Decreased battery life with the V10F

[scap]

I did a ride tonight with the local one wheel club. My unicycle should have more range and power than any of the one wheels but my battery was gone by the end of the ride (20 miles), we did stop along the way for people to charge up. I put my wheel on the charger for about an hour along the route as well. Finished with a single red bar. Wondering if the cells aren't ballanced. Has anyone taken apart the V10F and checked the battery cells. 

I need to check my pedals too. I am scraping a lot when I turn. These are supposed to have high pedals.

Only have 400 miles on the wheel need to open it up and do some maintenance I suppose. I have never opened it up tho. 

Edited January 9, 2020 by scap

[Meserias]

when you last time fully charge your V10F ?

charging fully should be done like this:
- check in application to be 100% charged
- led on charger it's green at least 2h more after turn green

[DjPanJan]

1 hour ago, scap said:

end of the ride (20 miles),

No problem i think is normal if you are heavy 20 miles is 32 Km if you have inclines or often aceleration deaceleration this distance looks normal to me. For long rides charge to 100% and balance battery. I give you example i have other city 8 km from my home i can ride to city center square with 99% battery with conservative ride style and other day with more "fun" ride style same place i am on 89%. Temperature surface tire preasure can have heavy inpact on range. Not open you unit is ok   

[Aneta]

Sounds like half of the battery disconnected? (I see in V10F teardown video that battery has 2 sets of wires, so it consists of 2 halves, even though physically it's one "banana"?) With 950Wh battery, 32km is 30Wh/km, which is ridiculously high (at least 2x the typical values).

PS. I think I'm mistaken, it's probably charging connector that I mistook for a second XT60 discharge connector.

Edited January 9, 2020 by Aneta

[mrelwood]

I would also first do a proper balancing charge, then check the tire pressure, and make more tests.

But before any more riding, check the pedals carefully! The V10F is known for a drooping pedal angle due to cracked or misformed pedals. Lots of discussion around. If they are indeed visibly cracked, I don’t think I’d go on the wheel until I had the pedals replaced. In a worst case scenario a V10F pedal has even teared staight off mid ride.

 

Quote

With 950Wh battery, 32km is 30Wh/km, which is ridiculously high (at least 2x the typical values).

I don’t know about yours, but for me 25-30Wh/km is typical. If it was a peaceful cruise, then sure, something’s not right. But I’d never dream of getting 30km on 475Wh, no matter how serene the ride. If it’s a 100kg rider having fun and showing off to those funny sideriders, it sounds perfectly normal to me.

Edited January 9, 2020 by mrelwood

[scap]

I'll do a full charge to 100% and do a range test this weekend to see how we do. As for the pedals I did inspect them and I didn't see any cracking but it does look like the pedal hangers may have been worn down maybe allowing some pedal droop. I'll post some pictures later to see if this is normal or if I should be concerned.

[scap]

8 hours ago, mrelwood said:

If it’s a 100kg rider having fun and showing off to those funny sideriders, it sounds perfectly normal to me.

lol ok sure I was riding one legged and going off curbs etc.. I probably wasn't in peaceful cruise mode. lol.

[scap]

[scap]

Does not look real droopy but I sure do scrape those peddles. Guess I just need to get better at turning without scraping. charged up to 100 today will keep on charger all day tomorrow and do a range test on saturday.

Edited January 10, 2020 by scap

[mrelwood]

While they are not pointing down, and the viewing perspective is different, they might be a good deal off from the angle they used to be when new:

 

[Unventor]

On 1/9/2020 at 8:30 AM, Meserias said:

when you last time fully charge your V10F ?

charging fully should be done like this:
- check in application to be 100% charged
- led on charger it's green at least 2h more after turn green

Don't only look at % look at look at voltage it reports. should be close to 84V at 100%. 

[DjPanJan]

84.42V in EUCWORLD for me after full ballance on my V10F 

Actualy my V10F is on  RMA my FAN is not hear at all i think not spining or i have bad termal sensor i duno. My V10F start overheating to 98/100 celsius.Outside temperature is  2 celsius on same route what i ride 30x minimal times with no problem. I hope service tell me something is wrong if they say all ok i be cry if they just "test" ride 300m with lightweight person and say all ok im in trap. I cant open myself my unit is sealed by original service if i open unit i lost my 2 years warranty and that i no want.  

 

Edited January 10, 2020 by DjPanJan
edit

[scap]

After letting it sit all night (I don't like to charge while everyone is sleeping call me paranoid but I worry about fires.) it was at 82.6. I have it back on the charger and will be monitoring it throughout the day. If it hits 84.42V does that mean it is all balanced and good to go or is that when I should keep it hooked up for a few hours. 

 

I may try to make some metal shims for the pedals. It looks like both the pedals and hangers have wear. Replacing the hangers sounds like a PITA.

[RockyTop]

Your other post may hold a clue. How cold was it? When it is cold the batteries will act slow to hand out power and show a low battery. 

[mrelwood]

 

1 hour ago, scap said:

If it hits 84.42V does that mean it is all balanced and good to go or is that when I should keep it hooked up for a few hours.

I would just time 2-4 hours from when the charger LED turns green. The measuring instruments on the wheels might not be precise enough to look at the voltage more closely than half a volt. The balancing will slowly continue for a very long time, but after a few hours it should be balanced enough for our purposes.

 

1 hour ago, scap said:

It looks like both the pedals and hangers have wear. Replacing the hangers sounds like a PITA.

What we learned from investigating drooping pedals on a local V10F, was that what looked like wear from outside of the pedal was actually deformation. There was a hump and visible cracks on the other side. The pedal structure really  is very thin where it leans on the pedal hanger.

Already 0.5mm thick steel shims would spread the pressure load and slow down the death of the pedals.

[scap]

it was pretty nice 60F...

[scap]

Been charging all day got to 82.7 v around noon and has just sat there for the last 9 hours. I dont think I will make it to 84v.

[DjPanJan]

8 hours ago, scap said:

Been charging all day got to 82.7 v around noon and has just sat there for the last 9 hours. I dont think I will make it to 84v.

Is clear now you charger is bad. You need new one.

Is good message you V10F is ok.   

[alcatraz]

Measure the voltage out from the charger.

If you want to be sure your battery is ok open it up and measure the balance terminals.

[Chriull]

11 hours ago, scap said:

Been charging all day got to 82.7 v around noon and has just sat there for the last 9 hours. I dont think I will make it to 84v.

 

3 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

Is clear now you charger is bad. You need new one.

Is good message you V10F is ok.   

Not necessarily. Could be be from some bad cells, too.

28 minutes ago, alcatraz said:

Measure the voltage out from the charger.

+1. First and easiest step to follow after these symptoms!

28 minutes ago, alcatraz said:

If you want to be sure your battery is ok open it up and measure the balance terminals.

Second step, if it's not the chargers fault.

[RockyTop]

On 1/10/2020 at 4:42 AM, scap said:

Does not look real droopy but I sure do scrape those peddles. Guess I just need to get better at turning without scraping. 

Everyone has a different preference and riding style. For me though, that pedal angel would be unacceptable. They have certainly dropped. pedal angle makes a big difference in pedal scrape. Unlike many I tend to prefer extreme high angled pedals.

[Chriull]

On 1/10/2020 at 10:42 AM, scap said:

Does not look real droopy but I sure do scrape those peddles. Guess I just need to get better at turning without scraping. 

 

2 minutes ago, RockyTop said:

Everyone has a different preference and riding style. For me though, that pedal angel would be unacceptable. They have certainly dropped. pedal angle makes a big difference in pedal scrape. Unlike many I tend to prefer extreme high angled pedals.

With motorbike riding there are two possible ways to take a corner - "road bike style" leaving the motorcycle quite upright and leaning ones body, so the motorcycle won't scrape - or "motocross style" pushing the motorcycle down and leave ones body upright.

From my experience i "naturally/subcunsiously" always use more the "motocross style" with my EUC - and by this scrape more easily.

I "tried to try" some times to shift my weight to the outer pedal while cornering, but always fail miserably by some mental blockade - but i'll go on trying to corner more "road bike style".

Real "road bike style" could be hard to accomplish (turning the outer feet spightly outwards, so one can bent his knee and lean inwards over the EUC ) but at least staying in a straight line with the EUC should greatly improve ground clearance!

[RockyTop]

9 minutes ago, Chriull said:

From my experience i "naturally/subcunsiously" always use more the "motocross style" with my EUC - and by this scrape more easily.

I "tried to try" some times to shift my weight to the outer pedal while cornering, but always fail miserably by some mental blockade - but i'll go on trying to corner more "road bike style".

Be careful . You will be depending on tire traction. Motocross style seems more natural to me and safer on dirt.  However on nice asphalt even at slow speeds being able to lean and twist brings a new level of flow and maneuverability. ........Vertigo comes to mind.    

I watch Chooch and Koji Rolls videos to see the physics in motion. I think you will find that Chooch shows advanced motocross skills and Koji Rolls depends heavily on road bike tire traction. 

[scap]

3 hours ago, Chriull said:

Measure the voltage out from the charger.

Did that it was 85V so the charger is likely ok. I think at this point I need to open it up an check the balance myself before I go on a ride. Anyone know of a good video showing how to do that?

Edit: I found this https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=disassembling+a+V10&view=detail&mid=EDAA3B5C0E4F9523BA2FEDAA3B5C0E4F9523BA2F&FORM=VIRE

Edited January 11, 2020 by scap

[Chriull]

1 hour ago, scap said:

Did that it was 85V so the charger is likely ok. I think at this point I need to open it up an check the balance myself before I go on a ride. Anyone know of a good video showing how to do that?

Edit: I found this https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=disassembling+a+V10&view=detail&mid=EDAA3B5C0E4F9523BA2FEDAA3B5C0E4F9523BA2F&FORM=VIRE

I'd assume the V10F has two battery packs? Could be that just one has bad cells and needs to be replaced/repaired.

So you could try to charge both sepwrately and see if one gets to 84V.