Eucner Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 On 4/9/2024 at 1:16 PM, bene said: You really helped me a lot. Thank you so much!!! You are welcome. Today has the proposal passed first voting. https://www.eduskunta.fi/FI/vaski/KasittelytiedotValtiopaivaasia/Sivut/HE_10+2024.aspx 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bene Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 On 4/18/2024 at 8:19 PM, Eucner said: You are welcome. Today has the proposal passed first voting. https://www.eduskunta.fi/FI/vaski/KasittelytiedotValtiopaivaasia/Sivut/HE_10+2024.aspx Thank you again for keeping me updated. Do you know how many votings there are until it gets to the President for approval? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eucner Posted April 24 Share Posted April 24 21 hours ago, bene said: Thank you again for keeping me updated. Do you know how many votings there are until it gets to the President for approval? The minimum is 2 votings. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magovec Posted April 24 Share Posted April 24 On 2/8/2023 at 9:46 PM, Kutvis said: The scary part is anything over 25kg must be in insurance, but it is not possible to get one for an EUC in our country. E. They say this will change, but as it is EU-wide we can take the insurance from any country. E. I did ask this from our government planner responsible for the change, she said the 25kg + 25kph + power limit removal is EU WIDE!! This will take effect at the end of THIS year. E. Insurance companies are forced to give insurance to all PEV, but I doubt it is as straight forward as this. There sure will be some limitations. I can confirm that in the Czech republic we have this in force already (commenced at April 1st 2024) and all EUCs going above 25 km/h or having higher wattage motors (all EUCs fall into this category as it was designed for bike sharing Bold/Lime scooters). There are actualy only 2 insurance companies actively offering such insurrance and it does not cost much (I already have it). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthraksi Posted Tuesday at 03:27 AM Share Posted Tuesday at 03:27 AM (edited) Instead of saying that it "doesn't cost much" could you just uh, please say what it actually costs? I mean sure probably the figures come from different countries and such, but it at least gives a comparison point that may or may not be useful in some way. We are still waiting for the law to pass in Finland, but it should happen in a month. I guess. I don't really see a point in this either way since no matter if your EUC is insured or not, the insurance company will be on your ass if you happen to be in an accident and they find out that your EUC isn't exactly legal to ride on the streets, as far as I know there really aint any EU countries which allow over 25kmh speeds on these things, but it varies how much they care about enforcing it. Which means that they ain't paying a dime and you are left with the bill. Leaves the question that what exactly are you paying for at that point? I guess the answer is that you are paying for the priviledge of not getting fined in case you do get pulled over. But that's it, it's basically a subscription service to skip getting fined by the police if they care enough to pull you over and ask you about it. If it's reasonably priced (around 100€ per year) I might as well just get it in case the local police actually do decide to start caring about PEVs, but anything closer or over 200€ is another topic entirely. Oh wait I do see the point. Money. Edited Tuesday at 03:27 AM by Anthraksi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted Tuesday at 05:46 AM Share Posted Tuesday at 05:46 AM 2 hours ago, Anthraksi said: Instead of saying that it "doesn't cost much" could you just uh, please say what it actually costs? I mean sure probably the figures come from different countries and such, but it at least gives a comparison point that may or may not be useful in some way. We are still waiting for the law to pass in Finland, but it should happen in a month. I guess. I don't really see a point in this either way since no matter if your EUC is insured or not, the insurance company will be on your ass if you happen to be in an accident and they find out that your EUC isn't exactly legal to ride on the streets, as far as I know there really aint any EU countries which allow over 25kmh speeds on these things, but it varies how much they care about enforcing it. Which means that they ain't paying a dime and you are left with the bill. Leaves the question that what exactly are you paying for at that point? I guess the answer is that you are paying for the priviledge of not getting fined in case you do get pulled over. But that's it, it's basically a subscription service to skip getting fined by the police if they care enough to pull you over and ask you about it. If it's reasonably priced (around 100€ per year) I might as well just get it in case the local police actually do decide to start caring about PEVs, but anything closer or over 200€ is another topic entirely. Oh wait I do see the point. Money. It costs 50sek a month in Sweden, but if you don't see the point what does it matter? You can take a gamble if you like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted Tuesday at 06:46 AM Share Posted Tuesday at 06:46 AM 3 hours ago, Anthraksi said: but anything closer or over 200€ is another topic entirely. I would happily pay 200 euro a year to insure my EUC. To not worry about being stopped by police and getting a £600 fine/massively increased car insurance costs for years to come and/or losing my EUC and/or putting someone in hospital and being sued for £££££'s. Yeah, I'd happily pay even 400 euro a year tbh. A 125cc class motorbike (ie 60mph capable) would cost me that to insure anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atdlzpae Posted Tuesday at 07:55 AM Share Posted Tuesday at 07:55 AM (edited) 200€ insurance would be more than I pay for a car. Edited Tuesday at 07:55 AM by atdlzpae Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padluka Posted Tuesday at 09:26 AM Share Posted Tuesday at 09:26 AM On 4/24/2024 at 11:42 AM, Magovec said: I can confirm that in the Czech republic we have this in force already (commenced at April 1st 2024) and all EUCs going above 25 km/h or having higher wattage motors (all EUCs fall into this category as it was designed for bike sharing Bold/Lime scooters). There are actualy only 2 insurance companies actively offering such insurrance and it does not cost much (I already have it). What is included in insurance policy? And it will be great to know real price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthraksi Posted Tuesday at 01:42 PM Share Posted Tuesday at 01:42 PM (edited) 7 hours ago, Rawnei said: It costs 50sek a month in Sweden, but if you don't see the point what does it matter? You can take a gamble if you like. I see the insurance as a way to avoid being ticketed for not being insured. Not much else. Thanks for the price, that seems very reasonable and I would be willing to pay that, even though I don't believe the insurance itself is anything more than just a safety net for not getting ticketed for not having one. I think this list perfectly captures how I view the situation On 2/13/2023 at 3:42 AM, mrelwood said: In conclusion, the big problems for EUCs are: - The legal status of EUCs doesn’t change. All wheels designed in the last 5 something years are still illegal. - There will be an additional law that is broken unless you get an insurance. - An insurance on an illegal vehicle most likely won’t cover any accidents anyway. Because at least how insurance companies work in Finland, they will be looking into the accident itself, what happened and what type of vehicles were involved. When I was younger and we were riding mopeds (which are supposed to be limited to 45km/h tops, registration and insurance required), which were of course modified to go faster than the 45kmh that they were supposed to go. This creates two issues. First one is if the police see you riding let's say 60kmh and they pull you over and test ride your shit and it goes like 65kmh. You probably would lose the plates and get a ticket. But the second issue concerns the insurance and is the one which pretty much directly would translate to EUCs too. Should you be in a crash and the insurance company finds out that your bike wasn't exactly street legal, they can just wash their hands from the whole ordeal and make you pay for all the damages. See the issue? Since the law didn't change in a way that PEV's that go over 25kmh are now legal to ride in the street, it means that you are still breaking the law and riding a vehicle that is not street legal. And should you get in an accident and the insurance company finds out what vehicle you rode, they can just tell you to go kick rocks and pay up. I mean thats at least how it would go in Finland. Not too sure about other countries but based on my own experiences in Sweden I don't think we have much differences between our laws, especially considering PEVs. You probably know better about the laws in there though. Unless in the eyes of the law limiting your EUC to 25km/h via tilt back and alarms makes it legal. No one has tested that out yet though and I wager no one wants to be first to find out either. I'm guessing it also depends on who pulls you over and if they have a bad day or not, the position of the stars and the moon and million other variables depending on how eager the police who pulled you over is to give you a ticket. You might get away with it or you might not. 6 hours ago, Planemo said: I would happily pay 200 euro a year to insure my EUC. To not worry about being stopped by police and getting a £600 fine/massively increased car insurance costs for years to come and/or losing my EUC and/or putting someone in hospital and being sued for £££££'s. Yeah, I'd happily pay even 400 euro a year tbh. A 125cc class motorbike (ie 60mph capable) would cost me that to insure anyway. Most of us would pay happily if it actually meant that the vehicle would be legal. Key word being legal, not insured. As I wrote above I don't really think the insurance makes a difference in any case since no matter which way you look at it, most EUCs are still illegal in most countries. Even if you are allowed/required to insure it, but it still is illegal to ride in the streets and you get in an accident on the street, you probably can guess what the insurance company tells you to go do afterwards? I do hope that one day there will be laws which do not limit how fast the vehicle can go, how heavy can it be or how much power can it have. You can buy a car that goes over 250km/h but you are still only allowed to drive 120km/h tops on the freeway. There are also no limits on weight, or power for that matter. The speed limits are placed on the roads instead, and I quite frankly don't see a reason why it couldn't be like that for PEVs also. Edited Tuesday at 01:44 PM by Anthraksi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atdlzpae Posted Tuesday at 04:42 PM Share Posted Tuesday at 04:42 PM (edited) 3 hours ago, Anthraksi said: Thanks for the price, that seems very reasonable 50sek per month = $4.5 per month, so about $0.15 per day. Over 4 years that's $220, so a fraction of a total cost of a typical unicycle. However, is that per EUC or per rider? Because if per EUC... 3 hours ago, Anthraksi said: I do hope that one day there will be laws which do not limit how fast the vehicle can go, how heavy can it be or how much power can it have. No chance. This is the EU, a bureaucratic hellhole. They regulate everything, even how curvy your cucumbers can be. The only thing we can hope for is that we're illegal, but it's not enforced. Edited Tuesday at 04:43 PM by atdlzpae Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magovec Posted Tuesday at 07:25 PM Share Posted Tuesday at 07:25 PM 15 hours ago, Anthraksi said: Instead of saying that it "doesn't cost much" could you just uh, please say what it actually costs? I mean sure probably the figures come from different countries and such, but it at least gives a comparison point that may or may not be useful in some way. This is way dependent on the country. If the insurance company consider the EUC as a small motorbike it costs approx 60 eur per year. There is also a special program for escooters and shared bikes (only one insurance so far) when they calculated my wheel for 20 eur per year. So to me it is reasonable price and I am not questioning it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onkeldanuel Posted Thursday at 11:40 AM Share Posted Thursday at 11:40 AM On 4/30/2024 at 9:25 PM, Magovec said: This is way dependent on the country. If the insurance company consider the EUC as a small motorbike it costs approx 60 eur per year. There is also a special program for escooters and shared bikes (only one insurance so far) when they calculated my wheel for 20 eur per year. So to me it is reasonable price and I am not questioning it. What if i want to ride in czech Republik? Im there End of the month. But im from Austria....how can i buy this insurance for cz? Is this even possible for guests? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eucner Posted Thursday at 06:37 PM Share Posted Thursday at 06:37 PM @bene The proposal has passed two voting's. It comes into force at June 1st. https://www.eduskunta.fi/FI/vaski/EduskunnanVastaus/Sivut/EV_28+2024.aspx 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magovec Posted Thursday at 08:17 PM Share Posted Thursday at 08:17 PM (edited) 22 hours ago, onkeldanuel said: What if i want to ride in czech Republik? Im there End of the month. But im from Austria....how can i buy this insurance for cz? Is this even possible for guests? Honestly I do not know but it should work as it is with cars, thus you just need an insurance in the domicile country of the vehicle. The problem is till now nobody knows you have an EUC and to which country it belongs to. Here is where you can buy it online (special program for small wehicles and scooters) but not sure if it works for a foreigner. https://www.koop.cz/pojisteni/pojisteni-vozidel/pojisteni-drobnych-vozidel Edited Friday at 09:58 AM by Magovec 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bene Posted Friday at 10:45 AM Share Posted Friday at 10:45 AM 16 hours ago, Eucner said: @bene The proposal has passed two voting's. It comes into force at June 1st. https://www.eduskunta.fi/FI/vaski/EduskunnanVastaus/Sivut/EV_28+2024.aspx Thank you @Eucner!! Much appreciated. Where can I find the information, that the proposal enters into force on 1.6? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atdlzpae Posted Friday at 11:06 AM Share Posted Friday at 11:06 AM 14 hours ago, Magovec said: Here is where you can buy it online (special program for small wehicles and scooters) but not sure if it works for a foreigner. https://www.koop.cz/pojisteni/pojisteni-vozidel/pojisteni-drobnych-vozidel Let's hope it's not the only option, it requires Czech social security number. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eucner Posted Friday at 11:36 AM Share Posted Friday at 11:36 AM 49 minutes ago, bene said: Where can I find the information, that the proposal enters into force on 1.6? I picked it up from newspaper. https://www.hs.fi/talous/art-2000010399839.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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