EUC Bodyguard from roll.nz

[Meulebeest]

On 11/5/2019 at 7:30 AM, The Fat Unicyclist said:

So many wheels... So few EUC Bodyguard Designers!!!   

We did look at the Z10 about 4-5 months ago and at that time it proved quite challenging to deliver (and subsequently put on hold).

However, our EUC Bodyguards are still evolving and the learning that we get from each new model or iteration adds to our understanding of how the Neoprene needs to fit for optimal protection, how it will stretch which affects LED cutouts, and where it needs to attach for stability...  And some of the key points we have learned since we first looked at the Z10 may mean that it is possible, so we will put it back on the "to do" list and see what we can manage...   

Hi @The Fat Unicyclist,

Any news on the Z10 bodyguard progress ?

Really would love one, certainly when always refixing these original stick-on pads, I 'd like more permanent solution

And I know there is a market here in Europe :-)

[The Fat Unicyclist]

12 hours ago, Meulebeest said:

Hi @The Fat Unicyclist,

Any news on the Z10 bodyguard progress ?

Really would love one, certainly when always refixing these original stick-on pads, I 'd like more permanent solution

And I know there is a market here in Europe :-)

As mentioned above, the Z10 has proved quite a challenge... But having worked out the Bodyguard for the KS-16X (and then resolving some initial issues) we want to look at it again... They are quite similar at the bottom.

[bcarp]

I'm not too sure where to post this message, but has anyone been having problems with the fitting of the EUC Bodyguard on a KS16X? I saw original problems, which I assumed were resolved after messaged in this forum, but an EUC Bodyguard I got a few days ago doesn't fit well, with the bottom of the Bodyguard pulling up & hooking on the pedal instead of the bottom of the KS16X. It looks like the problems described in the early reviews here on the KS16X.

I tried emailing @The Fat Unicyclist, but no reply yet, so I thought I'd ask here if people are receiving modified Bodyguards that work (and I just happened to receive old stock) or whether this is an ongoing unresolved issue.

[travsformation]

1 minute ago, bcarp said:

I'm not too sure where to post this message, but has anyone been having problems with the fitting of the EUC Bodyguard on a KS16X? I saw original problems, which I assumed were resolved after messaged in this forum, but an EUC Bodyguard I got a few days ago doesn't fit well, with the bottom of the Bodyguard pulling up & hooking on the pedal instead of the bottom of the KS16X. It looks like the problems described in the early reviews here on the KS16X.

I tried emailing @The Fat Unicyclist, but no reply yet, so I thought I'd ask here if people are receiving modified Bodyguards that work (and I just happened to receive old stock) or whether this is an ongoing unresolved issue.

No worries about posting, that's what the forum is for!

Kevin has great customer service and is usually very quick to reply, but he's been absent from the forum for some time, I think he's been a bit overwhelmed with the release of the new Gotway line of bodyguards (first the Monster, then the Nikola & now the MSX, all in a very short time-span). A lot of work goes into designing, tinkering with, testing, perfecting and finally producing new models...so I wouldn't be surprised if his inbox is overflowing with emails he can't keep up with. As soon as things settle down, I'm sure you can count on a reply.

In the meantime, maybe the rest of us can help troubleshoot. I haven't had an issues with my 16X fitting. It's customized with stitching, but is all-black, so I'm assuming the body itself was already in stock. I've had it for about two months, when did you buy yours? I can't quite picture the issue you're describing...could you post a picture? Maybe I'll be able to help you better.

[bcarp]

4 hours ago, travsformation said:

In the meantime, maybe the rest of us can help troubleshoot.

Thanks travsformation, that would be great. I only bought this a few days ago. The importer has offered to change it for another one in stock, but what I'd like to know if whether the replacement is going to have the same issues or not.

My issue is that the EUC Bodyguard doesn't fit the body of the KS16X. Well, it does, but it doesn't stay there. There's a flap that should go under the body of the EUC, but that flap is not contoured correctly & doesn't hold anything, allowing the neoprene to contract & ride up. While the EUC Bodyguard won't fall off because it's hooked around the pedals, this bunching obscures the rear safety lights, which is a bigger issue.

I see forum posts suggesting a redesign of the under-flap extension (which I think is what it needs), or velcro additions to the EUC Bodyguard (which to me seems like a temporary fix until the velcro fails to hold). Mine came with neither.

I've put some pictures here: https://imgur.com/a/AiDlqxX

I made a short video as well, but won't post it here. I'll let Kevin see it first & see if he explain or come up with a solution.

I'm open to any suggestions to solve this that don't damage this item as I still want the option of returning it. My question to myself is whether I ride with it on (the EUC Bodyguard may get dirty or damaged) or off (may get my brand new KS16X damaged).

[.....]

Wait for a response from him and ask. I contacted them and got a fairly prompt and courteous response, very recently.  You may be surprised at his understanding of the situation and what he may suggest. Im so stupid, i went a week before I even noticed the lower tabs for the 18xl cover. It was riding up a bit, THEN i realized the tabs. Loved it since. Boy is that 16x an odd shaped beast.  Keep us posted.

Edited March 11, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[travsformation]

On 3/11/2020 at 7:30 AM, bcarp said:

Thanks travsformation, that would be great. I only bought this a few days ago. The importer has offered to change it for another one in stock, but what I'd like to know if whether the replacement is going to have the same issues or not.

If it came from an importer, maybe it is from older stock that's been sitting around for some time.... [Edit: it looks like that's definitely the case]

On 3/11/2020 at 7:30 AM, bcarp said:

My issue is that the EUC Bodyguard doesn't fit the body of the KS16X. Well, it does, but it doesn't stay there. There's a flap that should go under the body of the EUC, but that flap is not contoured correctly & doesn't hold anything, allowing the neoprene to contract & ride up. While the EUC Bodyguard won't fall off because it's hooked around the pedals, this bunching obscures the rear safety lights, which is a bigger issue.

Based on the picture below, what I first noticed is the lack of tension around the light, which clearly indicates that the sleeve needs to be pulled further down.

I was simply going to suggest re-adjusting when I noticed that the bottom flap isn't the same as on mine. The material isn't the same, it appears to be neoprene or a similar fabric. This is what mine looks like (went trail riding this weekend, haven't cleaned the wheel yet hehe):

As you can see, the outer side of the flap is more of a fleece-type material (for lack of a better word), with a seam around the edges, and the inner side is rubberized so it doesn't slip, Edit: The flap is a thin piece of leather, soft suede on the outside and nice & grippy (looks kind of rubberized) on the inside. No seam. It folds over the bottom contour of the wheel and stays in place (although it's worth checking it from time to time...after long off-road tours, it can come undone). 

I get the impression yours must be from an older production batch because of the manufacturing differences (I received mine in early January, sent straight from NZ). So if you're having problems adjusting it, just have the importer/reseller replace it with another. Or mention the adjustment issues you have and the manufacturing differences outlined in this post to your importer/reseller, and if he can't guarantee he'll send you a "fresher" unit, return it and order another straight from roll.nz. You're in Sydney, after all...it only took 4 days for mine to be shipped from NZ to Spain!

When you do get the new one, take some time to adjust it correctly. I remember getting a little "bulge" above the pedal, like yours (but not nearly as much), after first putting it on, but pulling the bodyguard tightly from front and rear "ironed it out". It can take a little adjusting here and there until you get it just right.

It is worth noting, though, that the BG does obscure the rear lights. I initially thought it might be a manufacturing defect on my particular BG, but checked a few videos online and noticed that it seems do the same on everyone else's too. But come to think of it, I don't see this as a design flaw, but rather a limitation that's hard to bypass due to the shape of the wheel:

Even if you make a cutout for the lights, it's just a hole in the material (which is stretched tightly so the sleeve doesn't move around), that can't really make up for the cutout shape of the lights (which are indented/depressed). There's no way around that unless you actually stick the rearmost side of it to the shell. I tested using adhesive velcro, since I don't want it permanently fixed to the wheel: One thin strip at the front side of the light, to keep the light cutout aligned, and one at the rear, to hold the sleeve against the shell. The lights are still partially obscured, but it's better than it was. I'm going to have to try a different system though (sewn instead of adhesive velcro, and maybe a stronger velcro) because after a little trail-riding, the dust ends up loosening the adhesive on the velcro. As you can see, the light is still visible diagonally but not from straight behind (note this picture was taken after the velcro had come loose)

I'll eventually work out a better system, but for now, I've switched the riding LEDs to all-red, and from auto mode to "breathing", which makes them pulsate gently, but keeps them always on (=more visiblity at night). I've also added a cheap, rechargeable bike light that conveniently clips on very well right on the cutout for the charging port. I imagine this solution won't suit everyone, but to me, it isn't a big trade-off compared to keeping my wheel safe from the consequences of my reckless riding

Hope this helped!

Edited March 12, 2020 by travsformation

[Unventor]

@travsformation I think we have to report you for EUC bodybuard abuse.

What did you do to that think? Are you excavating something with your KS16X? 

[travsformation]

3 hours ago, Unventor said:

@travsformation I think we have to report you for EUC bodybuard abuse.

What did you do to that think? Are you excavating something with your KS16X? 

It's Spain...hasn't rained for a while so the trails are really dusty (wait to see the wheel in August...). The wheel only has 126 km on it and no falls, so no abuse yet. Just wait 'til I've put more kms on it...you've seen what the pedals on my 18XL look like...  

[Rehab1]

8 hours ago, travsformation said:

 

 

You should add my Gene MudTongue to your Bodyguard for a clean look. 
 

 

[travsformation]

1 hour ago, Rehab1 said:

You should add my Gene MudTongue to your Bodyguard for a clean look. 
 

 

Sweet! Love it!

[Lefteris]

Also a non-paid endorsment but it's the first time i see a Nikola bodyguard.

https://www.roll.nz/euc-bodyguard/83-205-euc-bodyguard-for-gw-nikola.html#/127-colour_combination-black_sides_olive_green_edges

And i would have bought it if :

Case #1: Some one could verify it would fit my Nikola Plus
Case #2: Haven't had a talk with a friend to buy his Ninebot S2 for my kid :-/ ( ) 

[bcarp]

18 hours ago, travsformation said:

I get the impression yours must be from an older production batch because of the manufacturing differences

I suspect this may be the case. Can you show me a picture of a close-up of your flap? Here's mine, which looks quite different to yours:

 

Edited March 12, 2020 by bcarp
Forgot picture

[Unventor]

I were discussing details for my order up until a few days ago. So I am waiting to get final confirmation/order setup. 

If I understand it correctly they have been busy with different things. They have always been very responsive in the past. 

So patience. 

[travsformation]

3 hours ago, bcarp said:

I suspect this may be the case. Can you show me a picture of a close-up of your flap? Here's mine, which looks quite different to yours:

Upon closer inspection, the flap isn't "fleece-like" on the outside and rubberized on the inside, it's a thin layer of leather, with no seam around the edges (what I thought was the seam was the inside of the flap curling over on the edges). 😅

Outside (as seen from below):

Inside:

View of how it should fit under the pedal (the rest you can see in my previous pictures)

Looking at your pictures and comparing to mine, the differences don't fully explain why yours doesn't stay in place. Try this:

Unfasten the top velcro to relieve tension. Undo the velcro around the rear of the pedal and adjust the flap around the bottom edge of the wheel first, then attach the bottom velcro afterwards (leave the top velcro undone, do that last). If it doesn't seem to reach, take notice of the light cutouts: are they aligned with the lights? The idea is to keep the bottom as is and adjust the rest of the BG. Pull the sleeve further down until you can attach the velcro strap. It can be a little tricky, but this way you make sure that the bottom flap, which you want to stay fixed in place, doesn't move, while you adjust the rest of the BG (which stretches). Take notice of horizontal and vertical alignment. Also look at the top of the wheel: I initially couldn't get the bottom velcro fastened, but then realized I hadn't pulled the bodyguard down tightly enough from the top. It can take a little tinkering

Once you're satisfied, fasten the top velcro. Stretch the sleeve laterally a bit, pull the front forwards and rear backwards. Check the LED, power input, USB & light sensor cutouts and make sure they're all properly aligned. You might get a little bulge (not as much as in your pic) above the pedals at first. On mine it went away after I'd put a few kms on it. You might also need to make small adjustments after the first couple of rides (and after that, from time to time), as it gradually settles around the wheel.

Edited March 12, 2020 by travsformation

[bcarp]

43 minutes ago, travsformation said:

Looking at your pictures and comparing to mine, the differences don't fully explain why yours doesn't stay in place. Try this:

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I tried those steps & had another look at the instructions that came with it. Still no luck. That extra flap in my version just seems so thin & weak that it's not doing anything. It's pretty much a layer to protect scratches & dirt from hitting the lowest LED lights, but has no structural strength & doesn't help the Bodyguard stay in position in any way. If the flap were not there, it would make no difference. Your flap seems stronger & the @The Fat Unicyclist's video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7eQNcGr33s) shows him trying to move the Bodyguard around & the bottom flap staying still – mine just doesn't do that.

It's weird. I've looked at every photo & every video that I can find that shows the lower flap in detail & I can't find any that seems to show my version. The importer has verified that he had just ordered these "not long ago", so it's not old original stock, and he has also verified that he has spoken with Kevin about this & is awaiting a response. Perhaps Kevin has a few versions floating around?? Nothing much I can do except wait or request a refund ("not fit for purpose"), which I don't really want to do since this product has so much potential & is otherwise well made.

[Unventor]

They keep changing they from the feedback they get. 

You will see when I can show you what we have come up with on the brainstorming I had with them and previous owners. 

But since I am waiting form them to say they want payment and I get shipping detail, I can't say when this is happening. 

[Rywokast]

14 hours ago, Lefteris said:

Also a non-paid endorsment but it's the first time i see a Nikola bodyguard.

https://www.roll.nz/euc-bodyguard/83-205-euc-bodyguard-for-gw-nikola.html#/127-colour_combination-black_sides_olive_green_edges

And i would have bought it if :

Case #1: Some one could verify it would fit my Nikola Plus
Case #2: Haven't had a talk with a friend to buy his Ninebot S2 for my kid :-/ ( ) 

there are no physical nikola variations.. this will fit every model

[The Fat Unicyclist]

Hi everyone! And thank you all for your recent contributions to this thread.

Reading through on the recent comments, there are quite a few aspects to all of this, so please accept that I won't be acknowledging most of you directly for your particular points - but I will hopefully cover them all off. Anything I do miss, please let me know - I am making a concerted effort to stay back online, and not just for this thread.

I would like to start by apologising for my recent absence - or rather my lack of response to this thread (due to my absence). Some of you have been in contact with me (or Chrissi) and are aware of the challenges that we have faced trying to release our new products while managing a sudden supply chain issue due to this whole virus thing. That is our problem though, not yours, so let's get to the responses...

To start with I would like to say that I am emailing @bcarp in parallel to this thread to ensure that we cover off all of the options that we have, between Roll.nz and One More Wheels (the Australian retailer) to resolve this. Yes I am a little late to the party, but that only means that I am now doubly focused on resolving the issue.

One thing that I would like to clear up first is that the cover supplied to @bcarp is not "old-stock". And I can say this with 100% conviction, as we do not hold any significant quantity of pre-made product. If anyone wants to know what our stock looks like, it is this...

 These are rolls of the Neoprene that the EUC Bodyguards are made from. Late last year we invested in more equipment (cutting machinery in this case) to allow us to offer more (custom) colour options for our customers. So right now, as I type this, anyone who has ordered (or is discussing an order) should know that the Bodyguard that they order will be cut, stitched and finished according to their requirements - including personalisation, alterations (eg. for mudguards) or anything else that they require.This includes our "wholesale customers" who may not choose "tailored solutions" but instead request a significant volume of units from across our range.

TLDR... Anything that we have that may be considered "old stock" is still an uncut series of pieces on a roll of neoprene.

This also extends to the "pockets" used to secure the Bodyguards to the bottom of the wheels... The initial release (in October '19) was Kevlar and did have issues. But this was resolved in November '19 and is no longer an issue. There has been a few different materials used for the 16X pockets since then, but all of them have a "leathery" inside which grips to the 16X shell as is intended.

Regardless of all that, i am working with OMW and @bcarp to resolve this issue with (hopefully) a satisfactory outcome for all parties.

Enough said for now... I am sure that either @bcarp or myself will provide an update shortly

[travsformation]

1 hour ago, The Fat Unicyclist said:

If anyone wants to know what our stock looks like, it is this...

 

[bcarp]

16 hours ago, The Fat Unicyclist said:

Regardless of all that, i am working with OMW and @bcarp to resolve this issue with (hopefully) a satisfactory outcome for all parties.

 

Just to let the followers of this thread know, @The Fat Unicyclist has indeed been in touch & we are working on a solution. I’ll update when the time is right. Thanks for the advice @travsformation, @Unventor, @ShanesPlanet

[Unventor]

1 hour ago, bcarp said:

Just to let the followers of this thread know, @The Fat Unicyclist has indeed been in touch & we are working on a solution. I’ll update when the time is right. Thanks for the advice @travsformation, @Unventor, @ShanesPlanet

You are welcome. I know it can be frustrating when there are no communication established. This is part of global trading issues. It isn't always a shop next door that that you can just walk into and talk to. 

[bcarp]

On 3/14/2020 at 2:53 PM, bcarp said:

Just to let the followers of this thread know, @The Fat Unicyclist has indeed been in touch & we are working on a solution. I’ll update when the time is right. Thanks for the advice @travsformation, @Unventor, @ShanesPlanet

Well, time for an update. Unfortunately, we have not come to an acceptable agreement, so I am of the opinion that the EUC Bodyguard for the Kingsong KS16X is not ready for market and would not recommend this product. Despite what others have written, I have found that manufacturer support for the product is not ideal, but may reflect the current COVID-19 period or some other reason.

I have met with the Australian distributor/importer again who brought another Bodyguard along, with the same problem. I have been in touch with @The Fat Unicyclist but communication has been slow & now silent again. I understand things may be difficult but it doesn't take much to write something to say "I received your message. I'll get back in touch with you in xxx days."

I have accepted the unit as is despite the fault and it still hangs on only by the pedals, with the lower contour not fitting the EUC. This results in the Bodyguard riding up and crinkling, with the Bodyguard covering the rear safety lights. I've also discovered that it moves such that it covers the front light sensor so that the EUC's headlight is on constantly because it thinks it's night time. The problem is that the lower flap just doesn't hang on to the EUC. It is not curved enough. I have offered to modify my own on the proviso that my warranty is not void by my own modification. Or to have a revised unit shipped to me to replace the one I have. I have not received a response.

I feel for the one-man-show Australian distributor, who has been very responsive & helpful. He has a shipment of these EUC Bodyguards, all of which have this problem. I have chosen to keep the one that I bought from him because it has been used (at that time for a 3km ride) & wouldn't be able to be resold as a new product. As he was very helpful, I felt I should also do the best I could for him, despite the product issue. I would have grounds for a refund as the product is "not fit for purpose" under the Australian Consumer Law, but chose not to exercise this right.

TLDR: Product shows promise, but not ready for market. Would not recommend.

Edited March 21, 2020 by bcarp
Clarified wording

[Unventor]

So finally the day have come for me to receive my early Christmas Present, wel maybe is bit delayed for many reasons. 

I am happy to present the latest version of the EUC bodyguard for KS16X. 

This one have a new feature for attaching things to it. I have 2 Molle attachment points at the top on each side. MOlle is a military standard for attaching anything to a harness like thing. 

I have another item also a first of, that I am to beta test but of course weather is not play ball here. All of a sudden we have summertime incomming. No rain forecast the next 10 days. Okey the smart ready have properly figured out what is installed. But Once I can confirm how it works I give a little review. 

I have asked Chrissi to add a few logos on my EUC BG.

You can read more about those here: https://sonsofvikings.com/blogs/history/viking-symbols-and-meanings

Ægishjálmr (Helm of Awe) is one of them.

Vegvisir (Viking Compass) is the other one. 

I though they embody the meaning of EUC riding and the EUC bodyguard very well. That siad I can only say it looks pretty darn cool imho with the golden stiching on the red in the sun.

Enough text, show us some pictures I hear you thinking. (yep I can do that....sometimes).

You find more details at this Album and better photo quality as the above is compressed.

https://flic.kr/s/aHsmMGQcdo

Edited April 20, 2020 by Unventor

[bcarp]

1 hour ago, Unventor said:

I have asked Chrissi to add a few logos on my EUC BG.

Clearly you are on the VIP contact list. You are getting responses at least. A month later, still no reply from the manufacturer. The last reply I received prior to my previous post was "I'm glad that things have worked out satisfactorily." Clearly a misinterpretation of my description of the EUC Bodyguard. Your photos seem to show a nice fit on the KS16X. I'd be interested to see how it fits after putting several kilometres over bumpy ground & whether the EUC Bodyguard rides up like mine does. It grabs on to the pedals, but not the undersurface of the machine, so the lights & light sensor become obscured.