenty of carving, Atlanta potholes and steel plates

Occasional offroad, gravel including an old olympic mtb trail and an mtb training course

Max spd 52mph   regularly above 45 mph  avg cruising 25-35

No issues with the tire, has handled huge divots and potholes I have hit full speed at night, because I didn't see them or couldn't dodge to the point where I thought I should have a pinch flat, but has never happened.  I have even ridden down a couple sets of stairs just for fun, but I am not purposely trying to destroy my wheel.  Any and all wobbles at any speed I attribute entirely to my lack of skill until proved otherwise.  This is my first real wheel and I have become much better after so many miles and the wobbles have become much better as a result.

 

Happy riding all.

[routb3d]

8 hours ago, Violinfun said:

I don't see too many people reporting their experiences with their tire so for the sake of another data point here's mine.

TL;DR I have no issues with my knobby tire after 3k+ miles

Received mid October

Odometer 3217 miles

Knobby tire

PSI between 15-25

Mainly high speed street riding with plenty of carving, Atlanta potholes and steel plates

Occasional offroad, gravel including an old olympic mtb trail and an mtb training course

Max spd 52mph   regularly above 45 mph  avg cruising 25-35

No issues with the tire, has handled huge divots and potholes I have hit full speed at night, because I didn't see them or couldn't dodge to the point where I thought I should have a pinch flat, but has never happened.  I have even ridden down a couple sets of stairs just for fun, but I am not purposely trying to destroy my wheel.  Any and all wobbles at any speed I attribute entirely to my lack of skill until proved otherwise.  This is my first real wheel and I have become much better after so many miles and the wobbles have become much better as a result.

 

Happy riding all.

Just ordered a Sherman and it’s nice to see things going well for you.. I hope I’m a lucky one like you!! 

[rexdelmolvo]

On 1/16/2021 at 1:51 PM, Sebaszz said:

ok interesting. probably i need to adjust my expectations. After some tweaking I think this is the best I can get it.

 

What methods did you use to acheive this? Just deflating, massaging, and riding on low PSI before a full fill? This is kind of a dramatic improvement!

[Mango]

Just ride the wheel, the wobbles will go away with the miles. My Sherman wobbles were more pronounced than in this video. As long as it doesn’t affect the ride stability, it is not an issue.

Internet posts by a few individuals just amplifies issues. Its like living in a hospital, you think everyone is sick and dying.