Hello from a new V8F owner

[Kai Drange]

Hello, everyone! I received my first EUC a week ago and just found this forum. So just wanted to say hi. :)

Budget was not an issue when deciding which wheel to get, but I wanted one that I could comfortably carry when needed, but powerful enough for my daily commute (7km each way with some steep hills). I don't think going above max 20-25km/h would be responsible on that route. With those criterias in mind, the new InMotion V8F looked like a decent choice that was available from a norwegian retailer. Browsing this forum I get the sense that other wheels are usually recommended instead, but so far it is everything i hoped it would be and happy with my purchase.

I have already found a lot of useful info here. Particularly about the limitations of UEC wheels, safe driving, etc. In particular, some face plant horror stories makes me very glad I found this place. I'd rather learn to drive safely from other people's mistakes than my own!

Anyways, thanks everyone for all the interesting content and discussions. This looks like a nice corner of the internet and a place where I will enjoy hanging around. :)

[null]

Sound choice for your need, welcome here and good fun riding 

Edited June 27, 2020 by null

[z3n]

1 hour ago, Kai Drange said:

Hello, everyone! I received my first EUC a week ago and just found this forum. So just wanted to say hi.

Hi @Kai Drange. Welcome to the future! 

1 hour ago, Kai Drange said:

I don't think going above max 20-25km/h would be responsible on that route.

Can't wait to hear about your future upgrades when the EUC Bug bites soon. 

[Kai Drange]

20 hours ago, z3n said:

Can't wait to hear about your future upgrades when the EUC Bug bites soon. 

Ha! Yes, I hope it won’t be too soon, though. Currently, practicing the pendulum, backwards driving, learning how to do sharp turns, tricks, etc. appeals more to me than lots of padding and high speeds, but that might very well change.

I have a fear of injuring others or even of being a mild nuisance in traffic (to the extent that it is irrational, tbh). I’m riding with a bell in my hand and slow down to walking speeds and keep my distance when closing in on pedestrians, dogs, children on bikes or similar. I never drive a car unless I absolutely have to out of fear that I might someday hit someone. I don’t think I have ever driven over the speed limit! So perhaps the need for speed will never come. Time will tell...
 

[pico]

13 hours ago, Kai Drange said:

Currently, practicing the pendulum, backwards driving, learning how to do sharp turns, tricks, etc. appeals more to me than lots of padding and high speeds

  My kind of Newbie!  Cheers!  Downgrading soon to a V8F!

[Felix]

Hi Kai from a fellow new V8F owner. Just had it for 2 weeks or so, its starting to really grow on me. 100km or so on the clock. I love most things about it except: Tilt back is very severe and sudden, really caught me by surprise first time it happened, so I just moved the speed slider to higher speed to avoid it. And: Battery indicator on device is not in line with the app. I get red bar blinking on device and app still says 30% or so. What are your likes and dislikes about V8F?

[Chriull]

19 minutes ago, Felix said:

I love most things about it except: Tilt back is very severe and sudden, really caught me by surprise first time it happened, so I just moved the speed slider to higher speed to avoid it.

Euc's unfortionately by now all have a "tiltback of death" implemented - it does the tilting within a fixed speed intervall. So this leads to a catapult effect if one accelerates faster into the tiltback. The stronger the acceleration - the harder the tiltback kicks in.

So it's a great measure to have (!for training!) the tiltback at lower speeds to get used to this behaviour - so it won't get one surprised at higher speeds and kicks you off the wheel!

At higher speeds one should not accellerate strong anyhow (overlean!)...

So maybe an alarm beep set just below tiltback speed as a "reminder" and then the tiltback as final warning could be a nice setup.

19 minutes ago, Felix said:

And: Battery indicator on device is not in line with the app. I get red bar blinking on device and app still says 30% or so.

At 30% a battery warning is not the worst idea - the wheels capabilities (speed, burden) are reducing with lower batteries!

Charge % are also directly calculated from battery voltage. So if one drives and battery voltage goes down momentarly (?and one sees the red led?) until one stops and looks at the app the "main voltage sag" is gone and the app shows a higher percentage.

Or do you mean continous discrepancy between the led display and the app? You use inmotion app? Some third party apps have different charge % algorirhms (optionaly) implemented.

Hiwever, charge % only shows a (about) real capacity figure after some minutes of rest!

[Felix]

2 minutes ago, Chriull said:

Euc's unfortionately by now all have a "tiltback of death" implemented - it does the tilting within a fixed speed intervall. So this leads to a catapult effect if one accelerates faster into the tiltback. The stronger the acceleration - the harder the tiltback kicks in.

So it's a great measure to have (!for training!) the tiltback at lower speeds to get used to this behaviour - so it won't get one surprised at higher speeds and kicks you off the wheel!

At higher speeds one should not accellerate strong anyhow (overlean!)...

So maybe an alarm beep set just below tiltback speed as a "reminder" and then the tiltback as final warning could be a nice setup.

At 30% a battery warning is not the worst idea - the wheels capabilities (speed, burden) are reducing with lower batteries!

Charge % are also directly calculated from battery voltage. So if one drives and battery voltage goes down momentarly (?and one sees the red led?) until one stops and looks at the app the "main voltage sag" is gone and the app shows a higher percentage.

Or do you mean continous discrepancy between the led display and the app? You use inmotion app? Some third party apps have different charge % algorirhms (optionaly) implemented.

Hiwever, charge % only shows a (about) real capacity figure after some minutes of rest!

On the tiltback: I was riding Gotway MCM5 for 2 weeks before the V8F and tilt back was much friendlier. About setting the beep before tiltback: I will try it but not sure thats possible using inmotion app. Will have a look. Maybe Darkbot?

Battery: The app % varies for sure depending on speed, but I assume when the red light on the device is blinking, it should be close to finished, but app would stay 30%  while riding and a bit more when stationary. For example on my onewheel XR  I only go by app and when its 30% I have no concerns whatsoever, except I would slow down a bit. But on V8F when the device is flashing red I guess I should be concerned even though app says 30%

[Chriull]

39 minutes ago, Felix said:

On the tiltback: I was riding Gotway MCM5 for 2 weeks before the V8F and tilt back was much friendlier.

Yes. Some wheels have a bit nicer tilbacks than others. But all are very unfriendly if one just accelerates hard enough into the tiltback.

So get aquainted with your wheels tiltback! As written before - one does not want to get surprised by the tiltback at top speed!

39 minutes ago, Felix said:

About setting the beep before tiltback: I will try it but not sure thats possible using inmotion app. Will have a look. Maybe Darkbot?

Afaik all these wheels should have setable speed alarms.

Afaik inmotion wheels are not as perfectly supported as ks and gw wheels by third party apps, but most major functionality should work.

39 minutes ago, Felix said:

Battery: The app % varies for sure depending on speed, but I assume when the red light on the device is blinking, it should be close to finished, but app would stay 30%  while riding and a bit more when stationary. For example on my onewheel XR  I only go by app and when its 30% I have no concerns whatsoever, except I would slow down a bit. But on V8F when the device is flashing red I guess I should be concerned even though app says 30%

Sorry - i have no experience with the special V8F behaviour. But 30% is already on the lower side. Most wheels have already activated/start speed throttling around this area. And one should use the wheel more prudent with and below 30%.

But yes - for a flashing red alarm it's a bit early!

[Vellberger]

Hi,

I would like to say hello, too. I own my V8F since June, 18th and I get more and more used to it. My feet allways want to get back on the pedals when I am at work, in car, in bed or else where. But as soon as I step on the wheel I am afraid and want to get off as soon as possible ^^. The more I practice the more the fear convert to a big smile in  my face. It is so fantastic to ride this thing without thinking to much. I feel more convidently to it every day and want to learn how to step on it with the left foot (by now I use allway my right one), to drive backwards and most importend of all to drive as convidently as possible. That means not only to take sharp corners for fun, but also when getting nervous about unexpected. To break really hard and to have the wheel under 100% controll in all situations.

By now I´m still driving with a belt around the handle to avoid clanking and scratching it over the asphalt when just hopping off. I also wear a bicycle helmet, wrist guards and kneepads. I always stay away from traffic and crowded places. In addition I always try to behave verry devensive. 

I hope my english is understandable :-)

Greatings from the south of Germany !

Edited June 29, 2020 by Vellberger

[Kai Drange]

3 hours ago, Felix said:

What are your likes and dislikes about V8F?

Hmm, I was worried it wouldn’t handle the steep hills around where I live, but that hasn’t been an issue at all. I’m also very pleased that it feels comfortable to ride on the route I wanted it for. I can keep up wih my wife’s electric scooter without problems, too, which is practical, as we will probably ride together once in a while.

Not too fond of the app, though. I’d like to keep track of my rides, but they seem to be gone the moment I turn the wheel off. And I wish it came with some kind of stand and some protective padding to avoid scratches when learning. So no real complaints so far. But this is the only EUC I have ever ridden.

I turned off speed clamping and set max speed to, eh, max from the beginning, so have only experienced the tiltback once. That was when pushing hard up a particularly steep and long hill. It caught me by surprise and lots of arm-waving ensued, but I managed a controlled stop. The suggestion in this thread to practice handling this sounds very sound. I will do that. I think I’ll reduce the max speed somewhat, as well. I have no intentions of going that fast, so a beep somewhere around 25-30km/h would be nice.

Edit: I think the manual could have been improved, btw. Only yesterday I discovered that a quick press on the power button toggles the headlight. Is that even mentioned anywhere? Some more detailed info on what some of the settings actually do (comfort/classic, what will actually happen if I set a max speed and then hit that limit, etc.) I’d prefer to have some detailed explanations instead of just having to experiment on my own.

Edited June 29, 2020 by Kai Drange

[Vellberger]

7 minutes ago, Kai Drange said:

Hmm, I was worried it wouldn’t handle the steep hills around where I live, but that hasn’t been an issue at all. I’m also very pleased that it feels comfortable to ride on the route I wanted it for. I can keep up wih my wife’s electric scooter without problems, too, which is practical, as we will probably ride together once in a while.

Not too fond of the app, though. I’d like to keep track of my rides, but they seem to be gone the moment I turn the wheel off. And I wish it came with some kind of stand and some protective padding to avoid scratches when learning. So no real complaints so far. But this is the only EUC I have ever ridden.

I turned off speed clamping and set max speed to, eh, max from the beginning, so have only experienced the tiltback once. That was when pushing hard up a particularly steep and long hill. It caught me by surprise and lots of arm-waving ensued, but I managed a controlled stop. The suggestion in this thread to practice handling this sounds very sound. I will do that. I think I’ll reduce the max speed somewhat, as well. I have no intentions of going that fast, so a beep somewhere around 25-30km/h would be nice.

I would like to give my personal opinion to the V8F, too. Starting with the don´t likes I mention the glossy black surface, wich looks really good while new, but might look bad after having some contacts to the ground. I have covered it in painting fleece with some duck tape to prevent it from too much scratches. Looks pretty silly but it´s ok while learning I think. I have not covered the pedals, because there will be scratches anyway. The second thing I don´t like so much is the app. Some parts are in chinese wich i don´t understand at all. But I get connected well as long as i have a connection to the internet and of course bluetooth. The app provide some usefull options which seams to work well. 

In fact that it is my first euc I can only compare it to my friends solowheels. They are three brothers who bought each one of the very first (?) solowheels 7 or 8 years ago. Could be an E200 or something, they even do not know themselfes. But it is interesting to see and try out how technology has improved in this period of time. My V8F is much more directly, so my friends had some trouble to get used to it first. beside that the V8F is bigger, a bit heavier and much faster than the older eucs. I like the little stands on the rear and front that allow to stand the euc upright on flat surfaces. And when driving on wet streets it seams to provent water splashing up, too. The pedals are in good size and have a good grip.

All in all I am very happy with my V8F and would buy it again. If it is worth the higher price to the V8 is up to everybody. You get an V10 for the same money. But the V10 was to heavy for me and I didn´t like the trolley handle as well.

 

[Tazarinho]

1 hour ago, Kai Drange said:

I’d like to keep track of my rides, but they seem to be gone the moment I turn the wheel off

There's a great app available: EUC World, that will allow you to do just that  

[Kai Drange]

55 minutes ago, Vellberger said:

I like the little stands on the rear and front that allow to stand the euc upright on flat surfaces.

I didn’t realize it could do that. Nice!

[Felix]

8 hours ago, Vellberger said:

Hi,

I would like to say hello, too. I own my V8F since June, 18th and I get more and more used to it. My feet allways want to get back on the pedals when I am at work, in car, in bed or else where. But as soon as I step on the wheel I am afraid and want to get off as soon as possible ^^. The more I practice the more the fear convert to a big smile in  my face. It is so fantastic to ride this thing without thinking to much. I feel more convidently to it every day and want to learn how to step on it with the left foot (by now I use allway my right one), to drive backwards and most importend of all to drive as convidently as possible. That means not only to take sharp corners for fun, but also when getting nervous about unexpected. To break really hard and to have the wheel under 100% controll in all situations.

By now I´m still driving with a belt around the handle to avoid clanking and scratching it over the asphalt when just hopping off. I also wear a bicycle helmet, wrist guards and kneepads. I always stay away from traffic and crowded places. In addition I always try to behave verry devensive. 

I hope my english is understandable :-)

Greatings from the south of Germany !

Klar verstehen wir dich! Ich fahre in Den Haag, NL durch die Gegend. Lass dich in DE nicht erwischen

[Felix]

5 hours ago, Vellberger said:

I would like to give my personal opinion to the V8F, too. Starting with the don´t likes I mention the glossy black surface, wich looks really good while new, but might look bad after having some contacts to the ground. I have covered it in painting fleece with some duck tape to prevent it from too much scratches. Looks pretty silly but it´s ok while learning I think. I have not covered the pedals, because there will be scratches anyway. The second thing I don´t like so much is the app. Some parts are in chinese wich i don´t understand at all. But I get connected well as long as i have a connection to the internet and of course bluetooth. The app provide some usefull options which seams to work well. 

In fact that it is my first euc I can only compare it to my friends solowheels. They are three brothers who bought each one of the very first (?) solowheels 7 or 8 years ago. Could be an E200 or something, they even do not know themselfes. But it is interesting to see and try out how technology has improved in this period of time. My V8F is much more directly, so my friends had some trouble to get used to it first. beside that the V8F is bigger, a bit heavier and much faster than the older eucs. I like the little stands on the rear and front that allow to stand the euc upright on flat surfaces. And when driving on wet streets it seams to provent water splashing up, too. The pedals are in good size and have a good grip.

All in all I am very happy with my V8F and would buy it again. If it is worth the higher price to the V8 is up to everybody. You get an V10 for the same money. But the V10 was to heavy for me and I didn´t like the trolley handle as well.

 

I got this cover with my V8F, not sure how much its cost extra, but it protects the sides nicely and doesn't look bad. 

I'm also happy with my V8F but always little worried I might be riding too close to max power. So I think medium to long term I want to get a more powerful one. I want to go 30kmh without any worries of closing in on the max, also with wind and low battery. Thinking MCM5 or Gotway Tesla which are still small-ish wheels but much more power.

[Vellberger]

13 hours ago, Felix said:

I got this cover with my V8F, not sure how much its cost extra, but it protects the sides nicely and doesn't look bad. 

Yes, I saw this cover when I ordered my wheel. But it was about 70€ if I remember correctly. And I rather wanted to spend this money for protecting myself instead. But I just checked the price right now and it is under 35€. That is ok if it is a good protection as you say and not just a thin plastic bag with a company´s logo on it. Think I will order one.

I´ve only driven my euc 20km/h max by now (except one short lane on 25km/h). Although I get more often to the limiter, I force myself not to increase the speedlimit until I have a protective motorcycle jacket and a full face helmet to complete my gear. I think the speed doesn´t sound much and it feels also not much... BUT it´s the same when you drive a car... 70km/h seams to be slow until you loose control and slip over snow or something. Then it feels immediatelly fast like hell. To say it short: I don´t want to risk to much while I´m still a beginner.

I´m just discovering what i call "the flow" of riding, which is pure joy. :-)

Edited June 30, 2020 by Vellberger

[Felix]

1 hour ago, Vellberger said:

Yes, I saw this cover when I ordered my wheel. But it was about 70€ if I remember correctly. And I rather wanted to spend this money for protecting myself instead. But I just checked the price right now and it is under 35€. That is ok if it is a good protection as you say and not just a thin plastic bag with a company´s logo on it. Think I will order one.

I´ve only driven my euc 20km/h max by now (except one short lane on 25km/h). Although I get more often to the limiter, I force myself not to increase the speedlimit until I have a protective motorcycle jacket and a full face helmet to complete my gear. I think the speed doesn´t sound much and it feels also not much... BUT it´s the same when you drive a car... 70km/h seams to be slow until you loose control and slip over snow or something. Then it feels immediatelly fast like hell. To say it short: I don´t want to risk to much while I´m still a beginner.

I´m just discovering what i call "the flow" of riding, which is pure joy. :-)

Yes i think it was just 30 bucks or so, it seemed insignificant to add it to the order at the time. I usually cruise at 25 kmh or so. Here in Holland we have excellent bike paths so 25 feels ultra relaxed and safe.  Sometimes i speed to 28 to 30 or so just to catch an electric bike  , but I do feel 30 is too close to the max and its probably not safe on low battery. Thats why i am considering for safety to get a bit bigger unicycle - not because i want to go much faster, but just to have more safety margin. 

[Vellberger]

28 minutes ago, Felix said:

Yes i think it was just 30 bucks or so, it seemed insignificant to add it to the order at the time. I usually cruise at 25 kmh or so. Here in Holland we have excellent bike paths so 25 feels ultra relaxed and safe.  Sometimes i speed to 28 to 30 or so just to catch an electric bike  , but I do feel 30 is too close to the max and its probably not safe on low battery. Thats why i am considering for safety to get a bit bigger unicycle - not because i want to go much faster, but just to have more safety margin. 

Hmm I understand. But on the other hand I guess Inmotion has already considered a big safety buffer. While you stay at max 30km/h you will always be 5km/h less than the maximum Inmotion provided to the V8F. So... for that reason I would trust the wheel. Especially on flat terrain. But I don´t have any experience about that, so... Hope some people here can tell more about it.

[Kai Drange]

I’d be interested in this as well. I have read the posts about faceplants on V8 when pushing it to its 30km/h limit, but the V8F is a more powerful wheel (with a different engine I think?). Have there been similar accidents on the V8F?

I’ve been above 30km/h by accident a couple of times and had no sense of being close to the limit in any way. But then again, as a beginner I might just not have realised this was unwise.

As I don’t  want to go past 30km/h (the legal limit is 20km/h in Norway) I’ve set the max speed to slightly below 30 for now...

[Vellberger]

Hello,

although it is a gear question, I ask it here, because it is specific to the V8F.

I am choosing gear since a few days now. And I have allready wrist guards, knee protectors and a motorcycle jacket with protectors. And i currently use a bicycle helmet as well, which I want to change in a full face helmet. Since I saw the drivers on youtube wearing such gear I decided to do so as well. Especially as I saw some cut outs. (And by the way, they looked really cool as well.) But now I´m struggling with the vision to drive around like Ironman while I get over taken by an old lady on an e-bike. ^^ In other words: Gear like that make sence on euc rushing 60km/h for sure, but do you think it is a bit overdone to gear up like this on a 35km/h max euc? I guess I am the only guy in my area riding a monowheel. So it would be ok to look some kind of "different", I do anyway ^^. And if there will be others following me starting this hobby, it would perhaps be no misstake to lead in example. And I feel pretty good wearing this things. I´m just not sure if it is too much.

What do you think?

[AtlasP]

On 6/29/2020 at 2:13 AM, Chriull said:

Euc's unfortionately by now all have a "tiltback of death" implemented

 

 

 

 

 

Tiltback is a remarkable safety feature, and the degree of its severity on most wheels is an indicator of the egregiousness of rider behavior, particularly acceleration. If someone characterizes it as "tiltback of death", then the "of death" part is a characteristic of their riding behavior which the tiltback is saving them from, not the other way around.

It amazes me the number of people who have no common sense idea of how these things work and what something like tiltback is and does. If you're experiencing tiltback on your wheel, it is /you/ who is doing something wrong, not the wheel.

On 6/29/2020 at 3:13 AM, Chriull said:

Afaik inmotion wheels are not as perfectly supported as ks and gw wheels by third party apps, but most major functionality should work.

 

 

 

 

 

I have no idea where you're getting this from. InMotion wheels are just as well supported by the main third party apps as KS & GW, and I believe the majority users of said apps are doing so on IM wheels.

Edited July 3, 2020 by AtlasP

[Chriull]

1 hour ago, AtlasP said:

Tiltback is a remarkable safety feature, and the degree of its severity on most wheels is an indicator of the egregiousness of rider behavior, particularly acceleration. If someone characterizes it as "tiltback of death", then the "of death" part is a characteristic of their riding behavior which the tiltback is saving them from, not the other way around.

Yes. But it could be much much better easily. As KS has already a much better safety threshold as speed, namely inverter load/motor output it could base tultback on this.

And there is no readon why tiltback has to kick in harder once one accelerates stronger

details in https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/7855-anatomy-of-an-overlean/?do=findComment&comment=107721

1 hour ago, AtlasP said:

I have no idea where you're getting this from. InMotion wheels are just as well supported by the main third party apps as KS & GW, and I believe the majority users of said apps are doing so on IM wheels.

KS unveild (by NDA) all their protocoll details with every "special"

GW has more or less "just basic functionality" which is stable and supported.

For Inmotion wheels some were reverse engeneered and not "everything" is supported. V8F, as i learned shortly, is not supported at all.

But yes, for most inmotion wheels "basic" functionality works.

[AtlasP]

1 hour ago, Chriull said:

And there is no readon why tiltback has to kick in harder once one accelerates stronger

 

 

 

Surely you can't be serious?

Tiltback is not simply to 'inform' the rider that they are approaching the wheel's limits, but to actually & physically help prevent them from exceeding those limits by physically shifting the rider's weight backward. The more aggressively/dangerously the rider approaches this failure point, the more drastic tiltback is required to achieve this end/prevent them from crossing the limit.

The number of people that do not understand this and simply believe that tiltback is just a 'nanny' feature is proof of both why tiltback has to exist and why it has to work the way it does, or else there would be a lot more faceplants by riders who have no idea what even happened.

1 hour ago, Chriull said:

KS unveild (by NDA) all their protocoll details with every "special"

GW has more or less "just basic functionality" which is stable and supported.

For Inmotion wheels some were reverse engeneered and not "everything" is supported. V8F, as i learned shortly, is not supported at all.

But yes, for most inmotion wheels "basic" functionality works.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

• The only brand that supports firmware updates by the third party apps is King Song, and then only very recently and after a great deal of having their hand 'forced' by Jason of ewheels (and possibly other etailers)--ultimately due to their longstanding failure over their handling of their own app situation, not because they're more supportive of the third-party efforts. (And indeed the hoops that third party app developers had to jump through was still pretty ridiculous.)
• There is often a delay between when new wheels are released and their being supported in the third-party apps, which is not at all unique to IM or the V8F.
• Otherwise IM functionality in the third party apps is on parity with every other brand, including Gotway & Ninebot.

 

Edited July 3, 2020 by AtlasP

[Chriull]

9 hours ago, AtlasP said:

10 hours ago, Chriull said:

And there is no readon why tiltback has to kick in harder once one accelerates stronger

Surely you can't be serious?

I'm dead serious with this statement.

Quote

Tiltback is not simply to 'inform' the rider that they are approaching the wheel's limits, but to actually & physically help prevent them from exceeding those limits by physically shifting the rider's weight backward.

Exactly!

It shall beside warn, intuitively help the rider to stop acceleration/decelerate and not endanger the rider by bringing him out of balance!

As it seems by now tiltback performs within some small speed range. To wildly guess some numbers (as this is just to get the picture, real accurate numbers won't change the system), if set to 35 km/h it goes from 0° pedal tilt at 35 km/h to 10° pedal tilt at 37 km/h.

If one accelerates slowly and comfortable within 5 seconds from 27 km/h to 37 km/h the tiltback kicks in within one second - a great help for the rider! In such a case one gets the starting tiltback and will stop easily the acceleration and never reach the 37 km/h, but "level off" around the 35 km/h and savely drive on - mission accomplished!

If one accelerates twice as hard tiltback kicks fully in within 0.5 seconds - a more severe situation, but should still be very ok to handle.

For four times and higher accelerations the tilt back kicks in in 0.25 seconds and less - developing to catapulting the rider off the wheel or at least dangerously destabilizing him! Then the tiltback is no help anymore but a dangerously, faulty implemented measure!

So how to easily solve this problem - one chooses a time duration instead of a speed intervall to let the tiltback kick in! Staying with the above example one wants full tiltback at 37 km/h and extending from 0° to 10° within a second.

For the "first acceleration" (from 27 to 37km/h within 5 seconds)  nothing will change - tiltback starts at 35 km/h and fully extends within a second at 37 km/h.

With the twice as hard acceleration tiltback will already start at 33 km/h and fully extend within _one_ second again until 37 km/h reached.

With a four times as hard acceleration tiltback already starts at  29 km/h and again extent within _one_ second to full tiltback at 37 km/h.

For higher accelerations tiltback will start quite immedeately and take the time available until 37 km/h.

(If one stops this "higher" accelerations, by this system tiltback will of course stop again and one can comfortably drive up to this 37 km/h!)

No more endagering of the rider by imbalancing/surprising/catapulting him!

The wheel knows the speed values about 100 times a second - getting the accurate acceleration from this is trivial.

Linear extrapolation is early high school math and no rocket science!

Now to the next "problem" - speed is just one variable to determine the safety margin until overlean. Looking at speed alone it is a "bad" indicator. With low burdens (acceleration,incline,etc) at a speed limit the safety margin is still "huge", with higher burdens it gets smaller and smaller! So each wheel with a fixed speed tiltback can be overleaned below this speed limit if one "just" accelerstes hard enough!

The good news is, that KS has found/introduced a new value in their firmware (inverter load, motor output %) that accurately gives a percentage of how near one is at the overlean limit! They afaik implemented the "88% alarm' (4 fast consecutive beeps) by this.

So they could implement tiltback to extent to full pedal tilt reached at such 88% (12% margin left till overlean) within one second. Or whichever values are suitable/usable - or just to be choosen by the rider!

Such a tiltback implementation would be a huge leap forward in warning quality/rider safety!

Quote

The more aggressively/dangerously the rider approaches this failure point, the more drastic tiltback is required to achieve this end/prevent them from crossing the limit.

The number of people that do not understand this and simply believe that tiltback is just a 'nanny' feature is proof of both why tiltback has to exist and why it has to work the way it does, or else there would be a lot more faceplants by riders who have no idea what even happened.

Sorry, but to this just a big no, as explained above.

Tiltback is badly and unnecessarily dangerous implememted by now!

Disclaimer: My knowledge about tiltback implementations could be a bit outdated, as i do not try and analyze tiltback with every new firmware version and just know other manufacturers implementations by reports here. So i trust that any bigger changes and improvements should come by this forum. At least there seems to be no announcents from manufacturer side, that anything changed/is about to change