Leaperkim Lynx 2700wh: 151V, 20" tire, suspension, 89lb

[Robse]

 

[tst]

Just wondering how does this 3200w motor stack up against the V14's 4000 watt?

I guess what matters is the total amps the whole system of motor, battery and controller can all handle. The least of those(weakest link) should be the number that matters.

Edited October 29, 2023 by tst

[Rawnei]

Motor watts seems completely irrelevant, if I am to guess based on Patton (and to some degree Sherman S) performance the Lynx will crush all competition.

[xiiijojjo]

Everything looks good but for that kind of speed paired with a small 2700wh battery I feel a lot of people will barely get to have top speed fun on this wheel before they have to start worrying about charging or going slower. 

Anything capable of going 90kmph+ with 150v< needs at least 3600wh to remain fun for more than 45min  

Don't get me wrong I hate heavy wheels and I don't go on long rides, but with these speeds we either need 3600wh+ or 30min charging from 0-100%.

I think people will love this wheel for the first few miles after which point they will wish they had gotten a 3600-4800wh battery. 

[carlitos]

On 10/28/2023 at 3:29 AM, fbhb said:

Just posted on Telegram today, is this photo of the New Leaperkim "Lynx" by member Ivan:

 

 

Which Telegram group is that?

[Paul g]

 

2 hours ago, tst said:

Just wondering how does this 3200w motor stack up against the V14's 4000 watt?

I guess what matters is the total amps the whole system of motor, battery and controller can all handle. The least of those(weakest link) should be the number that matters.

       They are two different wheels. One is torque oriented the other is speed oriented. Stacking them up against each other would make no sense. My view is that LeaperKim tries for the first time to make a race machine to compete against wheels like the Master. This is definitely not a Sherman type cruiser. Making this wheel with high discharge rate batteries is a no-brainer, why would LeaperKim use Samsung 50E??? Is like making an omelet without eggs  🤮😂 😂

[tst]

3 hours ago, xiiijojjo said:

Everything looks good but for that kind of speed paired with a small 2700wh battery I feel a lot of people will barely get to have top speed fun on this wheel before they have to start worrying about charging or going slower. 

Anything capable of going 90kmph+ with 150v< needs at least 3600wh to remain fun for more than 45min  

Don't get me wrong I hate heavy wheels and I don't go on long rides, but with these speeds we either need 3600wh+ or 30min charging from 0-100%.

I think people will love this wheel for the first few miles after which point they will wish they had gotten a 3600-4800wh battery. 

In my country many people don't even commute more then 45 mins ... in their cars. Let alone on euc.

What's the true average speed that one can achieve in normal life with other traffic etc? Who can go 90 for extended time? Not many. It's always lower. That fact alone extends the battery use a lot.

There is the Sherman S and the EX30 for long range. So those buyers are covered. And probably within one year they'll update the Sherms. For people needing 3600-4800 the Lynx simply isn't it. Just like the Patton isn't for people who like a bigger tire. It's not better or worse. It's a spec, a tradeoff between weight and range. With every new euc there will be people who are disappointed that it does not have the exact specs that they value for themselves. But as time goes on there is more and more choice for everyone.  We euc riders are very lucky. I'm still seeing e-bikes being sold with 42 volt etc. Now we are going to 150 lol

Bigger battery is more weight. I think it's a good thing that they think about the weight. The magnesium is also thoughtful.

I'm curious to see where this 'arms race' will end. What will be the top speed when the tech isn't a bottleneck anymore but just the physics. Surely there'll be a speed where a single tire or just aerodynamics will be the limiting factor.

Edited October 29, 2023 by tst

[techyiam]

34 minutes ago, tst said:

I'm curious to see where this 'arms race' will end.

When there is no longer a market demand for them. It doesn't look like we are there yet.

Pretty sure there are few riders over in Dubai who are still looking for more speed.

And plenty of demand in the USA.

Edited October 29, 2023 by techyiam

[Rollin-on-1]

2 hours ago, Paul g said:

 why would LeaperKim use Samsung 50E???  

Possibly using up existing inventories or waiting on 50S delivery.  Agreed though, ths wheel needs high discharge batteries.  The Lynx with a 6P config would be very interesting.

[techyiam]

25 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

Possibly using up existing inventories or waiting on 50S delivery.  Agreed though, ths wheel needs high discharge batteries.  The Lynx with a 6P config would be very interesting.

I think it would make more sense to upgrade Sherman S to 151.2 V, and 6P 50S cells.

36 cells * 3.6 V * 5 Ah * 6P = 3888 Wh

[Jason McNeil]

This morning's Lynx update: 
- LK has 20x preprods completed, shipping out this week to FreshlyCharged, Kuji, Marty, NYC (Hsiang/Ronin)—rest are allocated for testers in China
- The Preprods are fitted with the CST-186 tire, I've requested that they switch to the tried-and-tested Kenda K262 for default knobby tire, unless there's a better knobby option (Shinko's can not be sourced in CN) 
- According to spec sheet, both the Patton & Lynx are 40kg, can't be right (???), checking tomorrow morning.... 
- Any distrbutor can request 50S cells for their Lynx production, raw cell material costs are like $200 more
- If using 50S, the BMS thresholds will be increasaed to 78°C discharge & 65°C charge 
- Jack mentioned that the 'raw' potential of the motor/controller system was 168KPH free-spin, but they've electronically limited to 125KPH— obviously having a decent >15-20KPH buffer is essential for safety!
- @Electric Dreams has possession of a Lynx over the past few days, targetting a video release on Thursday evening CN time 
- Working on sourcing  a 10A/150A charger, which can be used with the stock 5A charger, for a combined 15A/2,250W input 
- Since the Lynx, Patton & SS are pretty similar in a number of areas, produced this Comparison graphic, will be launching deposit page by EOD   

 

Edited October 29, 2023 by Jason McNeil

[Rawnei]

1 hour ago, Jason McNeil said:

- According to spec sheet, both the Patton & Lynx are 40kg, can't be right (???), checking tomorrow morning....    

Benefit of Magnesium Alloy.

[PourUC]

9 hours ago, xiiijojjo said:

Everything looks good but for that kind of speed paired with a small 2700wh battery I feel a lot of people will barely get to have top speed fun on this wheel before they have to start worrying about charging or going slower. 

Anything capable of going 90kmph+ with 150v< needs at least 3600wh to remain fun for more than 45min  

Don't get me wrong I hate heavy wheels and I don't go on long rides, but with these speeds we either need 3600wh+ or 30min charging from 0-100%.

I think people will love this wheel for the first few miles after which point they will wish they had gotten a 3600-4800wh battery. 

Unless you off-road and do hills.

Not everyone is an NYC rider that just does speed runs all day. For me, if this wheel is good then it's just what I would like. More range than my S22 doing trails. Better torque for jumps and hill climbs. Able to go effortlessly normal speed (30-40mph) up normal hills.

My kinda riding normally ends up in me being out for 2 hours, with a break as part of those 2 hours. It's fine. My commute is 11 miles in total (there and back) so it works fine for that.

I get that people like you want it to have range. But it really annoys me when people act like your use case is the only use case. Same people that said the Patton was DOA based on it having a smaller battery.

[Critzlez]

Just now, PourUC said:

Unless you off-road and do hills.

Not everyone is an NYC rider that just does speed runs all day. For me, if this wheel is good then it's just what I would like. More range than my S22 doing trails. Better torque for jumps and hill climbs. Able to go effortlessly normal speed (30-40mph) up normal hills.

My kinda riding normally ends up in me being out for 2 hours, with a break as part of those 2 hours. It's fine. My commute is 11 miles in total (there and back) so it works fine for that.

I get that people like you want it to have range. But it really annoys me when people act like your use case is the only use case. Same people that said the Patton was DOA based on it having a smaller battery.

The main thing is that it's $4,200, which at that point you could just get a sherman S or an ex30 and still have plenty of speed while having a much bigger battery

[PourUC]

Just now, Critzlez said:

The main thing is that it's $4,200, which at that point you could just get a sherman S or an ex30 and still have plenty of speed while having a much bigger battery

But have less torque and a heavier wheel.

Same thing was said about Patton. In the UK that sold for £3400, Sherman S for about £4050.

Spend a little bit more, get a bunch more torque. The reality is, people have different use cases. If you off-road primarily as the 'fun' bit then you truly don't need 3600wh battery. Again, people struggling to understand a different use case. Go do off-road trails for an hour and then have a word with your lower back, your sweaty pits and your trembling feet about how you need to go another 2 hours.

This gives more range than the S22 and Patton, and has way more torque. That is a bonus. No where in my head am I thinking "I could get a sherman s instead". To me, this competes with the S22, Patton, Extreme, V14 segment of off-road wheels. The 16" being akin to smaller dirt bikes, and the S22 and Lynx being adventure bikes. With the S22 being a KLR and this being a KTM 890.

 

[Paul g]

6 hours ago, Jason McNeil said:

This morning's Lynx update: 
- LK has 20x preprods completed, shipping out this week to FreshlyCharged, Kuji, Marty, NYC (Hsiang/Ronin)—rest are allocated for testers in China
- The Preprods are fitted with the CST-186 tire, I've requested that they switch to the tried-and-tested Kenda K262 for default knobby tire, unless there's a better knobby option (Shinko's can not be sourced in CN) 
- According to spec sheet, both the Patton & Lynx are 40kg, can't be right (???), checking tomorrow morning.... 
- Any distrbutor can request 50S cells for their Lynx production, raw cell material costs are like $200 more
- If using 50S, the BMS thresholds will be increasaed to 78°C discharge & 65°C charge 
- Jack mentioned that the 'raw' potential of the motor/controller system was 168KPH free-spin, but they've electronically limited to 125KPH— obviously having a decent >15-20KPH buffer is essential for safety!
- @Electric Dreams has possession of a Lynx over the past few days, targetting a video release on Thursday evening CN time 
- Working on sourcing  a 10A/150A charger, which can be used with the stock 5A charger, for a combined 15A/2,250W input 
- Since the Lynx, Patton & SS are pretty similar in a number of areas, produced this Comparison graphic, will be launching deposit page by EOD   

 

       Thank you! So the max speed would be around 105 Km/h with good safety margin. I would love to see the first reviews, which would probably be some riding experience sharing, but more so a properly done teardown, that’s where the real meat is. Water protection/sealing, sturdiness of construction/screws used, tire change ease, these are really important stuff that I’m personally waiting for the most, beyond simple specs. It would be nice if at least one of these wheels would get to someone that could do this.

[Frolic0415]

9 hours ago, techyiam said:

When there is no longer a market demand for them. It doesn't look like we are there yet.

Pretty sure there are few riders over in Dubai who are still looking for more speed.

And plenty of demand in the USA.

There's a market for them here in Australia too, a lot of the riders like the heavy high-speed wheels

[Ryan5508]

This would be great on the empty running trails I ride at 2am. My v11 just beeps constantly on me now. 

I don't need the top speed off the Lynx but having more overhead would never hurt. 

Decisions, decisions... 

[Paul D]

Preordered. V14 as well. Which one should I go for? 

[techyiam]

24 minutes ago, Paul D said:

Preordered. V14 as well. Which one should I go for? 

Since you are an experience rider, and already ride the Sherman S, I would wait to hear what other have to say about both wheels, and if possible, see them in person, and actually get on one.

If would be difficult to know which wheel would be better suited to you without you experiencing them.

As for myself, I was very surprised how much I like my Abrams, even after having test ridden, the Patton, S22, Sherman S, EX30, Commander Mini, OG Sherman, and V13.

Sure, each wheel will have plus and minuses. The question is, overall, how much better are these two new wheels than what you have already, and which of the two is better suited to you?

[Jason McNeil]

19 hours ago, Rawnei said:

Benefit of Magnesium Alloy.

Amazing,  it looks correct! Packing in 500Wh more capacity (24x additional cells), with a 20" tire, larger frame, while keeping the weight at the same ~40kg/88lb as the Patton! The first time any manufacturer has achieved a significant spec bump, without a corresponding notch in net weight.  

EDIT: got some additional data on the structural components that were changed to magnesium alloy:
- Controller plate: 0.7kg
- Battery case: 2x 1.82kg
- Battery inside panels: 2x 0.43kg
- Motor assembly (with rim): 10.66kg 

 

Edited October 30, 2023 by Jason McNeil

[techyiam]

1 minute ago, Jason McNeil said:

Amazing,  it looks correct! Packing in 500Wh more capacity (24x additional cells), with a 20" tire, larger frame, while keeping the weight at the same ~40kg/88lb as the Patton!

Indeed. And the Lynx does not look less sturdy in anyway. Leaper Kim continues to impress.

[Mango]

What the Abrams should have been.

[techyiam]

35 minutes ago, Mango said:

What the Abrams should have been.

Ideal, no doubt.

The Abrams came out right after the OG Sherman.

If that was the case, then Leaper Kim would had to come up with a suspension design during that time frame, which they didn't have.

Going to 22" was reasonable then. Unfortunately, the learning curve was steep for people to adapt to such big wheels.

If Leaper Kim came up with the Lynx instead of the Abrams, they would have been able to blow away all competitors. Can you imagine, FastAce hydraulic suspension, 50S cells, 151.2 V system, Smart BMS, and 36 mosfets, 6P controller.

[Rollin-on-1]

20 hours ago, techyiam said:

I think it would make more sense to upgrade Sherman S to 151.2 V, and 6P 50S cells.

36 cells * 3.6 V * 5 Ah * 6P = 3888 Wh

It is probably coming in another year or two. 

A line up I'd like to see is 126v Patton with 4P, 151.2v Lynx with 4P, a 151.2v Lynx XR with 6p, a 151.2v Sherman S Pro with 8P...and maybe a 22" 151.2v 10P (Abrams S Pro?).