EUC on the highway videos

[Planemo]

32 minutes ago, amelanso said:

A guy on a bicycle traveling at 40kph is as dangerous to others as someone on an EUC doing 40kph. 

As the risk of outlawing myself (sssh don't tell anyone), I can't quite agree with that.

1. Most bicycles don't weigh 25kg plus.
2. Most bicycles wont career on for many metres after an accident.
3. Most bicycles have a braking system that is far more effective than an EUC. Certainly when it comes to unskilled EUC riders.
4. Most bicycles don't dump you when the power cuts out.
5. Most bicycles don't dump you when overleaned.
6. Most bicycles won't lose traction during a sudden direction change, and if they do, they are less likely to dump the rider than an EUC (how many riders can drift an EUC?)

I am sure there is more, but to say a bicycle is as safe as an EUC at the same speed seems totally wrong to me. I am willing to be corrected though.

[RoadRunner]

Well guys all i can say is enjoy riding as long as it’s possible and „legal“.

Because i live in a country where it’s illegal and i rode about 15000km always watching my back looking for cops, which takes a lot of the fun of riding.

2 weeks ago i was stopped by police and they confiscated my wheel, luckily I’m getting it back tomorrow and we have to see how much it will cost me at the end.

So all you riders out there who can ride without having problems enjoy it, have fun and be safe.

[Planemo]

 

14 minutes ago, RoadRunner said:

Because i live in a country where it’s illegal and i rode about 15000km always watching my back looking for cops, which takes a lot of the fun of riding.

I agree, it really does spoil the moment sometimes. The only place we can entirely relax is the Olympic Park stadium in Stratford, London as it's the only 'public' place in the UK to my knowledge that allows PEV's. Problem is, you can ride around the stadium in 10 minutes..

14 minutes ago, RoadRunner said:

2 weeks ago i was stopped by police and they confiscated my wheel, luckily I’m getting it back tomorrow and we have to see how much it will cost me at the end.

Does your system over there mean that you may end up with 'penalty points' on your licence? Please keep us updated.

[PLEASE_DELETE]

Deleted.

Edited March 18 by PLEASE_DELETE

[RoadRunner]

2 hours ago, Planemo said:

Does your system over there mean that you may end up with 'penalty points' on your licence? Please keep us updated.

Anything is possible, going from they let you go to 3000€ fine, depends on which officer you get.

 

[mike_bike_kite]

Car and motorcycle licenses are actually quite hard to get in many countries outside the US. The cost of insuring a 200HP superbike or a Lambo for a teenager also stops them from driving these vehicles even if the purchase price doesn't.

[GoGeorgeGo]

5 hours ago, Midlife Cricycle said:

Some great points being made by everyone to, dare I say, the biggest issue facing EUCs at the moment. We get all excited about the bells and whistles, the speed and the suspension, and we forget that these things could be legislated into oblivion at any time. I'm about to dosh out a few thousand on 2, maybe 3 wheels for myself, my wife and son and I'm worried that it'll all go down the toilet because some over-eager youtuber kills some kid in the pursuit of likes and it all blows up. I'm being melodramatic, sure, but really, with the speed these things go, the weight (check out the weight of the gotway ex!) and the build quality, it's a matter of time until this happens.

A question I've got is: what is the ideal situation for EUCs in the next, say, 3-5 years? If you had to come up with laws that had to balance the freedom of riders and the safety of other road users, where do you draw the line? Caps on speed? Limit to bike paths only? Or maybe have different classes - Class A wheels are slower and can ride on footpaths, Class B are built for roads, freeways, etc and have to stay off footpaths, bikepaths. Thoughts? Too complicated?

 

It will be the same as dirtbike laws.  You are not allowed on the street without plates and insurance.  You can ride it on private property, you can ride it where they allow motorized vehicles offroad.  You can mingle in with scooters. 

But you will get pulled over if your on the road without a plate.  Its easy to start enforcing and a no brainer imo.  75$ to register , 15$ excise, 50$ a month insurance.  But if you want it to be transportation, if you want to ride at speed on the road you have to do your part for the community and protect others by being insured and paying taxes to upkeep the roads.

I know we all dont want legislation but there is no avoiding it.  You cant ride a motorized vehicle 40+ mph on the roadways without insurance and registration.  

I don't want to drive on roads where people are riding unicycles uninsured.  

[Darrell Wesh]

1 hour ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

I don't want to drive on roads where people are riding unicycles uninsured

That says A LOT about your skill level or lack thereof and lack of comfort with riding in traffic. Unicycles aren’t as simple as twisting a throttle and accelerating faster than cars. There’s a steep learning curve and even then there’s a lot of limiting factors that prevent us from going fast all the time like a motorcycle would. 
 

It looks like your profile says you only ride a v8. If so, how could you even fathom how safe it is to ride at speed on a unicycle? You see these videos of guys carving at 40mph with traffic and can’t believe how unsafe it looks, but you’ve never done it yourself, wobbling at all of 18mph on the sidewalks. 

[.....]

2 hours ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

I know we all dont want legislation but there is no avoiding it.  You cant ride a motorized vehicle 40+ mph on the roadways without insurance and registration.  

I don't want to drive on roads where people are riding unicycles uninsured.  

No avoiding it... of course, you CAN drive unregistered and uninsured vehicles on some of the public roads out here. Farmers have fought hard to allow it. Of course, this aint a tractor or four-wheeler or buggy, but in some areas, the law does allow it. Man its great to live where I do!

[GoGeorgeGo]

7 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

That says A LOT about your skill level or lack thereof and lack of comfort with riding in traffic. Unicycles aren’t as simple as twisting a throttle and accelerating faster than cars. There’s a steep learning curve and even then there’s a lot of limiting factors that prevent us from going fast all the time like a motorcycle would. 
 

It looks like your profile says you only ride a v8. If so, how could you even fathom how safe it is to ride at speed on a unicycle? You see these videos of guys carving at 40mph with traffic and can’t believe how unsafe it looks, but you’ve never done it yourself, wobbling at all of 18mph on the sidewalks. 

I dont want to drive my car around uninsured unicyclists my friend.

I have over 300 miles on a KS18s . Plenty of road riding as you can see via my youtube channel Go George Go !! Another 1700 miles on my v8 , plenty of road riding with that to. I enjoy road riding and think its not reckless at all if you would take the time to read my comment thuroughly instead if assuming things about me.

However i do not want 40+ mph uninsured motorists on the road with me uninsured. They can cause serious damage to myself and others in the event if an accident. If your state does not require insurance thats your own personal decision. But my state requires all motorists have insurance to drive on public roadways. 

Edited October 8, 2020 by GoGeorgeGo

[.....]

3 minutes ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

I dont want to drive my car around uninsured unicyclists my friend.

I have over 300 miles on a KS18s . Plenty of road riding as you can see via my youtube channel Go George Go !! Another 1700 miles on my v8 , plenty of road riding with that to. I enjoy road riding and think its not reckless at all if you would take the time to read my comment thuroughly instead if assuming things about me.

However i do not want 40+ mph uninsured motorists on the road with me uninsured. They can cause serious damage to myself and others in the event if an accident. If your state does not require insurance thats your own oersonal decision. But my state requires all motorists have insurance to drive on public roadways. 

Insurance doesnt prevent accidents nor does it increase safety. So you're saying, you are worried about the financial compensation? Rest easy, I'd imagine the damages to your car when you run over a person or get hit by a unicycle will be minimal. This is assuming that YOU and the other motorists don't make poor decisions and overreact to an incident, therby causing an even more expensive pileup than would have happened otherwise. How in the world can you tolerate foot traffic and crosswalks? Surely you realize that there are LOTS of things that are 'dangrous' and uninsured. Personally, I'd worry more about the lack of skill, attention and respect fo the modern motorist and pedestrian. At least unicycle riders have some kind of clue about the position they are putting themselves in.

Edited October 8, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[GoGeorgeGo]

6 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

Insurance doesnt prevent accidents nor does it increase safety. So you're saying, you are worried about the financial compensation? Rest easy, I'd imagine the damages to your car when you run over a person or get hit by a unicycle will be minimal. This is assuming that YOU and the other motorists don't make poor decisions and overreact to an incident, therby causing an even more expensive pileup than would have happened otherwise. 

Yes i am very worried about the financial aspect of driving a vehicle lol.  If you hit a motorist you incrue their medical bills. Crashing infront of me leading to an accident, your at fault. Trusting all the morons on the road not to pile up is a poor decision lol

I get it, part of the attraction to these machines is lack of legislation. But our system is clearly designed for motorists in the road to be insured. 

Its not a popular opinion around here but i do think we should be legally allowed to register and insure our vehicles and legally drive them on the road. Motorcycle insurance is a fraction the cost of car insurance, im sure unicycle insurance would be even lower than motorcycle insurance. You still need insurance (in my state)

Edited October 8, 2020 by GoGeorgeGo

[mike_bike_kite]

7 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

You see these videos of guys carving at 40mph with traffic and can’t believe how unsafe it looks, but you’ve never done it yourself, wobbling at all of 18mph on the sidewalks. 

Carving is OK on the ski slopes but pretty stupid in traffic. How would you like it if all the other cars, motorbikes and bicycles weaved from side to side as you tried to get past them? It's also difficult to be fully aware of what's overtaking you on an EUC so weaving from side to side put's you in danger of colliding with anything trying to overtake you. Can I ask if you have a driving license?

Just now, ShanesPlanet said:

Insurance doesnt prevent accidents nor does it increase safety. So you're saying, you are worried about the financial compensation? Rest easy, I'd imagine the damages to your car when you run over a person or get hit by a unicycle will be minimal. This is assuming that YOU and the other motorists don't make poor decisions and overreact to an incident, therby causing and even more expensive pileup than would have happened otherwise. 

Are you saying vehicles shouldn't have insurance? I suspect that if you have an accident and you're driving without insurance on a vehicle that's not allowed on the roads then you'd need one hell of a lawyer to prove you're the innocent party. The average motor insurance claim is just over £10K ($13K). Even the cost of just replacing a car door is probably around $1500. Are you in a position to pay that? Didn't you also mention you had an accident where the passenger on your motorbike died. I'm obviously really sorry that that happened to you Shane but how would you feel if neither you or the other driver had insurance and your passenger ended up needing lifetime care?

[redsnapper]

5 hours ago, RoadRunner said:

Anything is possible, going from they let you go to 3000€ fine, depends on which officer you get.

 

Yikes! I thought Germany was forward thinking on low carbon initiatives! This sounds crazy... How/why did such a crazy law get passed? Was there not opposition to this?

[.....]

58 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said:

Carving is OK on the ski slopes but pretty stupid in traffic. How would you like it if all the other cars, motorbikes and bicycles weaved from side to side as you tried to get past them? It's also difficult to be fully aware of what's overtaking you on an EUC so weaving from side to side put's you in danger of colliding with anything trying to overtake you. Can I ask if you have a driving license?

Are you saying vehicles shouldn't have insurance? I suspect that if you have an accident and you're driving without insurance on a vehicle that's not allowed on the roads then you'd need one hell of a lawyer to prove you're the innocent party. The average motor insurance claim is just over £10K ($13K). Even the cost of just replacing a car door is probably around $1500. Are you in a position to pay that? Didn't you also mention you had an accident where the passenger on your motorbike died. I'm obviously really sorry that that happened to you Shane but how would you feel if neither you or the other driver had insurance and your passenger ended up needing lifetime care?

there are already laws in place about weaving in traffic and not driving safely in your lane. I dont condone driving in a manner that makes other people worry. Just like I dont condone talking on cell phones while driving. Ironically, politics and safety dont go hand in had. We allow dangerous things and ignore the reality, as it may prove inconvenient. I am fully prepared to have to pay for a car or damages to property, should I be the cause of it.

I had a sibling die on a bicycle. We were legally traveling on an uninsured bicycle riding doulbe. City law at the time was not being violated by myself or my passenger. Neither of us had but shorts and t-shirts on with tennis shoes. Safety gear would have not changed the outcome. The driver at fault DID have insurance on his trash truck, but my family did NOT persue them in court. The life of a child was lost and 2 years of mine was stolen from me. Even with a lawyer as my father, we DID NOT find it adventageous to file a lawsuit. The costs of funeral services and 2 years of medical assistance, fell squarely on the lap of my parents. Life can be a cruel bitch at times. The sooner we accept the fact that these things can't be avoided, the better off we will be. Even today I suffer from the accident. DO I feel like I am owed some form of compensation? No, I don't. Mistakes get made, people get hurt, innocent people suffer financial losses. Its a delicate balance, but I dont think that leaning heavily on laws and blame, makes a shit of difference in the larger scheme.  Luckily, I have taken these experiences and come up with an outlook on life. Enjoy it while you can, don't worry yourself as it doesnt help, and get ready for unfair shit to take its toll.

Fwiw, I lived in Tennessee for over a decade and the majority of it, insurance on cars was not required. Yup, tis true, TN didnt explode into a ball of fire or rebellion, simply because the law at the time, didnt require financial responsibility. Again, its a delicate balance. I dont have the perfect answer, but I am typically slow to agree that MORE rules will solve much of anything.

[GoGeorgeGo]

2 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

there are already laws in place about weaving in traffic and not driving safely in your lane. I dont condone driving in a manner that makes other people worry. Just like I dont condone talking on cell phones while driving. Ironically, politics and safety dont go hand in had. We allow dangerous things and ignore the reality, as it may prove inconvenient. I am fully prepared to have to pay for a car or damages to property, should I be the cause of it.

I had a sibling die on a bicycle. We were legally traveling on an uninsured bicycle riding doulbe. City law at the time was not being violated by myself or my passenger. Neither of us had but shorts and t-shirts on with tennis shoes. Safety gear would have not changed the outcome. The driver at fault DID have insurance on his trash truck, but my family did NOT persue them in court. The life of a child was lost and 2 years of mine was stolen from me. Even with a lawyer as my father, we DID NOT find it adventageous to file a lawsuit. The costs of funeral services and 2 years of medical assistance, fell squarely on the lap of my parents. Life can be a cruel bitch at times. The sooner we accept the fact that these things can't be avoided, the better off we will be. Even today I suffer from the accident. DO I feel like I am owed some form of compensation? No, I don't. Mistakes get made, people get hurt, innocent people suffer financial losses. Its a delicate balance, but I dont think that leaning heavily on laws and blame, makes a shit of difference in the larger scheme.  Luckily, I have taken these experiences and come up with an outlook on life. Enjoy it while you can, don't worry yourself as it doesnt help, and get ready for unfair shit to take its toll.

Fwiw, I lived in Tennessee for over a decade and the majority of it, insurance on cars was not required. Yup, tis true, TN didnt explode into a ball of fire or rebellion, simply because the law at the time, didnt require financial responsibility. Again, its a delicate balance. I dont have the perfect answer, but I am typically slow to agree that MORE rules will solve much of anything.

Condolences on your loss.

To me though its not about wanting laws, its about the inevitability of laws being created. We as a community have 2 options

1) do nothing, keep the status quo, and allow politicians and people who do not understand these vehicles make the laws for us. This will almost certainly result in an EU style ban of any machine that does more than X miles per hour

Or

2) we as a community push for legislation that will allow us to ride our vehicles freely on and offroad in exchange for standard things like registration and taxation. 

Insurance laws will vary by state, there are still states in the country that do not require motorist insurance. But for those that do require insurance i believe it will be a necessary aspect of getting any vehicle to be highway legal. 

Its way easier for them to just ban the machines and make riding them a living hell than it is to reach a compromise on what requirements are needed to drive one on the street. 

I hope it does not happen for a long long time.  I rather enjoy the low cost of ownership and the lack of limitations. But having lived in America my whole life, i know better than to think it will stay status quo forever, the taxman always gets his cut. It only takes one motivated Karen to get a ban in place which will be WAY harder to fight than just enacting the initial legislation.  We need to beat her to the punch.

[redsnapper]

8 hours ago, Planemo said:

As the risk of outlawing myself (sssh don't tell anyone), I can't quite agree with that.

1. Most bicycles don't weigh 25kg plus.

>> very true
2. Most bicycles wont career on for many metres after an accident.

>> also true
3. Most bicycles have a braking system that is far more effective than an EUC. Certainly when it comes to unskilled EUC riders.

>> you ever seen a guy braking from high speed on a bike? I don't think avg biker can outbrake avg EUC.

4. Most bicycles don't dump you when the power cuts out. 

5. Most bicycles don't dump you when overleaned.

>> agreed but a bike at high speed is less agile than EUC at high speed and the frame and front end of a bike with a guy bombing will be pretty deadly in a collision with a person!

6. Most bicycles won't lose traction during a sudden direction change, and if they do, they are less likely to dump the rider than an EUC (how many riders can drift an EUC?) >> depends on the terrain but you may be right

I am sure there is more, but to say a bicycle is as safe as an EUC at the same speed seems totally wrong to me. I am willing to be corrected though.

All good points ( I have commented above ). I don't know how many collisions between EUC and 3rd parties there are but I have to think this is extremely low even to the point of wondering should we even be concerned about it? If that number was let's say per capita as high as bicycles, maybe worth talking about. But you don't need a licence or insurance on a bicycle so even then??? But good points for sure...

[PLEASE_DELETE]

Deleted.

Edited March 18 by PLEASE_DELETE

[.....]

15 minutes ago, /Dev/Null said:

Consdering you can insure a motorcycle here for $10/month...I sure hope it isn't $50/month.

wow, thats cheap. Im a cdl holder with clean record and mine's never under $30 a month minimum liability for a baby motorcycle. Even $1 a month for the euc is too much tho. The price paid when you are forced to sign up, is the price I fear. As it is, my insurance won't cover me or my costs at all anyhow.

Edited October 8, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[PLEASE_DELETE]

Deleted.

Edited March 18 by PLEASE_DELETE

[Midlife Cricycle]

Just now, ShanesPlanet said:

Even $1 a month for the euc is too much tho. The price paid when you are forced to sign up, is the price I fear.

$1 a month is too much? Really?

I'm sorry you went through such a terrible personal loss but it seems like this experience has made you against any form of legislation. This is a shame as legislation is not, in and of itself, evil. At its best, it helps us all live together safely and aware that every activity has boundaries, that with freedom comes responsibility.

EUCs are no different. In fact, judging by the video in the OP and the response of some riders, I feel that the sooner we establish those boundaries, the better for everyone. 

[gon2fast]

30 minutes ago, Midlife Cricycle said:

$1 a month is too much? Really?

Yes it is when you consider the many different types of insurance we have to pay for (with no return usually). EUC should fall under car/renter/home owner's policy at no additional cost.  

[Darrell Wesh]

5 hours ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

But having lived in America my whole life, i know better than to think it will stay status quo forever, the taxman always gets his cut. It only takes one motivated Karen to get a ban in place which will be WAY harder to fight than just enacting the initial legislation.  We need to beat her to the punch.

If you’ve lived in America your whole life then you should know legislation does not get passed on the federal level for these PEV’s like they do in Europe. Every state, no, every CITY will have their own separate laws. The federal government couldn’t care less about PEV’s and drafting a blanket law for the whole country over some dude going 40mph on a highway. They’ll leave that concern to whatever locality some douchebag mayor or governor thinks it’s impacting. 

[.....]

3 hours ago, Midlife Cricycle said:

$1 a month is too much? Really?

I'm sorry you went through such a terrible personal loss but it seems like this experience has made you against any form of legislation. This is a shame as legislation is not, in and of itself, evil. At its best, it helps us all live together safely and aware that every activity has boundaries, that with freedom comes responsibility.

EUCs are no different. In fact, judging by the video in the OP and the response of some riders, I feel that the sooner we establish those boundaries, the better for everyone. 

Its not the dollar, i waste that daily. Its the principal of it all. Its the fact that I have to even say who the dollar came from. As also mentioned, I already pay a LOT of dollars for services I don't utilize. Perhaps a dollar of that can just be considered payment. Hell, you can take 2 of those dollars and consider the guy next to me, paid up as well. For me, its not my place to assume boundaries for other people. You're fooling yourself if you think that self regulation will stop the local legistlation from doing whatever THEY decide it should be. Maybe if we HIDE a little better, it will take longer, but reporting things isnt hiding them by any means. Best would be if we didnt film this shit at all, and we did our best to be somewhat inconspicuos or not look like full battlion soldiers(Im guilty of this too). Alas, we KNOW that isnt going to happen.n Wow, talk about derail! At least I did mention Euc's and highway, didnt I?

I dont think my belief in the broader sense of all of this, hinges on any one specific factor or learning experience of my life. I think that perhaps I was just born with this propesity and as I get older, I simply quit caring if people agree or not.

Edited October 9, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Darrell Wesh]

6 hours ago, mike_bike_kite said:

Carving is OK on the ski slopes but pretty stupid in traffic. How would you like it if all the other cars, motorbikes and bicycles weaved from side to side as you tried to get past them? It's also difficult to be fully aware of what's overtaking you on an EUC so weaving from side to side put's you in danger of colliding with anything trying to overtake you. Can I ask if you have a driving license?

Here we go again. Another rider who thinks carving is simply all show and fun and games. Another rider who tries to ride an EUC like it’s a car. Another rider whose mere frame of thought puts him at risk. 

If you don’t want to get hit, you carve. The complete opposite of what you think, but that’s why the best riders are always getting flak for their riding styles. Even motorcyclists are taught to ride from one side of the lane to the other in order to be seen(not as exaggerated as an EUC but still).
 

Movement is what catches motorists attention. I see a marked amount of “respect” for my personal bubble when I carve in my lane. Cars don’t tailgate me, even police have commented that my presence slows traffic down.

 If you want to ride stiff and still like a mummy, don’t bother asking why people cut you off, almost hit you, or act like they don’t see you. You don’t take up enough real estate for motorists to even signal in their brains that you’re a vehicle traveling with traffic.  
 

Not only is presence on the road increased by carving, but from a technique standpoint it decreases braking distance and also makes it easier for you to escape situations. If you’re constantly moving left and right you’re constantly checking what’s around you, plain and simple. So your awareness is increased twofold compared to the static mummy rider who only cares about what’s in front of him.