How does KS-16X acceleration rank relative to other EUCs?

[Scottie]

16 minutes ago, RetroThruster said:

All this talk about the 16x is really making me consider swapping my RS-T deposit to a 16x, I just felt comfortable on the 16x, maybe because it was the wheel that I learned on...

 The 16x was my learning wheel also, and in the early days of learning I knew I was not qualified to judge a wheel that I could barely stay on. Now I feel capable of having an opinion since my feet are becoming more sophisticated.

I always circle back to the 16X because it is the most enjoyable ... for me. I enjoy them all of course but still have a favorite. The 16X has some nice features. That speed based multi-stage headlight is great at night. The ground effect lighting back-lights the pedals which helps me locate my feet on the pedals in complete darkness. And as Mike mentioned, that big motor on a smaller wheel gives lots of effortless torque and acceleration. I find it the most comfortable wheel to mount and handle just because the body shape works well with my legs. The 18XL body shape is number one for mounting, but number two for riding control; giving the overall edge to the 16X. It is not a fast wheel compared to its competition, but it is plenty fast enough for my slow ass.

I wish the MSP had a body shape more like the 16X. That would move it up on the list. I find the body shape does not allow me the control to mount as well, but once on it ... all is well. I just received some power pads and will try them on the MSP to see what happens for me there.

At this point, if something happened to the 16X that put it out of commission, I would get another. I would think a bit harder about saying that for the others. Possibly the MSP is the runner-up in that arena.  

[RetroThruster]

23 hours ago, Scottie said:

 The 16x was my learning wheel also, and in the early days of learning I knew I was not qualified to judge a wheel that I could barely stay on. Now I feel capable of having an opinion since my feet are becoming more sophisticated.

I always circle back to the 16X because it is the most enjoyable ... for me. I enjoy them all of course but still have a favorite. The 16X has some nice features. That speed based multi-stage headlight is great at night. The ground effect lighting back-lights the pedals which helps me locate my feet on the pedals in complete darkness. And as Mike mentioned, that big motor on a smaller wheel gives lots of effortless torque and acceleration. I find it the most comfortable wheel to mount and handle just because the body shape works well with my legs. The 18XL body shape is number one for mounting, but number two for riding control; giving the overall edge to the 16X. It is not a fast wheel compared to its competition, but it is plenty fast enough for my slow ass.

I wish the MSP had a body shape more like the 16X. That would move it up on the list. I find the body shape does not allow me the control to mount as well, but once on it ... all is well. I just received some power pads and will try them on the MSP to see what happens for me there.

At this point, if something happened to the 16X that put it out of commission, I would get another. I would think a bit harder about saying that for the others. Possibly the MSP is the runner-up in that arena.  

We have VERY similar views of the 16x, pretty much exact, like the Mten3, I almost think every stable should include one, some have issues with it for sure but for me, it just has so many nice features and admirable performance that it's hard to be overlooked.

[postbio]

@Scottie@RetroThrusterYou guys are making me happy with my 16X. I was going to get another (RS T), but will just keep this for now.

[Sushiroller]

Just got myself a 16x and can't wait to learn on it.

I dropped my V11 deposit because I think I can wait for Inmotion to optimize that wheel even more.

[travsformation]

18 hours ago, postbio said:

@Scottie@RetroThrusterYou guys are making me happy with my 16X. I was going to get another (RS T), but will just keep this for now.

I also second their impressions. The acceleration is second to none in terms of how effortless it is, the handling is fantastic—so nimble and easy to maneuver—and the 16x3" tire is very stable at any speed. It's a great all-rounder (urban, cruising, off-roading, hill-climbing) and hard to beat in terms of how fun it is, unless your definition of fun starts above the 55 km/h mark. 😂

The only aspect I'm not crazy about is the braking, but you learn to adapt to it. It isn't all that terrible either, it's just that the deceleration can't match the acceleration, and the shell shape means there's less surface to grip onto, so if you lean back too hard you find your legs trying to grip thin air if you're not careful 😂

About speed and overleaning (a common concern with the 16X), I weight 68 kg + gear and have never overleaned mine, and I often accelerate hard above 40 km/h but am gentle once I reach the 45 km/h mark. For heavy riders it's a different story altogether...

If top speed and high-speed torque availability aren't a priority for you, I think the 16X fits the bill better. It's less taxing to ride (user effort vs. wheel output) than any 16"+ GW. The only advantage I'd see in the RS (for your specific use-case) is that with the 18x3" tire, it's more planted and won't be as bouncy as the 16X, which jumps around like a cricket with every little pothole. But who said that ain't fun?

[Mike Sacristan]

Last night I went for a cruise with some friends. I swapped wheels with Simon so I was on his 16X with the CYT H-5167. He was on my MSX.
The other riders were a Sherman rider and a Nikola rider.
Simon and the Nik rider were behind the whole time... I was sort of wondering why they were lagging behind half the time.
Turns out Simon didn't have his alarms on the 16X.. he had set them all at 50kmh. So basically I was riding near the soft tiltback but without hitting it and waiting for an alarm to come at 45 kmh. All my internal alarms were going off however. Above 45 kmh I only trust the 16X in perfect conditions. I am not a huge fan of the H-5167 and I much preferred the crazy gyro of the CX-321 although I never really tamed it even after 7000km. The H-5167 is just a bit thin... but it is a nice point and shoot tyre. You point... it goes... no tramlining, etc. Just a little sketchy at the highest speed and especially on high speed turns.

Nowadays I ride my MSX and my 1Rad Nik. Today I put a CX-321 on the Nik and it is amazing. So... tyres do a lot.
The MSX is still awesome even after 14000km, with the stock tyre still, thick Frank pads and karambits.

I can only imagine how nice Frank Pads and karambits would be on the 16X.

Ending the evening we played at a skate park and did some jumps as well as technical bonking. The 16X torque was very apparent during the bonks. Although the 16X config was much looser because no pads/karambits it still behaved very well and was extremely responsive and powerful.

So yes... the 16X is still a great wheel. I never really clicked with the H-5167 though. The throttling was ok. The features are great.

I like to play with idling and stairs and j-turns and jumps to 180 etc... my MSX config allows this. On my Fat Nik it is just torture. I bet it would be a dream on the 16X with the proper config.

I bet a CST C-1773 would be great on the 16X. Or a H-666 (these are widely available in 16").

Also... the CX-321 which had crazy gyro on the 16X and tramlined like hell behaved very nicely on the Fat Nik... which shocked me. And I was even running at 24.5 PSI for my 68kg riding weight which is a couple of PSI higher than I normally ride. So there is something about the 16X that made it behave like a crazy Z10 with the CX-321.

[Mike Sacristan]

On 11/5/2020 at 1:57 AM, Darrell Wesh said:

A bald stock CST Nikola tire feels exactly like a Z10 but on steroids. It’s so great, I’m sad to see this one is down to the cords and I have to put on a new piece of crap tire. New tires are not as fun as worn on the street for carving. 

 

Just wanted to mention that I changed tyre yesterday. My CST C-1448 was beginning to show an indication of cords. Once I removed the tyre I could see how thin the rubber was in that area. The tyre I put on is the Dalishen CX-321 which is the first batch 16X tyre. On the 16X it had a lot of gyro and resisted leaning, although the initial part of the lean/turn was easy. It had a very pronounced rubber band effect. It also tramlined like crazy on the 16X and I had to run pretty low tyre pressure for it to behave semi-acceptably.

On the Nik the CX-321 is a whole other story and actually behaves very nicely. More stable than a worn out CST C-1488 but crazy fun to carve. Much less tramlining but it will follow a crack here and there. My Nik weighs a bit more than the standard Nik though at 29.5kg.

I was both shocked and also a bit disappointed at how well the CX-321 behaved on the Nik. I was expecting a much wilder ride. All good though as I prefer to ride naked and the Nik was super stable.

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

17 hours ago, Mike Sacristan said:

I bet a CST C-1773 would be great on the 16X. Or a H-666 (these are widely available in 16").

So you think I should finally put my CST-C1737 tire on my 16X?
To be honest, I'm tired of the disassembling and the fiddling with the stupid glued pads and I only ride MSP HT anyway.

But my CST-C 1488 doesn't have much profile left after 4.300 km and I'm a little bit curious how the C1737 compares to it.
Well, let's see, winter is just around the corner, maybe there is a quiet minute to tinker around?

[Mike Sacristan]

5 hours ago, buell47 said:

So you think I should finally put my CST-C1737 tire on my 16X?
To be honest, I'm tired of the disassembling and the fiddling with the stupid glued pads and I only ride MSP HT anyway.

But my CST-C 1488 doesn't have much profile left after 4.300 km and I'm a little bit curious how the C1737 compares to it.
Well, let's see, winter is just around the corner, maybe there is a quiet minute to tinker around?

Yeah you definitely should. It's a great point and shoot tyre with nice grip. The 16X wasn't that terrible to open except the stupid glued pads lol.
And yeah... I know man... you only ride the MSP haha. I haven't really felt that motivated to fix my 16X... it is just there collecting dust.
On the other hand I did just get back from a 56km on the Nikola and had half battery left! Despite it being +3C.
And I can't say I was going that slow... the MSP rider with me got down to 9% battery at lowest but recovered to 20%.
I weigh nothing though.. but still. That freedom.
Top speed 58kmh and didn't beep a single time.

[Darrell Wesh]

8 hours ago, Mike Sacristan said:

Just wanted to mention that I changed tyre yesterday. My CST C-1448 was beginning to show an indication of cords. Once I removed the tyre I could see how thin the rubber was in that area. The tyre I put on is the Dalishen CX-321 which is the first batch 16X tyre. On the 16X it had a lot of gyro and resisted leaning, although the initial part of the lean/turn was easy. It had a very pronounced rubber band effect. It also tramlined like crazy on the 16X and I had to run pretty low tyre pressure for it to behave semi-acceptably.

On the Nik the CX-321 is a whole other story and actually behaves very nicely. More stable than a worn out CST C-1488 but crazy fun to carve. Much less tramlining but it will follow a crack here and there. My Nik weighs a bit more than the standard Nik though at 29.5kg.

I was both shocked and also a bit disappointed at how well the CX-321 behaved on the Nik. I was expecting a much wilder ride. All good though as I prefer to ride naked and the Nik was super stable.

Just changed my bald tire to a fresh new one.
 

Nik went from being my favorite wheel ever to me now wanting to sell it. No mten3 feel, no gyro, turns like an 18xl. I dread this every time I have to change it. I usually just let a friend ride it for 500 or so miles to get the tire worn. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by Darrell Wesh

[Mike Sacristan]

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Just changed my bald tire to a fresh new one.
 

Nik went from being my favorite wheel ever to me now wanting to sell it. No mten3 feel, no gyro, turns like an 18xl. I dread this every time I have to change it. I usually just let a friend ride it for 500 or so miles to get the tire worn. 

Aw man  So you went for a fresh stock CST C-1488?
I know the feeling anyway. 

[Darrell Wesh]

47 minutes ago, Mike Sacristan said:

Aw man  So you went for a fresh stock CST C-1488?
I know the feeling anyway. 

I don’t know of any slick tires that fit. 

[EMA]

On 11/3/2020 at 4:33 AM, mrelwood said:

There’s indeed a crucial distinction between “the fastest acceleration” and “most effortless acceleration”, and they come from completely different specs. “Good acceleration” leaves too much room for interpretation.

 The smaller the outer tire diameter, the more effortless the acceleration is. Large pedals and firmware affect this a lot as well.

 The more power the motor can output, the faster it can be accelerated without an overlean. Motor power and the capabilities of the battery affect this the most, right after the rider’s own behavior.

best explaination ever.

unless you measure something with a stopwatch it's all about rider sensation, speed feeling on 17' is waaaay different from 19' and so the stability and comfort.
you can feel the speed on a 16x even at 38-40km/h, you'll have the same sensation at 50 on msp, at 60 on a monster
bigger/heavier and powerfull wheels need more skill to get the best out of it, but there are lot of pros...

[ btw torque msp/rs acceleration is crazy compared to other wheels ]

Edited November 12, 2020 by EMA