Justify buying a Gotway Monster v3?

[Ben Kim]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

The first push off the blocks is all I'm talking about. Of course, for the entire run, we're not gonna catch a car if they wanna floor it and push 40 mph+.

But dead stop accel off the blocks, I'm gonna beat any ICE car (minus the $$$,$$$ sports cars) with my Monster seated "squeeze" technique; if you did the same, you would too. Of course, the ICE car will quickly catch up. Anything electric though, like a Tesla, etc., of course I'm not gonna be able to do this.

 

In my experience with the side-to-side & seated technique, if you get it right, fastest accel to slowest: 1. Seated Monster Squeeze; 2. My Side-to-Side/Heel-to-Heel Motion on the Nik+; 3. Regular Lean on the Nik+; 4. Side-to-Side/Heel-to-Heel Motion on the Monster; .... big gap..... 5. (slowest) Regular Lean on the Monster.

 

I for the love of me have no clue how guys can ride a Monster with that extra padding/thickness, as the Monster is super thick to begin with, stock.

 

IMHO, sitting will always win against standing, even seated Monster vs standing Nikola. The significantly greater leverage (again, literally squeeze) exerts so much more force than any standing technique.

 

Yes, all faster on the Nik+. Blow away? Not so sure it's that big a gap with the right rhythm/swing/leverage. And I'd beg to say I would get off the blocks a hair faster than the standing Nikola with squeeze seated Monster.

 

Zero exertion, all body angle leveraging and natural gravity weight falling, all plus the right rhythmic build up.

 

Believe me or not, with that same rhythmic motion I do on the Monster, doing so on the Nik+ makes it EVEN Faster than the norm!

 

Try a seated nikola.  that wheel is stupid easy to move even seated. 

[houseofjob]

19 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

Try a seated nikola.  that wheel is stupid easy to move even seated. 

Probably, but I prefer to keep my wheels as close to deadstock as possible since I will always upgrade. 

[Ben Kim]

29 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Probably, but I prefer to keep my wheels as close to deadstock as possible since I will always upgrade. 

it’s just 3 strips of velcro. easily removable. rock solid though, Yanson can attest. 

[houseofjob]

19 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

it’s just 3 strips of velcro. easily removable. rock solid though, Yanson can attest. 

eh.

I'm still waiting for a seated 24" or 26".... Monster 22" is a little too small, there's still room for a few more inches.

Edited December 2, 2019 by houseofjob

[Darrell Wesh]

4 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Nice jump 

EUC is not that kind of instantaneous burst push though IMHO, it's always felt more like a resistance force, like rowing or cable benching, etc., needs some more sustaining of force than just all initiation then instant release.

My motion is more like you're about to let the wheel body fall over and drop; that gravity based acceleration force sustained over distance of fall.

Whether I’m jumping high or pushing a bench press up I’m still trying to move the load as fast as possible. It’s very much an instantaneous burst at the very start of the movement. Whether that load is my body weight or 225lb on the bar (or an EUC.) That’s how you move the mass the quickest. 
Since I have a large percentage of fast twitch my explosive efforts can happen over very quick ranges of motion. As in, if me and Average Joe were to do a maximal jump we could both go through the exact same starting range of motion (depth of squat before exploding up) but on the way up I would reach the end of my range of motion (a tall, full extension posture) far quicker than Average Joe would. So to him, it would feel like (and he would be)pushing for a lot longer than it would feel like to me because his muscles can’t contract as fast as mine. Type in box jumps on YouTube and take notice of the slower arm swing of guys jumping boxes way lower. The velocity of my arm swing is extremely quick, even in slow mo it’s quick. A lot of fast twitch fibers at play. 

Back on topic: It’s the aggressive, instantaneous push that generates the quickest starts.
 

An effective kick start should feel like an “instantaneous burst” because that’s how you generate the most power. As soon as you start the kick, the wheel starts moving away from you, so you need to apply the most force as quickly as possible before you run out of range of motion in the kicking/extending leg. 
 

Power is force times velocity. More power is generated when you exert great strength at high velocity. Sure, someone may be able to push a 500lb sled down a track, but most people don’t have the velocity factor. Without velocity, they would only manage to be walking while pushing the sled because they can’t produce the force quick enough to run with it. 
On the other hand, I would be able to run pushing the sled down the track because I can produce the force needed to move it, very quickly. 

A long, sustained force to kick start an EUC is lacking the “speed” part of the “power” equation. Which means less power delivery for acceleration.

 

There is also the kinematic factor in kick starts. When most people push something they are applying their energy vertically instead of horizontally. They don’t know the joint angles needed to maximize propulsive force. 

The sled push (or pushing a car) is a perfect example of the horizontal force that should be applied to “kick start” an EUC. Hip hyper-extension.

If you try to move a car without sinking your hips and curling your feet to push horizontally, the car will not budge. Also, think of how you rock a car to get leverage in pushing it. You start off with an explosive pushing effort to get it started rocking. You can’t get it rocking with a slow sustained push. 

Regardless, since you don’t need anywhere near that level of effort and biomechanical correctness to move the EUC in a kick start, most everyone applies their force vertically and with no velocity or explosive effort. 

[Darrell Wesh]

6 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Zero exertion, all body angle leveraging and natural gravity weight falling, all plus the right rhythmic build up.

Well that’s the thing... exertion is required to achieve the fastest starts. Of course, I only start this fast when I absolutely need to gap cars because the speed of the road means they will leave me behind going 40+mph.
 

Or when I just want to taunt everyone with how fast these things are. 

[Darrell Wesh]

6 hours ago, houseofjob said:

And I'd beg to say I would get off the blocks a hair faster than the standing Nikola with squeeze seated Monster.

I needa go up to NYC to have a short acceleration race with you, best of 3; everyone start the bets! 

Edited December 2, 2019 by Darrell Wesh

[Ben Kim]

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

I needa go up to NYC to have a short acceleration race with you, best of 3; everyone start the bets! 

please do! Enough suicide riders willing to do this here along with lane split traffic on 6th avenue. 

[houseofjob]

12 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Whether I’m jumping high or pushing a bench press up I’m still trying to move the load as fast as possible. It’s very much an instantaneous burst at the very start of the movement. Whether that load is my body weight or 225lb on the bar (or an EUC.) That’s how you move the mass the quickest. 
Since I have a large percentage of fast twitch my explosive efforts can happen over very quick ranges of motion. As in, if me and Average Joe were to do a maximal jump we could both go through the exact same starting range of motion (depth of squat before exploding up) but on the way up I would reach the end of my range of motion (a tall, full extension posture) far quicker than Average Joe would. So to him, it would feel like (and he would be)pushing for a lot longer than it would feel like to me because his muscles can’t contract as fast as mine. Type in box jumps on YouTube and take notice of the slower arm swing of guys jumping boxes way lower. The velocity of my arm swing is extremely quick, even in slow mo it’s quick. A lot of fast twitch fibers at play. 
Back on topic: It’s the aggressive, instantaneous push that generates the quickest starts.

An effective kick start should feel like an “instantaneous burst” because that’s how you generate the most power. As soon as you start the kick, the wheel starts moving away from you, so you need to apply the most force as quickly as possible before you run out of range of motion in the kicking/extending leg. 

Power is force times velocity. More power is generated when you exert great strength at high velocity. Sure, someone may be able to push a 500lb sled down a track, but most people don’t have the velocity factor. Without velocity, they would only manage to be walking while pushing the sled because they can’t produce the force quick enough to run with it. 
On the other hand, I would be able to run pushing the sled down the track because I can produce the force needed to move it, very quickly. 

A long, sustained force to kick start an EUC is lacking the “speed” part of the “power” equation. Which means less power delivery for acceleration.

There is also the kinematic factor in kick starts. When most people push something they are applying their energy vertically instead of horizontally. They don’t know the joint angles needed to maximize propulsive force. 

The sled push (or pushing a car) is a perfect example of the horizontal force that should be applied to “kick start” an EUC. Hip hyper-extension.

If you try to move a car without sinking your hips and curling your feet to push horizontally, the car will not budge. Also, think of how you rock a car to get leverage in pushing it. You start off with an explosive pushing effort to get it started rocking. You can’t get it rocking with a slow sustained push. 

Regardless, since you don’t need anywhere near that level of effort and biomechanical correctness to move the EUC in a kick start, most everyone applies their force vertically and with no velocity or explosive effort. 

Er, I think you're overestimating the "kick start" part of all this, as starting off the ground is not an ideal leverage position on a wheel that has resistance.

But agree to disagree then.

 

12 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Well that’s the thing... exertion is required to achieve the fastest starts. Of course, I only start this fast when I absolutely need to gap cars because the speed of the road means they will leave me behind going 40+mph.

It's not that cut and dry.

Yes, fastest start, more force-pressure. But the Monster doesn't have the proper and proportional torque arm in pedal length to exert such force-pressure properly. 

My zero exertion method is based on the wheel body falling combined with the forward vector, nothing more (no muscle). You won't believe it until you get it and start feeling it, I know that if I were another rider without that feel, I wouldn't believe it either.

If you had like double the pedal length/radius to play with, maybe regular force-lean would get proper acceleration and be better on the Monster, but even then, you would be operating too far away from the wheel body center, sacrificing overall stability IMHO.

 

12 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

I needa go up to NYC to have a short acceleration race with you, best of 3; everyone start the bets! 

Bet.

Until then, you should really try my squeeze-sit method on the Monster. I know other Monster-seated-riding forum members will agree with me that the torque is definitely there on the Monster, since they feel this seated just as I do (translating that to standing is much much harder, again due to the lack of torque arm in pedal length).

[Darrell Wesh]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

think you're overestimating the "kick start" part of all this, as starting off the ground is not an ideal leverage position on a wheel that has resistance

 Not sure what you mean? Everyone starts off the ground. One foot has to be on the ground to balance a standstill EUC. The difference being my kick start is aggressive and angled correctly to provide propulsion compared to a similar rider just hopping on to the wheel. 

 

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

Yes, fastest start, more force-pressure. But the Monster doesn't have the proper and proportional torque arm in pedal length to exert such force-pressure properly. 

Well we agree on this. I did say I can’t do this kind of forceful start on the monster or i’d fall off it. 

 

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

Until then, you should really try my squeeze-sit method on the Monster.

I’ve been! That’s the obvious technique for getting started when i realized I can’t kick start it fast.
It’s funny because the friend I sold my ks18s to, I asked him how he achieves maximum acceleration if he were at a red light in front of cars. He demonstrated by simply sitting on the nose of the wheel right away. 

[Darrell Wesh]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

My zero exertion method is based on the wheel body falling combined with the forward vector, nothing more (no muscle). You won't believe it until you get it and start feeling it, I know that if I were another rider without that feel, I wouldn't believe it either.

Do you mean standing starting or sitting starting? Is this method only for the Monster? 
Let’s start at the beginning, you have one foot on the wheel, the other on the ground. What is zero exertion method after that?

[seage]

This conversation is super interesting. I just grabbed a snack and read through the whole thing. I apply a lot of what you guys talk about to my riding style, even tho some of it doesnt fully apply to my wheel. 

[houseofjob]

On 12/3/2019 at 3:17 AM, seage said:

This conversation is super interesting. I just grabbed a snack and read through the whole thing. I apply a lot of what you guys talk about to my riding style, even tho some of it doesnt fully apply to my wheel. 

 

(fyi, it all applies, regardless of wheel model IMHO, just smaller wheels lend themselves to less strict technique/"work")

 

On 12/2/2019 at 2:30 PM, Darrell Wesh said:

 Not sure what you mean? Everyone starts off the ground. One foot has to be on the ground to balance a standstill EUC. The difference being my kick start is aggressive and angled correctly to provide propulsion compared to a similar rider just hopping on to the wheel.

Ah yes, you subscribe to this ground kick-start thing, but I'm not fully convinced how effective it is on EUC's that are not free to roll and momentum, ala a manual skateboard, etc. Pressure on the pedal is pressure on the pedal, whether it's ground starting or not.

 

On 12/2/2019 at 2:30 PM, Darrell Wesh said:

Well we agree on this. I did say I can’t do this kind of forceful start on the monster or i’d fall off it. 

Right, but that's why I'm saying with the proportionally shorter pedals on the bigger Monster, you need a different way to start it IMHO than the usual jam-on-the-pedal-and-hold-it that everyone seems to do.

 

On 12/2/2019 at 2:30 PM, Darrell Wesh said:

I’ve been! That’s the obvious technique for getting started when i realized I can’t kick start it fast.
It’s funny because the friend I sold my ks18s to, I asked him how he achieves maximum acceleration if he were at a red light in front of cars. He demonstrated by simply sitting on the nose of the wheel right away. 

Yeah, this is the key to showing that the "big wheel, less torque" is not the only contributing phenomena for the markedly "lack of torque" riders feel on the Monster next to smaller wheels. Said this a million times to naysayers, but the Monster torque is there, you just can't do the same 💩you do for smaller wheels.

 

On 12/2/2019 at 2:41 PM, Darrell Wesh said:

Do you mean standing starting or sitting starting? Is this method only for the Monster? 

It's the standing technique I posted on IG, and it applies to any wheel, even if you don't "need" it for the smaller, lazier technique wheels.

 

On 12/2/2019 at 2:41 PM, Darrell Wesh said:

Let’s start at the beginning, you have one foot on the wheel, the other on the ground. What is zero exertion method after that?

The ground start is the ground start.

When on, heel plant each straightened foot on the side the wheel is bending/tipping over (other leg bent and on forefoot), then let the wheel fall over to the other side, feeling is like the flopping motion when pedaling a bicycle. Your feet need to be flared out at the heels to let the body of the wheel clear your legs.

If you've ever lazily turned on EUC while pressing the dipping pedal, it's that feeling of increased force: your weight gravity is doing the work, not your muscles.

[mrelwood]

15 hours ago, houseofjob said:

your weight gravity is doing the work, not your muscles.

I can’t really see how any acceleration is different in this regard. You can’t really use muscle to accelerate an EUC, it’s always the wheel reacting to the forward falling motion, which is caused by gravity.

[Darrell Wesh]

2 hours ago, mrelwood said:

I can’t really see how any acceleration is different in this regard. You can’t really use muscle to accelerate an EUC, it’s always the wheel reacting to the forward falling motion, which is caused by gravity.

You’re accelerating your body weight over the EUC quickly. I realize I painted an image of  “pushing the EUC” by kick starting but the proper concept would be pushing your body via kick start over the EUC quickly to produce fast acceleration. 

Its similar to aggressively leaning in to a turn vs slowly leaning in to a turn. The aggressive lean produces a quicker result. How quickly from a standing position you can move your body and center of mass over the wheel is determined by the push.
 

Most people pull their stance leg up and forward to step on to the pedal (like climbing stairs) and waste time having to initiate a a strong forward lean to get going fast. 
 

From the images, in the first frame I’m in the pseudo 3 point start stance, a deeply hinged position for stability and one arm cocked back. 
In the second frame of the image, I sweep my arm forward while simultaneously kick pushing at the proper angle (look at how my flexed knee is almost pointing horizontally, towards where I want to push myself- forward) to get my body’s mass over the wheel quickly to accelerate. 
You have to be pretty proficient and stable at 1 leg riding to be able to pull this off. I probably accelerate to 10mph before my trailing leg comes from full extension to resting on to the pedal.

Although it may seem like with my leg trailing behind me for that long that’s mass thats slowing me down; it actually acts as a counter balance and enables me to safely lean my whole body even further ahead of the wheel to accelerate harder without falling off the front. 
 

Once I’m on the pedals my body is already in an acceleration posture. What tends to happen to most people is they actually initiate braking and slow down when they first get on because they put pressure at the back of the pedals in order to find stability before committing to their forward lean. So you get this jerkiness or “pause” before you see them accelerate. Meanwhile, my acceleration is smooth because the transition onto the wheel was smooth.

Edited December 5, 2019 by Darrell Wesh

[Aneta]

2 hours ago, mrelwood said:

You can’t really use muscle to accelerate an EUC, it’s always the wheel reacting to the forward falling motion, which is caused by gravity.

The wheel is only reacting to its shell (=motherboard with gyro sensor) pitch change from calibrated neutral position, it has no means to know whether it was caused by strong muscle input (like @chrisjunlee's "ankle flicks") or by overall body falling motion. I'm not an aggressive rider to do things like flicks to speak from experience, but at least theoretically, it should be possible then to accelerate a segwheel "by muscle"?

[Hsiang]

21 hours ago, houseofjob said:

 

 

Yeah, this is the key to showing that the "big wheel, less torque" is not the only contributing phenomena for the markedly "lack of torque" riders feel on the Monster next to smaller wheels. Said this a million times to naysayers, but the Monster torque is there, you just can't do the same 💩you do for smaller wheels.

 

It's the standing technique I posted on IG, and it applies to any wheel, even if you don't "need" it for the smaller, lazier technique wheels.

 

The ground start is the ground start.

When on, heel plant each straightened foot on the side the wheel is bending/tipping over (other leg bent and on forefoot), then let the wheel fall over to the other side, feeling is like the flopping motion when pedaling a bicycle. Your feet need to be flared out at the heels to let the body of the wheel clear your legs.

If you've ever lazily turned on EUC while pressing the dipping pedal, it's that feeling of increased force: your weight gravity is doing the work, not your muscles.

As representative of the "naysayers" I resent you attitude.. LOL. my argument is that the "lack of torque" feel is due to the monster's well.. lack or torque, I am not saying that it isn't possible to overcome the momentum of the wheel due to larger diameter and weight through better technique. However there is a reason why they put a larger engine in a truck than a compact car. You can still drive an F150 with a v4 through better gear switching technique I am sure but you can't argue that it isn't underpowered.

I still don't understand the intricacies of how torque output from our motor in relates to the watt rating, some say that we can pull more simply by pumping in greater voltage, but I also hear that there are optimal voltage design for each motor and efficiency drop as you pump in more. But I don't think that there are any practical reason why a larger motor can't fit, the 6000 watt motor on the back of a ONYX looks not much larger, if there's an engineering reason I love to hear it.

I suspect the main reason is really Gotway's unwillingness to invest in engineering associated with fitting a larger motor; easier and cheaper to just keep upping the voltage.

 

[Hsiang]

4 hours ago, Aneta said:

The wheel is only reacting to its shell (=motherboard with gyro sensor) pitch change from calibrated neutral position, it has no means to know whether it was caused by strong muscle input (like @chrisjunlee's "ankle flicks") or by overall body falling motion. I'm not an aggressive rider to do things like flicks to speak from experience, but at least theoretically, it should be possible then to accelerate a segwheel "by muscle"?

I always wonder if its possible to do a "bobsled start" with a monster, it feels stable enough for you to jump on from a run with some practice.

[houseofjob]

3 hours ago, Hsiang said:

As representative of the "naysayers" I resent you attitude.. LOL. my argument is that the "lack of torque" feel is due to the monster's well.. lack or torque, I am not saying that it isn't possible to overcome the momentum of the wheel due to larger diameter and weight through better technique. However there is a reason why they put a larger engine in a truck than a compact car. You can still drive an F150 with a v4 through better gear switching technique I am sure but you can't argue that it isn't underpowered.

As usual, we agree to disagree. 

My argument is that the "big wheel, less torque" arguments are not describing the whole picture of what's going on for the Monster vs a smaller wheel (and yes, the bigger Monster has less proportional torque, but not nearly to the degree you are feeling, as that is just technique). 

It's not apples to apples when you size up that 16" EUC up to 22", but you don't size up the pedal length proportionally (same pedals for all Gotway sizes); you need the longer length on a bigger wheel diameter to exert the same proportional force input.

Say, if you think the Monster has half as less torque than say the Nikola+, then my argument would be it's more like 1/4 less torque when you actually tap into it correctly (effort/muscle is nowhere in my argument).

 

3 hours ago, Hsiang said:

I still don't understand the intricacies of how torque output from our motor in relates to the watt rating, some say that we can pull more simply by pumping in greater voltage, but I also hear that there are optimal voltage design for each motor and efficiency drop as you pump in more. But I don't think that there are any practical reason why a larger motor can't fit, the 6000 watt motor on the back of a ONYX looks not much larger, if there's an engineering reason I love to hear it.

I suspect the main reason is really Gotway's unwillingness to invest in engineering associated with fitting a larger motor; easier and cheaper to just keep upping the voltage.

You realize Onyx is reporting 6,000 W Max/burst, not Nominal/average right? (see here and here)

Plus, apparently it's rated 6kW, but actually 5,400 W real world Max/burst, which puts it about inline with our 2kW nominal EUC motors statistics; it's all the same parts basically.

Onyx didn't magically double current motor tech.

Plus, again, we are not e-bikes, different paradigm, you can't just paste and apply those numbers verbatim to the EUC case.

[houseofjob]

10 hours ago, mrelwood said:

I can’t really see how any acceleration is different in this regard. You can’t really use muscle to accelerate an EUC, it’s always the wheel reacting to the forward falling motion, which is caused by gravity.

I was referring to the guys who stand-squeeze the wheel body (often using pads), which I am not a proponent for due to the compromise in stability, reactivity from unexpected bumps.

[Ben Kim]

2 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

I was referring to the guys who stand-squeeze the wheel body (often using pads), which I am not a proponent for due to the compromise in stability, reactivity from unexpected bumps.

eww wheel squeezing. The less i touch the wheel the more control i have. I can’t imagine riding any other way 

[Darrell Wesh]

6 hours ago, Hsiang said:

I always wonder if its possible to do a "bobsled start" with a monster, it feels stable enough for you to jump on from a run with some practice.

lol I’m sure this is sarcasm but that would be disastrous... imagine holding the handle and pushing it forward, every stride you take would probably be a struggle to get it going straight while hunched over like that. Even if it’s not flopping left and right like crazy (because the human stride is left and right) then you still have to jump on the thing. Would you let go and try to jump on? Or pull the handle back and step on(that would kill all your momentum you built up)

[Aneta]

4 hours ago, houseofjob said:

You realize Onyx is reporting 6,000 W Max/burst, not Nominal/average right? (see here and here)

Plus, apparently it's rated 6kW, but actually 5,400 W real world Max/burst, which puts it about inline with our 2kW nominal EUC motors statistics; it's all the same parts basically.

Onyx didn't magically double current motor tech.

Plus, again, we are not e-bikes, different paradigm, you can't just paste and apply those numbers verbatim to the EUC case.

Looks like Quanshun QS273 H45 motor:

https://www.qsmotor.com/product/16inch-6000w-scooter-motor/

with 45mm wide magnets. Our segwheels typically have magnets in 15-30mm range (18L is 27mm, 16X is 30mm). The wider the magnets, the more torque, the more power.

These scooter motors are beasts in terms of weight, though - they can easily weigh 20 kilos, just the motor - more than 10 kilos heavier than what we have.

What we have in our segwheels are cheap ubiqutous ebike motors ordered from big manufacturers of these motors. They probably cost well less than $50 on B2B market in China, since they can be bought at retail prices of less than $100.

[Aneta]

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

lol I’m sure this is sarcasm but that would be disastrous... imagine holding the handle and pushing it forward, every stride you take would probably be a struggle to get it going straight while hunched over like that. Even if it’s not flopping left and right like crazy (because the human stride is left and right) then you still have to jump on the thing. Would you let go and try to jump on? Or pull the handle back and step on(that would kill all your momentum you built up)

For the crazy ones: unscrew the controller from the shell and mount it on a pivot with a handle. Voila - a real throttle, with insane accelerations possible even in the seated position, without moving body much.

[houseofjob]

15 minutes ago, Aneta said:

with 45mm wide magnets. Our segwheels typically have magnets in 15-30mm range (18L is 27mm, 16X is 30mm). The wider the magnets, the more torque, the more power.

These scooter motors are beasts in terms of weight, though - they can easily weigh 20 kilos, just the motor - more than 10 kilos heavier than what we have.

What we have in our segwheels are cheap ubiqutous ebike motors ordered from big manufacturers of these motors. They probably cost well less than $50 on B2B market in China, since they can be bought at retail prices of less than $100.

Interesting.

Is there any production non-motorcycle PEV using such motors? (and if so, please list)

I'm not sure you can lump all EUC manufacturers under the same boat, as Gotway performance-wise is clearly a notch above the rest (whatever that means), as evidenced by the increased motor magnet width to 35mm in their 14" MCM5, per ecodrift's teardown report:

 

11 minutes ago, Aneta said:

For the crazy ones: unscrew the controller from the shell and mount it on a pivot with a handle. Voila - a real throttle, with insane accelerations possible even in the seated position, without moving body much.

Video plz 

Edited December 5, 2019 by houseofjob