Popular Post litewave Posted February 20, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted February 20, 2023 7 hours ago, winterwheel said: ... That's why I ride without gear, it makes me super paranoid about coming off the wheel and I dial things back to a safe level. Yep, I can see that. Sorry, just having a little fun. Actually, your argument is the same as the fallacy that was used in the late 60's to oppose mandatory seatbelts: that setbelts gave drivers a false sense of security and that they would just drive faster and there would (supposedly) be more fatal accidents. That was debunked, too, of course. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 43 minutes ago, winterwheel said: Most of your comments are just trolling details which we could go back an forth on forever. Let me sum up where I'm at. 1) People wear gear so they can ride more dangerously. 2) Whenever they crash they claim this as justification for expensive gear 3) People who don't subscribe to this model of EUC riding are berated and belittled. 4) People who want to ride safely without gear are strongly discouraged from doing so. I think this model sucks. My primary disagreement with your summary is point 1. I can't say that doesn't happen but I also can't say that's the primary motivation. It isn't for me - I know, a single data point. Personally I don't bother commenting on peoples choices of gear anymore. In the early days you could say that there was a lot of ignorance on the subject. But today, with the number of EUC related videos and pictures it's hard to conceive of a person not being aware of safety gear. So if they choose not to wear gear than I assume it's an educated choice and then it's a don't care by me. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 Beginners and learners wearing gear.....might not want to ride more dangerously though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Cerbera Posted February 20, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) Back when I was very new at this, I failed to wear my wristguards down in Dover docks on the way to play a gig in France on a 14 inch Airwheel that could go 11 kph tops. I failed to spot a pothole in time, came down hard, scorpioned over my hands, hyperextended both wrists, fucked up the gig for everyone ( I had to limp through it one-handed with a cast in the end) and couldn't play piano for a living for the following 3 months. 6 months later I could play again, but my wrists still hurt to do so. I lived on the charity of my band-mates that entire time, who kindly gave me a 20% cut of all the gigs I couldn't play and took a pay cut themselves to pay for my replacement ! But the point is, my own negligence for just 5 seconds on that one day caused me and my band months and months worth of hassle that could have been so easily avoided. I learned a valuable lesson that day, and have never not worn my armour since, and, surprise surprise, have not damaged my wrists at all in any fall I have had subsequently, despite landing on them most times I have fallen ! Conversely, in one of those falls, many years later, I got de-platformed by some unexpectedly stony / lumpy terrain, and landed full force on my right hand. I could still play the gig I had booked that same night !! If that doesn't illustrate the value of gear I don't know what does... and while we're here, how much are wrist guards ?! Well the ones that have been saving me for 8 years cost 10 pounds. 10 pounds worth of gear that I actually had with me, but didn't think I needed to wear for a micro-ride ended up costing me and the poor buggers around me about 6000 pounds, and I live in a country where there WAS free healthcare !! Just another data point - I note I have not yet fallen off my Master in a serious way, nearly 1000 miles in, OR explored its full power and capabilities despite feeling very confident that I am tanked up in enough armour (helmet excepted, see my previous comment). The increased confidence it has given me has not, in itself, caused me to be more reckless, but it has made me fear falling (slightly) less, and the less worry there is on rides, the more enjoyable they invariably are... Edited February 20, 2023 by Cerbera 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 Motorcyclist saved by helmet after almost getting his head crushed Daily Mail 2.22M subscribers Sep 17, 2018 The rider lost control of his vehicle and toppled over to his right, just feet in front of the black SUV which could not brake in time, in footage captured in Manila, Philippines, earlier this year. The front left wheel went straight over the back of the man's head, sending him skidding along the ground, but he escaped alive because of his helmet. Another road user who captured the incident said the injured rider eventually climbed to his feet and walked to the side of the road to wait for an ambulance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 Woman Crushed by a Truck | helmet save life Top best 42 subscribers Jan 11, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mrelwood Posted February 20, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted February 20, 2023 6 hours ago, winterwheel said: Most of your comments are just trolling details which we could go back an forth on forever. Let me sum up where I'm at. 1) People wear gear so they can ride more dangerously. 2) Whenever they crash they claim this as justification for expensive gear 3) People who don't subscribe to this model of EUC riding are berated and belittled. 4) People who want to ride safely without gear are strongly discouraged from doing so. I think this model sucks. 1) I'm sure some do, but they don't have to. The seat belt comparison was aptly put. One could say that I also ride more dangerously with gear, since I don't leave our yard without it. 2) My gear has always been cheap or DIY. 3) & 4) I think the general attitude is much better this way, so that people who have not stopped to think about the matter at least get a push to do so. I have no issue with you riding without gear. That's your choice, and I won't waste my time trying to change your habits. What I have an issue with is you trying to do the opposite to others. You have replied numerous times on several threads with comments trying to prove that safety gear wouldn't bring any safety, which is irresponsible on a forum like this that is read by an increasing amount of beginners who are not aware of the risks of this hobby. You can prove stuff to yourself as distorted as you wish, just don't try to push your views to others. If you expect for others to let you ride without shaming your gearless approach, you best do the same for them. 2 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robse Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Paul A said: What in heaven's name is this? What has it been necessary to search for to end up on this y channel? The internet is full of the strangest things - this is one of them, a Greek warrior woman - her room looks like a dump, her thighs look like.... I won't write that here, let me get away in a hurry.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 9 minutes ago, Robse said: What has it been necessary to search for to end up on this y channel? Sorry. Marty had posted a video on another thread: 'TSG helmet advisory' In which Dawn attempted to crush a donated TSG helmet between her thighs, but was not able to. Might have been attempting to illustrate that some helmets may not be of adequate quality to provide protection. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) 7 hours ago, Paul A said: Beginners and learners wearing gear.....might not want to ride more dangerously though. I personally had zero gear while learning.. Only time i got myself a helmet, wrist/knee guards - was when i started to go "faster". Edited February 20, 2023 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, Cerbera said: Back when I was very new at this, I failed to wear my wristguards down in Dover docks on the way to play a gig in France on a 14 inch Airwheel that could go 11 kph tops. I failed to spot a pothole in time, came down hard, scorpioned over my hands, hyperextended both wrists, fucked up the gig for everyone ( I had to limp through it one-handed with a cast in the end) and couldn't play piano for a living for the following 3 months. 6 months later I could play again, but my wrists still hurt to do so. I lived on the charity of my band-mates that entire time, who kindly gave me a 20% cut of all the gigs I couldn't play and took a pay cut themselves to pay for my replacement ! But the point is, my own negligence for just 5 seconds on that one day caused me and my band months and months worth of hassle that could have been so easily avoided. I learned a valuable lesson that day, and have never not worn my armour since, and, surprise surprise, have not damaged my wrists at all in any fall I have had subsequently, despite landing on them most times I have fallen ! Conversely, in one of those falls, many years later, I got de-platformed by some unexpectedly stony / lumpy terrain, and landed full force on my right hand. I could still play the gig I had booked that same night !! If that doesn't illustrate the value of gear I don't know what does... and while we're here, how much are wrist guards ?! Well the ones that have been saving me for 8 years cost 10 pounds. 10 pounds worth of gear that I actually had with me, but didn't think I needed to wear for a micro-ride ended up costing me and the poor buggers around me about 6000 pounds, and I live in a country where there WAS free healthcare !! Just another data point - I note I have not yet fallen off my Master in a serious way, nearly 1000 miles in, OR explored its full power and capabilities despite feeling very confident that I am tanked up in enough armour (helmet excepted, see my previous comment). The increased confidence it has given me has not, in itself, caused me to be more reckless. About wristguards i can agree. - It's the only gear i never leave my house without. Why? Because when you fall, "most" times you fall on your hands. Edited February 20, 2023 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Paul A said: Dam she got them legs for days. Edited February 20, 2023 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbera Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Funky said: Dam she got them legs for days. Whose legs do you mean ? I mean, not to quibble (or objectify the girls) but Dawn's look like they could be the basis for sculpture, and Zenias looks like they could direct tank battles ! One of those has legs for days. The other has legs for siege warfare ! Edited February 20, 2023 by Cerbera Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) Not wearing gear, discourages risky behaviour........ Edited February 20, 2023 by Paul A 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Paul A said: Not wearing gear, discourages risky behaviour........ Ridder ErroR!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robse Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 22 minutes ago, Funky said: Ridder ErroR!!! no, dumb bike ! 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradox Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 25 minutes ago, Funky said: Ridder ErroR!!! Clearly the GodMod (brain) was not installed properly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Paradox said: Clearly the GodMod (brain) was not installed properly. The problem - it wasn't installed on the Bike. It doesn't matter, if that bike isn't electric. Most important part is to have it installed. Edited February 20, 2023 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterwheel Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 18 hours ago, mrelwood said: You have replied numerous times on several threads with comments trying to prove that safety gear wouldn't bring any safety, which is irresponsible on a forum like this that is read by an increasing amount of beginners who are not aware of the risks of this hobby. We are diametrically opposed on this. I think it is irresponsible to push gear on newbies, giving them the idea that this will keep them safe. It also damages the community as a whole, as it the general public is not interested in taking up an activity whose proponents spend much of their time touting how dangerous it is, when this is absolutely not the case for casual riders on small wheels who ride with reasonable care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_bike_kite Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 In most of the motorcycle forums they simply have rules to not have discussions about ATGATT and also between open faced helmets and closed face helmets. Those folk that ride sensibly tend to look at body armour etc as silly, those that come off at 30mph in full gear tend to assume it saved their life and want to preach it to the world. It never changes anyone's mind and just generates a lot of heated discussion - which is why these topics usually get banned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbera Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 (edited) 42 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said: Those folk that ride sensibly tend to look at body armour etc as silly As well they might, on their inherently stable 2 wheeled motorbikes ! But if there is just one wheel holding me up, and I am somewhat at the mercy of Chinese engineering and QC so I'll take all the help I can get, and if people think me vaguely ridiculous, well, I can live with that... I would also add that not everyone does think it's ridiculous ! I get an average of 2 people a ride that tell me how cool they think my armour set is ! Edited February 21, 2023 by Cerbera 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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