My new MSuper V3s+ and Gotway Screwed Us

[Marty Backe]

It's with sad news that I'm here to say that my brand new (now scratched to hell) MSuper V3s+ is afflicted with the now infamous Gotway oscillation syndrome.

I had just picked it up personally from @Jason McNeil a couple of days ago while he was out in California inspecting his latest delivery from Gotway. He's a great guy to hang with btw, and we (Jason, myself, and @Sven) had a fun little ride in some local hills. Andy, you need to post that video you made!

Of course I tested mine a day ago by riding (slowly - which is key to remember) over various bumps, curbs, etc. No problems. Yeah!

But this morning was my first opportunity to take it for a serious ride. I setup my camera and filmed a short mini-review introduction to my new MSuper (God I wanted to love this wheel) and then took it out on the road. As you'll see in the video below, about 3 minutes into the ride I'm on a sidewalk, probably not going faster than 15mph. I travel across a street and up on to the sidewalk, and that transition was enough to cause it to instantly oscillate and throw me off the wheel.

My take away is that the wheel has to be traveling at a fairly good clip for this to happen. But as you can see, I was not exactly traveling at an extreme speed.

Jason is screwed with his recent shipment, and I must say anyone who has received a unit within the last month or so is risking their skin if riding the wheel faster than 10mph. Even though I say in the video that I'm probably going to ride it, I'm not. As I rode home I couldn't make myself go faster than 10mph for fear of the oscillation. There is zero warning. There's absolutely no fun riding a wheel under those conditions.

I have no clue how Gotway is going to prove any recent wheel delivery is without the problem. They clearly lied to Jason regarding his shipment, and he must be one of their best dealers.

When I get a new control board (I assume), how will I know Gotway did anything. Who wants to gear up and ride 15 - 20 mph into a bump to test it? I'm sure I'll be more open to the idea after a few days, but not now. My left wrist and hand is getting worse as I type this 

Well guys, I only have my Monster and KS14C to ride now, and summer months are upon us. What a bummer.

Enjoy the video     The thumbnail is 1 second before the crash - ouch.

 

[Jason McNeil]

14 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Jason is screwed with his recent shipment

Marty, that clip is worse than any horror movie, where you know the protagonist is going to suffer something bad, sorry Buddy . Let's get this sorted out!  

[Marty Backe]

3 minutes ago, Jason McNeil said:

Marty, that clip is worse than any horror movie, where you know the protagonist is going to suffer something bad, obviously I feel terrible  

Very funny Jason  (I have a good sense of humor). Don't feel bad - you're one of the good guys. I still want Gotway to succeed because I love the MSuper. Just a bummer that summer is here and I'll be without one . I wish you the best regarding your upcoming troubles with Gotway. 

[Sven]

Yeah this is horrible i still remember the big smile on your face like a kid getting his favorite toy for Christmas. Sucks for all of us.

hope you recover from this accident soo. Marty

[Marcos75]

Exactly the same Problem like my new from wheel yesterday.

[Maximus]

21 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

It's with sad news that I'm here to say that my brand new (now scratched to hell) MSuper V3s+ is afflicted with the now infamous Gotway oscillation syndrome.

I think a large group of us all just took that fall with you Marty...I can't imagine how Gotway recovers from this...

[meepmeepmayer]

Uh that was hard to watch, every tiny bump might be the crash one

But @Marty Backe, due to your videos and their visibility you're right at the forefront of making Gotway get their act together, so thanks for that One Youtube video > 100 Chinese crashes that nobody ever hears about.

Can you tell more about how the crash happened and your experience?

• It was quite instant, but they call it oscillation. How long and often does it oscillate? How strong? How does it feel when that happens? Can you describe?
• You did need every part of your protective gear in this crash? What hit the ground first? Knee I assume? Can you tell more about what you think of the different protective clothing parts now?
• Wondering why you have elbow guards, but no wrist protectors. Will you change that now?

Hope your injuries get better soon, but usually this stuff can be felt for quite a long time. How many bad crashes (due to your or the wheel's fault) did you have now? Quite a lot I think...

[Rehab1]

46 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

But this morning was my first opportunity to take it for a serious ride. I setup my camera and filmed a short mini-review introduction to my new MSuper (God I wanted to love this wheel) and then took it out on the road. As you'll see in the video below, about 3 minutes into the ride I'm on a sidewalk, probably not going faster than 15mph. I travel across a street and up on to the sidewalk, and that transition was enough to cause it to instantly oscillate and throw me off the wheel.

I am so sorry for both you and Jason! WTF is going on! Thank God you landed in some soft landscaping!

If the Gotway Gods are not protecting you then the rest of us are basically screwed!

[meepmeepmayer]

4 minutes ago, Maximus said:

I can't imagine how Gotway recovers from this...

They'll rollback the firmware, continue selling wheels, and if they can keep the financial impact small enough where is their problem? Just saying, if they don't go broke over this, they lost some money but nothing else bad from their point of view. No competition.

Their real danger is, as soon as KS or someone else makes a better designed wheel that competes with their high powered ones, they're toast. Why buy Gotway if you can get the same, but better.

1 minute ago, Rehab1 said:

Thank the good God you landed in some soft landscaping!

I think only the camera did, he hit the concrete.

[US69]

@Marty Backe Ouch!

the Gotway Gods have seamed to leave you for a longer time! 

It ridiculous...i saw the conversation @Jason McNeil posted, that they put new firmware on every wheel they have sent to him!

It's the question if the gave a fu.... for one of the best sellers and his customers...and just lied! or if just NOBODY in this complete company has any clue of what the other one is doing...or what they are doing at all!

Sorry, i have a beloved V3 (oktober 2016).....but at THIS TIME i would advise everybody to stay away from Gotway completly!

As @Marcos75 aka Markus posted , 67 Volt Versions are having this problem also....so who knows which of their since end of April produced wheel has it not?

@Linnea Lin Gotway @Jane Mo Your company is ruining itself with its horrible Qualitymanagement!

[Marty Backe]

4 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Uh that was hard to watch, every tiny bump might be the crash one

But @Marty Backe, due to your videos and their visibility you're right at the forefront of making Gotway get their act together, so thanks for that One Youtube video > 100 Chinese crashes that nobody ever hears about.

Can you tell more about how the crash happened and your experience?

• It was quite instant, but they call it oscillation. How long and often does it oscillate? How strong? How does it feel when that happens? Can you describe?
• You did need every part of your protective gear in this crash? What hit the ground first? Knee I assume? Can you tell more about what you think of the different protective clothing parts now?
• Wondering why you have elbow guards, but no wrist protectors. Will you change that now?
•  

Hope your injuries get better soon, but usually this stuff can be felt for quite a long time. How many bad crashes (due to your or the wheel's fault) did you have now? Quite a lot I think...

I think the video says it all. I could wheel the wheel start oscillating (for a fraction of a second) before I was thrown from the wheel. Hard to describe, but I think those of us who have experienced understand the sensation. There is zero warning. I've ridden over stuff like this all the time.

Guess I just don't like wrist guards  I would have have some bloody knees for sure without the knee pads. Everything happened so fast (as you can see), it's hard to deconstruct what happened.

[Marty Backe]

7 minutes ago, Rehab1 said:

I am so sorry for both you and Jason! WTF is going on! Thank the good God you landed in some soft landscaping!

If the Gotway Gods are not protecting you then the rest of us are basically screwed!

My camera landed in the bushes - it had a soft landing . I went flying across the sidewalk  It was not a soft landing. My left hand is really stiffening up (it'll be OK - but no gym for me for awhile).

Thanks man!

[meepmeepmayer]

4 minutes ago, KingSong69 said:

It's the question if the gave a fu.... for one of the best sellers and his customers...and just lied! or if just NOBODY in this complete company has any clue of what the other one is doing...or what they are doing at all!

I imagine an overcrowded table, full with a pile of boards, some flashed with good FW, some still needing to be flashed, a tired unskilled worker, bad lighting, some kind of flashing machine, a messy paper list with board numbers or whatever, and of course time pressure. Chabuduo!

[Tishawn Fahie]

41 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

It's with sad news that I'm here to say that my brand new (now scratched to hell) MSuper V3s+ is afflicted with the now infamous Gotway oscillation syndrome.

I had just picked it up personally from @Jason McNeil a couple of days ago while he was out in California inspecting his latest delivery from Gotway. He's a great guy to hang with btw, and we (Jason, myself, and @Sven) had a fun little ride in some local hills. Andy, you need to post that video you made!

Of course I tested mine a day ago by riding (slowly - which is key to remember) over various bumps, curbs, etc. No problems. Yeah!

But this morning was my first opportunity to take it for a serious ride. I setup my camera and filmed a short mini-review introduction to my new MSuper (God I wanted to love this wheel) and then took it out on the road. As you'll see in the video below, about 3 minutes into the ride I'm on a sidewalk, probably not going faster than 15mph. I travel across a street and up on to the sidewalk, and that transition was enough to cause it to instantly oscillate and throw me off the wheel.

My take away is that the wheel has to be traveling at a fairly good clip for this to happen. But as you can see, I was not exactly traveling at an extreme speed.

Jason is screwed with his recent shipment, and I must say anyone who has received a unit within the last month or so is risking their skin if riding the wheel faster than 10mph. Even though I say in the video that I'm probably going to ride it, I'm not. As I rode home I couldn't make myself go faster than 10mph for fear of the oscillation. There is zero warning. There's absolutely no fun riding a wheel under those conditions.

I have no clue how Gotway is going to prove any recent wheel delivery is without the problem. They clearly lied to Jason regarding his shipment, and he must be one of their best dealers.

When I get a new control board (I assume), how will I know Gotway did anything. Who wants to gear up and ride 15 - 20 mph into a bump to test it? I'm sure I'll be more open to the idea after a few days, but not now. My left wrist and hand is getting worse as I type this 

Well guys, I only have my Monster and KS14C to ride now, and summer months are upon us. What a bummer.

Enjoy the video     The thumbnail is 1 second before the crash - ouch.

 

dude wow.. I'm glad your ok... I feel like taking my review of this down..... This is not cool at all.....I'm literarily telling people to go buy this nonsense... I still ride mine everyday.. I don't have problems.. The terrain you ride on is a dream.. You should see the roads I have to deal with yet this happens.... Thank you for alerting everyone...

[meepmeepmayer]

4 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I think the video says it all. I could wheel the wheel start oscillating (for a fraction of a second) before I was thrown from the wheel. Hard to describe, but I think those of us who have experienced understand the sensation. There is zero warning. I've ridden over stuff like this all the time.

Guess I just don't like wrist guards  I would have have some bloody knees for sure without the knee pads. Everything happened so fast (as you can see), it's hard to deconstruct what happened.

Hmm, will watch again. But it was so quick, seemed just like a cut out. But I understand you don't want to relive the crash

Wrist guards actually feel quite nice, make your wrists warm and comfortable and give you a safer feeling.

[Maximus]

3 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

if they can keep the financial impact small enough where is their problem?

I guess it's just speculation on my part that forums like this one have a major impact on the sales of wheels.  If anyone is willing to get on a Gotway product at this point, then either they don't mind face planting, are unaware of the problem, or are a little crazy.  Once you are emotionally connected or disconnected to a "brand" then it's kind of with you for life, in my opinion.  Apple products, for example, are my preference.  Somewhere in my past they became my product of choice and no matter what functionality a competitor has, it still isn't an Apple product.  Gotway had this opportunity with me and my new ACM, but they just lost me.  I'm more that willing to use a product now like Inmotion or KingSong, even though they may have "inferior" products in terms of speed or range, but once you've lost your confidence in a brand, it's lost.  Maybe this is not true for everyone, and maybe in time I'll try again, but for the foreseeable future my money is not going to a Gotway product.

[Pengo]

26 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

It's with sad news that I'm here to say that my brand new (now scratched to hell) MSuper V3s+ is afflicted with the now infamous Gotway oscillation syndrome.

I had just picked it up personally from @Jason McNeil a couple of days ago while he was out in California inspecting his latest delivery from Gotway. He's a great guy to hang with btw, and we (Jason, myself, and @Sven) had a fun little ride in some local hills. Andy, you need to post that video you made!

Of course I tested mine a day ago by riding (slowly - which is key to remember) over various bumps, curbs, etc. No problems. Yeah!

But this morning was my first opportunity to take it for a serious ride. I setup my camera and filmed a short mini-review introduction to my new MSuper (God I wanted to love this wheel) and then took it out on the road. As you'll see in the video below, about 3 minutes into the ride I'm on a sidewalk, probably not going faster than 15mph. I travel across a street and up on to the sidewalk, and that transition was enough to cause it to instantly oscillate and throw me off the wheel.

My take away is that the wheel has to be traveling at a fairly good clip for this to happen. But as you can see, I was not exactly traveling at an extreme speed.

Jason is screwed with his recent shipment, and I must say anyone who has received a unit within the last month or so is risking their skin if riding the wheel faster than 10mph. Even though I say in the video that I'm probably going to ride it, I'm not. As I rode home I couldn't make myself go faster than 10mph for fear of the oscillation. There is zero warning. There's absolutely no fun riding a wheel under those conditions.

I have no clue how Gotway is going to prove any recent wheel delivery is without the problem. They clearly lied to Jason regarding his shipment, and he must be one of their best dealers.

When I get a new control board (I assume), how will I know Gotway did anything. Who wants to gear up and ride 15 - 20 mph into a bump to test it? I'm sure I'll be more open to the idea after a few days, but not now. My left wrist and hand is getting worse as I type this 

Well guys, I only have my Monster and KS14C to ride now, and summer months are upon us. What a bummer.

Enjoy the video     The thumbnail is 1 second before the crash - ouch.

 

My heart just sunk when I heard about your crash on the brand new wheel. I have been waiting for my Gotway ACMs+ for months and can't wait to try it. My wheel is currently in transit but I believe it comes from the same Gotway shipment as yours. Now I'm not so sure if I want to be next human crash dummy experiment for Gotway. I will talk to @Jason McNeil re whether there should be a recall on this batch.

hope you recover soon!

 

 

[houseofjob]

1 minute ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Hmm, will watch again. But it was so quick, seemed just like a cut out. But I understand you don't want to relive the crash

Ummmm.... super hard to cutout on an 84V 1500W nominal wheel.

Also, wobbles are super noticeable.

[meepmeepmayer]

2 minutes ago, Maximus said:

I guess it's just speculation on my part that forums like this one have a major impact on the sales of wheels.  If anyone is willing to get on a Gotway product at this point, then either they don't mind face planting, are unaware of the problem, or are a little crazy.  Once you are emotionally connected or disconnected to a "brand" then it's kind of with you for life, in my opinion.  Apple products, for example, are my preference.  Somewhere in my past they became my product of choice and no matter what functionality a competitor has, it still isn't an Apple product.  Gotway had this opportunity with me and my new ACM, but they just lost me.  I'm more that willing to use a product now like Inmotion or KingSong, even though they may have "inferior" products in terms of speed or range, but once you've lost your confidence in a brand, it's lost.  Maybe this is not true for everyone, and maybe in time I'll try again, but for the foreseeable future my money is not going to a Gotway product.

Yep, the long term impact may be bigger. But as long as there is no competition, I'm afraid they won't feel it enough.

You want to buy a >1000Wh 16 inch wheel? Gotway is your only choice.

You want to but a >1000Wh 18 inch wheel? Gotway, or the comparably overpriced KS18.

You want a 22 incher? Gotway, or nothing.

But I won't buy GW again unless I know they are good, so I understand your position. One cut out crash and you change your mind really fast.

3 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Ummmm.... super hard to cutout on an 84V 1500W nominal wheel.

Also, wobbles are super noticeable.

Thanks for the info. Cut out, cut off, is there a difference? I use "overlean" or "overpower" for the non-hardware-error crash reason. With cut out, I mean the motor simply switching off, and (due to tire resistance from the magnets) the wheel tilting forward and basically stopping instantly.

[US69]

@meepmeepmayer

The "oscillating " problem is that after a bump o small jump or street imperfection the wheel starts to roll/oscillate uncontollable in one direction, forward/backward, and that so heavy and fast that you are -not able to controll the wheel anymore and-in the end it then cutsout...

thats how i understand and learned it from another conversation.   

[meepmeepmayer]

Yep, thanks, I just expected it to oscillate for a second or longer. This was basically instant crash (but apparently you still feel oscillation in this short time). No possibility to do anything

[Rehab1]

11 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

My camera landed in the bushes - it had a soft landing . I went flying across the sidewalk  It was not a soft landing. My left hand is really stiffening up (it'll be OK - but no gym for me for awhile).

Thanks man!

Then you are really lucky! Is your wrist swollen? Can you fully raise and lower your wrist and also rotate your hand palm up and down without excruciating pain? Maybe you should contact your physician. 

[Marcos75]

Yes it is like this. Take a look at my video in the fb gotway group grpm Markus polasik. There you can see it a little bit better. And imagine this at highspeed. 

[kour]

uuuggggh so hard to watch. it's terrible. you're pretty brave @Marty Backe - like, what if you'd been pointing at the street when it oscillated?! you (and the wheel) could've flown out into traffic! not trying to minimize your injuries, please understand. hopefully something positive can come out of this and you mend up soon. peace

[Maximus]

2 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

You want to buy a >1000Wh 16 inch wheel? Gotway is your only choice.

I wanted that...but not at the risk of a face plant.

3 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

You want to but a >1000Wh 18 inch wheel? Gotway, or the comparably overpriced KS18.

At this point, I don't think it is overpriced, I think it's the price of safety, right?

4 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

You want a 22 incher? Gotway, or nothing.

You are right, currently they are the only option, but I guess at this point I'll stick with the limitations of the manufacturers I trust, and when they come out with the upgrades, then that's when I'll purchase them.  I'm not interested in the cutting edge at the risk of safety, particularly when these wheels will be used by not just me, but members of my family or friends, it's just not worth it.