Why is everything EUC-related so darn expensive?

[BKW]

Hey guys, new here.

Why is everything EUC-related so expensive? And by 'expensive" I mean over-priced. The wheels are expensive, the parts are expensive, accessories like pads are expensive (over-priced), etc. Since when do plastic parts cost nearly 200 dollars? Or pedals cost nearly 300 dollars? Or cheap, thin, trolly arms cost 50 bucks? A charger, 100 dollars? On top of that, they want you to pay for shipping too

I say all this somewhat jokingly, but at the same time the prices are very high. Just want to get your guys' thoughts on this.

BTW, I live in Manhattan. Started riding about a month ago with my KS16x. Already broke the trolly arm

[OldFartRides]

Welcome to the forum.
You already know the answer to the question….

Everything  is expensive these days. Especially luxury items. 

Best,

[RockyTop]

Custom production, An actual factory could not make money on accessories because of the limited quantity needed. Smaller providers don’t have the benefit of mass production techniques. And time. By the time an accessory was developed properly the needs would have moved on to another EUC.

Edited December 27, 2021 by RockyTop

[Scubadragonsan]

I've been scuba diving all my life. Every darn thing in scuba diving is expensive. Initial investment could be about $3,000 or more these days. Without saying, diving gadgets are enormously expensive like underwater scooter $3000, underwater GPS $1000, dive computer $1000, to name a few. Like diving, EUC is a minority "elite" sports. Its target market is a niche market. EUCs are not really for kids. Most parents can't afford $2000 on EUCs for their kids. A $150 skateboard is more a preference. You think EUCs are expensive in the US. Check the prices that Europeans have to pay. After all, they are made in China with cheaper labor. Can you imagine if they are made in the good old USA? When will their prices come down? Two factors: Gain in popularity and volume sales. Will popularity rise? I haven't seen that. Neither have I seen huge volume sales. EUCs also are competing with many other alternatives such as e-scooter, electric skateboards, ebikes... Who wins? So far, not EUCs. In some way, I like to remain the "elite" minority!

[BKW]

Rocky, you make a good point. People that make custom pads, I can understand the prices there, mainly because of what you've said. I should probably do more research into the sales of bigger companies to get a better idea

[BKW]

Subagragonsan, you make some great points! Hm, I suppose I'm more accustomed to more mass-produced and less "elite" hobbies. Some things to think about...

[Paradox]

So riding a month?  Have you pre-ordered your second wheel yet?    If not,  you will!

[Mayhem]

Welcome to the world of EUC. Clearly What no one told you is that the “E” stands for EXPENSIVE lol…. 

as scubadragonsan touched on, this is a minority elite hobby. Wheels come from overseas and so do the parts. While I do agree that some things are heavily over priced (pads, bumpers & pedals) and then shipping on top of that. Prices quickly add up. 
 

Just look at the prIces of wheels themselves compared to prices 2 years ago. Wheels are now releasing at near $4k and the pricing isn’t going down anytime soon as long as people keep paying these absurd amounts. 

[Mayhem]

7 minutes ago, Paradox said:

So riding a month?  Have you pre-ordered your second wheel yet?    If not,  you will!

16x and in nyc.. he’s already looking at something faster 100%

[.....]

Suppply and demand, mixed with greed. I sell pads at a whopping $65 shipped, but I'm still a long way from breaking even. Some acessories seem expensive because they arent mass produced and are made of quality materials. Typically the mass produced stuff from China is simply greed. You think eucs are expensive, go price out a paramotor or a simple cloth wing. Niche hobbies + rich people = expensive If we wouldnt pay it, they wouldnt charge us so much. We're a long way from the days when I kid can barely afford a bicycle.

Edited December 27, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[meepmeepmayer]

It's a very small market, and also the manufacturers price gouge on occasion to get a financial cushion. It's both justified and not. Mostly justified.

[.....]

3 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

It's a very small market, and also the manufacturers price gouge on occasion to get a financial cushion. It's both justified and not. Mostly justified.

Imagine the price hike if these Chinese companies had to worry about insurance and product liability.

[BKW]

Yeah, I didn't want to seem like I was making a big fuss about it since I'm new here, but they are over-priced in my opinion. And while I live in manhattan, my income is on the lower side -- I just am frugal with money and spend big-priced items sparingly.

According to EUC World app, I've done about 338 miles so far. I usually am not riding too much above 20mph, and haven't done 30mph yet. I'm fine with that here and don't feel the need to go faster. Eventually, I'm sure I'll want another wheel but 4K seems way too expensive for my tastes.

[.....]

7 minutes ago, bkw said:

but 4K seems way too expensive for my tastes.

it aint just YOUR tastes. $4k is absurdly expensive. Im in my 40's and $4k is more than I've ever spent on a car. Hell, my supermoto was around $4k, and it makes euc quality a laughable attrocity. Combined with the fact that these machines have batteries with a shelf life, yet my moto will still be fine for another 15 years... yeah, we are being robbed. Of course you do know that being an owner of an euc, pretty much ruins your credibility to claim you are poor

Fwiw, youll learn VERY quickly: the 16x isnt  a distance speed wheel. Be VERY cautious when riding it around its top speed(27mph actual). Theres been mention that the 16x has a slight discrepancy with power when its running near its max.

Edited December 27, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[BKW]

2 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said:

it aint just YOUR tastes. $4k is absurdly expensive. Im in my 40's and $4k is more than I've ever spent on a car. Hell, my supermoto was around $4k, and it makes euc quality a laughable attrocity. Combined with the fact that these machines have batteries with a shelf life, yet my moto will still be fine for another 15 years... yeah, we are being robbed. Of course you do know that being an owner of an euc, pretty much ruins your credibility to claim you are poor

Fwiw, youll learn VERY quickly: the 16x isnt  a distance speed wheel. Be VERY cautious when riding it around its top speed(27mph actual). Theres been mention that the 16x has a slight discrepancy with power when its running near its max.

Well, I'm happy I'm not alone in thinking this!

Noted with the 16x and speed discrepancy!

Edited December 27, 2021 by bkw

[supercurio]

Yes EUCs and their many accessories can be expensive, no doubt about that.

A few additional factors for why:

• EUCs require powerful motors, advanced controller and big batteries. Usually surpassing ebikes and electric scooters, which often (but not always) provide lower capacities and basic squarewave controllers instead for the same money
• A worldwide shortage of components and supply chain congestion lead to manufacturers having more demand than they can produce: it increased the price of the wheels dramatically in the last 12 months
• Inflation. Lots of dollars have been printed since the pandemic start
• our perception of what "standard" EUC specs, performances and quality keeps shifting up. It pushes the prices up at the same time.

Fortunately there's a 2nd hand market with capable wheels being sold to compensate a bit.

[meepmeepmayer]

1 hour ago, bkw said:

but they are over-priced in my opinion

You are absolutely right. Given for what you get for the money (e.g. compare to a motor scooter), EUCs are definitely overpriced. The manufacturers still aren't swimming in money, though. Maybe calling EUCs a boutique industry is correct.

1 hour ago, ShanesPlanet said:

$4k is absurdly expensive.

Yep!!

35 minutes ago, supercurio said:

EUCs require powerful motors, advanced controller and big batteries. Usually surpassing ebikes and electric scooters, which often (but not always) provide lower capacities and basic squarewave controllers instead for the same money

This is a very good point. Spec-wise, EUCs blow any other electric ridable out of the water. Battery sizes, motors, etc.

-

Prices are too high, but mostly fair.

[Tawpie]

2 hours ago, bkw said:

Noted with the 16x and speed dependency

Keep it at 20 mph and you'll cruise for a very very long time! Know your equipment—KingSong has yet to make a 'speed' wheel, and the max speed they quote for our 16Xs is pushing it quite a bit.

I think EUCs are expensive because they're so much fun. They win the smiles per mile contest, no question.

Edited December 27, 2021 by Tawpie

[BKW]

17 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

Keep it at 20 mph and you'll cruise for a very very long time! Know your equipment—KingSong has yet to make a 'speed' wheel, and the max speed they quote for our 16Xs is pushing it quite a bit.

I think EUCs are expensive because they're so much fun. They win the smiles per mile contest, no question.

Thank you for your response.

I've been wanting to ask about the 16X: At what point does the battery level become cutout territory? I know the 16X has a speed throttle after 50%, but at what point of the battery life should I be extra careful not to push it too hard to cause a cutout? My thoughts are anything under 30% I should be extra careful but I don't know the wheel well enough yet.

[supercurio]

12 minutes ago, bkw said:

Thank you for your response.

I've been wanting to ask about the 16X: At what point does the battery level become cutout territory? I know the 16X has a speed throttle after 50%, but at what point of the battery life should I be extra careful not to push it too hard to cause a cutout? My thoughts are anything under 30% I should be extra careful but I don't know the wheel well enough yet.

Unpleasant answer: anything below.. 90-80%

Generally, the 16X beeps are pretty close to where the pedals will dip forward, which is recoverable if you're lucky, or you'll wipe out if you don't.
The wheel is pretty strong at low speeds but it's easy to pedal dip at 70% battery above 25-30 kph.

And since it's a wheel which accelerates effortlessly, you get to these speeds nearly instantly so it's best to not ride too aggressively on the street - compared to other wheels.

Sometimes the beeps are delayed a little bit and come after the pedals started dipping.
For this reason I recommend using EUC World and setting an extra alarm at 6-10% remaining margin. So you'll get that much more extra safety margin, which will bring it more in line with Inmotion/Gotway margins.

Its quite something off-road tho!

Edited December 27, 2021 by supercurio

[wheel-life]

27 minutes ago, bkw said:

Thank you for your response.

I've been wanting to ask about the 16X: At what point does the battery level become cutout territory? I know the 16X has a speed throttle after 50%, but at what point of the battery life should I be extra careful not to push it too hard to cause a cutout? My thoughts are anything under 30% I should be extra careful but I don't know the wheel well enough yet.

One of the nice features of an euc.world membership for KS wheels is seeing your minimum safety margin after each ride. fwiw, lowest I've hit on mine was 6% I think. Most of the time I'd be around 15-20% minimum after each ride. i'm 220 lbs geared up and kept my top speed around 40-42 km/h (no power pads).

[supercurio]

4 minutes ago, wheel-life said:

One of the nice features of an euc.world membership for KS wheels is seeing your minimum safety margin after each ride. fwiw, lowest I've hit on mine was 6% I think. Most of the time I'd be around 15-20% minimum after each ride. i'm 220 lbs geared up and kept my top speed around 40-42 km/h (no power pads).

Oh haha that's very good of you, mine is typically below that, maybe an exception at 6% here, 3% there, -1% (beyond beeps) here or there

[wheel-life]

2 minutes ago, supercurio said:

Oh haha that's very good of you, mine is typically below that, maybe an exception at 6% here, 3% there, -1% (beyond beeps) here or there

eesh, that's bold! i wasn't thrilled with single digits, didn't like the idea of being that close to a cutoff...thought it would be smart moving to the V12, oops

[supercurio]

To come back to the topic of expensive by the way @bkw, one area where some beginners try to avoid the expenses is gear.

But then this can happen (not me).

Effective gear is not necessarily high-end expensive stuff, but absolutely necessary - and it's a bit more a requirement than for bike/ebike/e-scooter.

 

[Unventor]

5 hours ago, bkw said:

Hey guys, new here.

Why is everything EUC-related so expensive? And by 'expensive" I mean over-priced. The wheels are expensive, the parts are expensive, accessories like pads are expensive (over-priced), etc. Since when do plastic parts cost nearly 200 dollars? Or pedals cost nearly 300 dollars? Or cheap, thin, trolly arms cost 50 bucks? A charger, 100 dollars? On top of that, they want you to pay for shipping too

I say all this somewhat jokingly, but at the same time the prices are very high. Just want to get your guys' thoughts on this.

BTW, I live in Manhattan. Started riding about a month ago with my KS16x. Already broke the trolly arm

In general spare parts are expensive no matter what business. Unless you can use general items. 

This comes now to handling and transport cost. 

Then you can add tax and profit on top of this. 

Now the past year or so logistics costs are going up in a mind blowing rate. Before the pandemic we paid a base cost. After one year it is x4 higher now it it x9 higher cost. This is in IT business but since there is only so much spare on container ships it effects every one. 

As others have said EUC have many special parts and some are pricy. On the other hand I found an EUC to be better value than a e-bicycle. And more convenient in most use cases. But to get cheeper prices sale volumes need to go up. Also these are built by hand and not by robots like car industry. So a fair bit of labour goes into this. Development cost is being shared over relative few units and it is racing ahead with mind blowing speed. Big wheels when I started like V8 is good as last mile but most here use their EUC as full commuter option or pleasure ride on long adventure cruises. 

I doubt we will see prices go down in near future. But that is my prediction for most things. Supply and demand and raw materials just makes cost goes up.