tessa25 Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 2 hours ago, General Principle said: What gloves are you flexmeter folks rocking? Fownes leather driving gloves here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 1 hour ago, chrisjunlee said: If that’s he root of out disagreement, then there’s not much we can constructively discuss. Kinematic is kinematics. The laws of physics don’t change. The irony being you’re wearing motorcycle jackets, knee guards, etc, yet insist that EUCS accidents are some magic unicorn requiring stronger gear 🦄. I’m advocating for proper protection. Full gauntlet gloves are a step above “wrist guards”. I don’t get stuck in the naming and marketing. “Wrist guards with flexometer D30!” just raises my eyebrow. And to be clear, I do see some value in these janky “wrist guards” : 80% in palm abrasion sliders, 20% in wrist impact reduction. I wear them for casual riding. If I’m planning on test crashing at high speed - full gauntlet gloves, no question. == Edit == For those actually looking for better gear, consider this is what motorcyclists deal with: Unlike a EUC where you literally fall from standing height, in a motorcycle high side crash, you get abruptly slingshotted up in the air, and you commonly land on an outstretched arm, aka your wrist taking the impact. As you can see, the crash forces and angles are a next level superset than whatever we encounter on an EUC. Wrists are important for a motorcycle racer - millions of dollars in prize money is at stake in their ability to fine tune control throttle, brake, etc, all through their hands. What do they use for protection? Full gauntlet gloves. (aka, full coverage gloves that reinforce the wrist). Don't you dare dismiss them if you haven't even tried them on. It truly is next level protection, and you'll see why 'wrist guards' are a child's marketing ploy at best. I don't know why people like @Unventor believe EUC's are sooo special, that motorcycle gloves just can't protect us. Is it possible that wrist guards offer better protection at the speeds we fall (low relative to motorcycle speeds)? Honest question. I look at the gloves you are wearing and I see zero slider functionality and zero wrist protection. Zero. They look fantastic for protecting against road rash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 55 minutes ago, chrisjunlee said: I don't know why people like @Unventor believe EUC's are sooo special, that motorcycle gloves just can't protect us. When you have had you first unexpected faceplant, come again and test your belief... I have had 2 hard accidents that could have ended so very different. I learned from the first and even in that I were "fully geared" compared by most people. Had I not upgraded I couldn't have come out so "easy" as I did. The picture in my profile is mostly another upgrade to make it easier and ensure I gear up as much and frequent as possible. The reason why EUC is special is a wheel cutout will most likely send you forward into the ground than make you slide along it. Since grand doesn't give, it is similar to hit a wall. It is due to balancing on ONE wheel, not anything like bicycle or moped or motorcycle. I have very little respect for what should happen in theory... It is what happens in real situations that you feel smacking the ground. I can tell you straight off I don't use fingers in falling. You use palms or fist to hopefully tomble or at least cushion or direct an impact. A finger snap glove or no glove. Like I started off, your theory, would not have help any bit in both my 2 crashes. Superhero and skills will only help so far when a situation hits the fan. Take a look and take you sunglass off and start read about how people expireanced the accident or incident they post here. There are enough of them for you to learn something rather than fitting the world to your theory because it suits you. Yep much easier not to wear gear, cheeper too, it probably also cramp your style to wear gear. Might messy your hair up. But that is life our in the real world. I didn't post my personal xray here for fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Is it possible that wrist guards offer better protection at the speeds we fall (low relative to motorcycle speeds)? Honest question. I look at the gloves you are wearing and I see zero slider functionality and zero wrist protection. Zero. They look fantastic for protecting against road rash. IMHO, wrist guards are adequate for low speeds. So is taping a hockey puck to your palm. Gauntlet gloves have a wrap around your wrist. While it’s easy to move a couple degrees up or down, it’s a reinforced stop beyond that. I would recommend you try on a pair to get the feeling of it. The leather is the slider, and is quite durable - I would say 3x more durable than the plastic sliders, which is why they make the plastic so thick. Tradeoff is dexterity and bulk: I find I have better dexterity and less functional bulk with a quality pair of motorcycle gloves. But worst guards are much easier to put on (a proper fitting pair of gloves should take a while to put on with zero slack). I personally like my gloves to fit very snugly, with zero slack, so I can stretch them out over weeks. I do find the knuckle portion of motorcycle gloves to be over built for our EUC speeds of under 30mph. They would be very useful once we start hitting 50+mph and we start rolling and violently limb slapping the pavement as we roll. Edited August 31, 2019 by chrisjunlee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 10 minutes ago, Unventor said: The reason why EUC is special is a wheel cutout will most likely send you forward into the ground than make you slide along it. Since grand doesn't give, it is similar to hit a wall. It is due to balancing on ONE wheel, not anything like bicycle or moped or motorcycle. That’s a subset of motorcycle crashes my friend In a high side crash, you’re bucked in an arc forward. I suppose there’s enough time to twist to your side or back, but end result you’re sliding forward. I’ve wiped out on a onewheel XR, and it felt the same, just a less forceful (but sooner) side impact, and sliding 5 ft, instead of sliding 50 ft then going into a death roll for 100 more feet in my motorcycle crash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 32 minutes ago, chrisjunlee said: I’ve wiped out on a onewheel XR, and it felt the same, just a less forceful (but sooner) side impact, and sliding 5 ft, instead of sliding 50 ft then going into a death roll for 100 more feet in my motorcycle crash. Still do hard crash on an EUC.... And see where your superhero skills bring you. As I recall one wheels are ridden in a sideway posture... And you are saying that you saved yourself from major injuries in your mc crash by gauntlets? Last post I do... On this matter. My Flexmeter guards have help me and I am sure if it should come to it, they will assist me fine next time too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Unventor said: And you are saying that you saved yourself from major injuries in your mc crash by gauntlets? Yes, I walked out of my worst crash with just a minor sprained ankle (vs having my entire foot cleaved off). Try on a pair of a good full gauntlet gloves, it's hard to explain, but you'll see they provide a good amount of wrist reinforcement. In addition, their finger protection is superb. The only downside would be the bulky knuckle protection - I don't think they're too useful for EUC speeds. Maybe wrist splints are necessary, but I haven't felt the need for them with a full gauntlet glove. 8 minutes ago, Unventor said: see where your superhero skills bring you. Edited August 31, 2019 by chrisjunlee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Ignore works wonders... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Unventor said: Ignore works wonders... Willful ignorance 😆 Edited August 31, 2019 by chrisjunlee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 2 hours ago, chrisjunlee said: IMHO, wrist guards are adequate for low speeds. So is taping a hockey puck to your palm. Gauntlet gloves have a wrap around your wrist. While it’s easy to move a couple degrees up or down, it’s a reinforced stop beyond that. I would recommend you try on a pair to get the feeling of it. The leather is the slider, and is quite durable - I would say 3x more durable than the plastic sliders, which is why they make the plastic so thick. Tradeoff is dexterity and bulk: I find I have better dexterity and less functional bulk with a quality pair of motorcycle gloves. But worst guards are much easier to put on (a proper fitting pair of gloves should take a while to put on with zero slack). I personally like my gloves to fit very snugly, with zero slack, so I can stretch them out over weeks. I do find the knuckle portion of motorcycle gloves to be over built for our EUC speeds of under 30mph. They would be very useful once we start hitting 50+mph and we start rolling and violently limb slapping the pavement as we roll. I'm wondering if leather slides great at 40-mph but not so great at 15-mph. And all survival stories (yours, mine, etc) are anecdotal. Luck plays a big part. I appreciate your commentary. For now I'm sticking with my low-speed gear. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Wesh Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Marty Backe said: Is it possible that wrist guards offer better protection at the speeds we fall (low relative to motorcycle speeds)? Honest question. I look at the gloves you are wearing and I see zero slider functionality and zero wrist protection. Zero. They look fantastic for protecting against road rash. This is the answer. @chrisjunlee Leather is not just going to magically allow you to slide along the ground. It’s nowhere near as good at sliding over surfaces as the plastic pucks on a wrist guard. You need some serious speed to start sliding in leather(or ridiculously smooth surfaces like you see on race tracks). Try falling at 20mph and seeing if you slide in your leather gloves on asphalt that resembles a kitchen grater. Won’t happen. This is why many many EUC riders wear plastic plated hard cap gear; they allow you to slide at the relatively low speeds we fall from, even on rough surfaces. This is why Knox has created their patented Scaphoid protection system and incorporated the hard plastic “sliders” in their motorcycle gloves(the Knox orsa gloves I always advocate). If leather slid so well why would Knox create such a system? It’s not hard to get the best of both worlds. Wrist guard “pucks” as the sliders and the full leather construction/coverage of motorcycle gloves. https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/knox-orsa-leather-mk2-gloves?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxbThlPWt5AIVjYrICh2MjQTdEAUYASABEgLGV_D_BwE Forgot to mention impact protection of which wrist guards are far superior then motorcycle gloves for low speeds. Edited August 31, 2019 by Darrell Wesh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 9 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said: This is the answer. @chrisjunlee Leather is not just going to magically allow you to slide along the ground. It’s nowhere near as good at sliding over surfaces as the plastic pucks on a wrist guard. You need some serious speed to start sliding in leather(or ridiculously smooth surfaces like you see on race tracks). Try falling at 20mph and seeing if you slide in your leather gloves on asphalt that resembles a kitchen grater. Won’t happen. This is why many many EUC riders wear plastic plated hard cap gear; they allow you to slide at the relatively low speeds we fall from, even on rough surfaces. This is why Knox has created their patented Scaphoid protection system and incorporated the hard plastic “sliders” in their motorcycle gloves(the Knox orsa gloves I always advocate). If leather slid so well why would Knox create such a system? It’s not hard to get the best of both worlds. Wrist guard “pucks” as the sliders and the full leather construction/coverage of motorcycle gloves. https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/knox-orsa-leather-mk2-gloves?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxbThlPWt5AIVjYrICh2MjQTdEAUYASABEgLGV_D_BwE And you are wearing those gloves? Do you feel that they offer adequate wrist protection too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Wesh Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Just now, Marty Backe said: And you are wearing those gloves? Do you feel that they offer adequate wrist protection too? The sliders are patented to do/will do their job. I don’t like the bracing of the wrist from “proper” long wrist guards. I definitely feel much safer in them then in my full gauntlet KLIM adventure gloves I have for winter. The Klim’s have a palm slider and an ulna slider but don’t slide anywhere near as well as the Knox’s little slider pucks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 6 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said: The sliders are patented to do/will do their job. I don’t like the bracing of the wrist from “proper” long wrist guards. I definitely feel much safer in them then in my full gauntlet KLIM adventure gloves I have for winter. The Klim’s have a palm slider and an ulna slider but don’t slide anywhere near as well as the Knox’s little slider pucks. Added them to my Rev Wishlist. Still debating gloves but I'm thinking I'll get a nice pair for the upcoming cool season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Well @Darrell Wesh should you ever get into an incident it would be nice to hear what happened and if you are injured, to what degree. I have yet to hear any with Flexmeter reporting major injuries in arrears that they are designed to protect. Yes I got a bit of skin torn on a finger. But I had no pain in my palms, wrists or finger joints. That goes for both my almost flat landing on my back/buttom. And for the forward tumble hitting my shoulder first on this curb then rolling./tumbling, 2nd contact was elbow and 3rd contact point was my outside wrist tuggen under my belly. This was the curb I cliped and landed more or less upside down outside shoulder first on the edge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 27 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said: @chrisjunlee Leather is not just going to magically allow you to slide along the ground. It’s nowhere near as good at sliding over surfaces as the plastic pucks on a wrist guard. You need some serious speed to start sliding in leather(or ridiculously smooth surfaces like you see on race tracks). Try falling at 20mph and seeing if you slide in your leather gloves on asphalt that resembles a kitchen grater. Won’t happen. Now that is a very good point. I didn't factor in the lower coefficient of friction of plastic. FWIW, I've taken spills at 20mph, and leather did a fine job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggie510 Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 I've been using these Dakine Wrist Guard gloves. Perhaps not your ideal glove for very hot summer days, but I live in the Bay Area where it rarely gets terribly hot and it can get quite cool in the evenings during the summer. There is reinforcement both for the back of the wrist/hand as well as for the front of the wrist/hand. I just had a crash at 25 mph onto asphalt, and my wrists came out just fine. The gloves themselves look great -- wouldn't be able to tell they were involved in a crash at all. My Fitbit Versa, which was on my wrist at the time, unfortunately did not make it -- the face was completely shattered. These gloves don't offer a lot of wrist mobility, but I have found very little need for that as an EUC rider. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavabo Posted September 3, 2019 Share Posted September 3, 2019 (edited) On 8/30/2019 at 1:06 PM, Marty Backe said: Is there really any device that can protect the fingers? The wrist guards are designed to protect the wrist and by extension, some of the palm. But fingers are always at risk. yes there is one for the thumb, i wonder if it can fit with the wrist guard: LEVEL Ski Thumb Protectorhttps://www.sicurogear.com/products/level-ski-thumb-protector Also about those wrist guard, i was not convince with fancy brand name like 3DO, but mostly because a traumatology doctor engineered them for ski accidents in the French alps. (he also engineered Spinemeter, Helmeter- Salomon bought the patent). The difference here is the abrasion that you dont have in ski (But Demon enhanced the product with slider pucks). Also about the engineering - i guess the speed of the ski ride was studied - it can go faster than EUC You can read his story here (in French):http://www.mecatronique.fr/skimeter-equipe-le-skieur-pour-un-ski-securite-mecatronique Edited September 3, 2019 by Lavabo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fat Unicyclist Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 17 hours ago, Lavabo said: yes there is one for the thumb, i wonder if it can fit with the wrist guard: LEVEL Ski Thumb Protectorhttps://www.sicurogear.com/products/level-ski-thumb-protector Ohhh... Is that a THUMB protector??? There is also this option that has been mentioned on other threads - Made by an EUC rider, for EUC riders... https://www.gyroriderz.com/products/gants-gyroriderz-avec-protege-poignets-integree @chrisjunlee - Does that meet your criteria to be a full gauntlet glove? I have some on the way to me to try out and I will review them once received... I will also be bringing them along to the LA EUC Games, if anyone else attending wants to check them out in person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, The Fat Unicyclist said: Ohhh... Is that a THUMB protector??? There is also this option that has been mentioned on other threads - Made by an EUC rider, for EUC riders... https://www.gyroriderz.com/products/gants-gyroriderz-avec-protege-poignets-integree @chrisjunlee - Does that meet your criteria to be a full gauntlet glove? I have some on the way to me to try out and I will review them once received... I will also be bringing them along to the LA EUC Games, if anyone else attending wants to check them out in person. 50% of my need is perfect fit. I will literally go through and try on dozens of pairs before I find one with perfit fit. Currently that’s Alpinestars Women’s XS - that’s basically Men’s XXS. It fits like a glove with absolutely no slack anywhere, not even a couple mm excess on the fingertips. Benefit of that? Dexterity and zero bulk when using phone. I’m also an XS for medical gloves FWIW. Edited September 4, 2019 by chrisjunlee 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 On 11/2/2018 at 12:52 PM, meepmeepmayer said: (think snowboard) and hit the ground BTW... snowboarders beyond the learning/novice stage take some popular risks that make wrist injuries or flexmeter protection seem trivial... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 @meepmeepmayerI hope you enjoy the TGR (Teton Gravity Research) film on snowboarding the remote mountains of Montana as much as I did. TGR films are about as wild as it gets (to watch) in skiing and snowboarding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 "Teton Gravity Research" I guess they fall a lot. I'll have a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 1 minute ago, meepmeepmayer said: I'll have a look. The art of the split board.😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 (edited) 37 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: they fall Actually they don't (usually)...they use helicopters, PA systems, high tech digital recording, avalanche protection(?)...but they do have a 'crash reel' film with all the tumbles. https://www.tetongravity.com/snowboard 'Jeremy Jones' , in the Montana film is one of the best snowboarders. Quite a few years ago they (TGR) did a film with a new all digital video camera from https://www.red.com/ At the time...very state of the art. And @meepmeepmayer More recently (2016) a $700,000 camera rig https://www.tetongravity.com/tgrstudios/the-700000-camera-rig-thats-changed-how-we-shoot-action-sports/ Edited October 4, 2020 by Bob Eisenman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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