Making Begode wheels safer: PWM tiltback with custom firmware

[Freestyler]

@Mike Sacristan thoughts on the dynamic tiltback feature:

(Once again, thank you for testing it )

 

[goatman]

i saw him ripping away from everyone on his latest video

too bad we couldnt just buy the blackcontrol boards from you or someone else with this feature already installed.

one would think ewheels would be ringing your phone all day long

if begode wont do it maybe they will

 

[Mike Sacristan]

9 hours ago, goatman said:

i saw him ripping away from everyone on his latest video

too bad we couldnt just buy the blackcontrol boards from you or someone else with this feature already installed.

one would think ewheels would be ringing your phone all day long

if begode wont do it maybe they will

 

Here is a link to the clip. And I can summarise a bit:

Having 75% PWM beeps lowered my top speed from 72kmh to 68kmh. At first I felt it was a bad thing... but I only ever hit 72kmh once.. and 69kmh twice. In 7500km of riding the EXN. I usually feel nervous when hitting the beeps on the EXN because in my mind I imagine a steep curve from 80% to 95% PWM (soft pedals at 95%) or eventually just over leaning. But now after one week of riding this 75% PWM version the buffer is correct.. as when I push the tilt back I will reach 80% PWM giving me a nice 20% buffer just about *always*. Instead of playing with how much of the 20% remaining buffer I can eat. I have played at 66kmh and 50% battery... since that is a much more comfortable speed than 70... but I am just as happy playing at 62kmh and half battery and surfing soft tilt back. Combination of beeping, soft-tiltback and a bump did cause a bit of an amp spike... but it was a fraction of a second and on a 6p config. I would think it would take a full second of high A draw to cause a high A over lean.

So with this firmware now I can confidently ride faster more often. Tobias with the chrome helmet is riding his new Sherman Max with tilt back at 58kmh. After high amp over leaning his Fat Nik last year he is no longer the speed demon he used to be when it comes to top speed.. but boy is he a crazy carver seated on that thing. 

 

[Freestyler]

You are right Mike, that you can approach the limit more often knowing that it is harder to miss the warning.

It makes for a less stressful riding session especially in noisy conditions!

No need to think: has the wheel beeped? Is the app connected? Is the bluetooth speaker on & connected?

It's liberating not have to connect to an app if you don't feel like.

 

Also, I can get behind Tobias. After my high speed crash at 74 km/h more than a year ago, I'm waaaaaay more conservative.

Even 40km/h feels like a lot now.

I dressed for war 2 days ago and hit a new personal record since my accident. 55km/h! Felt like a speed demon again. 

Edited June 6, 2022 by Freestyler

[Mike Sacristan]

8 hours ago, Freestyler said:

You are right Mike, that you can approach the limit more often knowing that it is harder to miss the warning.

It makes for a less stressful riding session especially in noisy conditions!

Exactly! Last night when I was out riding at one point Darknessbot had disconnected. I hit beeps while riding in traffic (barely audible) and then I got a very gentle tilt-back which was just fine... since by then I am usually approaching the limits of my lean and a subtle shift is enough to get me to slow down... which I did not.. I just surfed the tilt-back a bit. 

8 hours ago, Freestyler said:

No need to think: has the wheel beeped? Is the app connected? Is the bluetooth speaker on & connected?

It's liberating not have to connect to an app if you don't feel like.

It sure is! And also very nice to have it at 75% PWM.

8 hours ago, Freestyler said:

Also, I can get behind Tobias. After my high speed crash at 74 km/h more than a year ago, I'm waaaaaay more conservative.

Even 40km/h feels like a lot now.

I dressed for war 2 days ago and hit a new personal record since my accident. 55km/h! Felt like a speed demon again. 

And so it begins! You will be back to normal in no time! Especially since your scenario was rather extreme! I got some mild PTSD when my Nikola just shut off with me riding it at 32kmh. My brain got stuck at that speed for a month. 

[EMA]

2 hours ago, Mike Sacristan said:

It sure is! And also very nice to have it at 75% PWM.

Begode said in future firmware beeps could be set by app to 75 or 80% 

btw this is a nice mod

[Planemo]

All well and good being able to set 75% beeps but it still relies on you hearing them. I dont know what a 75% beep would equate to in terms of speed but even at 36mph, the stock sherman beeper isnt exactly loud.

I have been running my Sherman at the 36mph (max user settable) beep recently to check if I could hear it OK after cutting a hole in the top panel and turning the beeper around. It's definately better than stock, and I could clearly hear them on an open, empty country road at that speed which was reassuring. In fact it was liberating. But I wouldnt say it was 'loud'. I havent checked it in urban traffic either, with all the surrounding noise etc and at this moment I'm not convinced the beeps will be easily heard, even at 36mph. The wind noise is the biggest issue by far though, and obviously this will be hugely increased at the 43mph-ish of the final beeps.

If I can hear the 36mph beeps clearly in an urban setting then I will be happier to run the final beeps but even then it makes me nervous. It would be nice to have them user-adjustable between 36 and 43 but its not possible.

I would be happiest with a 40mph max stock final beep or even better a dynamic tiltback with a max of 40. I cant have the former, so if this mod ever makes its way to the Sherman I would be over the moon

 

[M7SZY]

Hello , @Freestyler as you ask me on the YT video (itshereanyfood ) im  here, unfortunately can't send any msg,s so there you go. Thank you in advance. Marek. 

[Freestyler]

On 6/7/2022 at 10:10 AM, EMA said:

Begode said in future firmware beeps could be set by app to 75 or 80% 

btw this is a nice mod

Confirmed. In the latest Master firmware the pwm limit is adjustable between 50%-90%.

Great. Exactly what we needed. Now the first advice a new begode rider will get in addition to: "disable speed alerts and tiltback" is "don't forget to set the pwm all the way up to 90% to avoid the annoying beeps"

Edited June 10, 2022 by Freestyler

[Lefteris]

Also @Freestyler new custom firmware that flashes the front light when you have it enabled and you reach your pwm limit and the pedals start tilting, is "the" best addition as a new feature.

You see your lights flashing and for some reason you didn't feel the pedals tilt yet, you know you've just entered your 75% pwm limit!!

Epic feature!!! 💪💪💪

[alcatraz]

Sorry if this is offtopic but which version of thr RS-HS supports flashing of this firmware? It's good to know now so that my next wheel supports this when it becomes available. Thanks!

[Freestyler]

14 minutes ago, alcatraz said:

Sorry if this is offtopic but which version of thr RS-HS supports flashing of this firmware? It's good to know now so that my next wheel supports this when it becomes available. Thanks!

If you connect to https://freestyl3r.github.io/euc-dash/begode.html and you get a value in the model code field, then the wheel is flashable.

By now it's flashed on most models: rs, exn, ex, mcm5, nikola, ex20s, monster pro and tesla. That includes C30 & C38 motor variants and accelerated stability versions.

The only wheel it's not ported yet is mten3 (not sure it makes sense) and Master.

Master is a moving target (rapid firmware releases), plus it's a bit different than all the other wheels so it requires more targeted work.

 

So anyone who fits the above criteria, feel free to pm me to arrange a flash.

Edited June 10, 2022 by Freestyler

[alcatraz]

30 minutes ago, Freestyler said:

If you connect to https://freestyl3r.github.io/euc-dash/begode.html and you get a value in the model code field, then the wheel is flashable.

By now it's flashed on most models: rs, exn, ex, mcm5, nikola, ex20s, monster pro and tesla. That includes C30 & C38 motor variants and accelerated stability versions.

The only wheel it's not ported yet is mten3 (not sure it makes sense) and Master.

Master is a moving target (rapid firmware releases), plus it's a bit different than all the other wheels so it requires more targeted work.

 

So anyone who fits the above criteria, feel free to pm me to arrange a flash.

Thanks. That's an impressive list.

Oddly, when I used EUCdash with my MSX84, the first three fields came out empty. That wheel is unsupported then, right?

[Freestyler]

Yeap. That would be a green motherboard with no support for bluetooth firmware upgrades.

[dycus]

Freestyler, thank you for taking the time to do this! I'd been thinking about ways we could get better feedback from our EUCs; I'm glad to see somebody else was too, and actually putting in the work!

Not only does it keep riders safer, it will allow people to learn to use their wheels to their fullest potential. Proprioception is a huge component in muscle memory.

I hope we can get lots of people using this firmware and giving feedback so all EUC manufacturers take notice.

[alcatraz]

What about glitches in the data? Is the data reliable enough to set limits based on it?

What happens if you're riding downhill at 75km/h? Will this still warn somehow?

[MexicanBatman]

Can you get this to work on my latest version  Monster Pro

 

small motor green board

 

because there’s no tiltback at all on it regardless of setting

 

you can set it in the begode app and it does nothing

 

and if I swap between firmware version it’s still doesn’t tiltback

[Freestyler]

9 hours ago, dycus said:

Not only does it keep riders safer, it will allow people to learn to use their wheels to their fullest potential. Proprioception is a huge component in muscle memory.

You touch on an interesting point. Many people who report their feedback back to me, claim that it allowed them to ride at higher average speeds.

So this feature will not "neuter" performance for most people as instinctively thought.

 

6 hours ago, alcatraz said:

What about glitches in the data? Is the data reliable enough to set limits based on it?

What happens if you're riding downhill at 75km/h? Will this still warn somehow?

It's as reliable as the PWM alarm beeps. If you trust those, then you automatically trust the tiltback feature as well.

Yes, it works on downhills and even when driving in reverse.

 

3 hours ago, Trevor Phillips said:

Can you get this to work on my latest version  Monster Pro

 

small motor green board

 

because there’s no tiltback at all on it regardless of setting

 

you can set it in the begode app and it does nothing

 

and if I swap between firmware version it’s still doesn’t tiltback

The monster pro situation is quite perplexing.

I have flashed the firmware to a guy with black controller, but the latest batches seem to ship with green controllers, which are not flashable.

You can verify by connecting to euc dash and check the model code. If model code is empty = not flashable (even if it is, we are not sure of the firmware it is running)

One theory is that they "locked" the firmware, because there are 2 motors released on the market and not all firmwares are compatible.

 

Edited June 12, 2022 by Freestyler

[M7SZY]

On 5/17/2022 at 3:13 AM, RideRiskReward said:

how does this compare to safety margin in EUC world? 

 

I noticed big difference, Before the change of Firmware my EUC World app showed 10% safety margins, now after flashing new Firmware I see in EUC World app 31% salty margins. so there is change for sure, the wheel im riding is  the EXN HT 

[MexicanBatman]

On 6/12/2022 at 7:36 PM, Freestyler said:

You touch on an interesting point. Many people who report their feedback back to me, claim that it allowed them to ride at higher average speeds.

So this feature will not "neuter" performance for most people as instinctively thought.

 

It's as reliable as the PWM alarm beeps. If you trust those, then you automatically trust the tiltback feature as well.

Yes, it works on downhills and even when driving in reverse.

 

The monster pro situation is quite perplexing.

I have flashed the firmware to a guy with black controller, but the latest batches seem to ship with green controllers, which are not flashable.

You can verify by connecting to euc dash and check the model code. If model code is empty = not flashable (even if it is, we are not sure of the firmware it is running)

One theory is that they "locked" the firmware, because there are 2 motors released on the market and not all firmwares are compatible.

 

I’ll let you know when I open the box and see what’s in there

 

mines a green board and and I can update the firmware in the begode app

 

but no tiltback

[misterdalto]

On 5/16/2022 at 10:51 AM, Freestyler said:

I can flash some peoples wheels here and there but it requires coordination with me.

That's why the end goal would be for wheels to ship directly with that feature.

Either through distributors or ideally from begode themselves.

when it comes to the RS C38 and C30 - is this available in both variations of RS firmware - specifically the stock, or, accelerated stability.

 

i personally love the RS C38 accelerated stability, and if your variant works with it - i'd like to test it out. 

 

thanks!

[Freestyler]

It is available for RS C30 (standard & accelerated stability versions) and RS C38.

RS C38 accelerated stability is the same firmware as standard RS C38.

See the discussion after this post for more info: https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/27359-what-is-the-accelerated-stability-firmware-in-the-begode-app/page/3/#comment-423054

 

Pm me to arrange a flash!

 

[onkeldanuel]

7 hours ago, Freestyler said:

 

7 hours ago, Freestyler said:

It is available for RS C30 (standard & accelerated stability versions) and RS C38.

RS C38 accelerated stability is the same firmware as standard RS C38.

See the discussion after this post for more info: https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/27359-what-is-the-accelerated-stability-firmware-in-the-begode-app/page/3/#comment-423054

 

Pm me to arrange a flash!

 

I would love to Test with my Begode EX...is it possible with the C40? Best Regards Daniel 

Edited July 6, 2022 by onkeldanuel

[Freestyler]

9 minutes ago, onkeldanuel said:

I would love to Test with my Begode EX...is it possible with the C40? Best Regards Daniel 

Yeap. Its available on all wheels except master. It has been flashed already in an ex.

[UtahRider]

8 hours ago, onkeldanuel said:

I would love to Test with my Begode EX...is it possible with the C40? Best Regards Daniel 

I had Freestyler flash my EX and RST a few weeks ago and it works great except the EX light doesn’t flash immediately when you hit PWM limit like my RS does. It will flash eventually but not immediately. However, the light feature is only useful when riding at night anyway (insightful huh?). This is such a great feature, with or without the light flashing, I highly recommend it and then use the hell out of it!

Edited July 7, 2022 by UtahRider