Is EUC a Way of Travel Or is it a Sport???

[The Brahan Seer]

29 minutes ago, Freeforester said:

What’s the saying?  There are old pilots, and there are bold pilots, but…

 A lot of it seems luck of the draw or sods law. Although you can lower the odds it doesn't always make any difference.

 

Edited June 10, 2023 by The Brahan Seer

[Elliott Reitz]

7 minutes ago, The Brahan Seer said:

I guess you have never had any serious crashes judging by your gear choice. So in this aspect perhaps you are inexperienced. Or you just love pain!

I do agree with you that practice and learning the skills is so important to keep you safe. So miles really doesn't mean anything if you don't practice the skills. 

But even better is learning/ practice and wearing protection.  Gear might not for save your life but in my rider experience it does minimise the hurt and maybe the number of injuries. 

I admire your faith in your wheel, in other people and your own instincts to not need to wear any gear. You do you. 

I've had serious crashes on motorcycles... and yet more serious helmet induced life threatening allergic reactions to bee stings (bee flies under helmet and stings - has happed to me twice).  The ONLY gear that has EVER helped were wrist guards.  Everything else has mostly had the opposite effect making things worse.  My 1st personal experience of that was an XL100 bike going 50 mph to woodchuck hole and tumble through the field but the helmet pulled my neck away from tuck-roll and thankfully unsnapped and flew further than me (hockey hemet).  A more recent EUC experience was a 12 mph crash on a V11 where my face was weighted further into the ground via the helmet.  It increased the face impact and there was no impact to back of my head.  

4 minutes ago, Mono said:

Is there any way I can solicit a source for these stats?

I wish.  I wrote a book "Live Free or Die - Choose" back in 1999 (not published but sold 500 self-copied) that began with helmet laws... 10 years after when I decided to go rework it I was shocked how every link was gone.  DOT, States, official sources of statistics were gone forever.  Those bastards really made me a conspiracy theorist to my core.  BUY HEMETS? - Fk Bell.  lol I still have/use helmets but the politics side of choices and fear-selling bullshit rules most people (IMHO y'all suck with your fears  ). 

Just now, Mono said:

same here

Thanks. 

[Mono]

11 minutes ago, Elliott Reitz said:

A more recent EUC experience was a 12 mph crash on a V11 where my face was weighted further into the ground via the helmet.  It increased the face impact and there was no impact to back of my head.  

I was always wondering about this mechanism and suspected that I might have had one or two injuries from this had I worn a helmet.

Though on a general note, I do expect and think that helmets increase safety for quite a few activities.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Mono

[The Brahan Seer]

23 minutes ago, Elliott Reitz said:

(IMHO y'all suck with your fears  ). 

Haha you are funny! I don't wear gear because I'm scared. I wear gear because I know I crash. 

So maybe you don't wear much gear because you know you won't (or are very unlikely to).

Edited June 10, 2023 by The Brahan Seer

[mhpr262]

Maybe not for real traveling (like hundreds of kilometers) but for longer trips, definitely yes. That is what I like doing most on my EUCs.

I have ridden the Danube Cycle Path from its source in Donaueschingen to Linz in Austria, I have ridden the Inn Cycle Path from the mouth of the river Inn in Passau through Rosenheim and Innsbruck to Imst in Austria (riding the rest of it to the source of the Inn in Maloja, Switzerland is my big summer project) and I have ridden the Inn/Salzach cycle path from Passau to Salzburg.

Riding so far in a single day (80-100 kilometers usually) used to be a bit of a pain in the behind because of the limited range of my V11, but with my EX20S I can finally ride as far as my legs and feet will carry me in a single day. Usually I have to stop before the battery is even half empty, LOL. It feels incredibly liberating not having to worry about range and having to find charging locations on the way anymore.

Edited June 10, 2023 by mhpr262

[Elliott Reitz]

This may become one of those super-threads in that a search for Gear features this thread and is at least another page till it comes up on yet more threads.  

SO, here's what I had written and researched for my book back in 1999 with what was on the internet at that time.  

Motorcycles Without Helmets  --  exerpt from Choose, Live Free Or Die!  By  Elliott Reitz, 1999

Riding a motorcycle is a risky activity that brings our will into real-time and thus stimulates the free feelings we have.  Having the wind in my hair is even better. 

Harley Davidson (made in USA) motorcycles without a helmet are especially satisfying to people who love the USA for it’s protection of their freedoms.  (original statement)

Laws in states requiring helmets are very annoying to motorcycle riders – especially harley riding USA loving people who cherish their freedoms.  The pro-helmet lobby includes helmet manufacturers, anti-motorcycle people (fearful and fundamentalist opposers of individual sovereignty), news companies such ABC World News, doctors, and insurance companies.  Reality is not what these lobbies preach with their slanted statistics.  Here's some better data.

The following is the justification of Bill Number A1956A pending in the New York legislature (provided to me by Assemblyman Robert J. Warner of the 124^th District who supports the bill):

The "Federal Aid Highway Act of 1975" abolished the power of the Department of Transportation to withhold highway safety funds for noncompliance with mandatory helmet laws.  Since then, thirty-two states have repealed their helmet laws, with the exception of California, which never had one.  Included in this number are such neighboring states as Connecticut, Rhode Island, Maryland, Delaware, New Hampshire, Maine, and Ohio, making New York law inconsistent with regional policy.

Statistics from NYS Motor Vehicle accident reports show the percentage of fatalities per number of accidents has not decreased as expected, but has actually increased by a small percentage since New York State required helmet usage.

The State Police of Maryland reported that, within the first 6 months of repeal, motorcyclist fatalities decreased by 30%.  The State of Rhode Island reported a 166.7% increase in fatalities in 1971 when their helmet regulation was in effect, but a 40% reduction in fatalities in 1979 when such regulation had been repealed.

Helmets-are an unnatural weight upon the head of the rider and radically increase cranial temperatures.  Helmets severely restrict peripheral vision and significantly reduce hearing.  No helmet, regardless of cost or design, is capable of resisting impact stresses above 13 m.p.h., as Federal Department of Transportation testing has evidenced, and, in lateral skids, helmets deteriorated at 2 1/2 m.p.h. The choice of when and where to wear the helmet would best be left up to the person operating the motorcycle, as is the case in other states.

I've been riding for 25 years.  7 of those years I lived in New Hampshire without a helmet law.  It's such a free and wonderful feeling to have the wind in my hair.  So who are you to require me to wear a helmet?  When I had a choice I did wear it for warmth sometimes, like when I rode in the snow. 

Here's more research to de-bunk the notion that helmets save lives, published on the ABATE of Arizona web site at http://www.primenet.com/~abate/library/library.htm:

The data used for this comparison was obtained from the 1994 Motorcycle Statistical Annual, Motorcycle Industry Council, Inc., 1994. The state motorcycle accident statistics were divided between states with a mandatory helmet law and those without.

The only variable used in this comparison is a mandatory helmet law. The results show that accident and fatality rates are higher, overall, in states with mandatory helmet laws. The total number of accidents and fatalities are also higher in these same states.

Comparing fatalities to registrations, Mandatory states average 6.61 fatalities per 10K registrations while Voluntary states average 5.63 fatalities per registration.   That's a 17% increase in the fatality rate induced by mandatory helmet use.  Similar math shows a 15% increase in reported accidents.

James.Arnold@anu.edu.au: 1993 data comparing registrations to fatalities between states with and without mandatory helmet use shows a 17.6% higher fatality rate in Mandatory states, and highly significant correlation calculation c² ₁  of 14.24, which exceeds the 0.01% level of significance. Were wearers and non-wearers recognizable (in optional states), one would expect the results to be even more spectacular and persuasive!

http://www.primenet.com/~abate/library/hmtlawst.htm: While helmet law states have 61% of all the registered motorcycles (2,457,637), they have recorded 64% of all accidents (52,955) and 66% of all fatalities (1,575), a significantly greater number of both accidents and fatalities.

http://www.primenet.com/~abate/library/hlmt_kil.htm:  K. Peter Krantz with the Department of Forensic Medicine at the University of Lund, Sweden, noted that ring fractures of the base of the skull were present in 21 out of 132 cases of motorcyclists whom he studied. Seventeen of these riders were wearing a helmet. Three riders suffering ring fractures of the base of the skull, and two riders who suffered disruption of the junction of the head and neck, did not show any sign of head impact, except for minor abrasions of the chin strap. These injuries are due to the result of a centripetal movement, owing to decreased velocity of the body in relation to the head.

Then there are even more obscure situations like my own.  I recently had a bee collide with my forehead.  Instead of bouncing off it slipped inside the helmet and stung me.  I had an allergic reaction that could have been fatal. Thus I'm tempted to ride without a helmet even thought it's still illegal.  My hope is that a jury would understand and exonerate me. Which leads to the FIJA thinking.  That is the Fully Informed Jury Association, http://www.fija.org.  Check that one out for yourself on the Internet.  It basically says you have a moral obligation to vote your conscience on a jury, and not just simply follow instructions of the judge.

Another side on helmet lobby activity.  Helmets are being studied and pushed for auto safety. 

A foreign study  http://www.globalx.net/ocbc/nigel.html concludes "Wearing helmets in cars has been proved more effective in preventing serious injury than cycle helmets, but promoting car helmets is likely to meet heavy opposition, writes Nigel Perry". 

I can concur with that conclusion since a car has a full windshield.  Wind resistance from the helmet and helmet weight won't contribute as much to accident rates in cars as they do on motorcycles.  Still I want my right to choose.  So much for custom of women going to the hairdresser.  Note the slant toward reducing fatalities in accidents that have already occurred.  On a motorcycle, that is too late.

So what do we do?  The best safety on a bike is to ride with more skill.  Thus the best thing to do is to learn to ride sliding and jumping on the dirt, or don't ride.

For those of us who do ride, help us repeal such stupid laws.  If we can't motivate our legislators then the courts will do.  It's important to the safety of riders that the public become more educated about the fallacy of helmets.  I've noticed that some people are riding without helmets in NY without getting stopped.  Some laws do die by non-enforcement too.

[mrelwood]

4 hours ago, Elliott Reitz said:

No helmet, regardless of cost or design, is capable of resisting impact stresses above 13 m.p.h.

Interestingly, the free fall speed when hitting the ground from 6 feet is 13mph… After which you slide. Works for me.

Instead of looking at state wide data and trying to compute how laws and accidents relate, I’d be more interested in what the doctors say about individual accidents with and without helmets. One person’s helmet usage wouldn’t change the statistics, but it could make a crucial difference when the unpinned S22 motor shorts it’s cables, Master mainboard fries out of nowhere, etc.

Same goes for rash resistant clothing. No matter how the stats can be made to look, it would decrease the damage in case of an accident.

Edited June 10, 2023 by mrelwood

[Elliott Reitz]

1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

Interestingly, the free fall speed when hitting the ground from 6 feet is 13mph… After which you slide. Works for me.

Instead of looking at state wide data and trying to compute how laws and accidents relate, I’d be more interested in what the doctors say about individual accidents with and without helmets. One person’s helmet usage wouldn’t change the statistics, but it could make a crucial difference when the unpinned S22 motor shorts it’s cables, Master mainboard fries out of nowhere, etc.

Same goes for rash resistant clothing. No matter how the stats can be made to look, it would decrease the damage in case of an accident.

Ah as for rash resistance, I'd rather ride barefoot and shorts on such a hot day.  If I had to have rash resistant clothing I just wouldn't ride and my dogs wouldn't get their exercise.    

Barefoot Night Rain Ride with Loki - YouTube

Barefoot and Shorts Weather is Here with Loki and Tedy on the T4 - YouTube

 

Edited June 11, 2023 by Elliott Reitz
+ 2nd vid link

[Punxatawneyjoe]

Bottom line is if you are wearing gear when you crash you are much better off than if you weren't but you only need the extra protection if you crash so you may never need it. I think @winterwheel was right when he stated that but either way, someone should never be telling another person what they should or shouldn't be doing with their life after they are an adult. @Elliott Reitzis a big boy, he knows what will happen if he wipes out at 50 mph with just a helmet on. To each his own. I will be moving to NH myself this year i hope. "live free or die"

Edited June 11, 2023 by Punxatawneyjoe
spelling

[Elliott Reitz]

10 minutes ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

Bottom line is if you are wearing gear when you crash you are much better off than if you weren't but you only need the extra protection if you crash so you may never need it. I think @winterwheel was right when he stated that but either way, someone should never be telling another person what they should or shouldn't be doing with their life after they are an adult. @Elliott Reitzis a big boy, he knows what will happen if he wipes out at 50 mpg with just a helmet on. To each his own. I will be moving to NH myself this year i hope. "live free or die"

Well said.  FWIW, I have much more fear of impact-crashes just like on motorcycles.  There are a few intersections on my commute and lots of driveways where there are blind spots that count on stop-sign obeying drivers and if they do stop to actually see me and stay stopped as I travel by.  I do slow for those intersections, especially when there isn't a car immediately behind me.  So as different as we are with our rides and our gear... there are some common dangers that don't matter what gear you're wearing.  I do care about ya'll here and don't intend to be a 'bad-example' even if I go against some of the mainstreamed gear-think.  Like traffic cares more about your skill to go with the flow of traffic than anything else (stay sidewalks till you get that good).  Be safe out there!  

Edited June 11, 2023 by Elliott Reitz
Spel+

[Finn Bjerke]

Its both. 

Thios is the type of question (tabloid) journalists asks all the time. 


Are EUC totally fun or is it a solution to urban polution?

its potentially  both....

[Elliott Reitz]

So I saw my friend Jamal today.  He's maintaining my old MSX-100V (over 4000 miles of his own on it already, in less than 6 months).  So today he showed me Baltimore.  What a nice day!  He kept saying "people just don't understand, this is all I do all day, every day man".  The 1st video of the day he had the wobbles, OMG, TFF, no fear.  Nice view by the end of that... and a few more in the playlist at the link.  

The point is that to Jamal (Bo), EUC is his 'way of life'.  He reminds people like me why we ride to live, and live to ride.  

Jamal Gives Me a Tour of Baltimore on Electric Unicycles (Begode T4, and Master) - Pt 003 - YouTube

PS:  We shared a pair of wrist guards with the wrist straps removed. 

Edited June 12, 2023 by Elliott Reitz
ps

[Elliott Reitz]

Back to gear! 

I need better eye-protection, especially for higher speeds without a helmet or non-full-face helmet.  I have goggles that go over my glasses but that's gets my glasses into my eyes, tears, messy lenses, etc.  I use ear-plugs (foam-inserts) for noise though it would be nice if the strap had ear-covers too.  

Anyone have any recommendations? 

So far:

• I've located SPortRx.com goggles and am considering the Snowcraft Snow Goggle Men's Goggles & Men's Prescription Sport Goggles | SportRx
• Normally I get my glasses from Eyebuydirect.  I have a pair of Rayban mirrored sunglasses that work to about 35 mph (a little more when I squash them on my nose - and they always get tears on them)
• {+} Shopping this site too https://rx-safety.com/... and booked an eye exam this morning so purchases this afternoon!  The safety glasses look perfect for what I want!  

 

Edited June 17, 2023 by Elliott Reitz
{+}

[sbb]

6 hours ago, Elliott Reitz said:

Anyone have any recommendations? 

Embrace Tradition!

[Elliott Reitz]

OK So 1st time in 20 years I got my prescription updated (its the same -3.0 in both eyes, confirm PD=64).

So I just bought these:  

• Googles:  Rec Specs Maxx 21 Goggles | Prescription Available | RX Safety (rx-safety.com)
• Safety Glasses: Prescription Safety Glasses T9538S | RX Available | RX Safety (rx-safety.com)
• Welding Googles (w/o scrip):  Green Welding Glasses 70-PC - Rx Prescription Safety Glasses (rx-safety.com)

Total was $747 using the HSA account (only thing I can buy with that account anyway since my health is perfect w/o Dr Pusher).

[Funky]

1 hour ago, Elliott Reitz said:

Total was $747 using the HSA account (only thing I can buy with that account anyway since my health is perfect w/o Dr Pusher).

Holy Cow... My entire "safety gear" doesn't even cost that much.  Heck not even half of that..

747$ for what exactly? Those glasses/googles in links cost 40-80$. Appointment?

Edited June 17, 2023 by Funky

[Elliott Reitz]

35 minutes ago, Funky said:

Holy Cow... My entire "safety gear" doesn't even cost that much.  Heck not even half of that..

747$ for what exactly? Those glasses/googles in links cost 40-80$. Appointment?

LOL, yea those 3 pairs.  Not bad with all the mirrored coatings etc.  Base cost of frames/lenses was ~$100 ea.  The prescription was $80 and a waste because it was the same answer as 15 years ago.

[Funky]

25 minutes ago, Elliott Reitz said:

LOL, yea those 3 pairs.  Not bad with all the mirrored coatings etc.  Base cost of frames/lenses was ~$100 ea.  The prescription was $80 and a waste because it was the same answer as 15 years ago.

xD I call a scam... As regular sunglasses cost ~10$. And "good enough" biker googles are under 50$. (Also with mirrored coatings and all that jazz..)

I would never buy from those "expensive" shops. They simply put 100$ price tag, for something that cost 10$.  Then again not my $$$, you do you. 

Same as buying things in city center - in those small mall shops.. 3-5 times more expensive than in regular shops. Even cheaper if you order online.

(Sorry i simply hate wasting money and got triggered seeing someone overspending. Especially for 3 pairs.. Those 750$ could easily been 200$.)

Edited June 17, 2023 by Funky

[Elliott Reitz]

4 minutes ago, Funky said:

xD I call a scam... As regular sunglasses cost ~10$. And "good enough" biker googles are under 50$. (Also with mirrored coatings and all that jazz..)

I would never buy from those "expensive" shops. They simply put 100$ price tag, for something that cost 10$.  Then again not my $$$, you do you. 

Same as buying things in city center - in those small mall shops.. 3-5 times more expensive than in regular shops. Even cheaper if you order online.

No, I got really good quality lenses on 2 pairs of these pushing their price up to near $300/ea.  My regular glasses are the same price escalation in add-on coatings/materials.  The 3rd pair was a $50 plain lens with welding shade 6.  Welding "glasses" are hard to find because all they sell is crappy strap ons at airgas.  

[Funky]

Just now, Elliott Reitz said:

No, I got really good quality lenses on 2 pairs of these pushing their price up to near $300/ea.  My regular glasses are the same price escalation in add-on coatings/materials.  The 3rd pair was a $50 plain lens with welding shade 6.  Welding "glasses" are hard to find because all they sell is crappy strap ons at airgas.  

Ohh... Special lenses for your eye sight? Then forget everything i said.  That makes more sense now.  

[Elliott Reitz]

Just now, Funky said:

Ohh... Special lenses for your eye sight? Then forget everything i said.  That makes more sense now.  

Prescription Safety Glasses T9538S - Clear Frame
Single Vision Distance or Reading ($25.00)

Lens Material (Single Vision):  Polycarbonate 1.59 Light | Thin | ANSI Z87+ high impact rated ($15.00)

Lens Color (Single Vision, Polycarbonate 1.59):  Transitions Xtractive Polarized ($95.00)

Lens Coatings:  Scratch Coating ($10.00), UV Protection ($10.00), Anti-Fog Permanent Coating ($50.00)

Anti-Reflective Lens Coating:  AR with Blue Blocker Coating ($50.00)

Mirror Lens Coating:  Silver Mirror Coating ($50.00)

Rec Specs Maxx 21 Goggles
Single Vision Distance or Reading ($35.00)

Lens Material: Polycarbonate 1.59 Light | Thin | ANSI Z87+ high impact rated ($15.00)

Lens Color (Polycarbonate 1.59): Clear

Lens Coatings: Scratch Coating ($10.00), UV Protection ($10.00), Anti-Fog Permanent Coating ($50.00)

Anti-Reflective Lens Coating: AR with Blue Blocker Coating ($50.00)

Mirror Lens Coating: Blue Mirror Coating ($50.00)

Green Welding Glasses 33 - 6.0
Filter Shade: 6.0   $50.00

[Funky]

36 minutes ago, Elliott Reitz said:

Prescription Safety Glasses T9538S - Clear Frame
Single Vision Distance or Reading ($25.00)

Lens Material (Single Vision):  Polycarbonate 1.59 Light | Thin | ANSI Z87+ high impact rated ($15.00)

Lens Color (Single Vision, Polycarbonate 1.59):  Transitions Xtractive Polarized ($95.00)

Lens Coatings:  Scratch Coating ($10.00), UV Protection ($10.00), Anti-Fog Permanent Coating ($50.00)

Anti-Reflective Lens Coating:  AR with Blue Blocker Coating ($50.00)

Mirror Lens Coating:  Silver Mirror Coating ($50.00)

Rec Specs Maxx 21 Goggles
Single Vision Distance or Reading ($35.00)

Lens Material: Polycarbonate 1.59 Light | Thin | ANSI Z87+ high impact rated ($15.00)

Lens Color (Polycarbonate 1.59): Clear

Lens Coatings: Scratch Coating ($10.00), UV Protection ($10.00), Anti-Fog Permanent Coating ($50.00)

Anti-Reflective Lens Coating: AR with Blue Blocker Coating ($50.00)

Mirror Lens Coating: Blue Mirror Coating ($50.00)

Green Welding Glasses 33 - 6.0
Filter Shade: 6.0   $50.00

Yeah - they are nothing special.. Just a bunch of "coatings".

Could have added more coatings for extra $$$. After seeing the list. I'm back to my original post. Those 300$ glasses are 50$.. They simply have put the 50$ for each separate coating.. If they wanted they could have put 100$, or even 200$ for each coating.  

Sorry sir. But you got scammed.. Same thing as buying milk from corner shop for 2$. Or same milk from 3rd party for 15$. At the end of the day they both are the same. Just one person made 13$ profit from nothing. In this case someone made 250$  

There are cheap stores and expensive stores. Both sell the same. Cheap store sells in bulk, more units sold - more income. Expensive store sell in few pairs for big margin.

Edited June 17, 2023 by Funky

[Elliott Reitz]

2 hours ago, Funky said:

Yeah - they are nothing special.. Just a bunch of "coatings".

Could have added more coatings for extra $$$. After seeing the list. I'm back to my original post. Those 300$ glasses are 50$.. They simply have put the 50$ for each separate coating.. If they wanted they could have put 100$, or even 200$ for each coating.  

Sorry sir. But you got scammed.. Same thing as buying milk from corner shop for 2$. Or same milk from 3rd party for 15$. At the end of the day they both are the same. Just one person made 13$ profit from nothing. In this case someone made 250$  

There are cheap stores and expensive stores. Both sell the same. Cheap store sells in bulk, more units sold - more income. Expensive store sell in few pairs for big margin.

LOL, perhaps we should discuss the weather and footwear?  

Barefoot Night Rain Ride with Loki - YouTube

 

[Funky]

8 hours ago, Elliott Reitz said:

LOL, perhaps we should discuss the weather and footwear?  

Barefoot Night Rain Ride with Loki - YouTube

 

My brotta - No gear - No worries.  Best way to feel the breeze. 

What footwear - who needs it, when you are on EUC.

Weather? (Looks out of his cave) Dam it's raining buckets today.

Edited June 18, 2023 by Funky

[mrelwood]

1 hour ago, Funky said:

What footwear - who needs it, when you are on EUC.

The ones with studded pedals.