Inmotion E20

[meepmeepmayer]

37 minutes ago, UniVehje said:

It is only on Kickstarter. So it might never be made if the idea doesn’t sell there. 

They already developed and built it, and did a photo shoot! A lot of effort/money seems to have already been spent on this.

I sure hope Inmotion isn't doing bad enough to depend on Kickstarter backing. I guess they do it to get publicity/gauge interest? Or maybe the Kickstarter is just an AI hallucination (The website still seems so fake, has anybody checked with known Inmotion contacts if this is real?)

The entire thing seems a bit out of date, or clueless. A Kickstarter in 2024? Throwing tons of new models at the wall and seeing what sticks (presumably, from their list of announcements)? One would think at this stage a manufacturer knows what works and what doesn't.

Well, I support anything they do as long as it doesn't bankrupt the company, so good luck to them! Maybe for the initial few minutes of learning, a double wheeler will entice people into EUCs before they try a real one.

On 3/14/2024 at 8:32 PM, Chris Chaput said:

The biggest problem is twofold - they don't turn easily and they don't go straight well.

Yea, that seems to be the problem

(Great post of yours, though, and I agree - if it helps teach newbies, that alone would make this worth it).

[The Brahan Seer]

I would love to see Begode produce an ET Max in this configuration just to see what it would be really like.

I know it would be really wide and heavy but imagine 2 motors, the adrenaline hit trying to go from 2 to 1 wheel in a turn. 

ok so need slimmer wheels than current but a high speed serious model, maybe its not as ridiculous as it is.

 

[yoos]

This type of wheel might contribute significantly to EUC popularity and growth by being the proper gateway drug device. The leap from bicycle/scooter/pedestrian to unicycle has always been a difficult one, both conceptually and in terms of learning curve (see @Hsiang's post). Now more people might try this and eventually outgrow it (give them a week!) and go for a proper single-wheel vehicle. Another important contribution could be to the image of EUCs, leading to more favorable legislation. The obvious drift of the industry towards heavy and imposing racing tanks is not good for public image and, consequently, legislation. Growing a cute, fun, family-friendly twin-wheel sub-genre would be a good thing PR-wise. So I welcome it and might even imagine getting one to teach my toddler son eventually.

 

[Robse]

A self balancing device with 2 wheels is not a "unicycle" , it's a twicycle ... 2 wheels in parallel makes slow turning difficult. The whole idea "unicycle" is lost in this kind of device, and learning will not be more easy than just to start with the real thing from the beginning. Or use the trick with the brooms under the pedals... imagin riding along on this gadget, trying to do a straight line on a skewed paved road, good luck with that.  Reminds me of riding a motorcycle with a sidecar, and that's even easy because the wheels are not syncronized. Mad idea, nothing else.

[KNZ]

11 hours ago, Robse said:

hard boiled self balancing 😂

And scrambled if you take an unexpected dive!

[Tomallo]

8 hours ago, Robse said:

A self balancing device with 2 wheels is not a "unicycle" , it's a twicycle ... 2 wheels in parallel makes slow turning difficult. The whole idea "unicycle" is lost in this kind of device, and learning will not be more easy than just to start with the real thing from the beginning. Or use the trick with the brooms under the pedals... imagin riding along on this gadget, trying to do a straight line on a skewed paved road, good luck with that.  Reminds me of riding a motorcycle with a sidecar, and that's even easy because the wheels are not syncronized. Mad idea, nothing else.

Keep in mind that you already know all that as an experienced rider. A person who's interested in trying an EUC for the first time might not fully trust the self-balancing, let alone that they'll be able to balance side to side after a short while (some people say, when they see me riding, that I drove out of a circus). But electric unicycles don't require as much skill as "manual" ones, we can all agree. So such a design could be helpful for establishing trust with the device. Let's say that a brick-and-mortar EUC store gets built in the neighborhood. They could have one of such wheels for curious people who are scared of jumping on a regular EUC and, because of this, would never even try. This way, they can discover all the facts that you've written for themselves.

[Robse]

24 minutes ago, Tomallo said:

Keep in mind that you already know all that as an experienced rider. A person who's interested in trying an EUC for the first time might not fully trust the self-balancing, let alone that they'll be able to balance side to side after a short while (some people say, when they see me riding, that I drove out of a circus). But electric unicycles don't require as much skill as "manual" ones, we can all agree. So such a design could be helpful for establishing trust with the device. Let's say that a brick-and-mortar EUC store gets built in the neighborhood. They could have one of such wheels for curious people who are scared of jumping on a regular EUC and, because of this, would never even try. This way, they can discover all the facts that you've written for themselves.

Good points, however, and with lot of experience from relatives working in kindergarten, the kids who spends must time learning to ride a bicycle are the ones who learns with support wheels installed on the bicycle. And even after initial learning to balance the bicycle at their own will, it seems like these kids also needs significant more time to acquire agility in their riding style.  Support wheels are no good for learning, just a false sense of security, that vanishes in the same moment the support wheels are dismantled.

[Robse]

19 hours ago, Hsiang said:

I'll probably make a review in a few weeks if I manage to get a hold of a demo!

i have watched many of your vids and like the most 😉, so i am looking forward to such a review. I suggest the following headline: " The insane way to 10 mph in a straigth line" 😂

[Aekainal]

On 3/16/2024 at 8:29 PM, mhpr262 said:

It will be almost as difficult to ride as a normal EUC (and possible a lot more difficult on uneven ground) but without all the fun and nimbleness that a normal EUC possesses. What a terrible choice.

That's true. Maybe those beginners who started riding with this wheel, simply get bored very quickly and then move to some big guy instead, the real EUC. That's a promising way to expand the current EUC group I guess.

[Nostris]

I’ll follow with interest! It’s true that a lot of people who show an in in EUCs are then put off trying it because of the thought of balancing on just one wheel. So this device might be a good thing to give people the confidence to get started.. But what are the other proposed wheels? Simply bigger renditions of the same thing?

Here in Italy and France we have several tricycle motor scooters by Peugeot and others, and even a  tricycle Yamaha Tracer 800cc motorcycle. These all use two independently sprung front wheels..and cleaver geometry so the scooter or motorcycle leans, turns and rides just like their two wheel counterparts..This is about the only way a twin wheel unicycle (Twicycle?) could ride reasonably, by having each wheel independently sprung, but it would still be prone to tracking and twisting if one of the two wheels hit a stone, or a yo the small object…as for riding up curbs etc….well..probably best not! 

[mhpr262]

Yeah, I have like 17.000 miles on various EUCs under my belt but I gotta say I would be somewhat hesitant to try and ride that wheel across uneven terrain. The terrible train tracking of my V11 with fhe CST 1488 factory tire is already quite bad enough for my taste, LOL

Edited March 20 by mhpr262

[Voyager]

It lives!  

Notice the third turn made by Voltride rider does get the device up onto one wheel, improving the ease of turn. Not an easy feat for a beginner though.

Beyond that, I make no comment    

Video credit: 'Voltride'

 

Edited March 29 by Voyager

[Robse]

1 hour ago, Voyager said:

It lives!  

Notice the third turn made by Voltride rider does get the device up onto one wheel, improving the ease of turn. Not an easy feat for a beginner though.

Beyond that, I make no comment    

Video credit: 'Voltride'

 

egg ....

[techyiam]

On 3/16/2024 at 5:29 AM, mhpr262 said:

It will be almost as difficult to ride as a normal EUC (and possible a lot more difficult on uneven ground) but without all the fun and nimbleness that a normal EUC possesses. What a terrible choice.

I had a chance to try out the Inmotion E20.

To me, the E20 is only practical for learning how to ride an euc.

It doesn't go straight well, nor turn well either. And it is more difficult to free-mount. An euc is better in almost every way.

However, I think it does serve a purpose.

This device allows a person to gradually develop balancing skills to ride an euc at very slow speeds. 

For young children, the E20 can be a great tool to help them learn to ride an euc, or for someone learning from scratch without any prior balancing sport or balancing activities experience.

I think it is similar to a bicycle with training wheels.

For those who prefer to start out learning to ride a bicycle with training wheels, then they would probably gravitate towards an E20 to learn to ride an euc.

Edited April 8 by techyiam

[Finn Bjerke]

Back to Stoneage. ....

Children aged 7-14 yrs learn motor skills very fast - there is no reason for this creation. Who the H is responsible for this contraption?

[Robse]

children who "learns" to ride a bike with training wheels only learn one thing: the first crash after the training wheels are removed hurts and comes as a complete surprise. And then it's back to learning again, this time the right way ...

[techyiam]

Actually, I saw a dad helping his young son learn to ride. In just one session, the progression of his son's improvement was impressive, but with much less hand holding, crashing and worry. The dad was happy with how well the E20 was able help his son learned to ride. Mind you I will have to ask him at a later date to see whether the balancing skills learnt on the E20 transfer over to an euc. To my mind, it does. But, of course, the proof is always in the pudding.

Also, for curious individuals who wants to get a taste of riding an euc, regardless of background, the E20 is a low risk device to help someone to do so.

Edited April 9 by techyiam

[Funky]

I personally think riding is very easy and effortless. Actually getting on the euc itself (stepping on pedals..) is the hard part for new riders.. Aka free mounting.

While riding you literally are standing in place. More centered your body is to tire the more balance you will have.

Only thing this is good for - letting one stand in place not moving at all. Same can be done with regular euc, if you are skilled enough. Like stopping and after some seconds later start going again.

Edited April 9 by Funky

[techyiam]

10 hours ago, Funky said:

I personally think riding is very easy and effortless. Actually getting on the euc itself (stepping on pedals..) is the hard part for new riders.. Aka free mounting.

While riding you literally are standing in place. More centered your body is to tire the more balance you will have.

Only thing this is good for - letting one stand in place not moving at all. Same can be done with regular euc, if you are skilled enough. Like stopping and after some seconds later start going again.

That is the thing.

People from all walks of life from all sort of balancing skill background can step on and start riding as slow as one wants, and with minimal risks.

 

Edited April 9 by techyiam

[Funky]

22 minutes ago, techyiam said:

That is just it.

People from all walks of life from all sort of balancing skill background can step on and start riding as slow as one wants, and with minimal risks.

 

I'm big fatso without any balancing skill background. Or in general i hate any type of "activities" and first time i rode i had zero problems.. 10 mins latter i was going in circles and doing "8ths". Most of my "learning" time was spent trying to freemont the dam thing.  Followed by -  problem of not leaning enough to get the dam thing going forwards. I was standing on wheel with both feet on pedals for about 2-3 seconds, before losing balance..

So yeah - anyone can ride an EUC. E20 is simply janky idea, that won't sell at all and will be gone in no time.

They could have removed that one wheel and made small amazing wheel instead (Mini V14 - 10" wheel with fat tire, making it 16" in diameter, 40kmh speed..) - that would sell like cupcakes (at least in my country - 25kmh sidewalks crawlers by law.) Or any other place where people ride bike lanes and sidewalks. Price it 2000$ and people still gonna buy it. Size and weight gonna sell that wheel alone.

I hope this isn't gonna be that "neighborhood" wheel.. They gonna release under "Courage" name... Please God no!!!

Clown wheels or Monster wheels...(Small vs Big) I think i'm gonna buy scooter sooner or later, if they will not start making something amazing in lightweight. Instead of these "jokes" of a wheels.  (Mten4, Mten4 Mini, S9 the basketball, E20 now..)

 

Edited April 9 by Funky

[Circuitmage]

E30 spotted at show;

[Robse]

3 wheels?? this is Insane. Just insane. Someone at Inmotion is.. not quite right 😁

[Circuitmage]

@Robse I'm not trying to spread rumors .... but there was some talk about an E40 at the show....I wonder what that might look like. 

[Robse]

2 minutes ago, Circuitmage said:

@Robse I'm not trying to spread rumors .... but there was some talk about an E40 at the show....I wonder what that might look like. 

 

[bpong]

On 3/16/2024 at 10:03 PM, Hsiang said:

well, I am going to come clean and say that I might have been responsible for this uhh wheel.

I had the chance to speak to Bob 2 years ago when he was still the CEO of inmotion, and he had asked for suggestions and this double wheel configuration was what I brought up. Now I did say that ideally I really want a tilting two wheels design with independent suspensions, which would allow a similar EUC ride feel while still allowing the possibility of locking them so that someone who's new would have an easier time learning. This is a terribly complex challenge and I had only seem it in advance robotic labs, but I honestly think would be an interesting leap for EUC.

But short of that I also think the static 2 wheels configuration in a low power/ low speed model is still a great idea because it solve 2 major problems with growing the EUC market; the steep learning curve and high price. If the E20 and deliver on the promise of being cheap enough (sub $500 in my mind) and actually be easy for anyone to jump on and ride. Then I think its appeal as a "fun toy" could potentially have a much larger mass appeal than $3-4k beast wheels that seems to take up a large chunk of the market right now.

I'll probably make a review in a few weeks if I manage to get a hold of a demo!

sorry guys, airwheel made these like since 2018.  they used to sell them at smartwheel when they just opened up.  really Hsiang ?  i say not...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006792708162.html?src=google&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=631-313-3945&slnk=&plac=&mtctp=&albbt=Google_7_shopping&albagn=888888&isSmbActive=false&isSmbAutoCall=false&needSmbHouyi=false&albcp=20235160513&albag=&trgt=&crea=en1005006792708162&netw=x&device=c&albpg=&albpd=en1005006792708162&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIj_eIpKDehQMVhwqtBh18yAuTEAQYASABEgI31_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&aff_fcid=06861deb4b704cbaad9a969e910fc0fe-1714078610900-00806-UneMJZVf&aff_fsk=UneMJZVf&aff_platform=aaf&sk=UneMJZVf&aff_trace_key=06861deb4b704cbaad9a969e910fc0fe-1714078610900-00806-UneMJZVf&terminal_id=d9fb7968aff54f7db07eb1495e42bfc3&afSmartRedirect=y

i didnt think its still available till i searched for it cause of this topic ...it looked peculiar to me then as it still does now...

Edited April 25 by bpong