Inmotion V13 Speculation

[KiwiMark]

Watching that video confirmed my thinking on this wheel - I would not consider the V13 as my only wheel, it just isn't a 'do it all' wheel.  I would love to own one though and think it would be really nice to ride, but I'd love to know the range of ranges - so far I only know that it is ~50km riding full on.  So, what would the range be riding fairly fast (50-70kph) and what would the range be with more relaxed riding (40-60kph) and what would the range be the range when taking it easy to get a better range (30-50kph).  I've put in a comment on the video asking for that, I don't know if there is much chance of them doing a series of range tests, but it is something I'd love to see on all wheels.

My RS gives me ~60km range when riding at a decent pace (no where near as fast as a V13 COULD ride) and that is reasonable, but a bit more range would suit me better.  My Sherman S that is on the way to me (slow boat from China) would be my long range wheel, so I'm good for longer rides.  My V12HT would be my shorter range wheel (its range wouldn't be terrible but I wouldn't want to do long rides without suspension after I get used to riding with suspension).  The V13 would make a great comfortable cruiser capable of quicker speeds for hopefully 70-80km at decent speeds but also capable of really blasting along quickly for up to 50km.  As long as I have in mind what sort of riding I want to do I could select the right wheel.

I'd love to own 5 or 6 wheels and the V13 would be in my ideal line up, but I think it is good enough to be in my ideal line up if I could only have 3 wheels.  The trouble is that at this stage I'm stopping at 2 wheels because money isn't unlimited, with a lottery win there would most definitely be more wheels on the way!

My perfect line up:

Sherman S - my 20" wheel, plenty enough speed for me, great range, decent torque, though heavy and big it isn't TOO big or heavy and would be my main 'daily driver'.  This would be my main wheel and also my range wheel.

V12HT - my 16" wheel, more nimble, torquey wheel that would be great for a bit of off-roading and for doing jumps.  I'd love to upgrade this to a suspension wheel like the T4 but would prefer better build quality like a new Inmotion V12 replacement with suspension. Let's say there could be a future replacement, ideally a V12HT-S (doesn't have to have that name). This would be my nimble wheel to use when that is my priority.

V13 - my big wheel, good for faster speeds and stable cruising, good for video work where a more stable platform is beneficial.  Could be a good choice for group rides as long as they weren't long range group rides (where I'd go with the Sherman S instead).  This would be my big cruiser and my high speed wheel.

TBH I don't know that I'd really need more than these 3, there are not many use cases of mine that these would not cover.  I could have a Master Pro for a big cruiser + decent range, but it doesn't make my top 3 because it is Begode - If I had an unlimited budget I could make it my 4th wheel though.  I could have a T4 for similar things as the V12HT, but with suspension, it could be my number 5 but not higher because again it is Begode.  I could have a Master as a high performance wheel, but I don't plan on racing and doubt that I really need more performance than I have from my other wheels so I don't know that I'd bother buying this wheel even with an unlimited budget.

For those actually buying this wheel - are there any riders that would buy this as their only wheel?

[techyiam]

Good to hear that Speedy Feet thinks the V13 and the Abrams have similar heft.

In the video where he placed the V13 right next to the Abrams, the pedal height of the V13 is so much higher. Also because of suspension, the whole body is raised. It should will come down some with a rider on it. Still, I can't help but to think that the V13 would be more top heavy than the Abrams.

In terms of maneuverability, in the parking lot when he got on it for the first time, it didn't looked bad. Pretty sure he would be even more at ease with it with more ride time.

I think as with the Abrams, with time, the V13 could be an enjoyable wheel to ride.

From watching the videos, both the V13 and the Sherman-S are premium quality wheels. For me, it won't be easy to decide which of the two wheels would make a better upgrade from my Abrams, still.

Edited December 24, 2022 by techyiam

[Freeforester]

In due course some of the other influencer/reviewers will make a more conservative average speed range test.

The build quality seems to be unquestionably great, notwithstanding the missing component mentioned, and bear in mind that they did build it in the workshop from multiple received packages, so it’s not as if it was factory assembled and QC checked, but for the cost, size and weight, a sizeable proportion of the interested may well be harbouring doubts as to and until the question of range:cost is more fully addressed and preferably set out in the various ‘speed categories’ that may interest these prospective buyers.

Edited December 24, 2022 by Freeforester

[Paul A]

5 hours ago, UPONIT said:

But how much time elapsed from pickup to home?

 

If the top speed is 90kph/56mph

And Ian achieved 30 miles/48 km

Then the riding time is approximately 32 minutes.

 

Sixteen minutes outbound, sixteen minutes inbound, for a 32 minute round trip.

Price $4k USD.

[techyiam]

10 minutes ago, Paul A said:

If the top speed is 90kph/56mph

And Ian achieved 30 miles/48 km

Then the riding time is approximately 32 minutes.

Speedy is based in the UK. Not only are Electric Wheels illegal to ride on public roads and bikeways, the police are known to enforce the law.

Travelling anywhere close to 90 km/h would stick out like a sore thumb, and thus would have landed him in jail, and the wheel confiscated.

Not a believable scenario. 

[Paul A]

18 minutes ago, techyiam said:

Not a believable scenario. 

That would  make the range test result even worse then.

Ian only achieved 30 miles, from riding at less than 56 mph.

[rebeuc]

I'm pretty sure the original veteran sherman which had a similar size battery to the v13 only got around 25-30 miles if you maxed it out while riding, so these numbers don't surprise me.

I'm not paying too close attention to the range stuff until we see non-maxed out and warmer weather range tests; the amount of power needed to go at max speed is SUBSTANTIALLY higher than lower speeds; I imagine a 20-30mph range test would be about perfect for my expected use case.

[Forwardnbak]

I’m looking forward to doing a full range test. Warm weather here and i’ll film the whole roll. I won’t max it out but just take the same roll i’ve done range tests on v11 and compare.

At this stage late Jan for mine. 

[LowFlyingSquirrel]

Range seems fishy. Even considering the rated discharge capacity for the samsumg 35e. Rdc would be 2.8kw of battery. 2800 Wh / 48 km = 58 Wh/km. Discharging at -10c provides 40% of the relative capacity 2900 Wh * 0.4 = 1200Wh. 1200 Wh / 48 km = 25 Wh/km. How many Wh/km would you expect at 80 km/h? I would geuss the wheel would require between 2.0-4.5 kW to sustain that speed.

Didnt he post more specs of the trip? Would be great to know the Wh/km and average speed and how much battery was available at 6 Celsius.

[Freeforester]

1 hour ago, Forwardnbak said:

I’m looking forward to doing a full range test. Warm weather here and i’ll film the whole roll. I won’t max it out but just take the same roll i’ve done range tests on v11 and compare.

At this stage late Jan for mine. 

Until that time we can but conclude that the anticipated performance (in terms of range) of this V wheel may be less than felt desireable, at least for those possibly interested but as yet uninvested,  until demonstrably more evidence to the contrary is made available.

[meepmeepmayer]

Guys, ride the original Sherman at max speed and see how far you get. Same battery size. Speed eats battery and that is never going to change. The V13 battery is borderline small if you really want to go close to 90kph a lot.

Also, obligatory standard disclaimer: Speedy Feet range tests always get atrocious range. Not sure if it is how he rides (fast) or the temperature or a curse, that's how it always is, just a fact of life. Just add 35% or whatever to get what everyone else gets.

In his latest video, Marty got 90 miles = 145km on his Master Pro (over 50% more battery than V13) down to the beeps, and he mostly went between 25-30mph = 40-50kph, not that fast, also in cold weather. That makes roughly 60 miles = 95-100km with the V13 battery size. Now floor it (lean it?) and guess what range you get then.

The numbers are what you expect, both from the battery size and from Speedy Feet range tests which are always the lowest of the low end.

[Forwardnbak]

31 minutes ago, Freeforester said:

Until that time we can but conclude that the anticipated performance (in terms of range) of this V wheel may be less than felt desireable, at least for those possibly interested but as yet uninvested,  until demonstrably more evidence to the contrary is made available.

if my city was more than 25km from home  i’d reconsider my purchase.

For my area, limited by speed on the wheel i think i’ll be ok.

I think i’ve never once fully ran the V11 down to complete death so i’ve learned my needs. Also charge places everywhere around here. 

I think the fact i have a bike for real range helps me out, and knowing our city isn’t yet E- ready for large distances helps my decision. 

[Bizra6ot]

From my experience the range doesn't change that much by constantly riding fast with a low but positive outside temp, the wheel is stored warm then the cells are constantly stressed during the test without any break to lose temp
On the other hand, on a Marty style speed test with breaks the wheel/cells cools down and the range is reduced

I do not have an identical tour at 6C degrees to compare, but comparing two with same routes/avg speed one at 32C and the other at 10C the voltage at the end is identical

[UPONIT]

8 hours ago, KiwiMark said:

For those actually buying this wheel - are there any riders that would buy this as their only wheel?

Feel like it will be this or Sherm -S, probably this.

Will sell V11. Keep Mten4. So both ends of the EUC spectrum covered!

[KiwiMark]

1 hour ago, UPONIT said:

Feel like it will be this or Sherm -S, probably this.

Will sell V11. Keep Mten4. So both ends of the EUC spectrum covered!

That seems like a huge gap to me, I'd be tempted to keep the V11 to fill the middle ground.  Having said that, if you did find that you just never needed the wheel lighter than the V13 but not so tiny as the MTen4 (i.e. the V11) then you could decide to sell it.  But yeah, initially at least I'd keep the V11 and see how things went.

[KiwiMark]

3 hours ago, Forwardnbak said:

if my city was more than 25km from home  i’d reconsider my purchase.

For my area, limited by speed on the wheel i think i’ll be ok.

I think i’ve never once fully ran the V11 down to complete death so i’ve learned my needs. Also charge places everywhere around here. 

I think the fact i have a bike for real range helps me out, and knowing our city isn’t yet E- ready for large distances helps my decision. 

Where I live I can ride to my sister's house which is on the other side of the city - about 15km riding distance taking the scenic route.  I could very easily take the fastest route and ride at the speed limit in the 80kph sections and get there and back comfortably on the V13.  To me it would be more important to know how far I could ride when keeping the speed between 40kph & 60kph, I think of this as quicker riding and plenty of fun and it keeps the speed around the normal 50kph limit which most of the roads around the cities & towns in NZ have.  I don't think that riding on the 80kph or 100kph roads on an electric wheel is all that good an idea, I'd rather be on my 1,000cc motorcycle on the open road.  I've had some experience with variation on range at different speeds, having driven a Nissan Leaf with 24kWh of battery for 5 years and you definitely to reduce the range at faster speeds, but if your distance to you destination is well inside your range then you certainly can put your foot down if you need/want to.

[HEC]

15 hours ago, Eyss said:

32 miles range is very concerning

At high speed, in cold weather and with large heavy rider. I ride much more "conservatively",  so I expect under usual conditions (i.e. no strong headwinds, no freezing) to have range up to 100 Km.

[Impoy47]

This past 3 months and during the holiday season my department has been making us work 16 hrs days 3-4 days a week. The accrued forced overtime hours and the extra $$  has easily made my decision to get a new wheel. So why not treat myself.  I was debating between the Sherman S, Begode Master pro or the V13.

With all the V13 all the safety features, ease of tire and battery swap and with Inmotion listening to YT influencers feedback to make a better wheel, I was impressed with this company. Then after seeing the Sherman S teardown, which has the same build as the Max showed me that  there wasn't enough advancement upgrade to the sherman S, which is still an awesome wheel, but compared to what Inmotion did to the V13, I'm leaning towards the v13.. 

I was also looking at the Begode Master pro that is readily available for purchase in my local shop (AR).. 

So in the end, I decided to put in a pre-order for the V13. 

[BKW]

IP ratings are probably the next best evolution for these wheels that need to take place I reckon, so I like how V13 is addressing this

[Funky]

27 minutes ago, Impoy47 said:

So in the end, I decided to put in a pre-order for the V13. 

Enjoy your first batch lemon.  

Edited December 24, 2022 by Funky

[Clem604]

14 minutes ago, Funky said:

Enjoy your first batch lemon.  

You're a really negative person, I suspect most people here would agree.

Edited December 24, 2022 by Clem604

[MrMonoWheel]

1 hour ago, Clem604 said:

You're a really negative person, I suspect most people here would agree.

Yep, I have been ignoring him because everything he says is negative and pessimistic, doesn't add to the conversation at all. Like bro if you hate this wheel so much why are you in this thread.

[KiwiMark]

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Retail version is likely to be third batch at least.  Maybe some issues will arise, but I'm sure Inmotion will put out a fix for those, as needed.

If I had the money to order a 3rd wheel right now, I would not hesitate to order a V13.  Since I already have a long range wheel on the way to me I'd be happy to add a larger wheel with excellent power & speed and most likely reasonable range.  I see no reason at all why anyone would hold off ordering this wheel if it matches up with your use case and you are happy to part with the cash to own it.

[BKW]

16 minutes ago, MrMonoWheel said:

Yep, I have been ignoring him because everything he says is negative and pessimistic, doesn't add to the conversation at all. Like bro if you hate this wheel so much why are you in this thread.

He's just frustrated about the quality and safety of these wheels, which I think is granted. I think there is a place to voice your frustration, but I'm pretty sure we get it at this point. I don't want to discredit people from speaking their minds either. These companies should continue to improve their quality and safety measures, of course. But I won't belabor this point anymore in the near future. I really appreciate the excitement for upcoming wheels as well!

Edited December 24, 2022 by BKW

[LowFlyingSquirrel]

52 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Not really production versions. First production refers to first made for customers. Before that is concepts, prototypes, production model, but none of these would have been produced in a large scale production batch or process.

52 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Not really production versions. First production refers to first made for customers. Before that is concepts, prototypes, production model, but none of these would have been produced in a large scale production batch or process.

52 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Not really production versions. First production refers to first made for customers. Before that is concepts, prototypes, production model, but none of these would have been produced in a large scale production batch or process.

52 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Not really production versions. First production refers to first made for customers. Before that is concepts, prototypes, production model, but none of these would have been produced in a large scale production batch or process.

52 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Not really production versions. First production refers to first made for customers. Before that is concepts, prototypes, production model, but none of these would have been produced in a large scale production batch or process.

52 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

First batch would have been what the Chinese testers were playing with.

Second batch would have been what overseas testers got.

Not really production versions. First production refers to first made for customers. Before that is concepts, prototypes, production model, but none of these would have been produced in a large scale production batch or process.