Inmotion V13 Speculation

[Robse]

5 hours ago, rebeuc said:

It's here! Kuji published his full review!

 

Weird review. Kuji doesn't seem to have fun at all.

[Mango]

Whatever the case, I think the V13 will do very well with the general, non-influencer, non-social media rider who is looking for the best all-around hyper performance euc.

Kuji definitely showcased its prowess and build quality. The safety and battery features alone will sway the majority of riders to the V13.

[alex5454]

Hi Guys, i think the V13 will be the best wheel ever built it wins over everything... the only problem is the 3K WH battery too small.

[Paul A]

Maybe EcoDrift will do a more in depth tear down/review.

[MrMonoWheel]

45 minutes ago, Paul A said:

 

Ssssh.....spoiler alert.....maybe let others vote on it without any bias of knowing what others' think....

People can be influenced.

Be interesting to see what the poll is, in a week's time.

I didn't think it was a big deal, plus most people are pretty set with their decision and are voting for that reason. 

 

22 minutes ago, Robse said:

buy it and sell it anyway. $3300 is a very "saleable" price 😉

Ehhh I'm not sure if it's worth the trouble, unless I can make a decent profit. I'll think about it.

 

7 minutes ago, Mango said:

Whatever the case, I think the V13 will do very well with the general, non-influencer, non-social media rider who is looking for the best all-around hyper performance euc.

Kuji definitely showcased its prowess and build quality. The safety and battery features alone will sway the majority of riders to the V13.

The v13 definitely does not strike me as an all around wheel. 

[That Guy]

57 minutes ago, Robse said:

Weird review. Kuji doesn't seem to have fun at all.

Totally. Almost cringy at a couple of points (when he's saying "let's put the usual music for acceleration testing" or something like that...).

[Freeforester]

Well, now we know why it’s called the Challenger, it seems that one of the world’s best known and loved influencers found it to be a ‘challenger’ in some respects at least (tech trails, low speed manoeuvrability, lifting, non-suspension mode performance…) but I enjoyed his take on this landmark wheel very much, despite his somewhat obvious less than effusive nod to the actual product. 
 

I’ve no doubt it’ll be a great seller, solid and mostly reliable, fast and planted over the distance it will cover, albeit perhaps not so quick off the mark for other less able riders, but few would argue as to the build quality of the wheel. Whether or not it’s got that ‘sweet spot’/X-factor will be determined over time, but there’s plenty to like, if not actually be crazy mad about. My main observation was surrounding the vulnerability of the bottom of the suspension rods/cylinders, which to my mind seemed to be rather more vulnerable than the Sh -S’s battery wires in a similar place, but it’ll sure be interesting to see them both compared head to head in a future review, hopefully covering their respective performance in all the common criteria.

Thanks Kuji, we owe you!   There’s going to be renewed interest in those vintage ‘Asics Onitsuka Tiger Mexico Tokyo mid runners’ and Ray-bans come springtime!

[BKW]

V13 is best suited for a cruiser wheel that can handle bumps, but the battery is less than some on the market

[UPONIT]

3 hours ago, MrMonoWheel said:

Alright I just watched the video, and I have to say I'm pretty damn disappointed. This didn't really show us anything we didn't already know about the wheel, and the thought that kept coming into my mind is that this was a showcase much more than a review. The difference? A showcase shows all the features and functions of the wheel where a review would actually have an ounce of criticality. 

The most critical thing he said was that its a bit heavy, so it takes more to maneuver, nothing we already didn't know. Now I'm not saying he's being heavily influenced (even though he's literally sponsored by inmotion), maybe he was just very excited about the wheel. But I get a strong feeling that the sponsorship had a lot to do with the general "tone" of the video.

Now for my thoughts. This is the most technologically advanced wheel every produced. The screen, lights, motherboard design, safety features, smart BMS, IP rating, insane free spin speed, and very high power motor all make this one of the safest and most reliable wheels ever made.

However. This is one massive wheel. The inertia from the motor alone makes this want to stand upright when at speed, not a very comfortable feeling. The "forehead" of the wheel (everything above the tire) is very tall and again makes it rather unwieldy.

And now my biggest gripe (and fear) was confirmed. The suspension is the same thing as the V11. In his video you can already see the rails at the bottom wearing from the sliders. Furthermore, the rails stick down so far that I am certain any offroading will lead to their destruction (just like on the v11). It does have some sort of damping system, but it really did not seem to do much at all. When he ride down stairs or bumps the wheel made the exact same clunky bottoming-out noise as my clapped out v11. 

My conclusion. This wheel is perfect for someone who rides 95% street for commuting. The weight and size makes it extremely stable, almost like a mini motorcycle. The suspension will be adequate in the street as well. This wheel is not for anyone who does mixed riding, rough terrain, trails, or slower speed stuff. The suspension is not set up for anything more than absorbing small bumps on the street. The weight of the wheel and tall profile make off-road riding and slow speed maneuvers a pain. 

Final thoughts. This is a very technologically advanced wheel, and will push the market in the direction of better builds, more safety, and more features. However this particular wheel is not for me. Mainly due to the suspension, size, and weight. I will be cancelling my order and sticking to the Sherman S. Maybe in a year or two inmotion will make a smaller wheel with these added features and finally upgrade their suspension. Then I will be back.

I'm really surprised you were disappointed. But I get that it must be crazy frustrating to have to make purchase decisions without getting to test drive anything first, and having to watch every second of a video review like a hawk to get info you need. I live 5 min from AR, so I will eventually get to see V13 in person. Not true with the other contender, Sher-S, because of exclusivity agreement, so I have to cross my fingers that I come across a local who has one at some point.

Note before proceeding: Almost everything I ever post on this forum should be viewed as a question, not a statement, even if there aren't question marks.

When I watched Kuji's video, my brain substituted "power" everytime he said "speed." V13 looks to have PLENTY. Steep hills here should be cake. Check!

Over-engineered. Build quality looks top-notch. I like the minimalist body design. When he taps on the body, it sounds SOLID. Durable. Water resistance. Check!

I don't have to carry it up stairs unless I want to, so the weight is... unavoidable? I'm sure InMotion did everything they could to keep it down. Things just have mass. Handling isn't super nimble, but that's not its wheelhouse (HA!) He's a pretty lean guy and manages to throw it around. He's also super skilled... Neutral

My use case: I won't ever need high speed. It's nice to know it's there as overhead. I'll likely NEVER do crazy MTB trails and jumps. If I ever get to the point where I need a different wheel to do that kind of thing, I'd be so surprised and thrilled it wouldn't be a problem. Long rides on terrible streets and light off-roading is my usage. Check!

About the suspension: Admission: 90% of the time I ride V11 with the suspension deflated. First, for the reason Hsiang suggests new riders start without suspension: i want to learn how to handle rough crap without it first. Second, lower COG has been easier to learn on.

I read your post before watching the video, so I was really paying attention to suspension portions. Random thoughts:

Starting at 8:15, there's a section showing "rough" terrain and it looks like the wheel is absorbing everything and the frame and rider are super stable. Is that an illusion from action cam stabilization? If not, isn't that exactly what a suspension is supposed to do?

The easily adjustable dampening using a tool seems like a massive improvement? I like that suspension is modular/removable, so if I found the transition hard to learn, I could start out suspensionless.

It does look like it bottoms out in a couple places, but those are PRETTY HIGH drops, right? I doubt I'll ever find the need for all that? Also, it handles them well? Also, couldn't he increase the psi to avoid it? From the perspective of not much suspension experience on anything less than 4 wheels, it didn't "look" bad enough to cross off the list without trying it out?

Well at least you'll get first hand experience on the Sherman and be able to pass along what you learn. Thanks for the thoughtful assessment!

[UPONIT]

3 hours ago, Paul A said:

WrongWay is conducting an informal poll on his YT channel.

 

https://www.youtube.com/@mr_wrongway/community

 

Why is he trying so hard to change the name to GyroWheel? Language doesn't work like that. "EUC" isn't an acronym and it avoids saying unicycle anyway.

[CrabChampion]

1 minute ago, UPONIT said:

Why is he trying so hard to change the name to GyroWheel? Language doesn't work like that. "EUC" isn't an acronym and it avoids saying unicycle anyway.

Feel like he is just trying to be quirky and go against the grain. I honestly think gyrowheel sounds wack and even nerdier than EUCs already make us look. Ill stick to calling it EUC. Even monowheel is ok

That poll is interesting though. I knew those harping about the sherman-s "quality" were mostly fanboys. The v13 is objectively more quality and has more safety features than the sherman-s. So where are all those "safety" guys now? Its fine to like the sherman-s for different reasons, but when your reasons are "quality above all else" and you vote for a wheel with no smart bms over the v13 that does... Clearly some bias going on that they dont like to admit lol

[UPONIT]

How high a jump does somebody need to do before a suspension is considered adequate? He did at least 3 or 4 three-foot drops and several stairs without pogo sticking or denting a rim? Does a lot of experience allow you to be able to tell from a video how good the suspension is without trying it in person? Granted, video is the only option for most buyers...   Thoughts?

Also, regarding suspension noise on this and every other vehicle: Don't suspensions just make noise by their nature? I mean a "clank" is bad, but things... make noise. Compared to leaf springs on a 22 ton Engine, EUC suspensions are pretty silent.

Also, Also: Did he really seem like he was being held at gunpoint by InMotion PR Team?!? Could he just be trying to make a more polished, less balls-to-the-wall type of review? He's critical in spots.

Seems like he was trying to assess the wheel according to its own intended purpose, rather than comparing it to the imaginary ideal: a 50 lb indestructible EUC that breaks the sound barrier for 400 miles between charges and feels like floating on a cloud.

Edited December 11, 2022 by UPONIT
More thinking, more questions

[Punxatawneyjoe]

5 minutes ago, UPONIT said:

How high a jump does somebody need to do before a suspension is considered adequate?

I was thinking the same thing after reading some others posts after the review. I also went back and watched it several times as well as watch a bunch of sherman s reviews. I think as far as the functionality of the suspension, its spectacular. i don't love the design with the struts sticking down below like that but i have ridden my v11 off road for over 800mi now and it honestly just needs that 1" or 2" more to clear some pretty substantial rocks. It's been pretty much maintenance free since i got it. I have over 1k miles now and have only checked the air pressure in it 3 times now with no leakage. Sure it "clanks" when it bottoms out but doesn't every suspension? I also went back and watched a few other reviews from Kuji that i hadn't seen before to judge his impartiality and it does seem he's hesitant to overly criticize the wheel but doesn't really seem any more/less exited than his other reviews. This is all just my opinion and it should be taken with a grain of salt since i have 1,200 total miles on euc's and have only tried 2 types both inmotion...so there's that.

[UPONIT]

28 minutes ago, Cobaltsaber said:

Feel like he is just trying to be quirky and go against the grain. I honestly think gyrowheel sounds wack and even nerdier than EUCs already make us look. Ill stick to calling it EUC. Even monowheel is ok

Yup. Gyrowheel sounds like food at a carnival. Monowheel is too general, plus sounds like "monorail" which The Simpsons killed long ago...

[UPONIT]

12 minutes ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

I was thinking the same thing after reading some others posts after the review. I also went back and watched it several times as well as watch a bunch of sherman s reviews. I think as far as the functionality of the suspension, its spectacular. i don't love the design with the struts sticking down below like that but i have ridden my v11 off road for over 800mi now and it honestly just needs that 1" or 2" more to clear some pretty substantial rocks. It's been pretty much maintenance free since i got it. I have over 1k miles now and have only checked the air pressure in it 3 times now with no leakage. Sure it "clanks" when it bottoms out but doesn't every suspension? I also went back and watched a few other reviews from Kuji that i hadn't seen before to judge his impartiality and it does seem he's hesitant to overly criticize the wheel but doesn't really seem any more/less exited than his other reviews. This is all just my opinion and it should be taken with a grain of salt since i have 1,200 total miles on euc's and have only tried 2 types both inmotion...so there's that.

AND AND AND:

InMotion has already made hints they are developing a new "smaller" EUC of some sort. Maybe they are legit trying to be a REAL vehicle maker, with a focused line-up. Like a flagship trackable model, a luxury sedan, and an SUV, all made well, packaged and distributed professionally and supported competently? You know what I'm trying to say...

I'm still happy to wait until hidden bugs are worked out, if any. But they really seem to have put a LOT of effort into making this a safe, durable VEHICLE rather than a toy. I'd be happy to support that even if it didn't seem to fit my use case so well...

But the Sherman S also has a lot going for it.

Edited December 11, 2022 by UPONIT
logorrhea

[onizukagto]

I like how no one mentioned that the V13 had a faster acceleration than the Master Pro. 

Sure kujiroll mentioned something about "60km in the fun zone". But I want to see an average speed close to the max doing that distance on camera. 

It's supposed to be a cruiser and with all that body size headroom, I expect videos. So I can watch. And judge with pessimism from my armchair. 

[Chucka Wheelie]

I just love how inMotion was just sitting quietly in the background confident about their product and just let the others show off their tacked on models.  Guess Begode had to get ahead of it.  

 

Begode die hards will bitch about the range but I certainly won't be fanging @ 89kmh around the city.  It'll be nice to have that head room but going 89-90kmh around where I live will only get this banned.   

 

Just to be that Karen voice for those who are getting it (which includes me).  Just use this speed capability wisely.  This is can easily fall to disastrous press if someone falls and hurts themselves and a pedestrian along the way. Then we're all F**KED.   Think uncle Ben from spiderman.    Okay Okay Okay!  Lecture over... soz. 

[KiwiMark]

I can't help wondering what the range would be if riding 40-60kph.  I suspect it would be a pretty decent range, especially if the range is 60km when riding MUCH faster.  Around the city I live in the most common speed limit is 50kph, so if I ride on the road I could easily get away with travelling at 40-60kph, but not at 70-90kph.

[Chucka Wheelie]

10 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

I can't help wondering what the range would be if riding 40-60kph.  I suspect it would be a pretty decent range, especially if the range is 60km when riding MUCH faster.  Around the city I live in the most common speed limit is 50kph, so if I ride on the road I could easily get away with travelling at 40-60kph, but not at 70-90kph.

From what he's telling us, fanging it at 70-90kmh gives him 60ishKMs then you're probably gonna eek out about 80-90km going between 40-60kmh.   Now saying this... Kuji's review is only the first of many to come.  I think a clearer picture will emerge when other EUC reviewers make their case.  Jack of Electric Dreams has always been the no nonsense on his reviews so temper that with Kuji's and go from there. 

[Freeforester]

2 hours ago, UPONIT said:

Why is he trying so hard to change the name to GyroWheel? Language doesn't work like that. "EUC" isn't an acronym and it avoids saying unicycle anyway.

We might be in danger of becoming the fabled ‘Two cultures separated by a common language’ here! If EUC isn’t an acronym, then wtf is it, lol? Should we ‘wiki’ it? 😆

Speaking of cultures, it may be the case that Europeans have more of a  leaning toward the term gyrowheel (gyro from gyroscope, the clever/‘magic’ bit that, in new electrotech form helps keeps the wheel upright), also the term ‘giroroue’ (gyrowheel) is the common description in France and French speaking European countries though quite possibly excepting French speaking Canada, IDK - see what he did there? 😆

Anyway, I’m sure we can gauge the feeling of the wider community by conducting a poll….oh, wait…
 

 

Edited December 12, 2022 by Freeforester

[Robse]

2 minutes ago, Freeforester said:

😆

 

Anyway, I’m sure we can gauge the feeling of the wider community by conducting a poll….oh, wait…
 

 

I vote for the Danish version because it will be easy to remember:  Ethjulet selvbalancerende elektrisk cykel

 

Goodnight

[Eyss]

Not sure why people are surprised about Kujis video. It's exactly what I expected and seems in line with his previous videos.

It's a big wheel and I don't think you should compare the Sherman s to the v13. The Sherman s is going to be much more nimble and the v13 is going to be better at speed and have more stability in general. 

Inmotion have clearly shown they are focused on safety and are avoiding the same debacle as the v12. 

 

Weight will be interesting. People said the hero was too heavy for MTB trails but it works very well. 

I'm keen to take it on some dirt bike / adventure bike trails. 

[MrMonoWheel]

4 hours ago, UPONIT said:

I'm really surprised you were disappointed. But I get that it must be crazy frustrating to have to make purchase decisions without getting to test drive anything first, and having to watch every second of a video review like a hawk to get info you need. I live 5 min from AR, so I will eventually get to see V13 in person. Not true with the other contender, Sher-S, because of exclusivity agreement, so I have to cross my fingers that I come across a local who has one at some point.

Note before proceeding: Almost everything I ever post on this forum should be viewed as a question, not a statement, even if there aren't question marks.

When I watched Kuji's video, my brain substituted "power" everytime he said "speed." V13 looks to have PLENTY. Steep hills here should be cake. Check!

Over-engineered. Build quality looks top-notch. I like the minimalist body design. When he taps on the body, it sounds SOLID. Durable. Water resistance. Check!

I don't have to carry it up stairs unless I want to, so the weight is... unavoidable? I'm sure InMotion did everything they could to keep it down. Things just have mass. Handling isn't super nimble, but that's not its wheelhouse (HA!) He's a pretty lean guy and manages to throw it around. He's also super skilled... Neutral

My use case: I won't ever need high speed. It's nice to know it's there as overhead. I'll likely NEVER do crazy MTB trails and jumps. If I ever get to the point where I need a different wheel to do that kind of thing, I'd be so surprised and thrilled it wouldn't be a problem. Long rides on terrible streets and light off-roading is my usage. Check!

About the suspension: Admission: 90% of the time I ride V11 with the suspension deflated. First, for the reason Hsiang suggests new riders start without suspension: i want to learn how to handle rough crap without it first. Second, lower COG has been easier to learn on.

I read your post before watching the video, so I was really paying attention to suspension portions. Random thoughts:

Starting at 8:15, there's a section showing "rough" terrain and it looks like the wheel is absorbing everything and the frame and rider are super stable. Is that an illusion from action cam stabilization? If not, isn't that exactly what a suspension is supposed to do?

The easily adjustable dampening using a tool seems like a massive improvement? I like that suspension is modular/removable, so if I found the transition hard to learn, I could start out suspensionless.

It does look like it bottoms out in a couple places, but those are PRETTY HIGH drops, right? I doubt I'll ever find the need for all that? Also, it handles them well? Also, couldn't he increase the psi to avoid it? From the perspective of not much suspension experience on anything less than 4 wheels, it didn't "look" bad enough to cross off the list without trying it out?

Well at least you'll get first hand experience on the Sherman and be able to pass along what you learn. Thanks for the thoughtful assessment!

I agree with all of your points including the suspension one, but theres a key element missing. When the suspension is new and clean I am sure it works much better than the V11s, and is plenty smooth for a street cruiser. However my problem is mainly with the fact that is uses the same plastic-slider-on-rail design as the V11, a system that (in my experience) very quickly gets dirty and stiff, not to mention the inevitable clunking when the sliders wear. So I guess my issues is with how inconsistent it is over time. Starts out great and smooth, 200 miles later its stiff and sticky. Something that I still haven't been able to avoid with my V11 even when I only ride street.

 

3 hours ago, Cobaltsaber said:

Feel like he is just trying to be quirky and go against the grain. I honestly think gyrowheel sounds wack and even nerdier than EUCs already make us look. Ill stick to calling it EUC. Even monowheel is ok

That poll is interesting though. I knew those harping about the sherman-s "quality" were mostly fanboys. The v13 is objectively more quality and has more safety features than the sherman-s. So where are all those "safety" guys now? Its fine to like the sherman-s for different reasons, but when your reasons are "quality above all else" and you vote for a wheel with no smart bms over the v13 that does... Clearly some bias going on that they dont like to admit lol

Yeah Im not sure what that quality thing is about, some people just have blind loyalty. Ive been well aware since day 1 that the InMotion will have far superior build quality and safety to every other wheel out there.

 

3 hours ago, UPONIT said:

How high a jump does somebody need to do before a suspension is considered adequate? He did at least 3 or 4 three-foot drops and several stairs without pogo sticking or denting a rim? Does a lot of experience allow you to be able to tell from a video how good the suspension is without trying it in person? Granted, video is the only option for most buyers...   Thoughts?

Also, regarding suspension noise on this and every other vehicle: Don't suspensions just make noise by their nature? I mean a "clank" is bad, but things... make noise. Compared to leaf springs on a 22 ton Engine, EUC suspensions are pretty silent.

Also, Also: Did he really seem like he was being held at gunpoint by InMotion PR Team?!? Could he just be trying to make a more polished, less balls-to-the-wall type of review? He's critical in spots.

Seems like he was trying to assess the wheel according to its own intended purpose, rather than comparing it to the imaginary ideal: a 50 lb indestructible EUC that breaks the sound barrier for 400 miles between charges and feels like floating on a cloud.

I wont be jumping off anything, as previously mentioned its just the overall suspension system that is disappointing, not to mention the exposed rails that inevitably get damaged one way or another.

 

2 hours ago, UPONIT said:

AND AND AND:

InMotion has already made hints they are developing a new "smaller" EUC of some sort. Maybe they are legit trying to be a REAL vehicle maker, with a focused line-up. Like a flagship trackable model, a luxury sedan, and an SUV, all made well, packaged and distributed professionally and supported competently? You know what I'm trying to say...

I'm still happy to wait until hidden bugs are worked out, if any. But they really seem to have put a LOT of effort into making this a safe, durable VEHICLE rather than a toy. I'd be happy to support that even if it didn't seem to fit my use case so well...

But the Sherman S also has a lot going for it.

This is what I am looking forward to. As I mentioned, all this tech will work its way down into smaller wheels and hopefully other companies will learn that this level of refinement and quality is totally possible. The V13 sets the bar for tech and safety, while the sherman sets the bar for suspension capability. I am sure over the next few years these will be merged into one.

[NSFW]

2 hours ago, Freeforester said:

We might be in danger of becoming the fabled ‘Two cultures separated by a common language’ here! If EUC isn’t an acronym, then wtf is it, lol? Should we ‘wiki’ it? 😆

EUC is an initialism - you pronounce the initial letter of each word.

Acronyms are pronounced as a word, like "scuba" for example. (self-contained underwater breathing apparatus)

 

[Paul A]

Nice work NSFW.

_________

 

22 minutes ago, NSFW said:

EUC is an initialism - you pronounce the initial letter of each word.

 

initialism

/ɪˈnɪʃəlɪz(ə)m/

Learn to pronounce

 

noun

1. an abbreviation consisting of initial letters pronounced separately (e.g. BBC ).