Gotway monster 22 inch or z10

[Phraggle]

I have an old gotway msuper( first gen,I think) and a ninebot one E+,I'm ready to go to the next level. The  ninebot only does 14 mph max(with beeps),and the msuper barely goes faster. It used to,I think I've managed 18 mph,but my phone that had the old gotway app died and I can't find the old app anywhere. I feel like I should have gotten more from the msuper,but even when I had the app,I couldn't make much sense of it. I thought I had it set to the fastest setting,but it seems like it should have done more than 18 mph. If someone has some insight to the the old app and the max speed of the first msuper,I'd appreciate it.

 Either way,I'm ready to go much faster and more off roading.  I'm torn between the new monster 22 inch and the ninebot z10. I've read a lot of reviews and comparisons,and there seem to be lots of love for both,but for different reasons. I have not rode either,my only experience is the 2 wheels I have. I like the immediacy of response in the ninebot,but I like the bigger tire and toughness of the msuper for off roading and really long rides.

 Has anyone ridden both,and would care to share their thoughts. Trail riding is my favorite, but by necessity I ride a lot of road miles too.

 And not nearly as important, but still curious, has anyone heard the bluetooth speakers on the new monster? Is it worth it? How much juice does it rob from the batteries? I like rocking music when I ride,I usually just clip my Wonderboom to my belt,but if the speakers are loud enough,it'll be one less thing to bring on the ride. Thanks guys!!

[FlyboyEUC]

Considering the track record of the Z10, I'd say go with the monster.

[ir_fuel]

It also depends on your definition of off roading. The Monster is quite a beast and for very technical slow sections it might not be the best choice, especially not if you have to walk with it if you really can't get through on the wheel. Faster sections it will probably do very well.

I also don't know how hard you have to lean in to it to do steep hills. 

I don't really consider the Z10 an off road beast either. TBH the wide tyre is more of a gimmick than something that actually improves off road handling. I have a Z10 but I take my KS16X to go off road.

[Phraggle]

Thanks ir_fuel. By off roading,I mean mountain bike single track trails, hiking/nature trails. I built a  mile or two of a pretty elaborate course in the woods behind my house too,jumps and barrel turns etc. that I certainly am exceeding the limits of the ninebot E+ on and my old Msuper does better on with the bigger tire,but is a bit of a dog with maneuverability. 

 Your the first person I've heard say that the fatty tire on the z10 isn't all it's made out to be,that's a valuable insight.  I've just seen lots of vids of it doing some great off roading and jumping with it and reviews saying it handles loose dirt and rough terrain well.

  What kind of range are you realistically getting on the Z10? I keep leaning towards the monster for the range  and 22 inch wheel,but Z10 owners are usually pretty convincing  about how awesome the wheels are.  I know the new monsters have flimsy shells,but I don't mind duct tape or how it looks as long as there's a dependable well engineered  motor and hardware underneath. Z10'ers seem to swear by theirs,and that it's a completely different kind of ride. That too is appealing, even if admittedly i only understand that in the abstract

[ir_fuel]

18 minutes ago, Phraggle said:

What kind of range are you realistically getting on the Z10?

Never did more than 25 miles (all on paved roads) and I had 40% battery left. That was with at that point a 175lbs rider weight including backpack. The Monster will take you a lot further.

It's quite possible it handles dirt and rough terrain well, but I would never claim it does it better than a lot of other wheels out there (the MSX to give one example).

The Z10 also has a pretty stiff tubeless tyre, so even with low pressures you'll feel the bumps a lot more.

I would get @Marty Backe to chime in. He will know best I think  

[Marty Backe]

29 minutes ago, Phraggle said:

Thanks ir_fuel. By off roading,I mean mountain bike single track trails, hiking/nature trails. I built a  mile or two of a pretty elaborate course in the woods behind my house too,jumps and barrel turns etc. that I certainly am exceeding the limits of the ninebot E+ on and my old Msuper does better on with the bigger tire,but is a bit of a dog with maneuverability. 

 Your the first person I've heard say that the fatty tire on the z10 isn't all it's made out to be,that's a valuable insight.  I've just seen lots of vids of it doing some great off roading and jumping with it and reviews saying it handles loose dirt and rough terrain well.

  What kind of range are you realistically getting on the Z10? I keep leaning towards the monster for the range  and 22 inch wheel,but Z10 owners are usually pretty convincing  about how awesome the wheels are.  I know the new monsters have flimsy shells,but I don't mind duct tape or how it looks as long as there's a dependable well engineered  motor and hardware underneath. Z10'ers seem to swear by theirs,and that it's a completely different kind of ride. That too is appealing, even if admittedly i only understand that in the abstract

I now consider the Z10 more of a specialty wheel and not the best general purpose. I love my Z10 and still ride it a lot, but am generally concerned regarding the lack of any after-sales support by Ninebot.

Regarding the tire, it absolutely loves loose sand, gravel, etc. Better than any other EUC available. Here's a video if mine that shows some trail conditions that the Z10 excels in. Checkout my Z10 Playlist for more videos of what it can do.

I'm not a jumper myself, but the only heavier wheel in existence is the Monster. And there are no supplied side pads for gripping the shell. I would think the Z10 is the worse wheel do doing jumping unless you are just talking about riding off the edge of something. But I avoid that with my wheels because of the stress put on the axles.

For pure off-roading excellence nothing beats the MSX.

[Marty Backe]

17 hours ago, Phraggle said:

I have an old gotway msuper( first gen,I think) and a ninebot one E+,I'm ready to go to the next level. The  ninebot only does 14 mph max(with beeps),and the msuper barely goes faster. It used to,I think I've managed 18 mph,but my phone that had the old gotway app died and I can't find the old app anywhere. I feel like I should have gotten more from the msuper,but even when I had the app,I couldn't make much sense of it. I thought I had it set to the fastest setting,but it seems like it should have done more than 18 mph. If someone has some insight to the the old app and the max speed of the first msuper,I'd appreciate it.

 Either way,I'm ready to go much faster and more off roading.  I'm torn between the new monster 22 inch and the ninebot z10. I've read a lot of reviews and comparisons,and there seem to be lots of love for both,but for different reasons. I have not rode either,my only experience is the 2 wheels I have. I like the immediacy of response in the ninebot,but I like the bigger tire and toughness of the msuper for off roading and really long rides.

 Has anyone ridden both,and would care to share their thoughts. Trail riding is my favorite, but by necessity I ride a lot of road miles too.

 And not nearly as important, but still curious, has anyone heard the bluetooth speakers on the new monster? Is it worth it? How much juice does it rob from the batteries? I like rocking music when I ride,I usually just clip my Wonderboom to my belt,but if the speakers are loud enough,it'll be one less thing to bring on the ride. Thanks guys!!

Trying to compare the Z10 to the Monster is just about meaningless. Totally different wheels.

But honestly, based on your description, I would highly recommend the Nikola Plus (or Nikola if you don't have the cash - but you do if you're considering the Monster). The Nikola is the best riding wheel that you can currently buy, handles trails wonderfully, and you won't lose the responsiveness that you desire..

[Darrell Wesh]

The Z10 tire is a gimmick for off road like @ir_fuel has said. My former MSX is much much better than the Z10 off road. I would rather take my Ks18s off road then my Z10. The wide tire just hits everything when you want to be technical and avoid everything. It’s really only good for gravel and sand. The pedals are too low so when you turn you’ll hit anything that’s sticking up on the trails. 

The Monster isn’t even in the question when you can get an MSX for less. Get the MSX for off road. 

[houseofjob]

@Phraggle I refuse to tell other people what wheel to get or put other wheel models in ppl's mouths that weren't mentioned, but I concur with the others, that these are not nearly the most ideal on the market for what you are describing in offroad/responsiveness, having owned both (albeit I am not an offroad guy FWIW).

Are you nowhere near other Texas riderships with known forum members like @Michael Vu or @Mike Paolini to possible try these wheels before you buy?

 

19 hours ago, Phraggle said:

And not nearly as important, but still curious, has anyone heard the bluetooth speakers on the new monster? Is it worth it? How much juice does it rob from the batteries? I like rocking music when I ride,I usually just clip my Wonderboom to my belt,but if the speakers are loud enough,it'll be one less thing to bring on the ride. Thanks guys!!

The power draw from EUC speakers in general is negligible IMHO, as the speakers they drive are very low wattage.

The V3 Monster speakers are the same speakers as the Nikola; they can get pretty loud but become very shrill at high volume (although while mounted on the wheel riding in noisier environments, this doesn't necessarily have to be a bad thing). Also, it's all highs & mids, no lows (makes sense as there is no crossover to a sub).

Edited August 20, 2019 by houseofjob

[erk1024]

20 hours ago, Phraggle said:

I have an old gotway msuper( first gen,I think) and a ninebot one E+,I'm ready to go to the next level.

The thing is, the Monster and the Z10 are NOT the obvious choices given your criteria. All of the newer wheels would get you to the "next level" (Nikola, 16X, 18XL, MSX, Monster) as they ALL go 30+ mph with very strong 2000W motors. For off-roading, probably the MSuperX is the one people use the most? That might change as the 16inch wheels have great torque and acceleration. So I think the guys on the forum are scratching their heads a bit, if the Monster and the Z10 are the only two they can choose from. 

As for the Monster, mine is sitting in a FedEx truck in Orlando at the moment, hopefully to get delivered on Wednesday.

 

Edited August 20, 2019 by erk1024

[Darrell Wesh]

The Nikola speakers are fantastic. You will not get bass out of any portable Bluetooth speakers especially at speed. I have one of the best portable Bluetooth speakers (Ultimate Ears Megablast) and even with two rocking in dual mode you’ll be disappointed playing any rap or hip hop music (if you’ve heard the songs before with a sub for reference) 

People have unrealistic expectations about bass outdoors. There’s a reason you need multiple 18” subwoofers with massive boxes to reproduce bass outdoors while indoors one small 12” can give you everything you want while watching a movie. 

The PA like projection of the speakers is amazing, loud and clear vocals. Don’t be fooled, even if YOU could hear bass while standing on top of the speakers, the people you pass can hear nothing except highs and mids, as bass volume falls off quickly the further the distance outdoors. And I imagine one of the reasons you want to play it loud is so other people can hear. 

The fact that I have two MEGABLAST speakers and never bring them with the Nikola should be testament enough that the speakers are adequate for cruising needs.

[houseofjob]

16 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

The Nikola speakers are fantastic. You will not get bass out of any portable Bluetooth speakers especially at speed. I have one of the best portable Bluetooth speakers (Ultimate Ears Megablast) and even with two rocking in dual mode you’ll be disappointed playing any rap or hip hop music (if you’ve heard the songs before with a sub for reference) 

People have unrealistic expectations about bass outdoors. There’s a reason you need multiple 18” subwoofers with massive boxes to reproduce bass outdoors while indoors one small 12” can give you everything you want while watching a movie. 

The PA like projection of the speakers is amazing, loud and clear vocals. Don’t be fooled, even if YOU could hear bass while standing on top of the speakers, the people you pass can hear nothing except highs and mids, as bass volume falls off quickly the further the distance outdoors. And I imagine one of the reasons you want to play it loud is so other people can hear. 

The fact that I have two MEGABLAST speakers and never bring them with the Nikola should be testament enough that the speakers are adequate for cruising needs.

Wait, but Timbaland said we can have wearable subwoofer backpacks now 

 

[Darrell Wesh]

2 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Wait, but Timbaland said we can have wearable subwoofer backpacks now 

 

Lmao. I would wear a sub backpack. Problem is a decent one would probably be heavy as hell and riding with that much weight behind you would make the EUC sluggish to accelerate. 

[erk1024]

4 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Problem is a decent one would probably be heavy as hell

Only 3.25 pounds with battery...

https://shop.subpac.com/products/m2x

[houseofjob]

2 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Lmao. I would wear a sub backpack. Problem is a decent one would probably be heavy as hell and riding with that much weight behind you would make the EUC sluggish to accelerate. 

But that 808 doe 

[Darrell Wesh]

5 minutes ago, erk1024 said:

Only 3.25 pounds with battery...

https://shop.subpac.com/products/m2x

It’s silent to the outside world. I definitely don’t want that. Any true basshead knows bass is meant to BE HEARD. A true subwoofer backpack would probably be like 30pounds and stick out behind you like a mofo (for the woofer to move air/large cabinet)

[ir_fuel]

6 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

And I imagine one of the reasons you want to play it loud is so other people can hear. 

But why?

[Michael Vu]

Thanks @houseofjob

@Phraggle Where in Texas are you? You're more than welcome to test ride all the wheels I have including the Monster. I don't have a Z10 though but I know a few guys around the Austin area that do.

[Phraggle]

@houseofjob I'm about 40 minutes outside Houston in Plantersville,right where the Texas Renaissance Festival is,near Magnolia. I do get out the Austin way now and again. I've got a lot of friends and some of my bandmates there. Thanks for the offer,I'll let you know when I'm out that way. It won't be for a bit,the fair here is gearing up to open in a month and a half,and I've got a lot of set up to do. If you happen to want to come to the fair ,I can hook you up with comp tickets and maybe we can ride out here as well.

 I haven't looked for local EUC groups,mostly cuz I'm out in the boonies and the closest would likely be Houston, but I'll check.

 I do have a big job to finish at Sherwood Forest Renaissance Festival near Paige ,outside of Bastrop, I don't know when yet,schedule is a bit packed right now,but I'll let you know.

 Thanks again!

[Phraggle]

Thanks for all the input guys,I've got a lot to think about,I'm still a month or two away from pulling the trigger on a new wheel,so I will likely have more questions.  This is the first forum I've joined and I'm already glad I have. One other thing to consider is ,where I live is very sandy, and I've been tossed more by loose sand than anything else,so I guess that's a pretty important concern. I just watched the video that @Marty Backe posted,and it seemed like the z10 handled that well. I have looked into the MSX,and I will check out the Nikola and others as well. I am certainly open to all suggestions and look forward to hearing from ya!

[Phraggle]

So,I tried the Gotway non social android app that Marty Backe linked and another dual language one someone else posted and I get to log in screen and it prompts me to type motor number,I've tried it both with the letters and numbers, and just the numbers and it keeps failing. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. It looks like the app I had on my old phone,but can't get past motor number registry,does anyone know how to navigate past this? I do remember having a hard time with that app on my old phone,but I can't remember if it was the same problem, or if it was,how I overcame it

[Marty Backe]

1 hour ago, Phraggle said:

So,I tried the Gotway non social android app that Marty Backe linked and another dual language one someone else posted and I get to log in screen and it prompts me to type motor number,I've tried it both with the letters and numbers, and just the numbers and it keeps failing. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. It looks like the app I had on my old phone,but can't get past motor number registry,does anyone know how to navigate past this? I do remember having a hard time with that app on my old phone,but I can't remember if it was the same problem, or if it was,how I overcame it

The non-social Gotway app does not require a motor number or any other kind of registration/login. Not sure what you're running 

[Phraggle]

It's definitely the one you posted,and it wants my phone number and motor number. I certainly appreciate your help and don't mean to frustrate, I swear! I had a hard time last time I loaded the old Gotway app as well. My Msuper is old( first gen),and I'm pretty sure the one you linked is the only one that'll work,I've tried all the newer gotway apps. You don't  happen to know what the max speed on the old Msupers is by chance? You seem pretty knowledgeable about different wheels.I think I've gotten mine to 18mph,but it seems like that big wheel should go faster,and that's the main reason I'm searching for the app so I can hopefully, with the help of this forum,get the most from my Msuper. 14 mph max on the ninebot 1E+,and currently not much more on the Msuper is frustratingly limiting my fun!

[Marty Backe]

26 minutes ago, Phraggle said:

It's definitely the one you posted,and it wants my phone number and motor number. I certainly appreciate your help and don't mean to frustrate, I swear! I had a hard time last time I loaded the old Gotway app as well. My Msuper is old( first gen),and I'm pretty sure the one you linked is the only one that'll work,I've tried all the newer gotway apps. You don't  happen to know what the max speed on the old Msupers is by chance? You seem pretty knowledgeable about different wheels.I think I've gotten mine to 18mph,but it seems like that big wheel should go faster,and that's the main reason I'm searching for the app so I can hopefully, with the help of this forum,get the most from my Msuper. 14 mph max on the ninebot 1E+,and currently not much more on the Msuper is frustratingly limiting my fun!

I guess I've posted multiple apps, but the Non-Social version by definition does not require any form of registration.