Mten4 announced!

[CrabChampion]

37 minutes ago, misterdalto said:

so with my own personal mTen4 750wh 50E, i was curious to get the pack out to see about swapping in some high discharge 42v packs in series, that i have.

Turns out, begode is continuing their pursuit of ever cheaper parts by not even having a true 20S pack in the mTen4.

The mTen4 84V 20S2P is ACTUALLY comprised of

• 2 x 10S2P packs wired in series, then wrapped together as a single pack, rating it for 84v, but noting via labeling that this is 42V packs, in format of A/B to indicate they are series, not the same (parallel). See link to google photos album

https://photos.app.goo.gl/EVQqUAeeMXS7UuD76

so, when the 40T high discharge packs were designed, it is likely they are using 20S1P packs outright, going for a easier modular approach to battery sizing options with 300wh, 600wh variants. To be more specific on my speculation, it is even more likely the 20S1P 40T packs are also a 42V-A/B but comprised of 2 x 10S1P per 20S1P 300wh module.

begodes logic(assumed) is simple, be it flawed -

• 10S BMS will ALWAYS be cheaper than a 20S BMS.
• for their newest 100v, T4 as example - a 12S is cheaper than 24S BMS. each one of the four T4 packs hold 24 cells, so there is no reason to not use a 24S BMS other than cost/availability of parts. 
• for the OG 134v: 8S is cheaper than 16S, 32S. 8S under performed, they spent what they had to to satisfy demand and bumped to 16S BMS architecture
• for the current 134v lineup just as 16S is cheaper than 32S BMS.

32S BMS exist, they are just extremely uncommon and therefore higher cost for higher current components. lower series BMS will always be cheaper d/t application across entire PEV sector and beyond, making product available, competitive, cheaper. 

Begode wants off the shelf parts/components for rapid prototyping aka small batch production for consumers.

King Song & Inmotion use BMS that are configured rated as the full series/output rating. They achieve this by designing their BMS in house. This bypasses the issues with lack in availability of off the shelf BMS/components that can handle 30S, 32S. they exist, just are not common. designing things like this inhouse requires commitment to product cycle life, which is not currently reflected in the products continuously being; discontinued, introduced, abandoned 

i do love my begode wheels, but its that i love what i have made them to be, i did not love what I was sold, as much.

eucfluid here hehe 

Great analysis here. Makes sense that the bms that begode uses are off the shelf units, but it never really crossed my mind that the bms are split into their respective series count per set of batteries. That being said, the mten4 being split into 2 bms to be kinda dumb. Would love to see what begode does next as far as their "smart bms" that they are working on. I dont know of any bms that has cell count capability and able to transmit that information to the controller without additional firmware needed to be loaded up. Begode firmware isnt their strongsuit I would say.

[joeboots]

Reminder to every mten4 owner to CHECK YOUR BATTERY CONNECTOR. I'm still waiting for a replacement battery for my Mten4, which has never had the short connector cutout issue. However, my brother, who's visiting next week, shipped me his in advance of his visit. Must be something about being shipped that causes these to wiggle loose, because my brother never had any issues in many many miles of riding. I put 100 yards on it and face planted into the sidewalk, with a busted lip and swollen right knee to show for it. One second I was riding along at 3 or 4 miles an hour, the next thing I knew I had the wind knocked out of me and tasted blood. It happened that fast. This is what it looked like under the hood. No bueno!

 

[CrabChampion]

8 hours ago, joeboots said:

Reminder to every mten4 owner to CHECK YOUR BATTERY CONNECTOR. I'm still waiting for a replacement battery for my Mten4, which has never had the short connector cutout issue. However, my brother, who's visiting next week, shipped me his in advance of his visit. Must be something about being shipped that causes these to wiggle loose, because my brother never had any issues in many many miles of riding. I put 100 yards on it and face planted into the sidewalk, with a busted lip and swollen right knee to show for it. One second I was riding along at 3 or 4 miles an hour, the next thing I knew I had the wind knocked out of me and tasted blood. It happened that fast. This is what it looked like under the hood. No bueno!

 

The new batch mtens have this connector glued down. Is this a batch 1 mten4? Mine never had this issue, but my friend's connector kept coming slightly loose (not enough to lose power). I think some batteries the cable is just too short and constantly under tension. The vibrations from riding (especially with that knobby tire) shake it loose. Another local rider, his pedal grub screws kept vibrating loose

[joeboots]

I think my brother's is a 1st batch. Mine definitely was. You're exactly right - the cable is too short, and it vibrates loose. There's a 3d printed clip design floating around to hold it in place. My brother's printing two of them for us. My pedal screws also vibrated loose fairly early on.

[joeboots]

@BKWI just got my new battery installed and rode 20 slow miles before hitting low battery

[BKW]

1 hour ago, joeboots said:

@BKWI just got my new battery installed and rode 20 slow miles before hitting low battery

What app were you using to track your distance in miles? I am getting different ranges with EUC World and Google gps

[joeboots]

Well fuck! Less than 30 miles on this (might as well be) new mten4 (everything's new except the wheel, tire, frame and lights lol) and it's crapped out on me again. Turns on, connects to EUC world, but won't balance. Like it's in tilt mode. 6 beeps (1 short 5 long). Fuuuuuck!

[joeboots]

Lol oops! It was just in transport mode

[BKW]

Just a little update since I made a big hoopla about my range with my mten4 600Wh 40T...

I'm convinced now that the reason my range was not very good (~1 mile per 10% battery) was because the EUC World app was reading the distance wrong.

Evidence:

1. I opened up the EUC and checked that I indeed had two 300Wh batteries (I did)
2. I gauged the battery from ~1% battery life to full with a plug power meter. It literally read it charged up to 0.601Kwh... literally right on the money to where it should have been at 600Wh. This convinced me nothing was wrong with the battery.
3. Next test I rode the battery down again and noticed with EUC World and Google maps GPS had ranges that were different from each other. The EUC World was vastly lower. This led me to believe EUC World was reading wrong.
4. Last test: I downloaded new GPS apps on my phone, did another range test and found the new GPS apps matched closely to the Google Maps GPS, and the app that was off from all the other distances was EUC World

With all this said, I am very happy that nothing is wrong with my battery. Ewheels is a stellar company in my opinion. They emailed me through the entire process and when I opened up the wheel everything was siliconed and you can tell it was QC'd well.

Today I did another range test with the accurate gps apps, and I ended with 26% left after ~14.50 miles. I did go up a couple hills at Central Park, etc. The PSI was 28psi for most the trip, my weight is roughly 178lbs, avg riding speed 11.1mph, temperature outside ~62F. All of this tells me I am getting advertised range and I can stop complaining now lol

Edited April 5, 2023 by BKW

[DjPanJan]

Hello i not fully underestand exist something like BATCH for Mten4? 

If yes how to recognise batches?

I talk about clasic 750Wh samsung variant not any special Mten4.

Second question what street tire is most easy to ride for kids becasue here i see experinced riders have trouble stay on mten4 with some scooter street tire timestamped video.

Not my video is from eucsale demo days in Prague Czech republic. (this experinced rider have problems just start riding mten4 he say i have 0 problems ride mten3)

 

[BKW]

7 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

Hello i not fully underestand exist something like BATCH for Mten4? 

If yes how to recognise batches?

I talk about clasic 750Wh samsung variant not any special Mten4.

Second question what street tire is most easy to ride for kids becasue here i see experinced riders have trouble stay on mten4 with some scooter street tire timestamped video.

Not my video is from eucsale demo days in Prague Czech republic. (this experinced rider have problems just start riding mten4 he say i have 0 problems ride mten3)

 

Have you ever rode a mten4? It's not as stable as bigger wheels, and it looks like this rider in the video came from a Sherman-S / EX30 to a mten4 that he never rode before. Of course it's going to be strange at first for him given these circumstances.

As far as the batches go, I don't know enough about them with the mten4. The only thing I heard that may be different is they made the body stronger than before, but I have got a newer mten4 and the body is still very weak. It is easily bendable from left to right. The other thing is that on the earlier batches I guess Begode did not have the motor cable (?) siliconed when plugged into the motherboard, and so this cable was coming loose and cutting out the wheel. Apparently, they have addressed this, but I cannot confirm if they have or have not. Ewheels, the company I got my mten4 from, supposedly did a quality control on my mten4 and when I opened it up I saw all the cable attachments were siliconed and connected well, so no loose cable wire attachments, etc.

As far as tires go for kids, I think the knobby will be more turbulent due to the knobs on it -- apparently the feeling is very noticable when riding the mten4 with kobby tire (vibrations). However, the knobby might be more stable and less tipsy side-to-side due to the flattened nature of the knobby tire. With a street tire you will have a much smoother ride, but it may be SLIGHTLY less stable side-to-side due to its more rounded profile. However, the tires for the mten4 are 3 inch I think, which in general are fairly stable in of itself for an EUC. The stability of the mten4 doesn't necessary come from the tires as much as it does from the WOBBLES of the small EUC. It's the wobbles that occur from the skill level of the rider that may be of more concern than the tire in my opinion.

The mten4 overall is not very stable due to its size. A more stable option would be a 16 inch wheel. However, I think the mten4 is still an option for beginners and kids due to its size and overall power.

Edited April 6, 2023 by BKW

[mrelwood]

On 4/6/2023 at 6:44 PM, BKW said:

on the earlier batches I guess Begode did not have the motor cable (?) siliconed when plugged into the motherboard, and so this cable was coming loose and cutting out the wheel.

I think it was the battery cable. It was so short that it had to be installed under tension, which would eventually yank the connector out. I’ve read that the cable is now longer which does fix the issue.

[joeboots]

On 4/8/2023 at 2:19 AM, mrelwood said:

I think it was the battery cable. It was so short that it had to be installed under tension, which would eventually yank the connector out. I’ve read that the cable is now longer which does fix the issue.

Yes - see my post further up on this page

[joeboots]

[joeboots]

@BKWwas that you I ran into on the corner of 12th and 4th on Friday?

[BKW]

13 hours ago, joeboots said:

@BKWwas that you I ran into on the corner of 12th and 4th on Friday?

haha yup. i remember you. good to meet you!

[DjPanJan]

I want ask what FW use for mten 4.

Original if yes witch one and have original FW PWM alarm?

Freestyler is not awaiable how i understand actualy.

I plan use Eucworld for update.

Mten4 is planed for my kid 6y what pedal mode you recommend i cant ride mten4 im over max weight limit this is why i ask.

Is posible make tiltback pedal on mten4 example 5Mph /9kmh?  

what PSI is optimal? Delivered with 20 Psi

How big backpack is need for mten 4 math say is 31L 

I Purchased 36L snowboard Nitro Hero if be ok i confirm later in thread. 

 

 

Edited April 17, 2023 by DjPanJan

[mrelwood]

12 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

Mten4 is planed for my kid 6y what pedal mode you recommend

Everybody is probably going to recommend hard mode since that’s what the racers tend to use. But a 6 year old might be able to brake more efficiently with the medium mode.

12 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

Is posible make tiltback pedal on mten4 example 5Mph /9kmh?

Yes, just set the top speed to 9kmh.

12 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

what PSI is optimal? Delivered with 20 Psi

A 6 year old might get away with 20 psi since they’ll probably ride “calmly”, but I’d go for at least something like 25 since it wouldn’t be as dangerous if you forget to check the pressure for a while. And I don’t see any downsides for it.

[CrabChampion]

1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

Everybody is probably going to recommend hard mode since that’s what the racers tend to use. But a 6 year old might be able to brake more efficiently with the medium mode.

In a smooth track situation, I would recommend hard mode. I raced using hard mode at my local mten race. If you're riding around outside and going over bumps and stuff I much prefer medium mode. Goes over the bumps much smoother without it feeling like you're getting bucked off such a small tire

[CrabChampion]

Ive seen this mod a couple times now, but it seems the mten4 controller is perfectly capable of handling 100v. Just needs a firmware update for the 100v battery. Man, now i really want a 100v mten4

[BKW]

43 minutes ago, Cobaltsaber said:

Ive seen this mod a couple times now, but it seems the mten4 controller is perfectly capable of handling 100v. Just needs a firmware update for the 100v battery. Man, now i really want a 100v mten4

I think the range on the mten4 is in a good spot now personally. Any more range and why not just go for a longer range wheel?

[Clem604]

My legs couldn't go longer than 30-35kms of riding the Mten4 as it hurts my legs and feet after a while. My Sherman S on the other hand..............

Edited April 20, 2023 by Clem604

[techyiam]

9 minutes ago, Clem604 said:

My Sherman S on the other hand..............

but but, but........

you are sitting most of the time on the Sherman-S. 

[Clem604]

25 minutes ago, techyiam said:

but but, but........

you are sitting most of the time on the Sherman-S. 

🧑‍🦽💨💨💨

Edited April 20, 2023 by Clem604

[Student4Life]

On 1/5/2023 at 9:31 AM, Clem604 said:

Thanks and I totally agree on the trolley handle. I thought I would be using the grab handle but in reality it isn't as useful as I would have imagined, mostly due to the Mten4 being heavier than I had first anticipated. Adding those heavy Begode spiked pedals didn't help .

Is the trolley handle quick-removable?  E.g. does it have a screw-mount bracket, and then a spring-loaded retainer clip?  Or does I need tools to remove it?  And how does the handle perform in a tumble?  It looks like it would bend or tear off.