Deleted

[Paul A]

Lisa Banes was the actress killed.

Brian Boyd is the suspect arrested and accused, in remand.

[UniBlab]

Vision Zero??? What a perfect name!!!

 

 

[Paul A]

https://ebiketips.road.cc/content/news/new-york-e-bike-shop-got-a-25k-fine-for-selling-e-bikes-3009

May 6, 2021.

Bike store 'Propel' was fined, but won the court case.

"Nolte’s case therefore helped set a precedent that pedal-assist e-bikes were legal. He has since opened a second branch of Propel in Long Beach, California."

[Skeptikos]

1 hour ago, LanghamP said:

NYC proper effectively bans all electric powered vehicles including EUCs and all electric bikes except the occasional city-owned eBike. While the law relaxed eBikes during the pandemic, that law has now been strongly enforced. Even bicycles are being strongly enforced when not using the bicycle lanes regardless if the bike lane is blocked. Bike stores are presently being fined something north of $16,000 (Propel recently got a fine for $26,000) by the NYC for merely selling eBikes and eScooters.

Apparently, NYC is being very pro-active in getting all vehicles except cars off their roads. They want you to drive or take public transportation.

My suspicion is that ever since that famous actress who I can't remember the name of was killed by an eScooter, NYC authorities have decided to remove all eBikes, eScooters, and EUCs from their city.

I think you're getting confused somehow. The graphic above is from the NYC DOT, and it specifically applies to NYC, and they specifically say e-bikes and e-scooters are *legal* on the road.

[Skeptikos]

I think NYC DOT's position is probably that, if a vehicle hasn't specifically been legalized, then it's illegal on the street. If you carefully read NY state traffic laws, it says that vehicles, aside from a few very specific categories, have to be registered to ride on the street. Since you can't register an EUC that makes it illegal.

And the graphic could be referring to sidewalk laws as well, it isn't totally clear.

Anyway, there aren't any state or city laws specifically about unicycles, so they have to be using some kind of generic argument along those lines. A few weeks ago I contacted them through their website to ask for clarification, but they haven't responded yet.

 

I think if you carefully read state traffic laws you'll find that this same reasoning applies in many states, and a lot of what people have been calling a "gray area" is actually illegal but just not enforced. But sometimes slower EUCs (<20mph max speed) fall into categories that are specifically exempted.

[mike_bike_kite]

I'm probably just bitter and twisted but the videos of people riding like a maniacs amongst pedestrians usually come from NY. If we were sensible we'd be promoting how green EUC's are and how easily they fit into everyday life. Instead we have people doing speed tests in public parks, riding down the freeway on a unicycle or barging through people on pedestrian crossings. What did you guys honestly expect? 

You guys seem to be about a year behind the UK at the moment. It will start off with you getting friendly warnings from the police then, before you know it, you'll suddenly find the road blocked and everyone on an EUC or escooter getting fined, their wheels confiscated and the serious risk of having your driving license revoked. That's currently the sad situation here in London.

[Ronin Ryder]

16 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said:

I'm probably just bitter and twisted but the videos of people riding like a maniacs amongst pedestrians usually come from NY. If we were sensible we'd be promoting how green EUC's are and how easily they fit into everyday life. Instead we have people doing speed tests in public parks, riding down the freeway on a unicycle or barging through people on pedestrian crossings. What did you guys honestly expect? 

You guys seem to be about a year behind the UK at the moment. It will start off with you getting friendly warnings from the police then, before you know it, you'll suddenly find the road blocked and everyone on an EUC or escooter getting fined, their wheels confiscated and the serious risk of having your driving license revoked. That's currently the sad situation here in London.

Hundreds of euc riders ride every day in nyc. And youtube isn't everyday life. I must say, after reading this topic and others, I find it weird to see regularly on Facebook or here people revel in a fictional ban in NYC. I wouldn't welcome any ban of euc anywhere in the world personally.... 

Edited August 31, 2021 by Ronin Ryder

[Skeptikos]

I'm trying not to get rude, but please at least read the graphic before unloading a bunch of random anxieties onto New Yorkers.

E-scooters are officially *legal* in NYC. It says so right there in the infographic at the top of the thread. That's a result of NY state law. They aren't about to be confiscated.

If you aren't getting even these basic facts right, well, no offense, but please consider just not commenting next time so that we don't have to constantly correct misinformation from people who have never looked at the laws in NY.

[GPW]

This is ultimately about what the city decides to enforce and how, and it is always evolving. The status for EUCs has not changed, and as far as anyone here has experienced - neither has functional enforcement. What is new since last year was the formal legalization of e-bikes and e-scooters.

I may not get all the exact history right but it goes something like this - E-bikes and e-scooters did not have formal legal status until last year during the pandemic, achieved largely because of the people using such e-vehicles to deliver food - this helped push the politics of the debate forward. This had been a subject of much debate for a long time before. Prior to last year, e-bikes and e-scooters were also "not legal", yet you saw them everywhere all the time. There were periods where e-bikes were targeted by police to some degree, but the practice was met with some backlash and there were attempts reorient towards focusing on addressing bad behavior - some ebb and flow between the two over time. The lack of formally legalized status for EUCs (and one wheels and electric skateboards) is a reflection of their status not having changed last year, where e-bikes and e-scooters were formally legalized. For the time being, the police have been treating EUCs like e-scooters, but this could change or follow the path of e-bikes where enforcement policies went back and forth over time. 

As much as this forum is focused on EUCs, important to keep in mind that the debate in NYC is far broader with more focus on the more commonly used personal electric vehicles. You see all sorts of vehicles in bike lanes these days, including larger scooters that are obviously gas driven. And I assure you there are issues with following the traffic rules for every type of personal vehicle - regular cyclists running red lights is basically common practice, and obviously there are more issues with e-bikes that tend to move somewhat faster. There are a lot more people riding the full spectrum of personal vehicles, and with increased ridership there will be issues and shifts in policy. The technology moves faster than policy, and much much faster than infrastructure. 

My own take is that as pev use grows, the city will need to find ways to regulate behavior rather than devices. That couples with building out more infrastructure.

 

 

[Skeptikos]

I wonder if the issue is that the graphic colored the e-scooter column red and people just aren't bothering to read the text. 😅 Read the text people!

Edited August 31, 2021 by Skeptikos

[Skeptikos]

There's a huge irony that, while on the forums all we hear are neverending lectures to New Yorkers about how they're going to get things banned, in reality over the last few years New York has been legalizing personal electric vehicles.

And now there are new graphics showing exactly what was legalized, and many of the same lecturers incorrectly interpret it as "EUCs were just banned". 🤪

Just, ugh, my least favorite genre of forum comment. So unhelpful

[mike_bike_kite]

1 hour ago, Skeptikos said:

There's a huge irony that, while on the forums all we hear are neverending lectures to New Yorkers about how they're going to get things banned, in reality over the last few years New York has been legalizing personal electric vehicles.

In all honesty I doubt if anyone outside of NY cares what laws are passed there but we do care about what laws are being passed in our own countries. The constant videos from NY of irresponsible riders endangering the public has influenced impressionable riders all over the world. I guess that's why the producers of these videos are called influencers. Instead of being seen as a clean, affordable and fun commuting solution, PEVs are now just seen as a danger to the public. When you see how people ride on these videos, it's quite easy to see why. 

[Surfling]

8 hours ago, LanghamP said:

While the law relaxed eBikes during the pandemic, that law has now been strongly enforced. Even bicycles are being strongly enforced when not using the bicycle lanes regardless if the bike lane is blocked.

is this factual? 

I commute to the city and do all my errands, weather permitting, on my EUC frequently. Never got a word from any NYPD encounters. I also work with a few of them.

[Paul A]

The NY video of a regular, weekly race in a public thoroughfare is disturbing.  

Close proximity side by side, high speed racing, in a narrow, enclosed, single lane tunnel.

The walls are solid, hard, bluestone/concrete.

Random spectators/camera operators/parked bikes/objects along the side of the route.

Racing for pink slips, where the loser forfeits ownership to the winner.  (Illegal gambling)

If a rider crashes, they can hit a solid, hard wall, bounce, ricochet directly or into path, of the other rider. 

Purpose built, designed race tracks have plenty of run off space, gravel traps all around.  Barriers are to be avoided and only used in existing repurposed street circuits.

Crashing, sliding, tumbling is survivable with gear, with gradual deceleration and energy dissipation.  Not so much when hitting a solid wall.

Princess Diana was killed in a tunnel.

 

[UniBlab]

14 minutes ago, Surfling said:

is this factual? 

I commute to the city and do all my errands, weather permitting, on my EUC frequently. Never got a word from any NYPD encounters. I also work with a few of them.

Don't worry so much about it Bro!!!  Just go about your biz and act responsibly - PD won't even look your way.  In fact, because of your job exposure, you'll be the first to know if they are coming down on EUC's.  And if you work with pd, ask them!!!

 

 

[Surfling]

31 minutes ago, UniBlab said:

Don't worry so much about it Bro!!! 

Never was, bro....just for clarity. There's fake news here and there.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Surfling

[Surfling]

10 minutes ago, UniBlab said:

And if you work with pd, ask them!!!

.....and what makes you think I don't? .." never got a word from any NYPD".... in case you missed that!

Edited September 1, 2021 by Surfling

[Paul A]

From the chart by the New York City DOT:

"Not Legal E-mobility devices"

"The following are examples of illegal e-mobility devices"

"Electric unicycle (two types)"

With picture of an EUC.

[UniBlab]

25 minutes ago, Surfling said:

.....and what makes you think I don't? .." never got a word from any NYPD".... in case you missed that!

Ahh gotcha!  That tells me they don't know what to do...haha.

[Foo Barstein]

EUC's in the city may properly be classified as wheelbarrows.  And use of wheelbarrows is regulated according to the city's construction codes, which forbid you from pouring concrete washout water from your EUC into any sewer, catch basin, drain, or body of water or let it leach into the ground.

[Skeptikos]

3 hours ago, mike_bike_kite said:

In all honesty I doubt if anyone outside of NY cares what laws are passed there but we do care about what laws are being passed in our own countries. The constant videos from NY of irresponsible riders endangering the public has influenced impressionable riders all over the world. I guess that's why the producers of these videos are called influencers. Instead of being seen as a clean, affordable and fun commuting solution, PEVs are now just seen as a danger to the public. When you see how people ride on these videos, it's quite easy to see why. 

I don't even care to argue about this with you. Can you please just stop spreading misinformation about New York laws and bans? That's all I want

[Skeptikos]

2 hours ago, Surfling said:

is this factual? 

I commute to the city and do all my errands, weather permitting, on my EUC frequently. Never got a word from any NYPD encounters. I also work with a few of them.

No, it's completely wrong. E-bikes are explicitly, officially legal in NYC. The chart from NYC DOT in the first post has the correct info. NYC DOT is a better source of info than anyone posting in this forum.

[.....]

12 minutes ago, Skeptikos said:

No, it's completely wrong. E-bikes are explicitly, officially legal in NYC. The chart from NYC DOT in the first post has the correct info. NYC DOT is a better source of info than anyone posting in this forum.

So... euc's aren't  "legal" on the streets of nyc? I thought the pdf shown was  accurate but then it was called inaccurate. I am still lost about the truth here. I think I shall just give up tho, as I dont live in NYC anyhow. The OP seemed to be asking a pretty simple question. I guess not...

Edited September 1, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[Skeptikos]

2 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

So... euc's aren't  "legal" on the streets of nyc? I thought the pdf shown was  accurate but then it was called inaccurate. I am still lost about the truth here. I think I shall just give up tho, as I dont live in NYC anyhow. The OP seemed to be asking a pretty simple question. I guess not...

Just about everything in the pdf is clearly accurate and you can look up the specific laws to verify it. The e-bike and e-scooter sections, in particular, are based on a new law that took effect at the end of 2020.

There's only a nitpicky question about whether EUCs are really illegal or if it's actually a gray area. That question is hard to answer because NYC DOT doesn't explain the reasoning behind the "illegal" label, and there isn't any law specifically making EUCs illegal. NYC DOT could definitely be right that they're illegal. I personally think that they're right, based on a very literal reading of NY traffic laws. But it's hard to verify because they don't explain the reasoning.

But overall NYC DOT should be a reliable source of info about NYC traffic laws. Whether EUCs are illegal or legally gray, the point is that they haven't been officially legalized, unlike e-bikes and e-scooters which are totally legal now.

[mike_bike_kite]

4 hours ago, Skeptikos said:

Can you please just stop spreading misinformation about New York laws and bans?

So what have I said that was misinformation? Are you saying EUCs are legal in NY?

3 hours ago, Skeptikos said:

There's only a nitpicky question about whether EUCs are really illegal or if it's actually a gray area. That question is hard to answer because NYC DOT doesn't explain the reasoning behind the "illegal" label, and there isn't any law specifically making EUCs illegal. NYC DOT could definitely be right that they're illegal.

Or you're saying they're illegal?